StrongLifts 5x5
Replies
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What sort of HRM do you have?0
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What sort of HRM do you have?
I have a pro form TX-300.0 -
This may have been covered, but I'm gonna ask anyways lol. For those of you lifting, how are you noting calories burned in yoru exercise diaries? I started Jamie Eason's 12 week program today on bodybuilding.com and am trying to figure out how to note that. I know good and well that I'm burning more than 50 calories in one of those workouts
I also do bodyrock, and free weight work on my own at home, as well as running a few times a week. Any idea how accurate the calorie needs on bodybuilding are?
I tried MFP's calorie recommendations for a while and did t feel like I was getting enough (not enough energy for workouts) so I started to look into how it was calculated. MFP used the Harris-Benedict equation to calculate you BMR and then bases your calorie deficit off of this number. The problem is that while this method is the most popular it is not the most accurate for most people. In my research I discovered that the Mifflin equation has become known as the most accurate so I started using that and manually configuring my calorie goal into MFP.
MFP recommendation: 1990 calories for 1lb per week
Mifflin recommendation: 2147 calories for lb per week
This is a really long way for me to say that I do not eat back my exercise calories (I know, shame on me, I'm going to starve, etc...) however I don't deliberately try to stay under on my workout days either, I eat if I am hungry and if I go over some then oh well. This method has allowed me to lose the 1lb per week fairly consistently also.
That being said, the calorie burn for bodybuilding isolation type exercises is going to be significantly lower than the compound full body lifts done as part of SL, I would just try and eat an extra 100 calories or so to make up for it if you want to go that route.
I calculated based on the Katch-McArdle method which put me at 1800-2000 calories a day. I end up around 1700 if I"m lucky. I've gained 7 lbs in recent months that I don't necessarily NEED off, but I need to be sculpted, if that makes sense. With Jamie Eason's program I'll be doing leg, shoulder, arm, back, and ab splits with one day of cardio, though I plan to do the body rock and extra cardio to get the fat off as I'm working.
Why do some of you feel the HRM's don't work for weight lifting? Wouldn't it be based on how your heart rate goes up with heavier lifts? For instance, doing legs yesterday for half hour, my heart rate was boosted quiet a bit.0 -
HRM do not work for weight training. there are a number of threads on here about the topic
Why is this?
ask Azdak
or search for threads he's posted in. he can explain it a lot better than me. it has to do with the stress weights put on your heart and how your heart rate is only elevated for short periods of time i believe. but don't quote me on that.0 -
I would not be doing this thread justice if I didn't recommend SL 5x5 over a body building program, that is if adding muscle mass is you goal. The benefits of SL over a body building program out numerous. First it uses the 5x5 method and progressive loading to keep intensity high and reps low for brining about myofirillar hypertrophy (building muscle mass). Most importantly though, it uses compound muscle exercises and focuses on full body workouts 3x per week (no splits) which translates to more functional strength.This may have been covered, but I'm gonna ask anyways lol. For those of you lifting, how are you noting calories burned in yoru exercise diaries? I started Jamie Eason's 12 week program today on bodybuilding.com and am trying to figure out how to note that. I know good and well that I'm burning more than 50 calories in one of those workouts
I also do bodyrock, and free weight work on my own at home, as well as running a few times a week. Any idea how accurate the calorie needs on bodybuilding are?
I tried MFP's calorie recommendations for a while and did t feel like I was getting enough (not enough energy for workouts) so I started to look into how it was calculated. MFP used the Harris-Benedict equation to calculate you BMR and then bases your calorie deficit off of this number. The problem is that while this method is the most popular it is not the most accurate for most people. In my research I discovered that the Mifflin equation has become known as the most accurate so I started using that and manually configuring my calorie goal into MFP.
MFP recommendation: 1990 calories for 1lb per week
Mifflin recommendation: 2147 calories for lb per week
This is a really long way for me to say that I do not eat back my exercise calories (I know, shame on me, I'm going to starve, etc...) however I don't deliberately try to stay under on my workout days either, I eat if I am hungry and if I go over some then oh well. This method has allowed me to lose the 1lb per week fairly consistently also.
That being said, the calorie burn for bodybuilding isolation type exercises is going to be significantly lower than the compound full body lifts done as part of SL, I would just try and eat an extra 100 calories or so to make up for it if you want to go that route.
