Too large for a seat, did the venue respond correctly?

That_Girl

Being supportive doesn't mean you can't have feelings or you can't ever say you don't like something.

Some of my most treasured people have made me face my issues and called them what they were. I don't look at them as being unsupportive. They probably saved my life. Had they just held my hand and said, "It will be okay", I wouldn't be where I am today with being able to look at myself and face all my demons.

That being said, I have read through the comments and see both sides and feel everyone's responses. This isn't a simple black and white issue.

Most of us have issues that make us "disabled" in one way or another. If you have bad shoulders, you can't carry heavy things. People on the outside may think you are lazy when you aren't helping move things in any situation. If you have issues gaining weight, people disregard your problems and tell you they wish they had that problem. There are many circumstances in which we judge other people without knowing their problems, good or bad.

Something that comes to mind is when I rode the bus when I lived downtown. Because of my medical issues, I couldn't stand for long periods of time without experiencing excruciating pain. It is general knowledge that in a crowded bus, able-bodied, young people should give their seats up for elderly/disabled people (there are even signs on the bus stating this). Many times I would pray no one would need my seat. Sure, I looked healthy and happy and able-bodied, but even standing for 20 minutes would spiral me into enough pain to put me in bed for a day. There were times I would try to ignore the person waiting for my seat. I would reluctantly get up because I could feel other people behind me staring at me to get up and offer my seat. I would then hobble home and have to lie down for a few hours to a day to manage the pain. This would throw my life into chaos because I couldn't do what I needed to do. Did the people on the bus care about my problems? Did they ask? Nope. I didn't expect them to. We can't always share our life story and many of us don't want to.

I guess my frustration in this is that people are judging other people for judging, but we all judge. We can't look at a person and know the state of their health. When it comes to the OP's original situation, I have to think, Life's not fair. I don't like 'rewarding' people because they cannot fit into a seat, but I understand that sometimes there are no other options.

In a perfect world, we would all just smile and let things roll off our backs. But this isn't a perfect world. When someone cuts you off on the road, you curse at them (probably) without thinking that maybe they have had a bad day, are having an emergency or something of that sort. No. We judge and think they are jerks.

The woman who was given seats in the VIP section is just one woman. I have never seen anything of this sort happen in my own life experiences, but I don't think it should be the general rule. They couldn't down-grade her, and maybe this was the best option for that moment.

crazymama2two

This is a very tricky situation. From a business standpoint, they did what was easiest for them. It was easier to move her and her friend than to risk her friend going completely off the handle about it.Their solution quickly diffused a potentially volatile situation, and that is the main job of customer service. They can't please everyone, but turning her away, or making her stand would be a discrimination lawsuit in the making.

I honestly think I would be a little jealous about it though. I hate thinking the worst of anyone, but it is a completely reality that she could have done it on purpose. There are a lot of people out there who do those types of things on purpose! It is not as though people who are overweight don't KNOW it. A lot of times they either don't know what to do to change it, or just don't care. There are a few, and I mean a few, who can't change it.

I often wonder about how society would react if we stopped treating obesity as a "disability" and something to tiptoe around to avoid offending someone or hurting someone's feelings?

Oh and before it can even be said. I'm a horrible person, catty and evil and blah blah blah. I don't care.

this and this!

_beachgirl_

Many overweight people don't "choose" to be. Medical conditions, prescriptions, and psychological issues can cause someone to gain weight out of their control.

is there seiously any kind of medical condition that would cause someone to become morbidly obese without making some poor choices alond the way. i would doubt it but if someone can prove me wrong then i will be happy to accept it.

sure, some people maybe more predisposed for storing fat etc etc but im sure it would take more than just a genetic or medical condition to become so large that you cant fit in to a seat.

Hypothyroidism
Prader-Willi Syndrome
Polycystic Ovary Syndrome
Cushing Syndrome
Cardiac and Kidney problems can cause water retention
Urinary problems
Repiratory problems
Antidepressants
Corticosteriods - my friend gained almost 100 pounds after being on them for a lengthy period of time due to her medical issue
Lithium
Tranquilizers
Phenothiazines

All of the above can make you gain weight.
And that's off the top of my head.

