I'm confused weight lifting/cardio/muscle question...

Jeff92se

You repeat yourself but don't address any of the points I bring up. Might as well put your hands over your ears and scream the same thing over and over again

You want to find out once and for all? Hop into that thread and ask the exact same things you just mentioned here. Convince him he's doing it wrong and I''ll be convinced right along with him. Deal?

Learn to read.

Just because he CLAIMS to be in a caloric deficit, that doesn't mean he IS. What part of that did you fail to understand???

Learn to read. Why not ASK him yourself?

Because I don't give a rat-**** what he believes. Like I said before, the evidence speaks for itself.

Self-reporting is inferior to objective measurement. Always has been, always will be.

The evidence I just presented. Pictures, testimony, history indicate it supports my claim. You've presented the same statement over and over again.

You don't give a crap. Yet you've posted in THIS thread about 6 times in the last 20 min. Afraid of what he might say? That it might turn your thinking around a bit? Hell, he might prove YOU right and me wrong.(if that's the case, so be it) I think you just want to adhere to what you think is right despite what anyone tries to present. That's becoming pretty apparent.

Do you know the difference between "anecdote" and "evidence"????


Apparently not.

Tell me, how is his evidence merely anectotal in nature? Point out specificaly.

N=1, self-reported, is the DEFINITION of anecdotal evidence.

Do you understand the scientific method at all????

Self reported as in what? Logs, scales, pictures, history, calorie history?

Like you'd accept them even if he did do that :laugh:

Wait a minute? I thought you didn't give a crap anymore?!!?! Aw, you DO care.

RonSwanson66

Self reported as in what? Logs, scales, pictures, history, calorie history?

Are you serious? Do you understand the difference between self-reported and objectively observed data?

Have you ever taken a science class?

Jeff92se

Self reported as in what? Logs, scales, pictures, history, calorie history?

Are you serious? Do you understand the difference between self-reported and objectively observed data?

Have you ever taken a science class?

Seriously? Why haven't you jumped into that guy's thread and tell he's full of crap??? Tell him to take a science class right?

I assume his training is based on Layne Norton's advice. Which as you probably have ignored:

currently working on my PhD at university of Illinois specializing in skeletal muscle protein metabolism. The purpose of this site is to provide information about bodybuilding and also to provide information about myself

If you are implying that his training is based on flying blind, it's not. It's also backed up by the article I just posted.

But I love the nosensical sematics batlle. Like your less than whitty quips really quantify anything resembling a debatable point.

He does mention a bulking session coming up. I'll assume he'll go into a carefully planned calorie surplus then. BUT it doesn't discount what he just accomplished and the methods he did to achieve them.

HolleeERL

It's practically impossible to build muscle on calorie deficit. To build muscle you would be adding weight. To add weight you need to be in calorie surplus.
Seeing definition isn't building muscle. It's losing body fat.

Agree 100% with this!!! You can add calories without adding fat by eating lean meats and more veggies.

RonSwanson66

Self reported as in what? Logs, scales, pictures, history, calorie history?

Are you serious? Do you understand the difference between self-reported and objectively observed data?

Have you ever taken a science class?

Seriously? Why haven't you jumped into that guy's thread and tell he's full of crap??? Tell him to take a science class right?

I assume his training is based on Layne Norton's advice. Which as you probably have ignored:

currently working on my PhD at university of Illinois specializing in skeletal muscle protein metabolism. The purpose of this site is to provide information about bodybuilding and also to provide information about myself

If you are implying that his training is based on flying blind, it's not. It's also backed up by the article I just posted.

But I love the nosensical sematics batlle. Like your less than whitty quips really quantify anything resembling a debatable point.

A BB.com article is NOT a scientific reference, and the article I posted above it completely debunks it.

And spare me your appeals to authority. Unless you can provide a physiological mechanism that allows someone to simultaneously exist in a quantum superposition of anabolic/catabolic stats while creating mass out of thin air, then you've brought nothing to the table.


You've shown that you clearly don't understand how science works, since you don't even understand what simple terms like "anecdotal evidence" mean. So I'm done with this thread. Keep living in fantasyland.

Goal_Seeker_1988

bump

Jeff92se

But bodycomposition is a scientific site? come on. He doesn't even DEFINE "overfat"

To top it off, at the end, he quantifies his article as such:

As a final comment, I can say without hesitation that someone will post in the comments that they managed to achieve the above results in some form or fashion. And while there are always going to be exceptions to any generality, that doesn’t tend to disprove the generality. And generally speaking, the above is what happens in the real world.

1) You talk of absolutes while your OWN ARTICLE talks about generalities
2) He doesn't even define "real world". Again not an absolute.
3) The gentlemen here could be an example of the exception mentioned IN YOUR OWN ARTICLE.

Hell bro. Do YOU read?

tigersword

I'll just point out the obvious with this back and forth argument.

Has this guy always gained and lost 100 pounds? If not then its pretty simple. When you gain a lot of weight, you do gain muscle mass, as your body needs more muscle to move the extra weight around. Now you lose that weight and train hard. You retain most of the added mass, while training the muscle fibers to increase strength. The result? You look bigger at the same weight and low body fat than you did before, but you didn't add muscle mass on a calorie deficit.