I calculated based on the Katch-McArdle method which put me at 1800-2000 calories a day. I end up around 1700 if I"m lucky. I've gained 7 lbs in recent months that I don't necessarily NEED off, but I need to be sculpted, if that makes sense. With Jamie Eason's program I'll be doing leg, shoulder, arm, back, and ab splits with one day of cardio, though I plan to do the body rock and extra cardio to get the fat off as I'm working.
Why do some of you feel the HRM's don't work for weight lifting? Wouldn't it be based on how your heart rate goes up with heavier lifts? For instance, doing legs yesterday for half hour, my heart rate was boosted quiet a bit.0 -
I haven't checked through all the posts, but noticed a few mentioned stalls. What I do is left heavy on the negative side. Mostly just for bench. You'll want a partner though, otherwise it gets tedious. Last year I was trying to get to 315 x 1. Around 275, my increases stopped. The heavy negatives at around 405 helped me reach 315. Anyway, just find a machine that can stop the weight from actually hitting your chest, either a smith machine or a cage. Put significantly more than your max on the bar. Lift off the holders and let it drop as slowly as you possibly can. Get a partner to help you put it back up and do it again.
I also recommend dumbbell bench. Makes your muscles work more.0 -
What stronglifts does for stalls is to repeat the same weight two more times. If you still can't do 5x5 the third time, you decrease your weight by 10% or 20lbs and then start increasing again. This should allow you to break through the stall. If you stall in the same spot a couple more times, it's time to move on to the next program.0
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I would not be doing this thread justice if I didn't recommend SL 5x5 over a body building program, that is if adding muscle mass is you goal. The benefits of SL over a body building program out numerous. First it uses the 5x5 method and progressive loading to keep intensity high and reps low for brining about myofirillar hypertrophy (building muscle mass). Most importantly though, it uses compound muscle exercises and focuses on full body workouts 3x per week (no splits) which translates to more functional strength.This may have been covered, but I'm gonna ask anyways lol. For those of you lifting, how are you noting calories burned in yoru exercise diaries? I started Jamie Eason's 12 week program today on bodybuilding.com and am trying to figure out how to note that. I know good and well that I'm burning more than 50 calories in one of those workouts
I also do bodyrock, and free weight work on my own at home, as well as running a few times a week. Any idea how accurate the calorie needs on bodybuilding are?
I tried MFP's calorie recommendations for a while and did t feel like I was getting enough (not enough energy for workouts) so I started to look into how it was calculated. MFP used the Harris-Benedict equation to calculate you BMR and then bases your calorie deficit off of this number. The problem is that while this method is the most popular it is not the most accurate for most people. In my research I discovered that the Mifflin equation has become known as the most accurate so I started using that and manually configuring my calorie goal into MFP.
MFP recommendation: 1990 calories for 1lb per week
Mifflin recommendation: 2147 calories for lb per week
This is a really long way for me to say that I do not eat back my exercise calories (I know, shame on me, I'm going to starve, etc...) however I don't deliberately try to stay under on my workout days either, I eat if I am hungry and if I go over some then oh well. This method has allowed me to lose the 1lb per week fairly consistently also.
That being said, the calorie burn for bodybuilding isolation type exercises is going to be significantly lower than the compound full body lifts done as part of SL, I would just try and eat an extra 100 calories or so to make up for it if you want to go that route.
I calculated based on the Katch-McArdle method which put me at 1800-2000 calories a day. I end up around 1700 if I"m lucky. I've gained 7 lbs in recent months that I don't necessarily NEED off, but I need to be sculpted, if that makes sense. With Jamie Eason's program I'll be doing leg, shoulder, arm, back, and ab splits with one day of cardio, though I plan to do the body rock and extra cardio to get the fat off as I'm working.
Why do some of you feel the HRM's don't work for weight lifting? Wouldn't it be based on how your heart rate goes up with heavier lifts? For instance, doing legs yesterday for half hour, my heart rate was boosted quiet a bit.