RoadDog

Can't say anything helpful, so I am going to butt out of this one. I feel for the person. Must have been embarrassing. But.....an overwhelming percentage of the obese are obese of their own choosing.

srp2011

Replying to the many posters who have tried to insist that being morbidly obese is not a choice - that is an absolute cop out. YOU have a choice over what you put in your mouth. YOU are responsible for your life, whether you like it or not. Stop blaming all of these outside causes and accept the fact that you are responsible and that where you are at in life is the result of CHOICES you have made along the way. Yes, there are conditions that may make it easier to gain weight, but you CHOOSE whether or not to counteract those conditions. Sorry if I'm not willing to throw you a pity party, but I've gone through hard times in my own life, and I've overcome a lot of things through hard work and committed effort and good choices so I really don't have a lot of sympathy for people who spend the better part of their lives coming up with excuses. I've had to pass up the instant gratification for long term rewards countless times, so again, I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who choose not to and then want everyone to be all politically correct and tiptoe around them because they haven't.

BTW, I have the utmost respect for people with genuine disabilities - someone with MS, or a paraplegic, or an amputee, etc... doesn't have a choice about their condition - compare those conditions to obesity and take note of the difference.

Bigpelly8

Interesting points of view here. I would say I am glad that the venue accomodated her, instead of just blowing it off and telling her tough *kitten*. Also, I'd be there to see the concert, and I wouldn't really bother myself with other peoples seat lcoations.

Now from my personal experience, and anybody who has ever been to Fenway Park can probably agree, but unless you are a fifth grader and weigh 80 lbs, those seats are not made to squeeze adult size *kitten* in them, let alone a larger than most size *kitten*! I have paid for seats before and was so uncomfortable, I had to go to the standing room only section, and I was more than ok to do it. It never once would have crossed my mind to complain and get "upgraded". I would be too embarrassed to call any of that extra attention on myself.

Lastly, I 100% agree with venues listing the seat dimensions. I think it is a great idea!!

Suedre

Wow! Lots to think about!

Several people mentioned that it didn’t directly affect me and I got the seats and show I paid for. You are absolutely 100% correct. It was an awesome show too, had a great time. I do wonder though, what about the guy that paid the $350+ for his padded VIP seat only to have two women squeezed in directly in front of him? Kind of sucks for him right?

I guess what I was struggling with was what so many of you mentioned personal responsibility and the extent of someone’s rights. One thing that goes through my mind is I’m faced with a similar situation due to my height. I’m terribly uncomfortable at some of the local venues (where it’s not appropriate to stand) and on a particular airline. I know that I don’t fit and I know when I leave my lower back is going to be screaming from trying to find a way to get my knees in there. I really don’t think that is the venue or the airline’s problem. I don’t think there should be a special ‘tall section’ where us long-legged folks can be more comfortable. Instead, I’ve solved the problem by paying the premium for seats at the beginning of a section that do not have a row in front and in the case of the airline, I speak with my money and don’t fly with them.

I think at the end of the day, I would have no problem with the added seats had they paid for their upgrade. Maybe it’s not for a good well thought out politically correct reason, it’s simply because that’s what I would have done if standing or moving to the general admission lawn was not an option.

Thanks so much for all the thoughts and mostly respectful tone with such a tough topic. You all really have me thinking and have so many valid points and points of view.

tammyquinnlmt

I am obese, and sometimes venue seats are uncomfortable. I would never dream of complaining though. I would be rather upset I think if I paid money to see an event and someone got better seats because of their choices. I have PCOS so getting fat wasn't a choice I made, however, getting this fat...WAS a choice I made. I ate because I wanted to, or because I was bored. I still struggle, but I'm doing something about it. On the other hand...what are you going to do about it? Complaining will get you no where, and she may have had other issues such as a bad back or knees that kept her from standing that long. Who knows..until you are in their shoes.

feliciapeters

i think the venue did the easiest "fix" they could think of on the spur of the moment without embarressing anyone, & bothering the least amount of people

we ALL have a "lucky day" once in awhile this one was hers. Besides u dont know that in a private conversation they didnt ask her to pay additional $

yanicka

Replying to the many posters who have tried to insist that being morbidly obese is not a choice - that is an absolute cop out. YOU have a choice over what you put in your mouth. YOU are responsible for your life, whether you like it or not. Stop blaming all of these outside causes and accept the fact that you are responsible and that where you are at in life is the result of CHOICES you have made along the way. Yes, there are conditions that may make it easier to gain weight, but you CHOOSE whether or not to counteract those conditions. Sorry if I'm not willing to throw you a pity party, but I've gone through hard times in my own life, and I've overcome a lot of things through hard work and committed effort and good choices so I really don't have a lot of sympathy for people who spend the better part of their lives coming up with excuses. I've had to pass up the instant gratification for long term rewards countless times, so again, I don't have a lot of sympathy for people who choose not to and then want everyone to be all politically correct and tiptoe around them because they haven't.

