the myth, starvation mode, and dont eat before bed.

wheelieblade

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Hootsmamma

bump

ladyhawk00

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Depends on your individual stats (and how much fat you have to lose), but typically if you stay fairly close to BMR, you won't have trouble.

These might help:

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/230930-starvation-mode-how-it-works

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/186814-some-mfp-basics

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits

registers

I think I see what you are trying to say, I just don't think you are very good an coming up with credible arguments. And yes, steroids are bad and have very serious side effects.
Medicating to lose weight and gain muscle is an idiotic idea. Especially when you experience lack of libido, acne, emotional outbursts (especially in the form of rage), and other not so pleasant side effects.

I don't agree with a medical approach to weight loss.I have known many people who taken steroids, with out the side effects you mentioned. I knew some professional body builders. One of my friends just retired from body building. He told me "the amount of steroids you need to take to be a pro is ridiculous" I don't EVER recall of pro bodybuilder dying due to steroid usage. Yes sometimes they die when they do stupid stuff like try to dehydrate their body to get a more lean look on stage.

Like I said, you can drown in a inch of water, does that make water dangerous? Depends on how use it.

And yes, HGH is a very popular steroid, and is sold on the black market.

I posted a few links above about GH. There are tricks you can do to trigger a natural release of GH from the body, it's very powerful for burning fat, it's also very critical for cell growth. You know one method to trigger it to release? Hunger will release Growth hormone. Oh about it being a steroid, no it's not. AS(anabolic steroids) mimic the effect of testosterone. Growth Hormone doesn't do this. It's not classified as an anabolic steroid.

I read your profile and you said it yourself you have issues with keeping weight off after you lose it... Maybe it is because your dieting method is simply not working. I can't say for certain I will keep the weight I have lost off once I have reached my goal because I have never attempted weight loss before - but I do know it seems absolutely like a reasonable and seemingly easy task by eating when I am hungry, stopping when I am full, making healthier choices and making exercise a part of my new lifestyle.

Yeah you're right eating 6 times a day wasn't working for me. Spent way too much time in the kitchen. On a more serious note. This is actually the first time I am combining everything I know in to one dietary approach. The results are fantastic, it's very easy.

For a beginner, I wouldn't recommend other wise. If a beginner told me they wanted to lose weight, I'd just tell them. "make sure you're getting enough protein it's critical for cell growth.Base your diet around that, make healthy food choices and exercise." Not complicated.

Yes heart disease and diabetes- and other obesity related diseases- have certainly increased in the United States and other countries in the past ten years- but so have trendy crash diets that cause the yo-yo effect of weight gain and muscle loss. There are many, many factors that have caused that increase and I would be willing to place money on a bet that it has absolutely zero to do with your incredibly outdated and irrelevant article.

You keep on talking about this "outdated" article. If i posted a study done 200 years ago where it states humans breathe air you would also say it's out dated. Our biology has worked pretty much the same in the last 10yrs. Fasting has been linked to many health benefits. Maybe if people incorporated fasting in to their daily lives we wouldn't have this issue.

I am done arguing with you considering you actually rhetorically inquired about steroid use, because its hilarious to me you actually find nothing wrong with using them.

You know what I think is funny, you think they are dangerous because you have absolutely no experience with them what so ever. You just blindly follow what people say. Isn't that what this entire topic is about? Guess what, asprin is dangerous too. This is a perfect example of you jumping to conclusions with out any evidence. Your only education on the subject is from the media.

registers

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Here are the facts about it. Not some random post that was gotten out of a fitness magazine. So we're on even ground I'll state it like this. Starvation mode is when your BMR slows down and your body starts to strip away it's muscle.

Without exercise, your BMR will slow down in about 72 hrs. You can combat this with exercise.

Protein get broken down to amino acids, carbohydrates get broken down in to glucose. Amino acids are critical for growth your immune system needs amino acids for it to function and repair itself. Lets say you go on a high carb diet, low in protein. Carbs can't turn in to amino acids, so what does your body do? It strips it from the muscle, slowing down your metabolic rate. This is your "STARVATION MODE"

Would this happen if you where consuming adequate amounts of protein with exercise? nope This obviously make complete sense.

