Government shutdown

Mistyfied_MD

What kills me are the people who want to blame both sides 'equally' for this shut down. It IS the law of the land, and only one 'side' has been against it.

ldrosophila

Most people qualify for subsidies when they buy health care on the exchange. Have you checked?

Yup and no...its an unaffordable act for those who have worked very hard to make a decent wage above the 400% cut off.

I would also argue that if you really look at it anyone making about 300% to 200% would also find it expensive.

Well I browsed plans and, while I didn't qualify for assistance, I could easily afford full coverage zero deductible for my entire family if my work did not provide health care. Was less than $10k/year, and the price didn't rise with income (past assistance level). The more I make, the easier it is to afford. Maybe this differs by state.

It is definitely by state I can expect to pay $10K a year...not affordable. Remember this is also looking at the low tiered bronze plan with a $5000 deductible and a 40% share of cost.

For one person? That's laughably bad. I'm seeing a platinum plan for 3, at ~800/month. Sorry to hear your options suck.

Edit: I didn't test income levels above $500k/year. Prices didn't change up to that, and I assume this isn't a particularly relevant issue for over $500k families.

If I chose the Pt plan that would put my monthly premiums at $547! Although to add the high deductible plan isnt as high as I had once estimated, but it's still double what I pay now. Which has been the general expectation for CA.

Now I added a dependent because I'm 26 weeks pregnant the plan jumps to $482 a month for bronze and for curiosity sake Pt is now $830. That after the birth of my child. Yeah real affordable for a family...note sarcasm. Ag is $595!!!!

So I guess the numbers arent off but it still seems unaffordable to me.

dawlschic007

Unfortunately those cheering the madness on fail to realize that now EITHER side can use that tactic, not just the people they agree with. Sound like a good thing now?

This has already happened 17 other times in the last 30 years. Both sides have used this tactic before.

mrdexter1

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all and so what if the path to that is not easy for some who have a job to return to and access to health care.

Biggest problem I see is if America is forced to default on foreign loans because no agreement is reached and the mere possibility of that has spooked me enough to sell out of falling stock prices with a view to picking up cheaper when agreement is hopefully reached

just_Jennie1

1. This thread was a bad idea. Not the right forum and it will get shut down.
2. Your problem is with the wealthiest citizens and companies in our country...not the tiny little portion of poor people who take advantage of the system. Once you figure that out, you'll be golden.

I don't see many wealthy people sitting on their duffs with their hands out.

They're the job creators. They're the ones who pump money in to the economy. They're the ones who pay the most taxes (yes, they do)!

They're not saying gimme gimme gimme they're asking 'How can I. . . ."

Where did you hear that on "Faux News"

Nope.

From personal experience.

You must be a minion working for "the man" who has NO IDEA what it takes to run a business, how much one has to pay, the taxes, social security, unemployment tax even when you have NO EMPLOYEES.

You really think the wealthy aren't the job creators? The ones who spend the most money?

You must be watching CNN.

TattooedNici

I highly suggest the book, Behold the Pale Horse and for everyone to look into/research the UCC and their straw(wo)man. You know, for fun. That is all.

Kitship

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all

this is just wrong.

Ed98043

Why in the world would anyone think that the Congress and Senate could get anything done with health care if they can't even pass a budget. No budget since 2009... I'd sure like to run my life without a budget, just look around and say... "oh, I like that... I think I'll get it" and not worry about how to pay for it. When the bill comes I just do a little creative accounting and forward the bill to my neighbor. Sounds like a winning plan to me.

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More like forward the bill to your kids and grandkids.

I am one of those people without health insurance. I haven't had it since 2003 when I left the corporate world. I'm self-employed now and insurance is damned expensive. Over 10 years that's about a seventy thousand dollars that I haven't paid into the health care system, but I haven't taken any out either. I pay for things like birth control out of my own pocket and haven't been to a "real" doctor in...gosh, at least 15 years. My dad worked in insurance his whole life and told me "But we need people like you, who just pay and pay and never make claims, to make up for the ones whose claims exceed their premiums". Yes, even the "rich" folks who complain about paying $10k a year for insurance spend other people's premiums when they get sick or injured. It bugs me no end when anyone who regularly gets medical care thinks their premiums are somehow only supporting the deadbeats, when they themselves also benefit from the pooling of everyone else's money.

At any rate, I've tried to get into the health care exchange website for my state today but it's telling me that they don't have a plan for me and I need to call. I assume they're having technical difficulties. Truthfully if they don't have anything for me that I consider affordable (say, under $500 a month as an individual), I'll probably continue without it and just pay the fine which will be something like $650 dollars next year and 2.5% of my income the year after that.

NikiChicken

I posted this in my updates, but I thought I'd put it here, since I think it's relevant:

A lady that works here part time for little more than minimum wage signed up for her and her 2 kids for $19/month on the ACA market site this morning. She didn't even know it had gone live today, was ecstatic when I told her and she got on the site and registered. I dunno how this all plays out over time, but seeing stuff like that makes me smile.

8 years ago I was working for AT&T Broadband and we had a big health insurance meeting. I watched a father break into tears in an auditorium full of employees trying to determine if his son who was suffering from MD would be covered by his company insurance and being told no. It's a scene that's picture perfect in my head today, and I always think about what if that was my son or daughter, what would I do?