BTW, I have the utmost respect for people with genuine disabilities - someone with MS, or a paraplegic, or an amputee, etc... doesn't have a choice about their condition - compare those conditions to obesity and take note of the difference.

100% Taking responsablility for your own choice is a must for me.... but not that important in our society sadely. I think the reason why people here do not have any patience in this is because everyday, those on MFP make the choice to be commited to a healtier life style. We stop bull ****ting ourself and made a change. I have PCOS and narcolpesy....2 really good reasons to be fat and just site on my bottom and eat nachos but everyday I do my best to be healthy. It's not easy....but it's worth it

LeviFit

Put your self in her shoes. We do not know her circumstances.

Cheermamasita

Very well said!
Focus on a solution rather than the problem.
The problem belongs to the individual and I'm sure she did not really feel "rewarded" for her obesity.

feliciapeters

Not too mention, venues make seats as small as humanly possible to fit in as many as they can. perhaps this was her 1st time at this venue didnt know how small the seats were & hasnt had too much of a problem in other places in the past.

perhaps she hasnt gone somewhere like this in a long time & didnt realize there would be an issue because it wasnt something that even occured to her?

making waaay too much of this

mmtiernan

While I don't necessarily agree with this woman's lack of planning - we all know how large/small 'standard' seating really is - I do understand the management's actions and it was likely better for everyone involved, including those who may have been seated next to this woman in her original location, to move her to the best possible alternate location.

I took my then 13-year old daughter to a concert at the State Fair a few years back. Seated next to her was an extremely large couple - both the man and the woman were very obese, so much so that they leaned away from one another in order to 'fit' into the seating. However, they did not fit, at all. In fact, the man spilled over onto my daughter's seat and leaned in toward her since he could not sit upright next to his equally obese wife. This entire situation completely frightened my daughter - to have some unknown, very large man half-sitting on her seat, leaning over on her. Fortunately, my seat was an aisle seat. I traded places with my daughter and she half-sat on my lap and the aisle seat. Not comfortable for either of us, nor what I paid for! To make it all worse, the couple was exceptionally rude, giving us angry looks for adjusting to move my daughter - as if we were purposely re-adjusting to make some sort of statement about their size - they acted as if we were violating THEIR rights!

The whole situation reminds me very much of the smoking issue. Folks who smoke get angry and belligerent about being asked not to smoke. However, their smoking completely violates my right NOT to smoke since I'm being forced to breathe it in when they do it in my space. I have no problem if someone wants to smoke. That's their choice. But I do have a problem when it takes away my choice not to smoke.

I don't think there is a good answer here. I feel for the woman - I believe that she must have been very embarrassed, particularly since you say that she made every attempt to actually fit in the seat, she was clearly very self-conscious about it. But I also see the other side - how much it might have affected those around her, so the management's decision to move her was probably best for all parties involved - the woman and the folks who were seated around her. At least all were made comfortable and able to enjoy the show.

I would also like to add a note to those who made mention of handicapped people possbily not having any choice. I have a 27 year old niece who is severely handicapped. She essentially cannot use one side of her body, with an arm and hand that she can not extend and a leg that drags because she can not move it properly. She is also mentally challenged and does struggle with weight, due to her inability to move fully. Yet she still chooses to go to Zumba several times per week and she moves as best she can, with probably more effort and exuberance than over half the class.

It's all about choices. I try very hard to respect an overweight person's choice or a smoker's choice or anyone else's choices, even when I do not understand their choosing and would not make the same choice myself. Where I get upset is when one person's choice takes away the choice of another.

FearAnLoathing

This world is full with enough people (usually thin) that belittle, judge, criticize & make fun of fat people.
I choose NOT to become one of "those people" when I've finished my battle of the bulge.

And heavy people never ever make fun of thin people,oh wait I forgott its ok because they are thin

travis1325

For a bunch of people with weight problems I don't find a lot of you very charitable. There, but for the grace of God, go I.:sick: :sad:

I agree. I have read a lot of people say that if she is that size she probably always has these issues. I am not sure she would? What happens if she DOESNT go out often because of her weight. Also if they were lawn seating I would assume they would be folding chairs anyway, and not something I would have to cram myself into, therefore I wouldn't have called to find dimensions.

