He wants kids, I don't....
Replies
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HONESTY is the most important part of a relationship and compromise 2nd! That being said contemplating bringing a child into the world is not an issue you can compromise on. If you do not want kids then don't have them. If you cave you will end up resenting him and the child. And probably either neglect the child or spoil out of guilt. It is not like buying a car you cant sell em if you are not happy.0
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Why do you just assume he wants to have kids out of some kind of pressure or something? Is it not possible that he just wants kids? Is it not possible that this is just coming up now because he and you are getting older and "coming of age"...I mean, yeah...that **** didn't exactly come up when I was in highschool or even in college...but deep down, I always knew I wanted kids. I didn't discuss it with my wife (then long time girlfriend) for a very long time...it was only after we had really done some growing up and I and she had to decide exactly where this thing was going and if we both were on the same page...thankfully we were.
She had been dreading the conversation with me because I had never brought it up and I was dreading that conversation with her because it wasn't something she ever thought of. We both wanted kids because we both wanted a family...not out of some kind of pressure or, "that's just what you do" or whatever. Thankfully we were both on board with the idea of having kids. Had we not been, sad as it would have been, no way it would have worked...it would have had to end there.
This honestly seems like a no brainer here. This isn't something to compromise either way over in a relationship. Either you're both on the same page or you're not...period.0 -
This is kind of a make or break situation for a relationship. If he wants them and you don't.....there is really no where you can go from there. One of you will be miserable. You both need to figure out what YOU really and if it's not the same in the long run, maybe you need to start looking at your options for your future. Having a kid for someone else is not fair to any of you (including the kid).0
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So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
WTF are you talking about? All of my friends are parents of beautiful children...all of them had children because they wanted children. I've never seen "peer" pressure to have kids in this day and age...if anything, there's more pressure to forgo the family and climb the corporate ladder in this day and age.0 -
I was with a guy for 4 years who couldn't decide if he wanted kids. I knew I did. Worst thing I did was wait around to see if he would change his mind. He strung me along, giving me hope he would change, but in the end I chose to leave. I am now with an amazing guy who wants what I want.
First thing you need to figure out is if YOU want to have them and then go from there. If you really aren't sure then tell him that and make sure he realizes there is a real possibility you won't want them. He will have to decide if he is going to make that a deal breaker or not. But you have to give him all the information he needs to know what he is getting into. Talk it out.
Good luck!0 -
This is not based on personal experience, but rather on what I've see either through my friends or my career as a supervisor who's had to help his people through rough spots in their respective relationships.
First, I think it is a good idea to go to therapy where you have an outsider who can guide discussions and help you figure out if it's something he wants but has suppressed so far, or if he's simply cracking under outside pressure. One of the worst things someone can do is to have children simply to "check the box" because they feel a professional, social, or familial requirement to do so. It's also good because it may help you have a better idea about if you want children, yourself.
This may sound odd, but I also think it's wise that you're nervous about what may come as a result of this, because it might reveal a large hurdle for your relationship. If it turns out he truly does want children and you truly do not, that's something worth knowing. Having children can often be a significant lifetime goal for some people. Harsh as it may be to hear- it's better to find out now while you're still boyfriend and girlfriend without significant legal ties than to have it contribute to a "irreconcilable difference" argument for a divorce or to a relationship where one feels denied by not having children or the other feels burdened by having them.
I know you have 8 years invested with him, but you're still a relatively fresh college graduate. Frankly, your world as adults in the work force is different than it was when you were students.
Something I discovered is that I was still evolving as a person for years after I graduated. Only now, over seven years later, have I really been able to figure out, sometimes through trial and error, who I am and what my long term desires are as far as potential lifelong relationships. In the meantime, I gained and lost friends. That included losing someone who was my good friend for about 14 years starting when we were classmates in High School, continuing through being roommates through all four years of college, and progressing on for about six years after that. But our differeing paths after graduating caused us to grow apart. I have done the "focus on your career" thing and figued out what kind of balance I want in my life. You may have reached this point of self awareness, already, but it's worth pointing out that simply graduating from college doesn't mean you're done growing.
