OK, let's talk

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jbeauchamp1

You have no complaints from me. To be quite honest I was getting a little disturbed by the amount of sexual content and very heavy and sometimes inappropriate flirting. I am all for making friends and if someone finds a soul mate on here so be it but keep the conversations clean and private if they need to become inappropriate. I almost posted today that people need to remember what this site is about and that we are all here for a common goal and that is to get healthy not see who we can pick on, pick up or put down....but I hate drama so I kept my mouth shut! I myself have a great group of supportive people and I would be lost without this site. Thanks for all you do and giving of your time to explain this to everyone. I recommend this site on a daily basis and I like knowing that you all care about the content so noone is offended.

Thanks again!

AshjMusik

Thank you so much for this wonderful site & your communication on these issues!

gandydancer

You have no complaints from me. To be quite honest I was getting a little disturbed by the amount of sexual content and very heavy and sometimes inappropriate flirting. I am all for making friends and if someone finds a soul mate on here so be it but keep the conversations clean and private if they need to become inappropriate. I almost posted today that people need to remember what this site is about and that we are all here for a common goal and that is to get healthy not see who we can pick on, pick up or put down....but I hate drama so I kept my mouth shut! I myself have a great group of supportive people and I would be lost without this site. Thanks for all you do and giving of your time to explain this to everyone. I recommend this site on a daily basis and I like knowing that you all care about the content so noone is offended.

Thanks again!

gandydancer

I agree completely, too much flirting, inuendos and sexual talk has its place but not here, take it to private emails but somehow the people that promote that type of conversation don't seem to want it to be private, rather they seem to want everyone to read it, why?

fitplease

Thank you, moderators, for all the hard work you do! I appreciate having a site that is low key and focused on its goals.

RunRideRay

** applause **

Mike and all, THANK YOU for the site and taking some control back.

MFP was starting to become a social experiment, with some grade school humor and antics, and I can't be happier to see you taking back some control. I know it is tough, and you'll have all kinds of tugs and pulls, but stay your course my friend. It was your vision that created this awesome site, and it will take that leadership to keep it awesome. GREAT JOB!!!

dumb_blondes_rock

Where all the white wimmen at?

quoting blazing saddles will always get a laugh

Mike

OK I'm back, and will be responding to as many posts as I can tonight before I pass out from exhaustion... :yawn:

Mike

My problem is the absolute ban on "sexuality" posts, but what that really means is *sexual orientation*. You've compared it to religion, etc and said there are no posts allowed about religion or politics, etc.

BUT, it's different. it isn't a topic ABOUT being gay. People just want to post to find other LGBT people to friend. That's it.

Just like I've seen people here request "kosher" recipes, or "halal" recipes. Though those are religions dietary restrictions, they aren't posts ABOUT religion. Those are just people looking for help from others regarding a topic that happens to *intersect* with religion.

The groups is a great idea. But, in the interim, I don't see why posts where someone happens to mention that they are gay and seeking other LGBT friends should be banned. If THAT is considered talking about "sexuality," then I want every single post wherein someone mentions their husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, etc banned. I fail to see how there's any difference and that too isn't talking about "sexuality."

CeeJay - I responded to a similar post to yours earlier, so you might want to check that out. But in a nutshell, our ultimate goal is to get rid of the rule against religion and sexuality entirely. We're going to start with groups, and also implement a bunch of other changes that we hope will help foster the supportive environment we're looking for. But our hope is to just get rid of this rule entirely. We just need to make sure we can do it in a way where participants in those threads can feel supported and at the same time, we don't overburden our mods.

jillybeanruns

A huge thank you to Mike, Al and everyone else that has made MFP such a great community. Sure, there are flaws, but I appreciate you being open and honest about them. I think making the rules more visible and the creation of Groups are both brilliant ideas!

As a person who has logged into MFP for 615 days consecutively (as of today), I can't see myself leaving MFP at any point in the near future. But I have seen a lot of things going on within the boards, especially these high school type cliques, inside jokes and people bashing, that made me start to question sticking around for the long term.

