Paleo.
Replies
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This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
I got bored after the 1st page0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
I've been here for about three years...so yeah, I already knew.
:drinker:0 -
I feel dizzy, it's like I don't know where to look first?
Obese kids who are not obese due to inacitivity unless they are inactive then yeah.
Italians who are not obese b/c they are active and pffffffffft only wheat makes you obese, duh! (but pasta?:huh: )
Nazi's? What?
Flouride?
IN for fattening toothpaste!
0 -
<<wall of test partially removed for space>>Yes, it is an essential mineral (and that is why many multi-vitamin-mineral products include small amounts of selenium). I should have said that it is toxic in moderately "large" amounts--and that it is easy to get too much. Eating a half-pound of Brazil nuts a day would be a problem. Eating one or two a day would give you all the selenium you need (along with eating a wide variety of nourishing food because many foods contain selenium, albeit in much lower amounts). But, if you ate a half-pound of Brazil nuts every day, you would soon get sick of even the look of them.
Fortunately, the body has a "wisdom" that keeps us out of trouble. However, we need to re-learn to "listen" to our bodies. Children naturally do so, if you don't distort their appetite with the "empty calories" of sugar and starch and allow them to become loaded up with the environmental chemicals that seem to be ever present. They will instinctively reach for what their bodies need and stay healthy, active and slim. Obese children are sick children, reflecting a sick environment and sickness-promoting "foods". They are not "lazy" (children are naturally much more active than adults) if they spend their days laying around watching television and playing video games--they are sick. If you restrict empty calories, give them plenty of nourishing food and spend time with them outdoors, they will get much healthier. This has been demonstrated in a number of pilot projects where they take obese children and their parents on two-week long health retreats where they learn to make healthier food choices and to pursue more outdoor sports and activities. The human body was perfectly designed to be nourished by naturally grown and caught food, in a context of outdoor activity in a clean environment.
Thus the popularity of the Paleo diet because it appeals to the desire to return to a time before "better living through chemistry".
Um, wow. Too much caffeine? That is an impressive bit of mind racing. You just jumped from eating 1/2 lb of Brazil nuts, which I imgine is pretty rare, to chidren being too sedentary, to the design of the human body, to why a diet is popular.
Well, I don't have all day to devote to responding on these forums and I try to include as much info as I can in the shortest number of words. To the contrary, my mind does not "race"--perhaps it is just unimpeded by fluoride poisoning. :laugh:
OIC. So you think posting "info" on parenting and how our bodies are designed and the other "info" above (all without any references) when asked why you believe selenium is more toxic than other nutrients is the norm for folks who don't drink fluoridated water?0 -
Another paleo thread? Just do a search for the other 100. This topic has been beat to death...
I have seen quite a few paleo threads and agree it has been beaten to death. This thread, however, is definitely not your typical paleo thread.0 -
I feel dizzy, it's like I don't know where to look first?
Obese kids who are not obese due to inacitivity unless they are inactive then yeah.
Italians who are not obese b/c they are active and pffffffffft only wheat makes you obese, duh! (but pasta?:huh: )
Nazi's? What?
Flouride?
IN for fattening toothpaste!
0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA
well fluoride is a chemical and all chemicals are bad, right? < that's all I got...0 -
Not for me. I'm not that fond of meat.
As a diet? Meh...I see it works for someone, and if this is a good way for you to get a calorie deficit then go for it. Just don't tell me how this is how people are supposed to eat or some BS like that.0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA
well fluoride is a chemical and all chemicals are bad, right? < that's all I got...
lol... I think that's as far as their logic gets to
this chemical phobia is doing my head in..... dear chemical phobes: you are made of chemicals. that is all.0 -
"The researchers conducted a systematic review of studies, almost all of which are from China where risks from fluoride are well-established. "
I suppose the fact that the US was adding iodine to salt to combat goiter over 25 years before (1924) they started adding flouride to water (1951) won't convince you that you're slightly off base on your conclusions?