With that in mind, I think it’s very reasonable for you to want to get your career on track before settling down. That’s especially true when you want to consider adding children to the mix because being a parent is a 24/7 job. You may have some unexpected dues to pay before your career is truly ready to go. My parents got married a year after graduating, but waited another seven years before having kids so that they were able to have most of the initial career turbulence behind them and they had the ability to sustain the family on only one of their salaries if necessary.
I have seen people bring children into the mix before they’re ready and they’re either personally, professionally, or financially not prepared to take care of themselves AND their children. It wasn't the end of the world, but it wasn't pretty, either.
The two of you will need to do what you can to tune out others to some degree so that you can focus on figuring out what you want as a couple and as the two individuals who make up that couple. You won’t be able to completely tune everyone out, especially the family. As much as we like to think of ourselves as individuals, we’re all still products of the world we grew up in, and that must be taken into consideration. I’ve never seen “pretend they don’t exist / matter” work as an effective way to deal with not agreeing with family.
So I would definitely advocate going to therapy. You may out for certain that he wants kids and you don't and have to make a tough decision on where your relationship is going or if it’s going to stop. You may find out that he’s not really that big on having kids, either, but is feeling the pressure from his family. You may also find out that the two of you just aren’t ready YET. The important thing is that you recognize this as an issue and you are taking steps to address it instead of burying your heads in the blankets and hoping the problem just goes away.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
WTF are you talking about? All of my friends are parents of beautiful children...all of them had children because they wanted children. I've never seen "peer" pressure to have kids in this day and age...if anything, there's more pressure to forgo the family and climb the corporate ladder in this day and age.
Erm?? Why so rude? Only because your experience differs from mine does not mean that I don't know "WTF" I am talking about?!0 -
I'm going to go a different direction from everybody else.
Firstly, the person who said imagine being 50 without a child? Um, ok. That'll be 12 years from now for me, I'll still be pursuing my education, career, volunteer work, health & fitness and all the other wonderful enriching things in my life. I'm not child-LESS. I'm child-FREE.
If that's what she wants, that's totally cool and none of your damn business.
My husband and I have been married 20 years and have been together since 10th grade. When we were in high school/early years of marriage, we spoke of having kids as sort of a foregone conclusion. Somehow, we both morphed into people that knew they never wanted kids. I think it might have been the onslaught of screaming brats in restaurants, but I digress...
The point is that we grew together and have common values and goals. Our marriage cannot have been successful without that. Almost the worst thing in the world is to be an unwanted child (I know from personal experience), or to be the unwanting parent of an unwanted child. If one of us decided suddenly that we wanted kids, then that person kinda gets overruled, because we already have a commitment to each other. We can't just abandon that because one of us wants to play dress-up with a dolly. But you are not in that situation. You aren't married and you CAN just choose to go your separate ways. If you truly love each other, you will support each other to realize your deepest hearts' desires, and if that is having kids for your boyfriend, please let him go with a heart full of love.
And now the different direction I promised. Individual counseling for yourself. You have already sent up the red flag about the "nagging feeling that [his unfulfilled dreams] are [your] problem." It betrays a codependent mindset, which is understandable in a lot of relationships that have been ongoing since childhood. (again, personal experience) If you work on that problem now when you're young, your life will be SO much more successful!
As a side benefit, if your couples counseling (in which you learn better communication skills, so it IS better than just having a real discussion!) results in the decision to split amicably, you're already set up with a counselor to help you learn the skills to cope with and grieve that loss.
I wish you so very well. You sound poised to effect real change in this world. Go take on the challenge!0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
WTF are you talking about? All of my friends are parents of beautiful children...all of them had children because they wanted children. I've never seen "peer" pressure to have kids in this day and age...if anything, there's more pressure to forgo the family and climb the corporate ladder in this day and age.
^ in that case, consider yourself lucky dude!
I live through the complete opposite! As one lady above stated: ".. it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen... "
How is it possible to have such different experiences in this "day and age" ? Must be sorcery!0 -
This is not based on personal experience, but rather on what I've see either through my friends or my career as a supervisor who's had to help his people through rough spots in their respective relationships.
First, I think it is a good idea to go to therapy where you have an outsider who can guide discussions and help you figure out if it's something he wants but has suppressed so far, or if he's simply cracking under outside pressure. One of the worst things someone can do is to have children simply to "check the box" because they feel a professional, social, or familial requirement to do so. It's also good because it may help you have a better idea about if you want children, yourself.