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.0 -
I wish my knee was better so I could try this. I have an appointment tomorrow at a sports injury clinic, hopefully that will result in some positive developments even if that means surgery. At least then once re-hab is done I can do stronglifts. Right now my knee can't handle that sort of weight.0
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I haven't checked through all the posts, but noticed a few mentioned stalls. What I do is left heavy on the negative side. Mostly just for bench. You'll want a partner though, otherwise it gets tedious. Last year I was trying to get to 315 x 1. Around 275, my increases stopped. The heavy negatives at around 405 helped me reach 315. Anyway, just find a machine that can stop the weight from actually hitting your chest, either a smith machine or a cage. Put significantly more than your max on the bar. Lift off the holders and let it drop as slowly as you possibly can. Get a partner to help you put it back up and do it again.
I also recommend dumbbell bench. Makes your muscles work more.
Another good way to help with stalling is by doing a Top-Half version of the exercise. Using the Bench Press as an example... You setup in a Power Rack and adjust the side bars to where you grab the bar and your arms are at a 90-degree angle; basically you're working from middel of the concentric movement. You can overload the weight on this type of lift too.
I couldn't find a good video on the bench press version but here's an example of the Top-Half Shoulder Press,
http://www.youtube.com/user/TestosteroneNation?blend=21&ob=5#p/u/0/rvWKBMTctCY0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"
My arms have never felt like Jello but deadlifts ARE a better mass builder for arms than curls, IMO. As they say "curls for the girls."0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"
My arms have never felt like Jello but deadlifts ARE a better mass builder for arms than curls, IMO. As they say "curls for the girls."
you seemed to know your stuff so hearing an ignorant comment like that is interesting.0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"
My arms have never felt like Jello but deadlifts ARE a better mass builder for arms than curls, IMO. As they say "curls for the girls."
you seemed to know your stuff so hearing an ignorant comment like that is interesting.
So you think a barbell curl is a better mass builder for arms than deadlifts? You might want to take a LONG look in the mirror before throwing out the "ignorant" term. Look at the GREAT bodybuilders throughout history, most, if not all, got their starts as powerlifters. It was only AFTER they acquired that mass that they refined it with isolation movements.
Take two equal lifters (similar size, genetics, etc), have one do bicep curls for a year and the do deadlifts. The guy doing curls (isolation movements) might keep up for awhile but in the long haul the deadlifter is going to get the better results because the compound lifter is going to put on overall body mass faster.0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"
My arms have never felt like Jello but deadlifts ARE a better mass builder for arms than curls, IMO. As they say "curls for the girls."
you seemed to know your stuff so hearing an ignorant comment like that is interesting.
So you think a barbell curl is a better mass builder for arms than deadlifts? You might want to take a LONG look in the mirror before throwing out the "ignorant" term. Look at the GREAT bodybuilders throughout history, most, if not all, got their starts as powerlifters. It was only AFTER they acquired that mass that they refined it with isolation movements.
most if not all? give me a break man. there's another comment out of thin air.
and yes i think a barbell curl is a better mass builder than a deadlift for your biceps. deadliftsdo work your entire body, but like i said before i've never felt like a had a great arm workout after deadlifts. your forearms get taxed from holding onto the bar, but basically your arms and hands are acting like hooks and the reason the weight is moving is because of back and legs. you know this though. i don't know what jroush is talking about saying his arms feel like jello. maybe he's pulling too much with his arms to get the weight started or something.
now if you had said barbell rows or pullups you may be on to something.
this obviously isn't going anywhere constructive though so have a nice day.0 -
most if not all? give me a break man. there's another comment out of thin air.
and yes i think a barbell curl is a better mass builder than a deadlift for your biceps. deadliftsdo work your entire body, but like i said before i've never felt like a had a great arm workout after deadlifts. your forearms get taxed from holding onto the bar, but basically your arms and hands are acting like hooks and the reason the weight is moving is because of back and legs. you know this though. i don't know what jroush is talking about saying his arms feel like jello. maybe he's pulling too much with his arms to get the weight started or something.
now if you had said barbell rows or pullups you may be on to something.
this obviously isn't going anywhere constructive though so have a nice day.
Deadlifts are a GREAT exercise, hands down my favorite. If I had to choose one exercise for the rest of my life it would be the Deadlift. Years ago when I first started doing dead's my chest was actually a little sore and I'll never forget the impact Dead's have on your entire body. HOWEVER... IF you want to grow appreciable mass and strength with your biceps you need to do some direct bicep work. Biceps are best developed with volume. The whole lift heavy thing doesn't apply to all muscle groups, mostly fast-twitch muscle fibers which your biceps are not. I'm not saying that deadlifts DON'T affect your biceps but don't look to deadlifts to build big biceps by themselves.