Wheat tends to make people fat, yes. But any food that raises blood sugar precipitously (as wheat and/or sugary foods do) will tend to make many people fat. So, unless you want to look like you ate an enormous doughnut and it settled around your waist, it is best to limit both wheat and sugar to an occasional indulgence (and by that, I mean once a month or less). Wheat contains gliadin (a component of wheat gluten) and amylopectin-A. Both are highly addictive. For myself, I never eat either wheat or added sugar. Formerly, I ate a lot of "healthy whole grains" even while following a calorie-restricted diet (read low-fat). It was not sustainable for me and I always reverted to eating "normally" and gaining the weight back (plus more). I have been eating lower carb--about 100--120 grams of carbs per day--(I eat everything but added sugar and wheat). I eat a bit of oats and rye in moderation. I have been following this plan for about three years. I have lost 66 pounds, and have not once regained an ounce in that three years. That is a first for me. While Paleo is a bit too restrictive for me, I recognize it is an essential diet for some people who have a severe problem with a deranged metabolism.
OK I'm curious---I live in Italy, which is carb heaven, and we have very few obese. How is this explained if wheat makes one fat. I know the portion sizes--100g dry of pasta, and so it isn't that they are eating small portions. In the pizzarias evenings I see really skinny young people eating a huge pizza plus deserts. I also observe family members and so know the food culture here. They laugh when someone mentions the paleo diet. Would like to know how this is explained by the wheat is bad folks. Thanks.
1. Italians tend to get a LOT of exercise (as do Europeans in general). 2. Young people haven't had time to develop blood sugar problems. 3. Probably the most important reason is that Italians do not drink fluoridated water because they wisely refused to fluoridate their water after World War II. Only 3% of Europeans drink fluoridated water (fluoride was once recommended as a way to curb thyroid activity among hyperthyroid individuals in Europe). World obesity figures are directly linked to water fluoridation. Fluoride, because it fills the iodine receptors in the thyroid, impairs thyroid activity. Virtually all major cities in the U.S. fluoridate the municipal water supply and it is estimated that approximately 2/3 of Americans drink fluoridated water despite the fact that: "...[Even though Europeans have eschewed] 'one of the top ten public health achievements of the twentieth century,' [according to the propaganda from the CDC], tooth decay rates have declined in Europe as precipitously over the past 50 years as they have in the United States. This raises serious questions about the CDC’s assertion that the decline of tooth decay in the United States since the 1950s is largely attributable to the advent of water fluoridation..." Because of the thyroid impairment, there are millions of Americans who simply cannot convert blood sugar to energy and as it climbs higher, it is recognized as being a grave threat by the body which then, moves to convert it to body fat as a "safer alternative" than going into diabetic coma. :frown: Fluoride dosing was developed by the Nazis as a potential way to pacify the people. :huh: Make of it what you will.
Excuse me again, but didn't you claim that wheat made one fat? Older people in Italy are also not obese. I will say that they walk much more than Americans, but doesn't that substantiate calories in--calories out? As to the fluroride claim, thank God the Nazis didn't pacify Italy---only America!
PS Italians do have thyroid issues since they did not put iodine in their salt. Since I've been here they've started to add it about 15 years ago. Now, if I understand your claim here, they should be obese because of thyroid malfunction. But they're not. :noway:
There are many factors in the obesity puzzle. First, I did not say that wheat "makes people fat"--I said that it "tends" to make people fat but I should have said that it "tends to make SOME people fat" (but I spoke to that in the next sentence when I also mentioned sugar). I also said that ANY food that precipitously raises blood glucose levels is a problem for obese folk. I know that from my own and other people's experience as well as from reading a lot of scientific literature on the subject.
The administration of iodine salts protects the thyroid from the ravages of fluoride. But, if there is little or no fluoride exposure, then there is nothing to fend off (and anyway, the Italians eat a LOT of seafood--getting their iodine that way). In areas where the people eat lots of seafood, there is little need for supplemental iodine (in fact, it can be counter-productive in terms of thyroid health). The reason why the mid-western U.S. is called the "goiter-belt" is because the people get very little iodine (without supplementation) and they develop goiters because of it. I didn't say that the Nazis "pacified the U.S.--only that they came up with the idea of using fluoride to "sedate" conquered populations. By the way, the mineral selenium is useful to help the body rid itself of fluoride. But selenium is, itself, toxic. Brazil nuts vary in the amount of selenium they contain but in general, they contain a lot of selenium. Our soils in North America are selenium poor. Haven't looked at what they are like in Europe.