This may sound odd, but I also think it's wise that you're nervous about what may come as a result of this, because it might reveal a large hurdle for your relationship. If it turns out he truly does want children and you truly do not, that's something worth knowing. Having children can often be a significant lifetime goal for some people. Harsh as it may be to hear- it's better to find out now while you're still boyfriend and girlfriend without significant legal ties than to have it contribute to a "irreconcilable difference" argument for a divorce or to a relationship where one feels denied by not having children or the other feels burdened by having them.
I know you have 8 years invested with him, but you're still a relatively fresh college graduate. Frankly, your world as adults in the work force is different than it was when you were students.
Something I discovered is that I was still evolving as a person for years after I graduated. Only now, over seven years later, have I really been able to figure out, sometimes through trial and error, who I am and what my long term desires are as far as potential lifelong relationships. In the meantime, I gained and lost friends. That included losing someone who was my good friend for about 14 years starting when we were classmates in High School, continuing through being roommates through all four years of college, and progressing on for about six years after that. But our differeing paths after graduating caused us to grow apart. I have done the "focus on your career" thing and figued out what kind of balance I want in my life. You may have reached this point of self awareness, already, but it's worth pointing out that simply graduating from college doesn't mean you're done growing.
With that in mind, I think it’s very reasonable for you to want to get your career on track before settling down. That’s especially true when you want to consider adding children to the mix because being a parent is a 24/7 job. You may have some unexpected dues to pay before your career is truly ready to go. My parents got married a year after graduating, but waited another seven years before having kids so that they were able to have most of the initial career turbulence behind them and they had the ability to sustain the family on only one of their salaries if necessary.
I have seen people bring children into the mix before they’re ready and they’re either personally, professionally, or financially not prepared to take care of themselves AND their children. It wasn't the end of the world, but it wasn't pretty, either.
The two of you will need to do what you can to tune out others to some degree so that you can focus on figuring out what you want as a couple and as the two individuals who make up that couple. You won’t be able to completely tune everyone out, especially the family. As much as we like to think of ourselves as individuals, we’re all still products of the world we grew up in, and that must be taken into consideration. I’ve never seen “pretend they don’t exist / matter” work as an effective way to deal with not agreeing with family.
So I would definitely advocate going to therapy. You may out for certain that he wants kids and you don't and have to make a tough decision on where your relationship is going or if it’s going to stop. You may find out that he’s not really that big on having kids, either, but is feeling the pressure from his family. You may also find out that the two of you just aren’t ready YET. The important thing is that you recognize this as an issue and you are taking steps to address it instead of burying your heads in the blankets and hoping the problem just goes away.
Thank you for a level-headed answer. This is the kind of advice I was looking for.0 -
Thank you for a level-headed answer. This is the kind of advice I was looking for.
Well then, next timne just tell us all what you want to hear and we'll repeat it back to you.
You're welcome from the rest of us who took the time to read your posts and offer you some very sound, rational advice. :flowerforyou:0 -
It wouldn't be unusual for a person (man or woman) to find, as they grow older, that they want things they didn't want when they were younger. Are you sure that it's only because of outside pressure that he's expressing this desire? Maybe he is really getting to point in his life when he wants children.
That he wants to have them with you doesn't mean that has to be your choice, however. And as hard as it may be be consider, this is a difference that ultimately will make it very hard for you to be a successful, happy couple in the long term. Hiding from it by avoiding the counseling that you have put on the table as a viable option (or by avoiding the issue in any other way) isn't a solution.
I think you should continue to discuss this, explore both of your motives and desires for your owns lives and your life together, speak to a counselor, and get to the bottom of whether your goals are the same. If they aren't, well, there would definitely be some hard decisions to make, but at least you'd know. This isn't like what color car to buy - it's a core issue in a family. If he really wants children, he has that right. If you really don't, you have that right. But it's going to be difficult to reconcile the two without causing some real unhappiness in the long run, so taking the time to really explore this now is important, in my opinion. Wishing you the best.0 -
Thank you for a level-headed answer. This is the kind of advice I was looking for.
Well then, next timne just tell us all what you want to hear and we'll repeat it back to you.