Thanks for doing all that you do:flowerforyou:

Mike

I'd love a better "find members" function. Maybe the ability to narrow it down to a 5 mile radius? Or to search by keyword (i.e. find others who identify as a certain religion or sexuality)

Definitely on our to-do list also. The find members is terrible right now - it's ridiculously slow, for one thing. We definitely want to fix it, but we've unfortunately got a lot on our plate right now. It's definitely something we would like to make happen though.

fatboypup

IM ALL AMPED UP ON COTTON CANDY please dont ban me im only 2lbs from goal weeeeeeee

godblessourhome

As a person who has logged into MFP for 615 days consecutively (as of today)

i know this is off-topic, but you, lady, are aawesome! way to go!

Mike

If I'm being redundant on some of this, I'm sorry. I didn't take time to read everyones post and usually I do. However, I'm trying to get about 20 quarts of spaghetti sauce so that a) we can have some supper tonight, and b) I can start canning tomorrow. So, I'm playing the busy mommy card.


I'd come to this site regardless of the forums. I am finding the best success ever, and trust me I've done a lot of other stuff. This just seems to be the easiest.

Yeah, I'm an adult and yeah I have an adult child. I know for a fact that I have people on my friends list that are almost the same age as my daughter as well as younger. No biggy.

I like coming to chit-chat. It's a place to get a little goofy, and let off a little steam, and trust me, I've had a lot of stress going this past couple of weeks. It may be that I have a really dark and sick sense of humor that I just see adults being goofy, but if I had ever seen something that offended me, first I'd MAKE SURE that it wasn't something that was illegal, and if it wasn't I'd move on, if it was, well then, I'd do something about it. I'm a firm believer of free speech my father did not almost dye escaping from a Communist Country so he could live in the US and raise a family American just for someone to decide what I as AN ADULT should see and not see. Now if this was something that my child was involved in, that'd be a totally different story, but we're talking about me, not my children. And yes, I do monitor what my child does and sees on the internet, on tv, reads, and listens too. I do so with an open mind and not that my youngest child is 14 we discuss why some of the stuff she seems to like might not be appropriate for other people. I do have veto power and she respects that. BUT SHE IS A CHILD. I don't need someone deciding these things for me.

I'm getting tired of the US vs. THEM. I've seen some pretty stupid stuff said here, I've seen very knowlegable people leave who made this site interesting. And I've seen a particular person try to instigate when really, there didn't need to be any instigation. I got a creepy PM from someone who I've never met or spoken to. No, I didn't report that person, there was no threatening going on, it was just creepy in MY OPINION, so I blocked that particular person. I truly get along with just about everyone. I won't stand for bashing of religions, races, or sexual preferences. But I also don't have to be your best friend. Heck I don't have to like you. But I will be civil towards you. There's the whole treat others as you'd like to be treated.

I like being silly, I like joking around. I like letting off a little steam. Hell if you want to call this my little fantasy land then so be it. I'm gonna be queen though! (No offenses to Queen_Christine) And I'd be willing to bet money I do not have that there are people here who are doing the same as me. Sometimes being silly in a forum literally takes my mind off of being hungry and wanting to snack. And that's a good thing for me! So let's just all step back, take a deep breath and remember we're grown ups, some of us are just acting like kids!

There's a lot to digest here. Overall, I think you should know that we're not trying to take the fun out of the forums. We want people to make friends, and we want people to be able to joke with one another. But we think its also reasonable to set some limits so that everyone on the site can feel comfortable. On the main forums, it just doesn't seem much of a sacrifice to me to not be able to make sexual jokes. Again, when Groups come, there will be a lot more leeway for content in Groups. But the main forums are for everyone, and while we try to make the rules as lax as possible, we've just found over and over again that some limits are necessary to keep the peace for everyone.

ladycomix

I'd like a preview post button. on other forums I've modded, just the act of reviewing what you wrote seemed to slow down the misunderstandings. It'd also give folks a chance to see what their pics would look like (pics cut off because it's too big etc)

Mike

I'm concerned that the problem-solving described here may be a little myopic, and is potentially supporting another problem that isn't always looked at carefully. What if there were 500 abuse reports in your example? At some point you have to consider the possibility that the abuse reports are themselves getting abused.

Do you guys track users who are the reporters? If you have one or two users who represent a disproportionate amount of the reporting, could it be that maybe they are too sensitive for the Internet? Is it possible they have an agenda? Could they be targeting specific people? Do you issue warnings to users who report N# of threads but those threads *don't* warrant deletion? If not, why not?