Just because they added enough iodine to salt to combat the epidemic of goiter in some areas does not mean that it was adequate to fend off the toxic attack represented by the addition of fluoride to municipal water supplies. As I have mentioned before, 97% of European water supplies are NOT fluoridated and they had the same decline in tooth decay as did N. America in the 70 years since the addition of fluoride to water supplies here. No, I am not "off base" in my conclusions--even scientists at Harvard have recently admitted that fluoride is rather toxic and that it profoundly affects the neurological development of children where there are very high natural levels of fluoride. They also said that much more research needs to be done on its health effects over time. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/
Since it does not retard tooth decay (and there have been numerous studies that show this) there was/is no logical purpose in fluoridating water. I am convinced that it is contributing to illness in the people.
From your link. Tell me exactly what a study about flouride in China has to do with the United States? Considering flouride is tightly controlled in the US, and we remove as much flouride in water as we add, based on the natural flouride content. Keeping in mind also, that over 30% of the water in the US isn't flourinated at all.
Also from your link: “Fluoride seems to fit in with lead, mercury, and other poisons that cause chemical brain drain,” Grandjean says. “The effect of each toxicant may seem small, but the combined damage on a population scale can be serious, especially because the brain power of the next generation is crucial to all of us.”
So flouride, when combined with lead, mercury, and other neurotoxins the people of China are exposed to (that are banned or tightly controlled in the United States) can be a problem. Seriously, an irrelevant conclusion for the US.
If you're going to provide evidence of effects in the United States, you need to provide evidence from the United States, not China.0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
If you got pregnant by drinking it then you've got some crazy biology going on. Lol0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
If you got pregnant by drinking it then you've got some crazy biology going on. Lol
she didn't say it where she was drinking it from. *smackslips*.0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
If you got pregnant by drinking it then you've got some crazy biology going on. Lol
she didn't say it where she was drinking it from. *smackslips*.
:drinker:0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
I once impregnated a woman while drinking water.0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
I once impregnated a woman while drinking water.
Mom?
Dad?
Is that you???0 -
one time i got pregnant from drinking fluoride in water.
wait... it wasn't fluoride.
oh... and i wasn't drinking water.
nevermind.
If you got pregnant by drinking it then you've got some crazy biology going on. Lol
she didn't say it where she was drinking it from. *smackslips*.
Lol.0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA
Where's YOUR research to back up that claim? We have an epidemic of thyroid disease in this country--they have no such epidemic in Europe. We fluoridate our water supplies, they do not. We are basically from the same genetic lines as Europeans. Something is clearly causing the deterioration of thyroid health here and fluoride is known to affect the thyroid gland (among other undesirable effects). I draw the conclusion that the risk versus benefit equation requires that we eliminate fluordiation as repeated studies have shown that there is no dental benefit. The National Academy of Sciences has recommended that the "safe" level of 4pm be reduced. By the way, there is no such thing as "fluorinated water".
http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=115710 -
I suppose the fact that the US was adding iodine to salt to combat goiter over 25 years before (1924) they started adding flouride to water (1951) won't convince you that you're slightly off base on your conclusions?
Wheat tends to make people fat, yes. But any food that raises blood sugar precipitously (as wheat and/or sugary foods do) will tend to make many people fat. So, unless you want to look like you ate an enormous doughnut and it settled around your waist, it is best to limit both wheat and sugar to an occasional indulgence (and by that, I mean once a month or less). Wheat contains gliadin (a component of wheat gluten) and amylopectin-A. Both are highly addictive. For myself, I never eat either wheat or added sugar. Formerly, I ate a lot of "healthy whole grains" even while following a calorie-restricted diet (read low-fat). It was not sustainable for me and I always reverted to eating "normally" and gaining the weight back (plus more). I have been eating lower carb--about 100--120 grams of carbs per day--(I eat everything but added sugar and wheat). I eat a bit of oats and rye in moderation. I have been following this plan for about three years. I have lost 66 pounds, and have not once regained an ounce in that three years. That is a first for me. While Paleo is a bit too restrictive for me, I recognize it is an essential diet for some people who have a severe problem with a deranged metabolism.