You're welcome from the rest of us who took the time to read your posts and offer you some very sound, rational advice. :flowerforyou:
Apologies, I didn't realize I was directing that towards anyone outside of who I quoted.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
......someone here gets it.
you're a bit biased in your presumption simply because you are singling out a post and saying that they get it, purely based upon what you want to hear.
Yes, I assume that I would be biased in my own post when there is someone who understands what I'm thinking.
in your original post you ended with: "I guess what I’m asking here is if anyone has any advice or if they know anyone who has gone through a similar struggle?"
Why ask for advice if you will only consider agreeing with someone who validates what you are already setting in your mind. You obviously are very self-centered, and after reading through your posts it definitely confirms it. You want want you want in your relationship and don't seem to consider that maybe your boyfriend of over a decade actually wants to settle down and have a family with the woman he LOVES. He wants to spend the rest of his life with you and have something beautiful created between the two of you, yet you are doubting him and whether or not he means it or can think for himself, THEN choosing your "career" over him and the possibility of a beautiful life where you CAN have your cake and eat it too. I am not being rude, just honest.0 -
getting the popcorn ready for the drama fest that this is about to become... :glasses:
Completely unrelated, OP you are lovely! I hope everyone here has a fabulous hump day.0 -
Just tell him to have kids with someone else.
Geez... Why didn't I think of that? :huh:
This one made me giggle :laugh: :drinker: You were honest with him , he can't just flip the script on you like that because mommy dearest wants grandkids... Gosh! The mother's are always the pain! Been there! Your man needs to politely tell her that ya'll already have an understanding and her input is not needed
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You're only 24, it's not even a necessary conversation right now. Now, it annoys me when people say "you might change your mind" but then again I'm 37. Likely not. However, at 30 something you might. Then again you might not. If he truely wants children and can't imagine a life without then it could very well be a deal breaker. It's heart breaking to think people are making you decide now at such a young age. You've worked hard to get where you are, forcing you to have children at the start of your career before you're established is selfish and wrong. I hope you're able to work it out, perhaps you can ask him to give you 5 years and if you both feel the same as you do now, then agree to part amicably.0
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I went through a similar situation with my ex-girlfriend recently. Granted we weren't together as long as you and your boyfriend have been, but the problem was almost the same. She didn't want kids either and I do. At first I thought maybe she'd change her mind about it eventually, but after she kept mentioning it every other week, I realized we were wasting each other's time by trying to pursue something that would never truly fulfill us both.
I think you summed up your next steps fairly well. Couples counseling may help to see if it's something he truly wants or it's just pressure from others that's causing it. But even with counseling, this may still lead to a breakup between you. It sucks but it happens sometimes. Hope it works out for you.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
WTF are you talking about? All of my friends are parents of beautiful children...all of them had children because they wanted children. I've never seen "peer" pressure to have kids in this day and age...if anything, there's more pressure to forgo the family and climb the corporate ladder in this day and age.
^ in that case, consider yourself lucky dude!
I live through the complete opposite! As one lady above stated: ".. it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen... "
How is it possible to have such different experiences in this "day and age" ? Must be sorcery!
I must say I was a bit puzzled by the "in this day and age" reference too and was wondering whether either I've been in a time warp for the last 20 years or the gentleman in question is significantly younger than me. However judging by his 38 years to my 43 I guess the excuse of "generation gap" might be out. :laugh:
I most definitely had my fair share of sustained questioning and pressure for most of my childbearing years about my choice not to have children.
It can be both subtle to extremely unsubtle, and has come from both family as well as strangers, other women as well as men.
It ranges from patronising remarks by other women implying that you don't know your own mind by telling you that eventually you WILL "come round" or that it won't be your choice because your "biological clock" WILL take over. Even when you admit to not actually being particularly fond of children you're told "oh I don't like other people's but it's different when it's you're own". When you can't be convinced differently, there is usually a shift from the trying to covert you stage to what I called the ill concealed hostility, where it's implied that might want to rethink your priorities in life, that you're selfish, that it's "not normal" not to want children, that you will be lonely in old age with no one to look after you..... When you hit round about 40 people start laying off you a bit because they assume one of 2 things, you biologically "can't have them" or you "never met the right guy"... both assumptions result in pity for your life.