I'm in that boat now, I'm currently at 20% body fat, trying to get down to about 15%. However, I am currently the same size measurement wise that I was 5 years ago, when I weighed 30 pounds less than I do now. I attribute that to body recomposition, and retaining added muscle mass from gaining 75 pounds of excess weight, I certainly didn't add mass while losing these first 50 pounds.

It's mostly a semantics argument, as the end result is the same, but the scientific explanation is the added was already there, not added during the weight loss.

Jeff92se

He also gained muscle going from 175lbs to about 177lbs. While already pretty lean.

Not to mention he was training at a calorie deficit the entire time(according to him)

Silverkittycat

Questions from the original post -

Does that mean the only way that I'll actually make my muscles bigger, or that I'll be able to lift more, or do more reps is by not eating a caloric deficit?

I guess I'm just looking for clarification on the increase in rep weight while eating a deficit.

PepeGreggerton

I don't understand the debate... The guy that asked the question has 65lbs to lose. My advice, focus on that. You need a calorie deficit to burn fat.

PepeGreggerton

Questions from the original post -

Does that mean the only way that I'll actually make my muscles bigger, or that I'll be able to lift more, or do more reps is by not eating a caloric deficit?

I guess I'm just looking for clarification on the increase in rep weight while eating a deficit.

If you want to be stronger lift big once you can do 3 sets of 5 or 10 or whatever low rep you set your mind to increase the weight next time

tigersword

He also gained muscle going from 175lbs to about 177lbs. While already pretty lean.

Not to mention he was training at a calorie deficit the entire time(according to him)

Well he didn't gain 2 pounds eating at a calorie deficit. Unless it was water weight from majorly increasing carbs. That is physically impossible.

weightofyourskin

I don't understand the debate... The guy that asked the question has 65lbs to lose. My advice, focus on that. You need a calorie deficit to burn fat.

So if I lift weights at a slight calorie deficit, I'm going to burn fat? I don't care so much about losing weight as losing fat and getting slimmer.

Sorry if that's a stupid question, but there's so much conflicting information here.

Helloitsdan

Ok, so I've been reading about the muscle not increasing when eating a deficit, and that when you lift you burn fat which makes your existing muscles more visible (in essence toning up, due to visibility of muscle). Does that mean the only way that I'll actually make my muscles bigger, or that I'll be able to lift more, or do more reps is by not eating a caloric deficit?

I've been lifting now for only about 3 weeks (3x lifting a week full body routine in my blog, and 2x a week cardio 30-45 minutes of recumbent bike and HIIT running). I'm not expecting results over night, and it took me about a week to hone in on what my rep weight should be. I'm shooting for 8 reps, 3 sets of a higher weight to make bigger muscles to burn more calories through existance. I've gotten a ton of info from a lot of my friends, and I understand what they're saying, I guess I'm just looking for clarification on the increase in rep weight while eating a deficit.

Thanks in advance!

Strength and mass are different.
If you want to maintain while cutting you lift heavy.
If you want to gain mass you eat above maintenance.
Preferably 20% above maintenance!

Start this around 15-20% body fat.
Mass for about 10-16 weeks then cut again.
BUFF SUMMER DAYS!
=D

PepeGreggerton

I don't understand the debate... The guy that asked the question has 65lbs to lose. My advice, focus on that. You need a calorie deficit to burn fat.

So if I lift weights at a slight calorie deficit, I'm going to burn fat? I don't care so much about losing weight as losing fat and getting slimmer.

Sorry if that's a stupid question, but there's so much conflicting information here.

Yes, Strength and Mass are different. Two different goals, two different eating styles, two different workouts. You need to created a deficit from your resting metabolic rate to burn fat. You can do it through diet and or exercise.

Helloitsdan

LeanGains anyone?

sharonhauptman

At the 8th rep of each set, if that muscle group is exhausted, then you will build muscle even as you are losing weight. You have probably used the predictive method to determine your one repetition maximum. NEVER EVER START TOO HEAVY AND REDUCE PLATES TO DETERMINE ONE REPETITION MAXIMUM BECAUSE THAT IS EXTREMELY UNSAFE. Use the predictive method. Then, select 80% of that one repetition maximum and do your sets with that weight. This will help you. Coach S.

Jeff92se

He also gained muscle going from 175lbs to about 177lbs. While already pretty lean.

Not to mention he was training at a calorie deficit the entire time(according to him)

Well he didn't gain 2 pounds eating at a calorie deficit. Unless it was water weight from majorly increasing carbs. That is physically impossible.

According to him he did. Read the thread and ask him

Asher213

I'm currently eating at 1000 calorie deficit in order to lose 2lb per week and have been doing so since May. I do 4 days strength training per week but for the past few months have noticed next to no no muscular gains. I have been coming down in body fat/scale weight but my strength doesn't seem to have increased one bit for the last 3 months or so as I am still lifting same weight for each exercise and struggling to go any higher. Like most are saying in this thread, I am putting this down to the large calorie deficit and resulting reduction in body fat/muscle mass.

So if one can't build muscle whilst eating at a calorie deficit, how about when in maintenance? is it possible to build muscle whilst maintaining or can it only be done when eating a calorie surplus?