Please click on the post ladyhawk posted the one about "caloric deficits" and read the second to last post completely disproving most of what he said.

ladyhawk00

Let me make sure I read this correctly. Now you're saying there's nothing wrong with taking illegal steroids?

musica814

[quote/] Here's the problem though...you can't argue with an idiot...because they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. Intelligent people eventually give up...and then the idiot that's posting the misinformation ends up with free reign to do and say as he pleases, post his garbage information wherever he pleases, and in the end, confuse and possibly hurt a lot of innocent people who are just trying to lose weight in a comfortable, safe manner.

In my opinion, this is where moderators should step in. When it comes to peoples safety...it should be bannable. I've been an admin/moderator on MANY automotive forums, as well as bladesmithing forums. Each forum I was with, implemented a clause into the agreement that if you were banned, and you tried to rejoin under a false name or email...you could be sued for stupid amounts of money for breaking the agreement.

it worked.

To Ascriminal:

Go back and read all your posts. You change your stance so many times it's not even funny...and I don't care if YOU think you have it straight in YOUR head...your method of communicating it to others is flawed at best. One second you're exclaiming that starvation mode isn't real...then that it's real but misunderstood...then that it's a lie...wtf man? Do YOU even know what the hell you're talking about?

Once again...a plea to the moderators to please do something about this guy?

Cris
[/quote]

^^THIS.

ladyhawk00

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Here are the facts about it. Not some random post that was gotten out of a fitness magazine. So we're on even ground I'll state it like this. Starvation mode is when your BMR slows down and your body starts to strip away it's muscle.

Without exercise, your BMR will slow down in about 72 hrs. You can combat this with exercise.

Protein get broken down to amino acids, carbohydrates get broken down in to glucose. Amino acids are critical for growth your immune system needs amino acids for it to function and repair itself. Lets say you go on a high carb diet, low in protein. Carbs can't turn in to amino acids, so what does your body do? It strips it from the muscle, slowing down your metabolic rate. This is your "STARVATION MODE"

Would this happen if you where consuming adequate amounts of protein with exercise? nope This obviously make complete sense.

Please click on the post ladyhawk posted the one about "caloric deficits" and read the second to last post completely disproving most of what he said.

You didn't disprove anything...you agreed with what he said and then said "you're wrong on these points", not giving any real explanation of why you think he's wrong, other than that you believe the BMR calculator was wrong for YOU, so you categorically state that they can't be right for ANYone. Despite the MANY studies that state that BMR calculators are fairly accurate for about 85% of the population. Basically like saying "well, I know this guy that has 3 legs, 4 arms, and weighs 45 lbs, he's 6'5" and the calculators don't work for him, so they must not work for anyone".

kaypee65

Although not a bodybuilder Lyle Alzado attributes his death to steroid abuse. Has it clearly been demonstrated in double blind laboratory studies? No. But you don't have to be a health professional with volumes of medical research to know that tinkering with the body's endorcrine system can be very damaging to long term health.

wheelieblade

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Depends on your individual stats (and how much fat you have to lose), but typically if you stay fairly close to BMR, you won't have trouble.

These might help:

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/230930-starvation-mode-how-it-works

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/186814-some-mfp-basics

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits

thank you, have tested my BMR on 2-3 different sites including this one and have had varying results, the average is about 1500 calories, but if I was to set my weight loss goal to 2lbs a week this would be around 300 cals less than my bmr

ladyhawk00

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Depends on your individual stats (and how much fat you have to lose), but typically if you stay fairly close to BMR, you won't have trouble.

These might help:

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/230930-starvation-mode-how-it-works

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/186814-some-mfp-basics

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/61706-guide-to-calorie-deficits

thank you, have tested my BMR on 2-3 different sites including this one and have had varying results, the average is about 1500 calories, but if I was to set my weight loss goal to 2lbs a week this would be around 300 cals less than my bmr

Yeah, 2 lbs per week is not appropriate for everyone. Generally only for someone with a lot to lose (75+ lbs). You'll probably do better about 1 lb per week.