I know it's easy to blame the "trolls" for being "mean" and disruptive. But we have to take responsibility for being adults. I'm not condoning overt sexual comments or clearly political agendas or personally attacking someone. Those are against the rules. It's pretty clear. But I've seen people get offended at things that wouldn't make an elementary schoolteacher raise an eyebrow. And though it's been said many times before, it bears repeating: disagreement does not equal harassment or abuse or even being rude. Not everyone understands this.

I won't pretend what you and the mods are doing is an easy job. But I hope that you remember it cuts both ways. Just as constant rule-breakers and rule-testers can negatively impact the well-being of the community, overzealous rule/agenda crusaders can negatively impact a community as well.

Thanks for keeping the discussion open.

I hear what you're saying, but it should comfort you to know that just because an abuse report is received doesn't mean that an action is taken. We simply dismiss a lot of abuse reports because after reviewing them, we don't think a rule violation actually took place. Some people report posts as being ads, for example, when they aren't ads. Or some people complain about an insult, but when we review the post, we don't think it's really an insult. The moderators all use their judgment when reviewing a report - they don't just blindly delete posts that are reported.

We don't always get it right. The mods are people too, and they make mistakes, just like I do, and just like you do. But they do their best. And they definitely don't just take an Abuse Report at it's word.

If, in fact, we felt someone was deliberately abusing the Abuse Report system as a vendetta against another user, for example, they themselves would be warned.

Mike

1st, luv the site Mike. Mad props to you.

Suggestion: since most of the drama is centered around the "Chit-chat, fun and games" forum, why not just exclude such threads when someone clicks on "recent posts"?

If someone would like to stay current on the community message board topics without entering a potentially "hot" topic, where they might get offended, or worse, become offensive, they don't have to if such topics didn't automatically list under "recent posts." That way, someone would have to go directly into that forum and see the varying "Chit-chat" topics purposely.

This is an interesting idea. Maybe we can make it an option to remove those topics from Recent Posts if you want to.

Enforcer25

Mike,
I posted this earlier and just want to post again, what about asking for volunteers to handle some other tasks, just like you did with the moderators? Ibdont know what other tasks you are looking to do or if this is possible, but I know I would be willing to give back to this site for what it has given me, maybe you could post it in the MFP blog, just a suggestion among the many others you have received. Keep up the great work.

ladycomix

Mike,
I posted this earlier and just want to post again, what about asking for volunteers to handle some other tasks, just like you did with the moderators? Ibdont know what other tasks you are looking to do or if this is possible, but I know I would be willing to give back to this site for what it has given me, maybe you could post it in the MFP blog, just a suggestion among the many others you have received. Keep up the great work.

In real life, I'm a SysAdmin. without going full Geek in the explanation, I would personally be wary of handing out too many programming tasks without a lot of thought put into a review system. The possible security and stability implications would be yucky.

NeuroticVirgo

You have no complaints from me. To be quite honest I was getting a little disturbed by the amount of sexual content and very heavy and sometimes inappropriate flirting. I am all for making friends and if someone finds a soul mate on here so be it but keep the conversations clean and private if they need to become inappropriate. I almost posted today that people need to remember what this site is about and that we are all here for a common goal and that is to get healthy not see who we can pick on, pick up or put down....but I hate drama so I kept my mouth shut! I myself have a great group of supportive people and I would be lost without this site. Thanks for all you do and giving of your time to explain this to everyone. I recommend this site on a daily basis and I like knowing that you all care about the content so noone is offended.

Thanks again!

I agree completely, too much flirting, inuendos and sexual talk has its place but not here, take it to private emails but somehow the people that promote that type of conversation don't seem to want it to be private, rather they seem to want everyone to read it, why?

I'm not an easily offended person, really I'm not. But we were getting racy in some of the chit-chat topics. I was waiting for some topics to come up like "show me your [insert private part] " and it be filled with pictures of full exposed people parts. There were a few that borderlined this, nothing "fully" exposed...but definitely some exposure. I mean if you want to see that, there's private emails and well, there is a whole lot of other FREE sites that show all kinds of body parts...it doesn't really need to be on a fitness website.....
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NeuroticVirgo

My problem is the absolute ban on "sexuality" posts, but what that really means is *sexual orientation*. You've compared it to religion, etc and said there are no posts allowed about religion or politics, etc.

BUT, it's different. it isn't a topic ABOUT being gay. People just want to post to find other LGBT people to friend. That's it.