OK I'm curious---I live in Italy, which is carb heaven, and we have very few obese. How is this explained if wheat makes one fat. I know the portion sizes--100g dry of pasta, and so it isn't that they are eating small portions. In the pizzarias evenings I see really skinny young people eating a huge pizza plus deserts. I also observe family members and so know the food culture here. They laugh when someone mentions the paleo diet. Would like to know how this is explained by the wheat is bad folks. Thanks.
1. Italians tend to get a LOT of exercise (as do Europeans in general). 2. Young people haven't had time to develop blood sugar problems. 3. Probably the most important reason is that Italians do not drink fluoridated water because they wisely refused to fluoridate their water after World War II. Only 3% of Europeans drink fluoridated water (fluoride was once recommended as a way to curb thyroid activity among hyperthyroid individuals in Europe). World obesity figures are directly linked to water fluoridation. Fluoride, because it fills the iodine receptors in the thyroid, impairs thyroid activity. Virtually all major cities in the U.S. fluoridate the municipal water supply and it is estimated that approximately 2/3 of Americans drink fluoridated water despite the fact that: "...[Even though Europeans have eschewed] 'one of the top ten public health achievements of the twentieth century,' [according to the propaganda from the CDC], tooth decay rates have declined in Europe as precipitously over the past 50 years as they have in the United States. This raises serious questions about the CDC’s assertion that the decline of tooth decay in the United States since the 1950s is largely attributable to the advent of water fluoridation..." Because of the thyroid impairment, there are millions of Americans who simply cannot convert blood sugar to energy and as it climbs higher, it is recognized as being a grave threat by the body which then, moves to convert it to body fat as a "safer alternative" than going into diabetic coma. :frown: Fluoride dosing was developed by the Nazis as a potential way to pacify the people. :huh: Make of it what you will.
Excuse me again, but didn't you claim that wheat made one fat? Older people in Italy are also not obese. I will say that they walk much more than Americans, but doesn't that substantiate calories in--calories out? As to the fluroride claim, thank God the Nazis didn't pacify Italy---only America!
PS Italians do have thyroid issues since they did not put iodine in their salt. Since I've been here they've started to add it about 15 years ago. Now, if I understand your claim here, they should be obese because of thyroid malfunction. But they're not. :noway:
There are many factors in the obesity puzzle. First, I did not say that wheat "makes people fat"--I said that it "tends" to make people fat but I should have said that it "tends to make SOME people fat" (but I spoke to that in the next sentence when I also mentioned sugar). I also said that ANY food that precipitously raises blood glucose levels is a problem for obese folk. I know that from my own and other people's experience as well as from reading a lot of scientific literature on the subject.
The administration of iodine salts protects the thyroid from the ravages of fluoride. But, if there is little or no fluoride exposure, then there is nothing to fend off (and anyway, the Italians eat a LOT of seafood--getting their iodine that way). In areas where the people eat lots of seafood, there is little need for supplemental iodine (in fact, it can be counter-productive in terms of thyroid health). The reason why the mid-western U.S. is called the "goiter-belt" is because the people get very little iodine (without supplementation) and they develop goiters because of it. I didn't say that the Nazis "pacified the U.S.--only that they came up with the idea of using fluoride to "sedate" conquered populations. By the way, the mineral selenium is useful to help the body rid itself of fluoride. But selenium is, itself, toxic. Brazil nuts vary in the amount of selenium they contain but in general, they contain a lot of selenium. Our soils in North America are selenium poor. Haven't looked at what they are like in Europe.
Just because they added enough iodine to salt to combat the epidemic of goiter in some areas does not mean that it was adequate to fend off the toxic attack represented by the addition of fluoride to municipal water supplies. As I have mentioned before, 97% of European water supplies are NOT fluoridated and they had the same decline in tooth decay as did N. America in the 70 years since the addition of fluoride to water supplies here. No, I am not "off base" in my conclusions--even scientists at Harvard have recently admitted that fluoride is rather toxic and that it profoundly affects the neurological development of children where there are very high natural levels of fluoride. They also said that much more research needs to be done on its health effects over time. http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/news/features/fluoride-childrens-health-grandjean-choi/
Since it does not retard tooth decay (and there have been numerous studies that show this) there was/is no logical purpose in fluoridating water. I am convinced that it is contributing to illness in the people.
