Paleo = dying young?
Replies
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Even the bread your grandmother ate is significantly different than what we eat today due to a lot more modern manipulation of wheat.
My grandmother hated the bread my grandmother made. It was coarse, rough, and about as digestible as a brick. She considered herself the most blessed person on earth when she emigrated and discovered "modern" bread.0 -
K8 -- how we've been growing our agriculture in the last 50-100 years is drastically different than it was done 10,000 years ago. Even the bread your grandmother ate is significantly different than what we eat today due to a lot more modern manipulation of wheat. So "agriculture" from 10,000 years ago is significantly different than it is now.
We didn't even have the technology and science 100 years ago in agriculture that we have now (even 50-75 years ago is pushing it as it's on the cusp)... the point is... agriculture, grains, and whatnot is not what's "killing us" as the Paleo adherents like to claim... perhaps too much of it is (because it's cheap and easy)... perhaps the variations are... but grains, legumes, tubers, etc. in and of themselves are not what the problem is.0 -
Mr_Knight -- it depends on how literal you want to be with Paleo or Primal. A lot of people that are more permissive and less literal, look to the underlying nutritional value - -and if it mimics the standards in Paleo/Primal, it's good enough.
Almonds wouldn't fit into a raw diet, but there are certain types of "processing" that is acceptable in Paleo/Primal -- like almonds, cold-pressed coconut oil, etc. We don't eat our meat raw either, but cooking isn't something we generally consider "processing" like you see in junk food, but more akin to what we see in almond "processing".
Its just like don't eat dairy! But butter and cream and cheese (if you're primal) are A OK. Simply make exceptions for foods you want to eat and demonize all others0 -
I like these threads. What we do really know is that cavemen lead rough existences because they were constantly at war with the Sleestaks.
brutal life I tell 'ya...just brutal...
I pity the caveman life...truly
Am I the only person who actually liked that Caveman show. He worked at IKEA(sort of), oh god, it was so bad it was good
(Oh damn...sorry I'm sure there will be a swift and terrible punishment coming my way for speaking out of turn)0 -
K8 --
I'm not sure I'd saying killing us. But there are a lot of people that have issues with components in grains -- whether that's gluten or otherwise. And we are eating them (along with sugar and processed foods) in far higher proportion than we ever have before the last 100 years or so.
Is it correlation or causation? Hard to say at this point, but many people are having success when eliminating or reducing them from their diet.0 -
Acg67--
I don't think it's demonizing, it's taking a reasoned position. If you read more of the science behind it, perhaps you'd understand it. But, since you haven't, I suppose it's easier to just scoff at that which you don't understand.0 -
Mr. Knight --
Well, if your goal is to run 5 miles, is it better to settle for 4 miles on some days? Or better to just not run at all?
I think the 80/20 rule makes a lot of sense, and far much more so than a 100/0 rule.
Don't let perfection get in the way of progress.0 -
Imagine the burns ol Neadernlefty can get from that weber!I like these threads. What we do really know is that cavemen lead rough existences because they were constantly at war with the Sleestaks.
brutal life I tell 'ya...just brutal...
I pity the caveman life...truly0 -
I will now exit the thread so that we may all bask in the omnipotence of his highness Johnny9000millino posts.
Hey, bring those back.
Johnny9000 ain't bad, he's just a... character.0 -
Paleo is a gimmick and there's nothing inherently healthier about it.
+10 -
I will now exit the thread so that we may all bask in the omnipotence of his highness Johnny9000millino posts.
Hey, bring those back.
Johnny9000 ain't bad, he's just a... character.
Oh i never said hes a bad guy...we all have our charms. Ive agreed with him on other threads...im certainly not without any reason.
Ive no problems with disagreeing yet still being able to acknowlegdge positives. I also have a steel *kitten* so butthurtery is not my gig.0 -
Acg67--
I don't think it's demonizing, it's taking a reasoned position. If you read more of the science behind it, perhaps you'd understand it. But, since you haven't, I suppose it's easier to just scoff at that which you don't understand.
lol0 -
um no. If I fill up on donuts, pizza, icecream and junk its quite obvious to me that I feel like crap and no positive thinking is going to make me feel any better. When I went grain free it was quite obvious to me that I felt awesome and this really works a lot better for me than your standard well balanced food pyramid with whole grains. And not only did I feel better but my blood work was excellent and further confirmed that it works great for me.It would be fun to do a google search like this:
site:myfitnesspal.com "feel great"
to see what comes up. People report "feeling great" on all manner of crazy unhealthy trash, like juice cleanses, lemon water detoxes, HCG diets, <900 calorie diets, etc etc. It's also easy to find many reports online from former vegans who for years proclaimed they "never felt better" until they finally gave in and realized their bodies were in terrible shape and they had been fooling themselves all these years.