Just like I've seen people here request "kosher" recipes, or "halal" recipes. Though those are religions dietary restrictions, they aren't posts ABOUT religion. Those are just people looking for help from others regarding a topic that happens to *intersect* with religion.

The groups is a great idea. But, in the interim, I don't see why posts where someone happens to mention that they are gay and seeking other LGBT friends should be banned. If THAT is considered talking about "sexuality," then I want every single post wherein someone mentions their husband, wife, boyfriend, girlfriend, etc banned. I fail to see how there's any difference and that too isn't talking about "sexuality."

I think this is a good point. Their is a difference between reaching out for like minded people, and getting into a discussion about a easily heated topic. Maybe this is where the mods judgement has to come into play. A topic like "Looking for other Christian women" - were the topic is about looking for other Christian women to friend to help on their weight loss journey. Might be a keeper. Vs a topic like "Looking for Christian Women" - were the topic is a man looking for Christian women to flirt with and date...not appropriate. Maybe? Same thing for the LGBT example. There's a difference between asking for like minded or a "genre" of people to friend you because you think it would make a better support, vs starting up a topic that is all opinions and can get crazy. That's were the moderators judgement comes in.

I guess its hard because subjects like religion, sex, sexuality, race, politics etc, can all easily turn bad. But I do agree with this person, that its something to think about until we are able to have groups.

methetree

Thanks for the site Mike, it's assisted me in losing weight I couldn't lose before.
Also thank you for making it free.

I appreciate what you are trying to do here, and I appreciate all that has been said.

One little comment... if it isn't ok to talk LBGTQ.... then it also shouldn't be ok to talk religion.
Discussions on religion offends me as much as LBGTQ offends others and it sparks equally as much debate..

Just my two cents.

I can't wait for groups, like buttons, ignore features and all that you have planned.

Thanks again... you can't please all of the people all of the time.

ShellyMacchi

my 2 cents worth...

i have moderated in chat-room sites and social networks online at various times over the past 14 years online. If i 'wanted' a place for sexual content chatting, or 'adult' content , trust me i know where to find those...

That however is NOT why I joined mfp. I am here for the company of like minded, health conscious individuals, as well as a means of tracking and controlling, as well as sharing and learning, healthy eating habits to get my own health and life back on track.

I don't need or want mfp to become another venue like facebook... I am here for my health, not to win any popularity contests *S* I am completely supportive of whatever means necessary for you and the moderators (i KNOW how challenging their job is) to return some limits on how mfp is being used.

There are a number of underage members here as a matter of fact, who are very open about confessing their age, who are here for their health as well... and some of the things i see being mentioned in the forums, as well as the way some 'adults' treat others, makes me cringe when I think of those 15 years olds I know are here.

Thank you Mike and all, for your calm, well-considered manner of handling all issues.. keep up the great work, the silent majority loves all you do *S* Don't let the vocal few discourage you *s*

darkrider42

Bumping to finish reading later. Made it to page 4, but it's 2:00am.

awdamm

I say just add a chat room program. That way the forums won't get all bogged down with people just chatting back and forth and 7 mile long "quote fields"

have a few general topic rooms ( rooms that could be accessed by any member at any time)

then have the option for people to create their own chat rooms and invite who they wanted. I think this option would free up the forum from "chitter and chatter" and if the chat room members got snarky, rude or judgemental they can be reported or you have the option to just leave the chat room.

_Ben

From being a moderator on a site of 600,000 people, I totally get where you are coming from. Sometimes you need to just step in and end a discussion before it gets too out of hand. I didnt see any of these major threads that were taken down, but Im assuming that they were taken down before things got to crazy. Ive watched threads get so out of control that I have had viruses sent to my computer, so the hacker could try to ban the person that they were arguing with. Discussions do not need to get that heated

PBJunkie

How about a voting system where people can up vote a post on sound advice given? So if people agree they would simply up vote the post and not re-qoute and say "I agree", this will keep the threads short and ultimately help the newbie to choose the correct advice.

_Ben

We could also look into a reputation system as well. Many forums have this. Just because you have a lot of posts, doesnt necessarily mean people really appreciate your posts

jeanlake

Thanks for the explanation and for this most helpful accountability site. This is the first time I've logged in food and exercise and it is extremely helpful. Have seen some drama and rude remarks. Most of us have family, friends, busy lives and jobs and try to avoid that chaos as much as possible. It isn't healthy. I appreciate the position you are taking.