As I mentioned before in this thread.... in Bahrain, the naturally occuring water (i.e. spring water) is too high in fluorine... nowadays it's not a problem as people drink treated water, but in the past it was, and people suffered a lot of problems because of a lifetime exposure to excessive fluorine. the problems they suffered are quite distinctive, and I've never come across *ANYONE* in the USA suffering similar problems. And obesity has nothing whatsoever to do with it either. Sorry but blaming obesity on fluorine is being delusional. Go to the Bahraini national museum and look at the skeletons of people from pre-industrial Bahrain and tell me whether USA citizens have the same skeletal problems they do... the answer is "no they don't" - these problems were so endemic in the pre-industrial Bahraini population they were considered a normal part of old age.
It's nothing new that "harvard professors" would say that fluorine in excess is toxic, because it's always been widely accepted in science. It's the same for a lot of vitamins and minerals such as vitamin A and iron. The amount added to water in the USA is well within safe parameters. Additionally, fluorine occurs naturally in a lot of waters all around the world and only in a few places, like Bahrain, does it occur naturally in high enough doses to cause long term health issues and skeletal deformities. Did I mention that this is from naturally occuring high fluorine levels in the water? So, just because a country doesn't add fluorine to the water, it doesn't mean the water doesn't have fluorine in it naturally. Some countries don't add fluorine because their water already has fluorine in it.
Just because the fluoride levels are not high enough to cause skeletal fluorosis does not mean that there is an absence of adverse effects.0 -
<<wall of test partially removed for space>>Yes, it is an essential mineral (and that is why many multi-vitamin-mineral products include small amounts of selenium). I should have said that it is toxic in moderately "large" amounts--and that it is easy to get too much. Eating a half-pound of Brazil nuts a day would be a problem. Eating one or two a day would give you all the selenium you need (along with eating a wide variety of nourishing food because many foods contain selenium, albeit in much lower amounts). But, if you ate a half-pound of Brazil nuts every day, you would soon get sick of even the look of them. Fortunately, the body has a "wisdom" that keeps us out of trouble. However, we need to re-learn to "listen" to our bodies. Children naturally do so, if you don't distort their appetite with the "empty calories" of sugar and starch and allow them to become loaded up with the environmental chemicals that seem to be ever present. They will instinctively reach for what their bodies need and stay healthy, active and slim. Obese children are sick children, reflecting a sick environment and sickness-promoting "foods". They are not "lazy" (children are naturally much more active than adults) if they spend their days laying around watching television and playing video games--they are sick. If you restrict empty calories, give them plenty of nourishing food and spend time with them outdoors, they will get much healthier. This has been demonstrated in a number of pilot projects where they take obese children and their parents on two-week long health retreats where they learn to make healthier food choices and to pursue more outdoor sports and activities. The human body was perfectly designed to be nourished by naturally grown and caught food, in a context of outdoor activity in a clean environment.
Thus the popularity of the Paleo diet because it appeals to the desire to return to a time before "better living through chemistry".
Um, wow. Too much caffeine? That is an impressive bit of mind racing. You just jumped from eating 1/2 lb of Brazil nuts, which I imgine is pretty rare, to chidren being too sedentary, to the design of the human body, to why a diet is popular.
Well, I don't have all day to devote to responding on these forums and I try to include as much info as I can in the shortest number of words. To the contrary, my mind does not "race"--perhaps it is just unimpeded by fluoride poisoning. :laugh:
OIC. So you think posting "info" on parenting and how our bodies are designed and the other "info" above (all without any references) when asked why you believe selenium is more toxic than other nutrients is the norm for folks who don't drink fluoridated water?