I feel like ACA probably has some issues, just like any new legislation, social security and medicare weren't perfected in a day, but I think the good for people like the lady in my office far outweighs the bad. Shutting down the government for it seems extreme and selfish, and I hope this ends soon for the people who work for and are affected financially by the furloughs and lack of support they need.

Well said. Thank you.

samiyan05

What kills me are the people who want to blame both sides 'equally' for this shut down. It IS the law of the land, and only one 'side' has been against it.

What kills me is people actually think there are two sides lol

There is only one side and they are all working for the same goal!

I'd like to think one day people will take their blinders off but sadly it's much easier to handle it all if they don't

saschka7

Hegelian dialectic - look it up... It explains this entire mess.... Unfortunately most of the public are willfully ignorant

I never thought in a million years that I would EVER see a Hegel reference in the forums. Government shutdown, be damned, I feel chipper enough now to go get ice cream. :drinker:

jwdieter

Most people qualify for subsidies when they buy health care on the exchange. Have you checked?

Yup and no...its an unaffordable act for those who have worked very hard to make a decent wage above the 400% cut off.

I would also argue that if you really look at it anyone making about 300% to 200% would also find it expensive.

Well I browsed plans and, while I didn't qualify for assistance, I could easily afford full coverage zero deductible for my entire family if my work did not provide health care. Was less than $10k/year, and the price didn't rise with income (past assistance level). The more I make, the easier it is to afford. Maybe this differs by state.

It is definitely by state I can expect to pay $10K a year...not affordable. Remember this is also looking at the low tiered bronze plan with a $5000 deductible and a 40% share of cost.

For one person? That's laughably bad. I'm seeing a platinum plan for 3, at ~800/month. Sorry to hear your options suck.

Edit: I didn't test income levels above $500k/year. Prices didn't change up to that, and I assume this isn't a particularly relevant issue for over $500k families.

OK now my curiosity is peaked because these are not the numbers I have been seeing and espeically for Pt tier!!! Without being intrustive and i guess there is no way around this what state are you from would you say that your income is above the 400% cut off?

If I chose the Pt plan that would put my monthly premiums at $547! Although to add the high deductible plan isnt as high as I had once estimated, but it's still double what I pay now. Which has been the general expectation for CA.

Now I added a dependent because I'm 26 weeks pregnant the plan jumps to $482 a month for bronze and for curiosity sake Pt is now $830. That after the birth of my child. Yeah real affordable for a family...note sarcasm. Ag is $595!!!!

I'm one state up, and above the 400% tier. From what I'm seeing, the best possible plan in the marketplace for me costs less than what our employers are currently paying for health care.

Edit: I looked at options for Downtown SF (just a random place that seemed like it'd be high price), and yeah Silver plan for little over $900, and no gold or platinum options. Kinda crappy. But I have no idea what people are used to paying there to start with.

ladymiseryali

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all

this is just wrong.

Wait, it's wrong for people to have healthcare or it's wrong that people don't?

whierd

What kills me are the people who want to blame both sides 'equally' for this shut down. It IS the law of the land, and only one 'side' has been against it.

What kills me is people actually think there are two sides lol

There is only one side and they are all working for the same goal!

I'd like to think one day people will take their blinders off but sadly it's much easier to handle it all if they don't

IKR? Both sides of the aisle are just there for the power grab. Very few on either side actually believe the crap that comes out of their mouths.

whierd

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all

this is just wrong.

Wait, it's wrong for people to have healthcare or it's wrong that people don't?

It is neither.

ldrosophila

Can someone remind me why a flat rate insurance plan doesnt work for healthcare? Why cant it be like car insurance that's affordable.

Enhance medicaid to those who cant afford the flat rate.

Kitship

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all

this is just wrong.

Wait, it's wrong for people to have healthcare or it's wrong that people don't?

Wrong to say that a country is not civilized until every citizen of that country has access to healthcare.

whierd

Can someone remind me why a flat rate insurance plan doesnt work for healthcare? Why cant it be like car insurance that's affordable.

Enhance medicaid to those who can afford the flat rate.

Because not everyone has the same health risks as others. A person with a poor driving record will pay a higher premium. A person who is obese and smokes will pay a higher premium.

ironanimal

no country can be deemed civilized without access to health care for all

this is just wrong.

Wait, it's wrong for people to have healthcare or it's wrong that people don't?

Wrong to say that a country is not civilized until every citizen of that country has access to healthcare.

I would actually tend to agree. Being allowed to die somewhere because you can't afford healthcare for something that is treatable is pretty primeval.

This is not to say Obamacare is the right way to go about it, since I'm ignorant of the intricacies of the system, but I do think access to health care for all is a good indicator of progression in civilisation.

ldrosophila

Can someone remind me why a flat rate insurance plan doesnt work for healthcare? Why cant it be like car insurance that's affordable.

Enhance medicaid to those who can afford the flat rate.

Because not everyone has the same health risks as others. A person with a poor driving record will pay a higher premium. A person who is obese and smokes will pay a higher premium.

What if all (how many Americans are there now 350 million?) Americans paid some arbitrary number $200 a month and $100 for each dependent now you spread that throughout the country would that make healthcare affordable? Of course that gets into the whole cost control thing, and do we put a cap on what a surgeon can charge or a hospital can charge for overhead? If you want the cadillac plan thats great you just have to pay more. How would that work? Now is a doctor forced to take the insurance plan or can they deny it if they arent remibursed enough? Theres gotta be a way for us Americans to have our cake and eat it too.

Can doctors not accept Obamacare?