What is clean eating?

jmv7117

anything not processed

For us, home processed is fine but not commercially processed foods with the exception of a very, very limited list of foods. Some clean eaters will include a larger list of commercially processed foods, but still very minimal at that. Even then there are other criteria any commercially processed food must meet before we consume them. Other clean eaters may or may not share these criteria.

rossraskolnikov

If "clean" eating is eating only non-processed stuff, can we agree that it doesn't have much to do with health OR weight loss?

Not really. There's ample evidence to suggest that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods (which is primarily what you're left with once you eradicate 'processed') has significant health benefits. Meat and dairy, there seems to be divided opinion on.


I haven't seen many suggest that frozen vegetables are 'unhealthy'. Some actually believe they're more nutritious because freezing preserves the nutrients.

Sabine_Stroehm

If "clean" eating is eating only non-processed stuff, can we agree that it doesn't have much to do with health OR weight loss?

And if you don't agree, tell me why frozen vegetables are unhealthy.

Part of the issue is there's a tendency to want to list examples, which often leads to discussions about what wasn't included.
Again, I think the name (as with many on here) is problematic. But, I know what I characterize as part of my health style and what I don't.

Annie_01

there are other costs involved here.

Interesting... like what?

Long story...very personal...this for me has been a journey not just about losing weight, health or getting fit.

So I do things my way...if that means opening my diary...I do...if it means closing it to just friends or not at all...then that is what I do.

I think that when you make assumptions about people based on such trivial things such as a closed diary you are being unfair. Maybe they are not trying to hide anything...maybe it is just how they choose to deal with their own journey.

I admit...I find it a bit insulting when someone implies that I am uneducated...lazy...stuffing my face with "junk"...but honestly...it is not about what they think...it is all about what I choose to do. What I choose to do to accomplish what I have set out to accomplish.

I hope that one day my journey will inspire someone else...but right now...I have to finish this journey on my own...doing it my way.

I leave others the same courtesy...letting them do it their way.

lemurcat12

If "clean" eating is eating only non-processed stuff, can we agree that it doesn't have much to do with health OR weight loss?

Not really. There's ample evidence to suggest that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods (which is primarily what you're left with once you eradicate 'processed') has significant health benefits. Meat and dairy, there seems to be divided opinion on.

Well. we mostly agree that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods is good, and I also happen to think that meat and dairy are just fine. (Personally, I think grains, even whole grains, tend to be somewhat overrated, and they certainly are processed under any reasonable definition, but I don't think they are bad for you at all, except that they aren't particularly nutrient-dense. This all supports my argument.)

The point, however, is that one can eat lots of vegetables and fruits whether or not one is a so-called "clean" eater, whether or not one attempts to cut out processed foods. Indeed, as I pointed out, processing may make it much easier to have access to vegetables and fruits, especially outside of the relatively short growing seasons some places, and typically are at least as healthy as those carted in from across the country or farther (as you stated below).

Thus, if the health-based advice that you would give is eat lots of vegetables and fruits, saying that you should "eat clean" seems a needlessly non-direct way of giving the advice. I'd recommend instead "eat lots of vegetables and fruits."

Not to mention, that just like some vegetarians I know, it's quite possible to cut out the so-called "bad" foods without bothering to replace them with what you might consider healthy. Depending on what we define as processed, I could quite easily preen about how I never eat TV dinners or poptarts or even those dastardly processed frozen vegetables and still eat very little in the way of fresh fruits or vegetables. I could delude myself that all natural peanut butter on whole wheat bread (again, seems pretty processed to me) 24/7 is a fabulously "clean" diet. But clean or not (and again, weird to claim it's not processed), that's not particularly healthy on its own.

It's not the not eating processed foods that's the issue, it's what the majority of your diet consists of. The "clean" nonsense is just a red herring.

I haven't seen many suggest that frozen vegetables are 'unhealthy'. Some actually believe they're more nutritious because freezing preserves the nutrients.