"Feels great" is meaningless. People who buy into a fad diet invariably "feel great" because they want to. No one wants to believe they bought into and followed some stupid idea for months or years.
I actually just did this.
"33 days on Herbalife and I feel Great"
"I feel great eating raw!"
"i started eating right sence thursday and i feel great."
"i drink a detox tea that has garcinia cambogia in it and i have to say i love it, i feel great"
Could it be these people "feel great" because they think they are doing something great for their health, whether they are or not? I can say that I personally "feel great" when I'm proud of something I've done, regardless of what I'm eating..0 -
um no. If I fill up on donuts, pizza, icecream and junk its quite obvious to me that I feel like crap and no positive thinking is going to make me feel any better. When I went grain free it was quite obvious to me that I felt awesome and this really works a lot better for me than your standard well balanced food pyramid with whole grains. And not only did I feel better but my blood work was excellent and further confirmed that it works great for me.It would be fun to do a google search like this:
site:myfitnesspal.com "feel great"
to see what comes up. People report "feeling great" on all manner of crazy unhealthy trash, like juice cleanses, lemon water detoxes, HCG diets, <900 calorie diets, etc etc. It's also easy to find many reports online from former vegans who for years proclaimed they "never felt better" until they finally gave in and realized their bodies were in terrible shape and they had been fooling themselves all these years.
"Feels great" is meaningless. People who buy into a fad diet invariably "feel great" because they want to. No one wants to believe they bought into and followed some stupid idea for months or years.
I actually just did this.
"33 days on Herbalife and I feel Great"
"I feel great eating raw!"
"i started eating right sence thursday and i feel great."
"i drink a detox tea that has garcinia cambogia in it and i have to say i love it, i feel great"
Could it be these people "feel great" because they think they are doing something great for their health, whether they are or not? I can say that I personally "feel great" when I'm proud of something I've done, regardless of what I'm eating..
That has been my experience as well. Shocked my primary care physician, but totally inline with what my specialist expected.0 -
Actually yes could you please provide peer reviewed double blind studies on stage 4 cancers and low carbohydrate. I mean since you are the authority on this subject.
Oh now we're talking about low carb, not Paleo. Impressive how quickly you made that turn.
Paleo would qualify as low carb. At least from what I have seen it would fall under that umbrella.
Paleo comes in many flavors, and Paleo is not necessarily low carb.0 -
Delete. Dupe.0
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Well, if your goal is to run 5 miles, is it better to settle for 4 miles on some days? Or better to just not run at all?
If your goal is to run 5 miles, you need to run 5 miles. (Actually, you should be running 10, but that's a longer story).
If running less is "ok", then your goal isn't actually to run 5 miles.
The real issue with 80/20 is that in practice it simply becomes SAD. There is a qualitative difference between 80/20 and for example 95/5.0 -
It's not a fad for some. People do it because of diseases like Hashimoto's.
Not sure what Paleo has to do with Hashimoto's. A diet appropriate for Hashimoto's and Paleo are not synonymous, even if they're compatible.
Many People who have Hashimoto's eat an AIP (auto-immune paleo) Diet in order to help with the symptoms of Hashimoto's and to avoid flair ups. Many people with this auto-immune disease have food sensativities or have reactions triggered by certain foods. Many people with Hashimoto's tend to avoid gluten and dairy along with other allergen foods for this reason.
Thank you. Someone who gets it!
Let's not forgot the Crohn's, U. Colitis, and other autoimmune sufferers. Some have trigger foods related to insoluble fiber (beans, popcorn, whole corn, whole grains, potato peels, cucumber peels, etc.), seeds, dairy (dairy is really bad for gastritis), nightshades (peppers, potatoes, eggplants, etc.), high acidic foods (tomatoes, pickles, citrus foods), sorbitol (grapes, sugar alcohol), and items from the trigger foods ... pickled foods, vinegars, grain-based alcohol, sugar free gums, high fructose corn syrup.0 -
Well, if your goal is to run 5 miles, is it better to settle for 4 miles on some days? Or better to just not run at all?
If your goal is to run 5 miles, you need to run 5 miles. (Actually, you should be running 10, but that's a longer story).
If running less is "ok", then your goal isn't actually to run 5 miles.
Well, then I think that's is fair to say that people that enjoy the Paleo/Primal lifestyle aren't necessarily looking to eat 100% Paleo/Primal all the time. They're looking to improve their life in certain fashion and getting to 80% is 80% further than 0. I suppose if your goal is 100% in everything, you're going to be very disappointed in life. Or have way too low of goals.0 -
I see paleo as more as someone choosing to eat vegetarian.
My problem with this statement is that I know quite a few vegetarians and a handful of vegans...they're full time vegetarians and vegans. Every paleo eater I know is paleo...except on Saturdays when they go grab a pizza...or they're paleo except they eat legumes...or, they're paleo X% of the time...or they're paleo except they were just craving a snickers so they had one, etc.