Only relatively recently I joined a new team at work and a woman came to chat to me and literally the first thing she asked me (possibly even before my name!) was "do you have any children?", so I smile and politely say no I don't.... Her face changes to somewhere between embarrassment and pity and she says... "Oh... polycystic ovaries???" and I respond awkwardly "erm... no, I just didn't want any!"..... [silence].... "oh....!"
It's as if for some people it defines them, and thereby it defines you!
I have no problem with how people live their lives, but it does feel like some parents have a problem when you admit that you actively avoided having kids (the distinction between childless vs child free!). It's as if your choice is an outward criticism of their life somehow.
Perhaps it's something men don't experience so much but I have most certainly felt it even in "this day and age".0 -
My experience:
When my now-husband was my boyfriend, I was ambivalent about having kids, leaning slightly toward not wanting them. He wanted them. When we got engaged, we had our officiant do a few pre-marital counseling sessions with us. One thing we wanted to get to the bottom of was the kids issue. I felt like I needed to make a decision for or against kids before we made it official.
Counseling was TREMENDOUS for putting my mind at ease. First, our officiant said I didn't have to make a decision in the few months before the wedding, but that this could be an open and ongoing discussion between my husband and me. Second, I had been overestimating how much my husband wanted kids. In counseling, he said he would rather have me than kids. It was really important for me to hear.
We've been married for a few years and we are now both fairly certain that we want to remain child-free for the rest of our lives. We talk about it all the time and check in with each other frequently to see if we are still on the same page. All of our discussions and personal reflections have revealed to me that all of the reasons I could think of to have children were all about other people, not me. They were that my husband would make a great dad, my parents would be so happy as grandparents, we'd fit in with all of our friends who are reproducing, etc.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
......someone here gets it.
you're a bit biased in your presumption simply because you are singling out a post and saying that they get it, purely based upon what you want to hear.
Yes, I assume that I would be biased in my own post when there is someone who understands what I'm thinking.
in your original post you ended with: "I guess what I’m asking here is if anyone has any advice or if they know anyone who has gone through a similar struggle?"
Why ask for advice if you will only consider agreeing with someone who validates what you are already setting in your mind. You obviously are very self-centered, and after reading through your posts it definitely confirms it. You want want you want in your relationship and don't seem to consider that maybe your boyfriend of over a decade actually wants to settle down and have a family with the woman he LOVES. He wants to spend the rest of his life with you and have something beautiful created between the two of you, yet you are doubting him and whether or not he means it or can think for himself, THEN choosing your "career" over him and the possibility of a beautiful life where you CAN have your cake and eat it too. I am not being rude, just honest.
She's 24!! Get off your pulpit. I suppose you think as long as he gets to keep his career it's all dandy for her to throw away the last 6 years of education to get where she is. If they were having the conversation at 30 there'd be warrant, at 24 are you kidding me?! Grow up, life isn't butterflies and unicorns where you live happily ever after just because you spend your life "with someone you love" and have "something beautiful created between the two of you" children are not fulfulling to everyone. She shouldn't sign on to something that isn't fulfilling to her, and neither should he, but it's not just black and white and give him a baby and live happily ever after.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
......someone here gets it.
you're a bit biased in your presumption simply because you are singling out a post and saying that they get it, purely based upon what you want to hear.
Yes, I assume that I would be biased in my own post when there is someone who understands what I'm thinking.
in your original post you ended with: "I guess what I’m asking here is if anyone has any advice or if they know anyone who has gone through a similar struggle?"
Why ask for advice if you will only consider agreeing with someone who validates what you are already setting in your mind. You obviously are very self-centered, and after reading through your posts it definitely confirms it. You want want you want in your relationship and don't seem to consider that maybe your boyfriend of over a decade actually wants to settle down and have a family with the woman he LOVES. He wants to spend the rest of his life with you and have something beautiful created between the two of you, yet you are doubting him and whether or not he means it or can think for himself, THEN choosing your "career" over him and the possibility of a beautiful life where you CAN have your cake and eat it too. I am not being rude, just honest.
lol0 -
I would like to interject that people who have not attended college or who work in jobs that *you* wouldn't consider "professional careers" are still perfectly capable of feeling the desire to have a satisfying life. Attending college or have a different "better" job does not make you more entitled to your goals and dreams than your boyfriend.