I used a mixed grip on the deadlift and my arms are never tired afterwards, however; many days I cannot do Shrugs if I chose to do a Shoulder / Deadlift split.0 -
I second this.
One thing I've noticed about SL5X5 versus bodybuilding type splits is lack of joint pain. Doing all of the isolated movements (barbell/dumbbell curls, tricep extentions/skullcrushers/pushdowns, etc) eventually caused me significant elbow pain. The compound movements don't and they seem to be adding more quality mass.
I bet if you asked the layman weightlifter/bodybuilder "what builds better bicep mass, heavy barbell curls or heavy deadlifts?" that 90% of them would say the curls. I disagree.
I'll third this.
On my last set of deadlifts, my arms were jello. I haven't been able to do that yet on any of the arm exercises.
oh come on. give me a break. how are deadlifts making your arms jello? i've yet to finish a set of deadlifts and say to myself "wow what a great arm workout"
My arms have never felt like Jello but deadlifts ARE a better mass builder for arms than curls, IMO. As they say "curls for the girls."
you seemed to know your stuff so hearing an ignorant comment like that is interesting.
So you think a barbell curl is a better mass builder for arms than deadlifts? You might want to take a LONG look in the mirror before throwing out the "ignorant" term. Look at the GREAT bodybuilders throughout history, most, if not all, got their starts as powerlifters. It was only AFTER they acquired that mass that they refined it with isolation movements.
most if not all? give me a break man. there's another comment out of thin air.
and yes i think a barbell curl is a better mass builder than a deadlift for your biceps. deadliftsdo work your entire body, but like i said before i've never felt like a had a great arm workout after deadlifts. your forearms get taxed from holding onto the bar, but basically your arms and hands are acting like hooks and the reason the weight is moving is because of back and legs. you know this though. i don't know what jroush is talking about saying his arms feel like jello. maybe he's pulling too much with his arms to get the weight started or something.
now if you had said barbell rows or pullups you may be on to something.
this obviously isn't going anywhere constructive though so have a nice day.
I would also rank deadlifts as better for arms than curls. This often gets overlooked because people think that the only way to work a muscle is through flexing the said muscle. During a deadlift, your biceps (and many other muscle) do not flex, however they do still contract isometricly and they do so under a heavier load then you could ever do with curls. Same goes for squats being better for your abs than thousands of situps.
Keep in mind we (or at least I am) are talking about MASS not SIZE, these often get lumped together as synonyms but they are not. Curls may build bigger arms than deadlifts, but they will not build stronger arms.
And yes, most of the original bodybuilders (Arnold, Reg Park, etc…) started as powerlifters and trained in the compound exercises. Today if you look at many bodybuilders they have big and flashy muscles but they are actually not very strong; aside from the top bodybuilders like Cutller and Coleman, but these guys also squat and deadlift heavy.0 -
I would also rank deadlifts as better for arms than curls. This often gets overlooked because people think that the only way to work a muscle is through flexing the said muscle. During a deadlift, your biceps (and many other muscle) do not flex, however they do still contract isometricly and they do so under a heavier load then you could ever do with curls. Same goes for squats being better for your abs than thousands of situps.
Keep in mind we (or at least I am) are talking about MASS not SIZE, these often get lumped together as synonyms but they are not. Curls may build bigger arms than deadlifts, but they will not build stronger arms.
And yes, most of the original bodybuilders (Arnold, Reg Park, etc…) started as powerlifters and trained in the compound exercises. Today if you look at many bodybuilders they have big and flashy muscles but they are actually not very strong; aside from the top bodybuilders like Cutller and Coleman, but these guys also squat and deadlift heavy.
Again, Biceps are built with volume. You can easily make an arguement that you can build nice biceps via Rowing and other back work but deadlifts ALONE will not build you big arms. Deadlifts are valuable but if your goal is bigger biceps Deadlifts alone will not get you there.
Arnold did plenty of direct arm work, his favorite arm exercise was incline dumbell curls if I remember correctly.
You can't compare powerlifters and bodybuilders. Powerlifters train in the deadlift, overhead press, bench press, and squat because they compete in 3 of those 4 lifts. They don't need big biceps to compete in those lifts. Not saying they don't have big arms because they do but there's a difference. Bodybuilders are not typically as strong as powerlifters, they drain for size, definition, and symmetry, strength is irrelevant. It's not apples-to-apples.