Hmm. Perhaps you haven't seen the many, many posts in this thread alone claiming that processed=unhealthy. As I've been saying, that's false. One reason I think it's bad advice to tell people (especially people who seem to be seeking basic advice on nutrition) that processed food is unhealthy is that there are a lot of good, health and nutrition-based reasons to include specific processed foods in one's diet. Processing is not the issue. I see nothing wrong with eating ice cream, but even if you disagree it really makes no difference whether it's store-bought or home-made. The difference, if any, has to do with the specific ingredients, so if there is a specific processed ingredient you think is unsafe at any speed (poor old sucrose, perhaps), then why not identify that, rather than claiming it's about "processing." Then we can debate the specific claim, at least, not just whether or not it's rude to tell others that their food is not clean (although obviously it is, or would be if it were not so absurd).

I just ate a salad with chicken bought from a local restaurant (that uses good ingredients, publishes nutrition information, blah, blah). Does that salad transform into something unhealthy merely because I did not make it myself?

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

We could still all argue about the evils of fruit and dairy (not my view, to be clear), whether people eat too much or too little protein, and the importance of bread, I guess. So we wouldn't be left with nothing to talk about, even if we dropped the assertion that only "clean" eaters are healthy (although they get to define for themselves what "clean" is, apparently).

jmv7117

If "clean" eating is eating only non-processed stuff, can we agree that it doesn't have much to do with health OR weight loss?

Not really. There's ample evidence to suggest that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods (which is primarily what you're left with once you eradicate 'processed') has significant health benefits. Meat and dairy, there seems to be divided opinion on.

Well. we mostly agree that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods is good, and I also happen to think that meat and dairy are just fine. (Personally, I think grains, even whole grains, tend to be somewhat overrated, and they certainly are processed under any reasonable definition, but I don't think they are bad for you at all, except that they aren't particularly nutrient-dense. This all supports my argument.)

The point, however, is that one can eat lots of vegetables and fruits whether or not one is a so-called "clean" eater, whether or not one attempts to cut out processed foods. Indeed, as I pointed out, processing may make it much easier to have access to vegetables and fruits, especially outside of the relatively short growing seasons some places, and typically are at least as healthy as those carted in from across the country or farther (as you stated below).

Thus, if the health-based advice that you would give is eat lots of vegetables and fruits, saying that you should "eat clean" seems a needlessly non-direct way of giving the advice. I'd recommend instead "eat lots of vegetables and fruits."

Not to mention, that just like some vegetarians I know, it's quite possible to cut out the so-called "bad" foods without bothering to replace them with what you might consider healthy. Depending on what we define as processed, I could quite easily preen about how I never eat TV dinners or poptarts or even those dastardly processed frozen vegetables and still eat very little in the way of fresh fruits or vegetables. I could delude myself that all natural peanut butter on whole wheat bread (again, seems pretty processed to me) 24/7 is a fabulously "clean" diet. But clean or not (and again, weird to claim it's not processed), that's not particularly healthy on its own.

It's not the not eating processed foods that's the issue, it's what the majority of your diet consists of. The "clean" nonsense is just a red herring.

I haven't seen many suggest that frozen vegetables are 'unhealthy'. Some actually believe they're more nutritious because freezing preserves the nutrients.

Hmm. Perhaps you haven't seen the many, many posts in this thread alone claiming that processed=unhealthy. As I've been saying, that's false. One reason I think it's bad advice to tell people (especially people who seem to be seeking basic advice on nutrition) that processed food is unhealthy is that there are a lot of good, health and nutrition-based reasons to include specific processed foods in one's diet. Processing is not the issue. I see nothing wrong with eating ice cream, but even if you disagree it really makes no difference whether it's store-bought or home-made. The difference, if any, has to do with the specific ingredients, so if there is a specific processed ingredient you think is unsafe at any speed (poor old sucrose, perhaps), then why not identify that, rather than claiming it's about "processing." Then we can debate the specific claim, at least, not just whether or not it's rude to tell others that their food is not clean (although obviously it is, or would be if it were not so absurd).

I just ate a salad with chicken bought from a local restaurant (that uses good ingredients, publishes nutrition information, blah, blah). Does that salad transform into something unhealthy merely because I did not make it myself?

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

We could still all argue about the evils of fruit and dairy (not my view, to be clear), whether people eat too much or too little protein, and the importance of bread, I guess. So we wouldn't be left with nothing to talk about, even if we dropped the assertion that only "clean" eaters are healthy (although they get to define for themselves what "clean" is, apparently).