The original post says her FRIEND complained, not her. So she was willing to do something else NOT to be singled out.

As someone that has lost a lot of weight, I would feel sorry for her, and then happy she got the upgrade, but then still sorry for her because of how everyone must be looking at her. You have to remember that she was probably STILL humiliated when she got the upgrade because then they had to VISIBLY make accomodations for her in the VIIP section. MORE EXPOSURE.

Maybe she had lost a lot of weight already and was rewarding herself and finally getting out and doing something because she felt better. I am sorry but everyone that would have *****ed about this I can't see as respectable, supportive people that would promote someone being healthy. It is all fine and good to say "Fat *kitten* lose some weight" but honestly, having heard that all my life, it doesn't promote healthy living, only mental stigmas surrounding self-image.

Good for everyone that has lost weight. Now we just need to remember to live as the example, NOT as the elite.

Losingitin2011

This world is full with enough people (usually thin) that belittle, judge, criticize & make fun of fat people.
I choose NOT to become one of "those people" when I've finished my battle of the bulge.

And heavy people never ever make fun of thin people,oh wait I forgott its ok because they are thin

Exactly. Isn't hypocrisy grand? ;-)

RhonndaJ

I have mixed feelings about this.

As someone who's been in a similar situation I really do feel for the woman because it is embarrassing as heck and may not have had anything whatsoever to do with lack of planning on her part. Who's to say she was familiar with the venue? Now, i say that not knowing exactly how large she was, but there is a grey area in seating that is really hard to navigate because there is no consistency in seat sizes. I might fit fine in one venue, but not in the next.

Most recently I went to a local event where I figured I would not fit in the seats but I did so with the mindset that I would try, and if I didn't I would ask if there were alternate accommodations that could be made or I would forfeit the cost of the ticket. I went aware. Well, I didn't come close to fitting in the seat and after a discussion they gave me a chair and had me seated in the wheelchair area. Had they had someone in a wheelchair that particular night I'm fairly certain I would have been SOL, and that would have been fine but I was grateful for the accommodation.

Now, rewind a number of years ago when I could still reasonably comfortably fit in economy airplane seats. Working on the assumption that if I could fit in those well enough I should be able to fit in the seats in a newly outfitted theatre. As it turned out, it was a mistaken assumption. There wasn't a chance I was going to fit. So, again a discussion with a staff member, some walkie talkie calls later and both my husband and I were escorted to what I swear were the best seats in the house...think leather recliner seats as compared to theatre seats. Again it was a situation where the seats were empty anyway so they accommodated us. Had they been unable to do so, I would have understood. And according to the woman we spoke with it was the theatre's policy to handle people that way. If seats were available they would move you...and then sell the seat, if they could, that were now empty. I presume all venues, large ones at the very least, have protocols.

Is what they did right? Honestly, yes and no, depending on perspective. They saved the woman further embarrassment by moving her to an area that had room. Does it make the people around her resentful because she got more simply for being too big for the usual seats? Some, yeah, probably, and in a way I don't blame them.

But I wonder how many would feel resentful if the person were in a wheelchair and given the same treatment. Obesity on that level is a handicap, and we don't know why she was that size any more than we know how someone got to the point of being in a wheelchair. Both could be beyond the person's control, or both could be self caused.

Thriceshy

Perhaps she did agree to pay? Maybe that was part of the discussion? It's possible regulations prevented them from setting the chairs up where they initially were? Maybe they felt awful for her, same as you did? I wouldn't consider it rewarding her for being heavy-no concert ticket makes up for that sort of humiliation. I'm just glad she got to see the show. As someone with debilitating back pain, I can certainly understand why she couldn't stand for an entire concert.

Kris

sculptandtone

The venue did exactly the right thing. But, I'm curious to know how the OP knows she didn't pay for the upgrade? Perhaps she did. It's not like she'd pull out a wad of cash in the middle of a crowd and hand it to some usher. But, even if she didn't, I am glad this woman found some compassion at the concert. I quite think she paid a price much higher than money. I would think that anyone who is on this board would identify with and have some empathy for her....even if fitting into a chair is not an issue for you, we all have our challenges when it comes to weight. I've never had to get a second seat or a belt extender or anything of the sort. But, I certainly don't judge people who do.