MFP is sort of a "dumb" tool - even if a goal isn't appropriate for you, it will follow what you tell it and try to help you get there.

registers

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Here are the facts about it. Not some random post that was gotten out of a fitness magazine. So we're on even ground I'll state it like this. Starvation mode is when your BMR slows down and your body starts to strip away it's muscle.

Without exercise, your BMR will slow down in about 72 hrs. You can combat this with exercise.

Protein get broken down to amino acids, carbohydrates get broken down in to glucose. Amino acids are critical for growth your immune system needs amino acids for it to function and repair itself. Lets say you go on a high carb diet, low in protein. Carbs can't turn in to amino acids, so what does your body do? It strips it from the muscle, slowing down your metabolic rate. This is your "STARVATION MODE"

Would this happen if you where consuming adequate amounts of protein with exercise? nope This obviously make complete sense.

Please click on the post ladyhawk posted the one about "caloric deficits" and read the second to last post completely disproving most of what he said.

You didn't disprove anything...you agreed with what he said and then said "you're wrong on these points", not giving any real explanation of why you think he's wrong, other than that you believe the BMR calculator was wrong for YOU, so you categorically state that they can't be right for ANYone. Despite the MANY studies that state that BMR calculators are fairly accurate for about 85% of the population. Basically like saying "well, I know this guy that has 3 legs, 4 arms, and weighs 45 lbs, he's 6'5" and the calculators don't work for him, so they must not work for anyone".

Okay you might be right. A few others said they get varied results with BMR calculators. I do have more muscle mass than average. I still don't think it's right that those 15% of the population need to be misinformed.

registers

Although not a bodybuilder Lyle Alzado attributes his death to steroid abuse. Has it clearly been demonstrated in double blind laboratory studies? No. But you don't have to be a health professional with volumes of medical research to know that tinkering with the body's endorcrine system can be very damaging to long term health.

Yes I remember Alzado.dangers of anabolic steroid use is mostly based on the dosage. Like any other drug.

writtenINthestars

Wow reading this whole thread legit hurt my brain.

ladyhawk00

ok for those saying starvation mode is real I have a few questions

1) how long does this take?

2) is there a specific amount of calories I should eat to stave off starvation mode?

Here are the facts about it. Not some random post that was gotten out of a fitness magazine. So we're on even ground I'll state it like this. Starvation mode is when your BMR slows down and your body starts to strip away it's muscle.

Without exercise, your BMR will slow down in about 72 hrs. You can combat this with exercise.

Protein get broken down to amino acids, carbohydrates get broken down in to glucose. Amino acids are critical for growth your immune system needs amino acids for it to function and repair itself. Lets say you go on a high carb diet, low in protein. Carbs can't turn in to amino acids, so what does your body do? It strips it from the muscle, slowing down your metabolic rate. This is your "STARVATION MODE"

Would this happen if you where consuming adequate amounts of protein with exercise? nope This obviously make complete sense.

Please click on the post ladyhawk posted the one about "caloric deficits" and read the second to last post completely disproving most of what he said.

You didn't disprove anything...you agreed with what he said and then said "you're wrong on these points", not giving any real explanation of why you think he's wrong, other than that you believe the BMR calculator was wrong for YOU, so you categorically state that they can't be right for ANYone. Despite the MANY studies that state that BMR calculators are fairly accurate for about 85% of the population. Basically like saying "well, I know this guy that has 3 legs, 4 arms, and weighs 45 lbs, he's 6'5" and the calculators don't work for him, so they must not work for anyone".

Okay you might be right. A few others said they get varied results with BMR calculators. I do have more muscle mass than average. I still don't think it's right that those 15% of the population need to be misinformed.

Typically, when calculators are off, it has to do with one of two things: race (genetics) or medical issues (thyroid/PCOS). Calculators can be off for people of certain racial backgrounds due to different genetic dispositions for body composition and metabolism. And, obviously, if the thyroid or other metabolic regulators are not working properly, normal formulas do not apply.