You are missing the point. Here is an article right on MFP addressing some of the fears regarding processed foods.
http://blog.myfitnesspal.com/2014/07/are-your-food-fears-founded-by-science-or-social-media/

Whether you like someone's dietary choice is a moot point. Whether someone thinks sugar is the devil is a moot point. Whether someone refers to their diet as clean eating is a moot point. You do you and let others do as they feel is best for their own body.

lemurcat12

Again, I think the name (as with many on here) is problematic. But, I know what I characterize as part of my health style and what I don't.

And I have no argument with that. My argument is with (a) the term "clean eating" (because it is both meaningless and a slur on the food that others eat); (b) the claim that one can only have a healthy diet by cutting out foods, specifically "processed" foods or sometimes specific processed foods like wheat or sugar or dairy; and (c) the claim that there is some reason to cut out all "processed foods."

Most recently the assertion has been made that "processed foods" should be avoided because they are unhealthy. I am trying to explore that claim.

JoRocka

If "clean" eating is eating only non-processed stuff, can we agree that it doesn't have much to do with health OR weight loss?

Not really. There's ample evidence to suggest that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods (which is primarily what you're left with once you eradicate 'processed') has significant health benefits. Meat and dairy, there seems to be divided opinion on.

Well. we mostly agree that eating a diet rich in plant-based and whole grain foods is good, and I also happen to think that meat and dairy are just fine. (Personally, I think grains, even whole grains, tend to be somewhat overrated, and they certainly are processed under any reasonable definition, but I don't think they are bad for you at all, except that they aren't particularly nutrient-dense. This all supports my argument.)

The point, however, is that one can eat lots of vegetables and fruits whether or not one is a so-called "clean" eater, whether or not one attempts to cut out processed foods. Indeed, as I pointed out, processing may make it much easier to have access to vegetables and fruits, especially outside of the relatively short growing seasons some places, and typically are at least as healthy as those carted in from across the country or farther (as you stated below).

Thus, if the health-based advice that you would give is eat lots of vegetables and fruits, saying that you should "eat clean" seems a needlessly non-direct way of giving the advice. I'd recommend instead "eat lots of vegetables and fruits."

Not to mention, that just like some vegetarians I know, it's quite possible to cut out the so-called "bad" foods without bothering to replace them with what you might consider healthy. Depending on what we define as processed, I could quite easily preen about how I never eat TV dinners or poptarts or even those dastardly processed frozen vegetables and still eat very little in the way of fresh fruits or vegetables. I could delude myself that all natural peanut butter on whole wheat bread (again, seems pretty processed to me) 24/7 is a fabulously "clean" diet. But clean or not (and again, weird to claim it's not processed), that's not particularly healthy on its own.

It's not the not eating processed foods that's the issue, it's what the majority of your diet consists of. The "clean" nonsense is just a red herring.

I haven't seen many suggest that frozen vegetables are 'unhealthy'. Some actually believe they're more nutritious because freezing preserves the nutrients.

Hmm. Perhaps you haven't seen the many, many posts in this thread alone claiming that processed=unhealthy. As I've been saying, that's false. One reason I think it's bad advice to tell people (especially people who seem to be seeking basic advice on nutrition) that processed food is unhealthy is that there are a lot of good, health and nutrition-based reasons to include specific processed foods in one's diet. Processing is not the issue. I see nothing wrong with eating ice cream, but even if you disagree it really makes no difference whether it's store-bought or home-made. The difference, if any, has to do with the specific ingredients, so if there is a specific processed ingredient you think is unsafe at any speed (poor old sucrose, perhaps), then why not identify that, rather than claiming it's about "processing." Then we can debate the specific claim, at least, not just whether or not it's rude to tell others that their food is not clean (although obviously it is, or would be if it were not so absurd).

I just ate a salad with chicken bought from a local restaurant (that uses good ingredients, publishes nutrition information, blah, blah). Does that salad transform into something unhealthy merely because I did not make it myself?