You can try counseling. But kids are usually a deal-breaker. It's not fair for you to ask him to put his wishes on hold to wait several years for you to accomplish your dreams while the risk remains that at the end of it, you still may not want children.
This. It's fine that you are undecided but you have been together 8 years. At some point you will have to make a decision, for physical reasons.. It's not fair to HIM to waste his life waiting for you to decide if you want them or not. But I think setting some goals and a timeline would do a ton for your relationship.
I have a 6 year old (no dad in the picture) and when my fiance and I got serious, I told him that I did not want to have my next child after I was 30. I've been dying to have another and the wait is heartbreaking, especially with PCOS and the possibility of a struggle. He wanted to at least be married and finished with school so we made that compromise, another year and a half until we are married and he is graduated. That gives him time to get settled and gives me an idea of when it can happen, not an endless wait until he is ready.0 -
Trust in the Lord with all your heart... Proverb 3:5 Stay true to yourself. No one can achieve your dreams for you. And if your paths are supposed to be together in life than they will be. I know....easier said than done.
Genesis 1:28 - "Be fruitful and multiply"
Hmm, quite the conundrum now.
Deut. 25:11
When two men are fighting and the wife of one of them intervenes to drag her husband clear of his opponent, if she puts out her hand and catches hold of the man by his privates, you must cut off her hand and show her no mercy.
Genesis 38:9
Onan knew that the offspring would not be his; so when he went in to his brother’s wife, he wasted his seed on the ground in order not to give offspring to his brother. But what he did was displeasing in the sight of the LORD; so He took his life also.
I had to. :laugh:
Seriously, OP I can't add to all of the good advice you've gotten, so I'll just say that I hope things work out for the best!0 -
Sometimes sticking with someone just because you have a lot of history together isn't the best idea if you're starting to find that you're not compatible. Talk to him about it, throwing caution to the wind, because it's a lot worse to let resentment build up over time than to potentially break it off now.
Not saying that's what is going to happen, but if it does, it does. Your goals are obviously very important to you, and his desire for children may actually be genuine and he's just using the pressure from his mom as an excuse to tell you about it.0 -
Ultimately, you both need to figure out exactly what you want from life. If one of you wants kids and the other doesn't the relationship will not work. There is no compromise in that situation. One person will not get what they want and will end up resenting the other person. And if it's you who gives in and you end up having kids, the kids will suffer because the relationship will suffer.0
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Is anyone really surprised a guy who made a decision in his teens/early twenties changed his mind?
It's easy to say you don't want a kid when you are one yourself. Saying "LOLOLOL too late, you already said you didn't want them when you were 4 so now that decision is valid forever!" is both illogical and fairly,..re*arded.
He'll probably back down for now to keep his girlfriend, but eventually he'll come to the conclusion he can have a kid and a girlfriend, just not this girlfriend.
It's normal to want to progress after a decade, regardless of age.0 -
in your original post you ended with: "I guess what I’m asking here is if anyone has any advice or if they know anyone who has gone through a similar struggle?"
Why ask for advice if you will only consider agreeing with someone who validates what you are already setting in your mind. You obviously are very self-centered, and after reading through your posts it definitely confirms it. You want want you want in your relationship and don't seem to consider that maybe your boyfriend of over a decade actually wants to settle down and have a family with the woman he LOVES. He wants to spend the rest of his life with you and have something beautiful created between the two of you, yet you are doubting him and whether or not he means it or can think for himself, THEN choosing your "career" over him and the possibility of a beautiful life where you CAN have your cake and eat it too. I am not being rude, just honest.
She's 24!! Get off your pulpit. I suppose you think as long as he gets to keep his career it's all dandy for her to throw away the last 6 years of education to get where she is. If they were having the conversation at 30 there'd be warrant, at 24 are you kidding me?! Grow up, life isn't butterflies and unicorns where you live happily ever after just because you spend your life "with someone you love" and have "something beautiful created between the two of you" children are not fulfulling to everyone. She shouldn't sign on to something that isn't fulfilling to her, and neither should he, but it's not just black and white and give him a baby and live happily ever after.