Train for what your goals are. If you want to powerlift and be good at it then don't curl. If you want bigger stronger biceps you need more than deadlifts. There is plenty of information about arm training, at nauseum at this point.0 -
When i lift i lift for strength,size, symmetry, lean muscle, muscle hardness... It's great that you guys are going for the strong lifts, its great mass and strength builder. But to my honest opinion i do not want to look like a strongman... Doing Deadlifts, Squats, over head press, bench press, will give you mass... but if you have seen a strongmen or a guys with lots of "mass" it doesn't look too great.. the muscle looks big but soft so you get confused if the dude is fat or if he is muscular, also i have worked for just mass before.. i got big pretty quick but when i stopped lifting i lost the mass just as quick, it is very important to do higher rep workouts too and other workouts to build up that lean muscle tissue that will actually stay on you for longer than a month or two. I do my regular workout of 8-12reps but on lets say back day i add the deadlift for 5-8reps, on leg days i do heavier squats 5-8reps, this way i am building size, and at the same time im adding the "power" movements to get my strength up.
To those that were saying that deadlift being the better "mass builder" for biceps then barbell curls or others... PLZZZ tell me your not srs??? There's couple strongmen that train at my gym.. they are deadlifting if i remember correctly 700-750lbs (full bar of 45lb plates) yet they are still doing skull crushers, barbell curls, bicep curls..
A famous strongmen Matt Kroczaleski even wrote a article in the March 2011 Muscle & Fitness magazine about him not only training as a strongman but also as a bodybuilder because he does not want to end up looking like other strongmen as they are not symmetrical and don't look as "fit"
It has his workout in that edition and Derek Poundstones (another famous strongmen) yet both of them still do barbell curls and other bicep workouts.. if what you say is true about deadlifts being a good workout for arms then explain why true strongmen that do it for living and put your lifts to shame still do those workouts?
Here is some links to pictures of strongmen and bodybuilders and tell me which one looks better to you and which physic would you prefer! oh and who has "bigger,more mass and nicer" arms
Strongmen:
http://www.crossfitsouthmetro.com/uploads/southmetro/image/6a00d8341bf90553ef0120a9381696970b-800wi.jpg
http://www.criticalbench.com/images/finnish-deadlifting.jpg
Derek Poundstone - Trains everything proper...
http://primalstrength.files.wordpress.com/2011/05/poundstone.jpg
Matt Krock..
http://muscleandbrawn.com/forums/attachments/bodybuilding/1275d1272635780-matt-kroc-goes-bodybuilding-2mdkwi9.jpg
Bodybuilders:
http://www.yurielkaim.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/09/arnold-schwarzenegger.jpg
http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_mC1TEdZ4gks/S188KeXORWI/AAAAAAAAF-k/pxaDPr1otN8/s400/Franco+Columbo+-+www.Musclebase.blogspot.com+08.JPG (can you lift that?)
Now just to make it clear.. i am NOT saying that deadlifts don't work the arms, they work the entire body.. its great.. but IT IS NOT the best "mass builder" for arms. or just do deadlifts everyday and expect to have big biceps! You still need to do other workouts and exercises if you want a proper physic. Also i didnt read the whole 8 pages of posts so if i missed something sorry lol0 -
Dude, Matt Kroczaleski is a friggin' BEAST!!! Ever see the video of him doing one-arm DB rows with 200lbs on the DB? He did a set of 20 reps I believe, so much for not doing volume, eh? I believe he trains at EFS to right? Even the EFS guys, professional powerlifters, do some isolation work. Jim Wendler's 5/3/1 manual specifically advocates doing assistance work. I haven't read it in a few months but I believe he advocated 5 sets of 10 reps or something like that.0
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not sure with who or where he trains.. in the magazine where they interviewed him he was saying he trains trains at home, his brother is a welder so when they get scrap metal they weld on custom barbell weights, dumbells etc... his deadlift bar is long metal bar with 2 truck tires welded on weighing in at 605lbs and he pumps out 10 reps in 95 degree humid weather... i tried to find a picture of him doing lunges INSANE!!! goes out in the winter with a with a 200lb light post cut log.. does 50 lunges 25 each, if his rear knee doesnt touch the ground he doesnt count it followed by 20 *kitten* to ground squats. (i thought you guys said he should just do 5... should ask him.. :S ) to fuel a beast that size you need 500g of protein and 500g of carbs a day!!