One calculator/formula or website cannot be ALL things to ALL people. It's not reasonable to expect that. Things like BMR formulas work off of a bell curve. The vast majority are within "normal" range, but people who are vastly different from "average" are going to have to tweak the numbers - perhaps it isn't fair, but expecting one tool to adapt for people well outside normal ranges is pretty unrealistic.

Most people will need to tweak the numbers a bit at SOME point in the weight loss process. There's nothing exact about any part of weight loss (or ANY of the numbers available to us from ANY source), because there are far too many factors to try to account for all of them. But for MOST people, with a goal of a healthy weight and being physically fit, MFP can be trusted to set up an initial plan. There are very few people who aren't successful if they set realistic goals and follow the guidelines.

wheelieblade

weightloss aside, I would like to know a way of calculating my BMR, I know that I can handle a 1k cal deficit so not worried about that but am curious

ilsie99

Although not a bodybuilder Lyle Alzado attributes his death to steroid abuse. Has it clearly been demonstrated in double blind laboratory studies? No. But you don't have to be a health professional with volumes of medical research to know that tinkering with the body's endorcrine system can be very damaging to long term health.

Yes I remember Alzado.dangers of anabolic steroid use is mostly based on the dosage. Like any other drug.

Awesome. Now you are condoning the use of anabolic steroids in moderation for muscle gain. I'm sure that steroid use is endorsed by the NASM or whatever that you keep throwing around as one of your credentials?

What a joke.

carmenstop1

Here's the problem though...you can't argue with an idiot...because they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience. Intelligent people eventually give up...and then the idiot that's posting the misinformation ends up with free reign to do and say as he pleases, post his garbage information wherever he pleases, and in the end, confuse and possibly hurt a lot of innocent people who are just trying to lose weight in a comfortable, safe manner.

In my opinion, this is where moderators should step in. When it comes to peoples safety...it should be bannable. I've been an admin/moderator on MANY automotive forums, as well as bladesmithing forums. Each forum I was with, implemented a clause into the agreement that if you were banned, and you tried to rejoin under a false name or email...you could be sued for stupid amounts of money for breaking the agreement.

it worked.

To Ascriminal:

Go back and read all your posts. You change your stance so many times it's not even funny...and I don't care if YOU think you have it straight in YOUR head...your method of communicating it to others is flawed at best. One second you're exclaiming that starvation mode isn't real...then that it's real but misunderstood...then that it's a lie...wtf man? Do YOU even know what the hell you're talking about?

Once again...a plea to the moderators to please do something about this guy?

Cris

I agree completely....he spouts nonsense constantly and I am scared someone is going to read his garbage and follow his very flawed advice!

wheelieblade

Although not a bodybuilder Lyle Alzado attributes his death to steroid abuse. Has it clearly been demonstrated in double blind laboratory studies? No. But you don't have to be a health professional with volumes of medical research to know that tinkering with the body's endorcrine system can be very damaging to long term health.

Yes I remember Alzado.dangers of anabolic steroid use is mostly based on the dosage. Like any other drug.

Awesome. Now you are condoning the use of anabolic steroids in moderation for muscle gain. I'm sure that steroid use is endorsed by the NASM or whatever that you keep throwing around as one of your credentials?

What a joke.

while I wouldn't take steroids to enhance muscle building there are steroids to varying degrees in certain medications, one of my asthma inhalers contains steriods for instance

ladyhawk00

weightloss aside, I would like to know a way of calculating my BMR, I know that I can handle a 1k cal deficit so not worried about that but am curious

There's no exact way of measuring it, but you can do a couple of things. Bodybuggs or Bodymedia Fit are a monitor you wear all day that calculate cals burned (so they measure TDEE or total daily energy expenditure, not just BMR). But they aren't exact either.