I am guessing, "nice guy" who's been romantically devastated, frequently / future men's rights activist0 -
She's 24!! Get off your pulpit. I suppose you think as long as he gets to keep his career it's all dandy for her to throw away the last 6 years of education to get where she is. If they were having the conversation at 30 there'd be warrant, at 24 are you kidding me?! Grow up, life isn't butterflies and unicorns where you live happily ever after just because you spend your life "with someone you love" and have "something beautiful created between the two of you" children are not fulfulling to everyone. She shouldn't sign on to something that isn't fulfilling to her, and neither should he, but it's not just black and white and give him a baby and live happily ever after.
I don't recall specifying that she has to right now, i was going against the fact that she stated she "may never want to" and is writing off the possibility because her boyfriend of nearly a decade could never possibly think of the idea on his own accord without his mother pressuring him to. I have never heard someone I knew in their old age- state, damn I wish I worked on my career longer, or spent more time on work.
I agree by no means is having a baby the have all cure all, and I never specified that. Quoting two lines out of my post kind of alters the point I was trying to make, which was that she doesn't seem the be taking the option too seriously because she won't get out of her own way and think about what he may want - not just now, but in the future as well.
But I'll go on my pulpit, it's rather nice talking down to others.0 -
So sorry to hear you are going through this!!!! I understand! Luckily, my hubby of 10 years does not want children BUT everybody around us - friends, family etc - have kids and they ask us fairly often why don't we want kids or when are we going to have them.
Yeah. We get this... I think a lot of people do it due to some need for external validation of their own choices, e.g. "if everyone else does what we've done then we've done the right thing" ... it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen...
WTF are you talking about? All of my friends are parents of beautiful children...all of them had children because they wanted children. I've never seen "peer" pressure to have kids in this day and age...if anything, there's more pressure to forgo the family and climb the corporate ladder in this day and age.
^ in that case, consider yourself lucky dude!
I live through the complete opposite! As one lady above stated: ".. it's usually followed by ill concealed hostility and making you feel like an alien if you don't chose what they've chosen... "
How is it possible to have such different experiences in this "day and age" ? Must be sorcery!
I must say I was a bit puzzled by the "in this day and age" reference too and was wondering whether either I've been in a time warp for the last 20 years or the gentleman in question is significantly younger than me. However judging by his 38 years to my 43 I guess the excuse of "generation gap" might be out. :laugh:
I most definitely had my fair share of sustained questioning and pressure for most of my childbearing years about my choice not to have children.
It can be both subtle to extremely unsubtle, and has come from both family as well as strangers, other women as well as men.
It ranges from patronising remarks by other women implying that you don't know your own mind by telling you that eventually you WILL "come round" or that it won't be your choice because your "biological clock" WILL take over. Even when you admit to not actually being particularly fond of children you're told "oh I don't like other people's but it's different when it's you're own". When you can't be convinced differently, there is usually a shift from the trying to covert you stage to what I called the ill concealed hostility, where it's implied that might want to rethink your priorities in life, that you're selfish, that it's "not normal" not to want children, that you will be lonely in old age with no one to look after you..... When you hit round about 40 people start laying off you a bit because they assume one of 2 things, you biologically "can't have them" or you "never met the right guy"... both assumptions result in pity for your life.
Only relatively recently I joined a new team at work and a woman came to chat to me and literally the first thing she asked me (possibly even before my name!) was "do you have any children?", so I smile and politely say no I don't.... Her face changes to somewhere between embarrassment and pity and she says... "Oh... polycystic ovaries???" and I respond awkwardly "erm... no, I just didn't want any!"..... [silence].... "oh....!"
It's as if for some people it defines them, and thereby it defines you!
I have no problem with how people live their lives, but it does feel like some parents have a problem when you admit that you actively avoided having kids (the distinction between childless vs child free!). It's as if your choice is an outward criticism of their life somehow.
Perhaps it's something men don't experience so much but I have most certainly felt it even in "this day and age".
I don't think it's that as much as we tend to seek out people like us. When we find someone, we try to make connections and find similarities. With most parents, a large part of their lives revolve around kids. That being the case, it's sometimes hard to see the similarities when something that important in your life isn't at all important in someone else's. It's like someone that's passionate about politics meeting someone that doesn't vote or give a crap about politics. It's just hard to overcome the initial shock that the person is THAT different. That doesn't mean as the relationship develops, that won't change, but it's a knee jerk reaction we all have on some level or another.0
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