Would love to upload the magazine or show you guys
Here is a rep to his 40-rep squat.. you start heavy and drop set until you vomit... check out his youtube video.. (again high rep damn i wonder why he did the high rep instead of 5 reps all the time..)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5KkvrVq_0CM Copy and paste the link watch the whole thing.. he just dropps n then sits with a bucket...
just for fun, Derek Poundstones workout... i think im counting wrong but hes going way over 5 reps..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ms8jcc8npZY
this guy blends chicken breast, eggs, water, protein and makes that his shakes for work <--grossss
Ill be taking advice from these guys for now until i see you deadlift the back of my car for 16reps :P0 -
Curling doesn't build bicep mass and strength?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SF_rWAYJS6M&feature=related
Here's the rowing video I'm referring to,
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D7jAIdoORxI
Recent article from Lee Boyce on arm training:
http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/7_surprising_tips_for_bigger_arms&cr=0 -
I think we wont get a reply...
N seen the rows its awsome!!!0 -
I think we wont get a reply...
N seen the rows its awsome!!!
Did you realize he was shifting gears to bodybuilding? Wow! I saw picture of him at sub-10% bodyfat and he is ripped as hell.0 -
poundstone does some awesome lifts. that guy is crazy strong.0
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Deadlifts are valuable but if your goal is bigger biceps Deadlifts alone will not get you there.
Tell me WHERE someone said "deadlifts ALONE will get you there?" My point was that deadlifts are a better MASS builder because doing the compound movements will build OVERALL mass faster than an isolation movement. I don't get a pump from doing deadlifts in my biceps or my forearms. Sure, combined with the bent rows it will add bicep size.
My point was that you are going to build a bigger, more solid foundation than just doing isolation moves. StrongLifts are a MASS building program NOT a BODYBUILDING program. I'll still take deads over curls for the girls any day.0 -
I think it needs to be clarified that 5x5 is a methodology which can be incorporated into different programs (such as the Stronglifts version of it.) It can therefore be applied in various contexts.
Stronglifts is a good foundational programme which focuses on strength for a beginner. It is not the same as Bill Starr's original version in that it is not periodised into heavy, medium and light days which is more suitable for intermediate trainees.
My point is specificity. Your training should match your goals and your current level. SL 5x5 starts (quite correctly in my opinion) on the basis that for a beginner at least STRENGTH is the base which everything builds upon, be it in day to day life or sports conditioning. A BB routine where the trainee has never worked for strength is more limited to looks without as much of the additional benefits that true strength training brings. Fair enough looking good is all some people care about but that's certainly not the case for me and many others. I'll leave simply looking good to women...
The difference is where you start and where it takes you. You will get more overall benefits in starting on a strength programme and then switching to a BB routine than vice versa simply due to the functionality that strength brings.
Curls are great in the correct context. So are deads.
There's nothing to see here folks
Move along please.. 0 -
Quote: all of the pro-curl posts.
No-one said that deads or anything else will build “bigger” arms than curls, we said that it is a better “mass” builder. And as I continue to state time and time again, mass and size are not the same thing; denser muscles are stronger than fluid inflated (pumped) muscles, period. If we are going to continue this one-sided debate (because no one is debating curls will not build more size) then please at least read what I write, instead of just glancing it over and continuing to make counter points to things that were never stated.
If you want to be a bodybuilder than by all means hit every muscle once a week by every conceivable angle and be satisfied with your nice easy Abercrombie training style. However if you want to build mass, power, and strength, then get under a heavy bar and make it happen.
EDIT:
My apologies for my tone. I personally think that bodybuilding is stupid but if you enjoy it, then more power to you.0 -
No-one said that deads or anything else will build “bigger” arms than curls, we said that it is a better “mass” builder.
And that was the WHOLE point of my comment. If I'm training someone who is just starting out who wants to put on MASS quickly, I tell them to do heavy, compound movements, not curls. You build your mass with the compound movements, then you can refine that mass with isolation exercises like curls to make the muscle more aesthetically pleasing if that's what you're going for. I personally have no use for curls but that's not to say they don't work for others.0
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