Nothing that you stated here is intelligible. Do you enjoy illogic and making others appear to be illogical? And it is actually a lie that I have not included any references. What I would like to know is why you and all the regular obfuscators are here attacking.0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA
Where's YOUR research to back up that claim? We have an epidemic of thyroid disease in this country--they have no such epidemic in Europe. We fluoridate our water supplies, they do not. We are basically from the same genetic lines as Europeans. Something is clearly causing the deterioration of thyroid health here and fluoride is known to affect the thyroid gland (among other undesirable effects). I draw the conclusion that the risk versus benefit equation requires that we eliminate fluordiation as repeated studies have shown that there is no dental benefit. The National Academy of Sciences has recommended that the "safe" level of 4pm be reduced. By the way, there is no such thing as "fluorinated water".
http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=11571
Britain puts fluorine in its water!! And what about places that don't add fluorine because fluorine is already naturally occurring in the water? LIke in Bahrain, only not such high levels of it....
fluorinated water = water with added fluorine - of course it exists it's what you've been talking about all along
and why was there no obesity in the pre-industrical populations of Bahrain? If you look at Bahrain statistically, obesity has risen since the Bahraini people switched to bottled water which had much less fluorine in it than the spring water that comes from the island itself.... it can't have anything to do with people becoming sedentary and food becoming more easily available
as nice as it is to blame obesity on some dietary bogeyman (or bogeyman in the water).......... fact is obesity is the result of eating more food than you burn off.0 -
This is just awesome.
I know, right?
Conspiracy theories, big government, Nazis, foreign governments...oh, and paleo.
:drinker:
I bet you never knew dieting was so interesting.:laugh:
is this thread still going?????
yes although the topic now is fluorinated water and how that has absolutely nothing whatsoever to do with the obesity epidemic in the USA
Where's YOUR research to back up that claim? We have an epidemic of thyroid disease in this country--they have no such epidemic in Europe. We fluoridate our water supplies, they do not. We are basically from the same genetic lines as Europeans. Something is clearly causing the deterioration of thyroid health here and fluoride is known to affect the thyroid gland (among other undesirable effects). I draw the conclusion that the risk versus benefit equation requires that we eliminate fluordiation as repeated studies have shown that there is no dental benefit. The National Academy of Sciences has recommended that the "safe" level of 4pm be reduced. By the way, there is no such thing as "fluorinated water".
http://www.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=11571
Britain puts fluorine in its water!! And what about places that don't add fluorine because fluorine is already naturally occurring in the water? LIke in Bahrain, only not such high levels of it....
fluorinated water = water with added fluorine - of course it exists it's what you've been talking about all along
and why was there no obesity in the pre-industrical populations of Bahrain? If you look at Bahrain statistically, obesity has risen since the Bahraini people switched to bottled water which had much less fluorine in it than the spring water that comes from the island itself.... it can't have anything to do with people becoming sedentary and food becoming more easily available
as nice as it is to blame obesity on some dietary bogeyman (or bogeyman in the water).......... fact is obesity is the result of eating more food than you burn off.
They do not put "fluorine" in the water (fluorine is a toxic gas), they use:
"...Sodium Fluorosilicate (Na2SiF6) is primarily added to public drinking water as a fluoridation agent. This same compound is also used as an insecticide and a wood preservative. It is a classified hazardous waste by-product of phosphate fertilizer manufacture which, if not put into our drinking water, must be disposed of at hazardous waste facilities. Other names for it are Sodium Fluosilicate and Sodium Silica Fluoride..."
You should at least know what you are talking about before you argue with someone.
Britain is one of the few European nations that has a large and rapidly expanding problem with obesity and Bahrain has one of the highest rates of obesity in the world: http://www.kfshrc.edu.sa/annals/Old/213_214/01-007.pdf
Certainly, more sedentary behavior and more easily available food has an impact. But are the people eating more because of their access to sugar and high gluten wheat (with an underlying thyroid condition)? Are they more sedentary because they are sick? It is clear that something has changed and thyroid disease is just one factor among many in a constellation of causes. It is obvious that obesity is multi-factorial and giving simplistic nostrums like "calories in--calories out" does nothing to help anyone to curb the problem long term. Obesity is a complex illness.0 -
Flouride is an ion of flourine. Making the semantic distinction between flouride and flourine is like making the semantic distinction between sodium and salt. Ironic that you are claiming someone doesn't know what they are talking about by pointing out that flourine isn't flouride (even though it basically is.)