It's like religious people who pick and choose which parts of a particular religion pertain to them and which parts can be ignored. It's pretty ridiculous really...and I truly believe that it is overwhelmingly a fad.
^This. Everyone I know who "eats paleo" only follows it until it becomes inconvenient.0 -
They're looking to improve their life in certain fashion and getting to 80% is 80% further than 0.
No, it's not.
That's the point.
If someone is eating 40/40/20 during their "paleo" phase and then 0/0/20 during their "20%" phase, they're basically right back to SAD.
20% isn't a "cheat", it's a more or less complete undoing. A "cheat" or "close enough" would 95/5.0 -
I will now exit the thread so that we may all bask in the omnipotence of his highness Johnny9000millino posts.
Hey, bring those back.
Johnny9000 ain't bad, he's just a... character.
Oh i never said hes a bad guy...we all have our charms. Ive agreed with him on other threads...im certainly not without any reason.
Ive no problems with disagreeing yet still being able to acknowlegdge positives. I also have a steel *kitten* so butthurtery is not my gig.
How you doin'0 -
I will now exit the thread so that we may all bask in the omnipotence of his highness Johnny9000millino posts.
Hey, bring those back.
Johnny9000 ain't bad, he's just a... character.
Oh i never said hes a bad guy...we all have our charms. Ive agreed with him on other threads...im certainly not without any reason.
Ive no problems with disagreeing yet still being able to acknowlegdge positives. I also have a steel *kitten* so butthurtery is not my gig.
Gunna be honest here, I'm just in this thread for profile pics.
This topic not only has it been butthurted and beaten to death, it's just kinda silly.
The whole caveman thing is a gimmick, and in time it may just end up being, eat like a pharaoh next. What's interesting though is the people dedicated to agonizing over every little detail.0 -
That Mammoth steak crusted with grasshoppers I had last night was delish!
Tonight: Fresh Wooly Rhino ribs with grub sauce!! yum!!!!0 -
They're looking to improve their life in certain fashion and getting to 80% is 80% further than 0.
No, it's not.
That's the point.
If someone is eating 40/40/20 during their "paleo" phase and then 0/0/20 during their "20%" phase, they're basically right back to SAD.
20% isn't a "cheat", it's a more or less complete undoing. A "cheat" or "close enough" would 95/5.
I'm glad you established the exact value of what a 'cheat' is. Jesus, the arrogance...0 -
What diet isn't a gimmick then? By calling paleo a gimmick you are implying there is a diet that is the standard to hold all diets too.I will now exit the thread so that we may all bask in the omnipotence of his highness Johnny9000millino posts.
Hey, bring those back.
Johnny9000 ain't bad, he's just a... character.
Oh i never said hes a bad guy...we all have our charms. Ive agreed with him on other threads...im certainly not without any reason.
Ive no problems with disagreeing yet still being able to acknowlegdge positives. I also have a steel *kitten* so butthurtery is not my gig.
Gunna be honest here, I'm just in this thread for profile pics.
This topic not only has it been butthurted and beaten to death, it's just kinda silly.
The whole caveman thing is a gimmick, and in time it may just end up being, eat like a pharaoh next. What's interesting though is the people dedicated to agonizing over every little detail.0 -
They're looking to improve their life in certain fashion and getting to 80% is 80% further than 0.
No, it's not.
That's the point.
If someone is eating 40/40/20 during their "paleo" phase and then 0/0/20 during their "20%" phase, they're basically right back to SAD.
20% isn't a "cheat", it's a more or less complete undoing. A "cheat" or "close enough" would 95/5.
Obviously, you don't understand what Paleo/Primal means. It's not about percentages per se, like the Zone, Atkins or other ones. It can be low-carb or it can be quite heavy on the carbs depending on the person's goals -- but what they have in common is the type of carbs, protein and fat. Perhaps you should educate yourself on the subject matter at hand before you rile against it.
You can keep the exact same ratios of carbs, protein and fat if you like. But, it means having a cookie, slice of pizza, sandwich or ice cream on occasion, it's okay. Just keep it small and go back to your eating the right way the rest of the time. Full deprivation tends not to work well for people, so that's why they put it in there.0 -
I'm glad you established the exact value of what a 'cheat' is.
Thanks! I can see some folks are really struggling with this, so I'm glad I could help!
:drinker:0 -
It can be low-carb or it can be quite heavy on the carbs depending on the person's goals -- but what they have in common is the type of carbs, protein and fat. Perhaps you should educate yourself on the subject matter at hand before you rile against it.
I. Never. Mentioned. Macros.
I give up - have fun storming the castle!
:drinker:0 -
I'm glad you established the exact value of what a 'cheat' is.
Thanks! I can see some folks are really struggling with this, so I'm glad I could help!
:drinker:
It must be terribly fun to live in a world of absolutes.0
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