You can also get RMR tested (similar to BMR). Many gyms can do it for $50-100. Or you can google BodPod for your area.

wheelieblade

have had a look at the uk equivalent of bodybug and don't find it cost effective, can't afford a gym at the moment now but thanks for the help, will ask my gp when I next see her see if she can advise, she is happy enough with what I'm doing at the moment

ladyhawk00

have had a look at the uk equivalent of bodybug and don't find it cost effective, can't afford a gym at the moment now but thanks for the help, will ask my gp when I next see her see if she can advise, she is happy enough with what I'm doing at the moment

Yeah, for me personally, I don't find it important enough to have a slightly more accurate number to spend the money on it.

One thing to note, though. I don't know if they do it in the UK, but a lot of gyms in the US will do the RMR test without you being a member, so it's not too bad of an expense.

wheelieblade

will have a look at the gyms near me thanks

registers

Although not a bodybuilder Lyle Alzado attributes his death to steroid abuse. Has it clearly been demonstrated in double blind laboratory studies? No. But you don't have to be a health professional with volumes of medical research to know that tinkering with the body's endorcrine system can be very damaging to long term health.

Yes I remember Alzado.dangers of anabolic steroid use is mostly based on the dosage. Like any other drug.

Awesome. Now you are condoning the use of anabolic steroids in moderation for muscle gain. I'm sure that steroid use is endorsed by the NASM or whatever that you keep throwing around as one of your credentials?

What a joke.

Funny how people just randomly assume things I never said. I can guarantee you that alcohol and tobacco use have killed more people than use of steroids. These are legal. Steroids are prescribed all the time. There many different types of steroids. I have known of Doctors who have taken steroids for the benefits. He does take them in very low doses. There was this long list of drugs that have killed people. I think anabolic steroids was like 225 on the list.

No it's not endorased by NASM. 6 meals a day was endorsed by NASM which is not "the best way" for weight loss. I have known many people who have used them without effects of emotional disturbance. Some do get this effect, but like anything else in life. Can we conclude that alcohol can effects people emotional state in a negative way? Yes the angry drunk. Can it change it for the positive? Yes the happy drunk.

capogirl728

While this makes perfect sense, I would bet that the reason cavemen aren't exactly the best example to compare to our current situation because they didn't live sedentary lives. They were constantly active and on the go.

registers

While this makes perfect sense, I would bet that the reason cavemen aren't exactly the best example to compare to our current situation because they didn't live sedentary lives. They were constantly active and on the go.

Yes you're right, activity is very important to counteract the effects of starvation mode.

TrophyWifeSass

Crap, now I'm hungry!!!!

cheryl3660

Apparently cavemen weren't Diabetic.

Thank you!

My take on all of this is that everyone is different. I never accepted that "a calorie is a calorie no matter where it comes from" or a "carb is a carb, no matter where it comes from" line of thinking. I call BS because, for me, it is different. I was up and down with my weight loss until I started eating something for breakfast within an hour of waking. It's what works for me. May not work for others. I also have a very low metabolism and I didn't lose weight on 1200 calories a day. At 1300, however, my body says fine.

So I don't think either line of thinking is wrong per se, it just depends on the person. As you say, you have to go from personal experience and not because someone else says so. There are so many corporations and people pushing a personal agenda, that it is hard to know what to believe. It's all about research based on your personal circumstances and finding what works for you.

registers

Apparently cavemen weren't Diabetic.

Thank you!

My take on all of this is that everyone is different. I never accepted that "a calorie is a calorie no matter where it comes from" or a "carb is a carb, no matter where it comes from" line of thinking. I call BS because, for me, it is different. I was up and down with my weight loss until I started eating something for breakfast within an hour of waking. It's what works for me. May not work for others. I also have a very low metabolism and I didn't lose weight on 1200 calories a day. At 1300, however, my body says fine.

So I don't think either line of thinking is wrong per se, it just depends on the person. As you say, you have to go from personal experience and not because someone else says so. There are so many corporations and people pushing a personal agenda, that it is hard to know what to believe. It's all about research based on your personal circumstances and finding what works for you.

I agree with finding what works for you. That's the best advice anyone can give. Is it possible your breakfast consisted mostly of protein?

cmaloy11

I think that youre on the money. I started counting calories and it has made all of the difference in the world. right on