Also, please show me some evidence of this "thyroid epidemic" you are referring to.0 -
Actually, it does.giving simplistic nostrums like "calories in--calories out" does nothing to help anyone to curb the problem long term.
It is the very basis of what ANYONE needs to lose weight.
The fact that people try and claim they are special fairies who it doesn't apply to is much more of a problem, I would suggest.0 -
Actually, it does.giving simplistic nostrums like "calories in--calories out" does nothing to help anyone to curb the problem long term.
It is the very basis of what ANYONE needs to lose weight.
The fact that people try and claim they are special fairies who it doesn't apply to is much more of a problem, I would suggest.
I think the correct term on these forums are 'special snowflakes'.0 -
Flouride is an ion of flourine. Making the semantic distinction between flouride and flourine is like making the semantic distinction between sodium and salt. Ironic that you are claiming someone doesn't know what they are talking about by pointing out that flourine isn't flouride (even though it basically is.)
Also, please show me some evidence of this "thyroid epidemic" you are referring to.
"Flouride" (sic) does not exist as an ion of fluorine apart from a compound such as stannous fluoride, calcium fluoride. sodium fluoride, etc. Arguing about the chemistry is meaningless. There are a plethora of fluoride compounds that range in toxicity. I suspect that it is you who are making silly distinctions in order to obfuscate the issue--my question is why? The CDC estimates that 95% of fluoridated water supplies are fluoridated through the use of fluorosilicic acid:
"...Fluorosilicic acid (H2SiF6) is commonly used for water fluoridation. This form of fluoride is a toxic liquid by-product, acquired by scrubbing the chimney stacks of phosphate fertilizer manufacture. Other names for it are hexafluorosilicic, hexafluosilicic, hydrofluosilicic, and silicofluoric acid. (http://www.cdc.gov/fluoridation/fact_sheets/engineering/wfadditives.htm#1)
Thyroid epidemic: The American Thyroid Association estimates that "...as many as 20 million Americans have some form of thyroid disease..." and that likely "..12 percent of Americans will develop thyroid disease in their lifetimes..." http://www.thyroid.org/media-main/about-hypothyroidism/
I don't know about you, but I'd consider that to be an epidemic.0 -
mullberry and lindz need to hook up for a night out on the town …they sound like the same person …hey, what a minute!? ….0
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Actually, it does.giving simplistic nostrums like "calories in--calories out" does nothing to help anyone to curb the problem long term.
It is the very basis of what ANYONE needs to lose weight.
The fact that people try and claim they are special fairies who it doesn't apply to is much more of a problem, I would suggest.
While it is true that anyone can restrict calories and lose WEIGHT in the short term (you'll note that I SAID "long term"). But non-OCD individuals find calorie-restrictive diets tedious. That is why the weight-regain figures are so miserable. Calorie-restriction is ultimately not very effective for most people in terms of PERMANENT weight loss. In the end, WHAT you eat is easily as important as HOW MUCH you eat. I come here to share what has been effective for me and others on a long-term basis. I actually do not follow a strongly Paleo diet but I do eliminate wheat and added sugar (as the least painful/healthiest way to control blood glucose--which is a large part of controlling tendencies toward obesity).0 -
Actually, it does.giving simplistic nostrums like "calories in--calories out" does nothing to help anyone to curb the problem long term.
It is the very basis of what ANYONE needs to lose weight.
The fact that people try and claim they are special fairies who it doesn't apply to is much more of a problem, I would suggest.
While it is true that anyone can restrict calories and lose WEIGHT in the short term (you'll note that I SAID "long term"). But non-OCD individuals find calorie-restrictive diets tedious. That is why the weight-regain figures are so miserable. Calorie-restriction is ultimately not very effective for most people in terms of PERMANENT weight loss. In the end, WHAT you eat is easily as important as HOW MUCH you eat. I come here to share what has been effective for me and others on a long-term basis. I actually do not follow a strongly Paleo diet but I do eliminate wheat and added sugar (as the least painful/healthiest way to control blood glucose--which is a large part of controlling tendencies toward obesity).
so people that count calories are OCD, really?
Oh lawd here we go again ..so I can eat 500 calories of "quality" food, be over maintenance level, and still lose weight?0
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