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

We could still all argue about the evils of fruit and dairy (not my view, to be clear), whether people eat too much or too little protein, and the importance of bread, I guess. So we wouldn't be left with nothing to talk about, even if we dropped the assertion that only "clean" eaters are healthy (although they get to define for themselves what "clean" is, apparently).

^^^^

sound. This guy gets it.

Sabine_Stroehm

Out of curiosity: if the OP said "what is healthy eating" how would folks respond?

lemurcat12

You do you and let others do as they feel is best for their own body.

You will not be able to find a post on MFP where I criticized someone's personal dietary choices (other than saying that they should probably include more vegetables or protein when asked about that topic). Nor have I ever criticized someone else's choice to eliminate foods. Instead, I've said repeatedly that that can be a valid choice for individuals. If asked whether they should I may have said it wasn't necessary for health or to lose weight, but even there I'm sure I would have said it was going to be an individual thing.

Thus, I'm confident when I say it's not me, but the "clean" eaters, who are making assertions about one way of eating being superior. I'm just objecting to the silly notion that eating yogurt and frozen vegetables makes you less healthy or an "unclean" eater. Telling someone who is trying to figure out how to eat a nutritious diet that they MUST eat clean and that people who don't are unhealthy is IMO bad advice.

lemurcat12

Out of curiosity: if the OP said "what is healthy eating" how would folks respond?

To quote myself from a couple of posts ago:

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

J72FIT

Telling someone who is trying to figure out how to eat a nutritious diet that they MUST eat clean and that people who don't are unhealthy is IMO bad advice.

^^^This

J72FIT

Out of curiosity: if the OP said "what is healthy eating" how would folks respond?

To quote myself from a couple of posts ago:

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

Amen...

jmv7117

You do you and let others do as they feel is best for their own body.

You will not be able to find a post on MFP where I criticized someone's personal dietary choices (other than saying that they should probably include more vegetables or protein when asked about that topic). Nor have I ever criticized someone else's choice to eliminate foods. Instead, I've said repeatedly that that can be a valid choice for individuals. If asked whether they should I may have said it wasn't necessary for health or to lose weight, but even there I'm sure I would have said it was going to be an individual thing.

Thus, I'm confident when I say it's not me, but the "clean" eaters, who are making assertions about one way of eating being superior. I'm just objecting to the silly notion that eating yogurt and frozen vegetables makes you less healthy or an "unclean" eater. Telling someone who is trying to figure out how to eat a nutritious diet that they MUST eat clean and that people who don't are unhealthy is IMO bad advice.

No one here, on this thread, is telling anyone to eat clean. No one but you mentioned yogurt. The OP asked what clean eating is which is the only reason why some clean eaters are responding. I cannot speak for others here but I certainly do not tell anyone how to eat, what to eat or anything else with respect to 'their diet' other than make their own choices and not let other members badger them into opening their diaries. Accusing all clean eaters of making perceived assertions is nothing more than a red herring in the discussion of clean eating. If you perceive that someone feels superior due to their dietary choice, the perception is yours not necessarily what that person actually feels. I doubt anyone feels anything about how anyone else eats so why should you?

Sabine_Stroehm

Out of curiosity: if the OP said "what is healthy eating" how would folks respond?

To quote myself from a couple of posts ago:

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

Perfect. Works for me.

J72FIT

It's a marketing term that ignites debate and sells diet books, nothing more...

Just to reiterate...

jmv7117

OP asked the question then disappeared from the conversation. Seven pages later and still no sight of OP so I say...congratulations OP on a well played troll :drinker:

Sarauk2sf

Out of curiosity: if the OP said "what is healthy eating" how would folks respond?

To quote myself from a couple of posts ago:

Rather than go on about processing or eating "clean," or the horrors of letting some pre-packaged yogurt pass your lips, why not suggest that people eat a good variety of vegetables and fruits, get adequate protein and fiber (which may mean whole grains), focus on foods that will tend to be more filling and rich in micro-nutrients, etc. And then if they have room left eat some less nutrient dense foods if that's what they desire, in moderation (which this basically by definition is).

Perfect. Works for me.

Me too!

J72FIT

OP asked the question then disappeared from the conversation. Seven pages later and still no sight of OP so I say...congratulations OP on a well played troll :drinker:

Seems that way doesn't it...