At what price do we eat meat?

CaptainGordo

I take back all my former comments on this post. I broke the forum rules by suggesting a member use Firefox to catch his multiple spelling mistakes. I'm so done with the forums, MFP.

Yeah, they frown upon calling out spelling errors.

fteale

See it as a form of flirting, if you will.

Barelmy

I was headed towards plant based foods anyway, but although I love the taste of meat, I look at my 4 legged buddy Cody and can't help but think that all animals given the opportunity have charm and personality, like he does.

You let me know when you teach a cow or pig to sit and lay down..........Don't worry I'll wait!

Pigs are as intelligent as three-year-old children.

rbryntes

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

Really? All but one look rather fried and not low calorie to me.

Thomasm198

I don't eat meat. I am too much of an animal lover.

I'm an animal lover. I love them fried, roast, baked, poached, etc.

Jeff92se

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

"Healthier" is subjective.

The meat ones look a million times tastier to me.

Really? They look gross and dripping in fat to me.

What's wrong with fat? It's a necessary component to your body's function

Some is. I eat dairy so I have a reasonably high fat intake. If it is dripping off your food that's a different matter IMO.

How much fat is dripping here?

If you cooked it....All the white bits.

And the problem would be?

It looks gross?


It looks like what it is. Lumps of bloody muscle. The thought of eating that turns my stomach. It's probably full of parasitical worms too. Gross.

Looks doesn't equal health value. And yes, the plant based foods are most likely invested with deadly mold too. I mean come on. Really?

If you are going to debate by adding pictures of gross looking lumps of meat, I am going to reply with equally inane reactions to it. See the vegan food pictures.

What's inane about it? I had no problem wtih the vegan foods? Did I post anything derogatory about those pics?

bahacca

I think after watching FOOD INC. and other documentaries, the question should really be "At What price do we eat? PERIOD." The herbicides, fungicides, and pesticides that are used in farming the beloved fruits and veggies you are eating aren't much better for you than the fat on some meat.
(I eat plants and animals, though I'm slowly moving more toward organic produce and meat. But I'm not blind. I realize even organics contain run off, winds blow pesticides onto crops, etc.)
So if the treatment of the animals bothers you, the treatment of our entire food supply as a whole should have you reeling.

sarahsmom1

I find meat eaters to be extremely threatened by the position of vegetarians, and I have to wonder why. As a vegetarian, I don't feel threatened by their position; I simply disagree with it. But the people who feel that human beings have a "right" to eat animals do make me see slightly red. As the OP stated, when plants will sustain us, why kill? And those who consider themselves "carnivores" but have to have their (purchased, not self-killed) meat cooked to perfection? C'mon. REAL carnivores kill their own and eat it raw and bloody. The hypocrisy just gets to me. And the poster on this thread who cautioned against anemia for vegetarians, may I say that I am vegetarian and am healthier than I have EVER been in my 54 years of life. My family is healthier because I cook less meat for them. We are almost never sick, and when we are its just a cold or mild bug. No chronic anything. I exercise daily and have amazing stamina and strength. I am 54 years old and can still dance all night. Vegetarianism does NOT equal anemia or poor health. You CAN get all your nutrition from plants with the possible exception of B12, which can be supplement by fortified foods. Research! Don't just believe what you hear! Vegetarians and vegans who pay attention to their nutritional needs instead of just scarfing down everything that isn't meat will find themselves healthier, and probably lighter of spirit, as their own spirits begin to resonate with the respect they are showing the animal kingdom. If you say you love animals yet you allow your spirit to be numbed to the "industry you rely on for food", then perhaps YOU should make changes so that you no longer rely on that industry...or seriously question your own love of animals. If we are truly honest with ourselves, and make ourselves recognize the absolute devastation that the animal meat industry for food is causing to our health and to the environment, I don't believe we could continue the process.

Do you grow all your own food that you eat I doubt it im sure you do not grow every veggie, fruit tree, fake meat , grow your own yogurt, tofu.if you are a real vegetarian you will grow you own food ALL your own food nit just a tomato plant My friend is a vegetarian and she is a breast cancer survivor you just have good genes vegetarians get sick too

mgmt7498

It's not about becoming a vegetarian! I love me a good steak. It's about knowing where your food comes from and demanding better food handling practices. I am not rockafella but after watching that movie I definitely try to buy organic, locally grown foods and meats! You really should see it and decide for yourself!

NicolePatriot

bump

fteale

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

Really? All but one look rather fried and not low calorie to me.

Nope, one had breadcrumbs, but they are mostly just raw vegetables and salad ingredients.

Barelmy

It apparently occurs more with vegans than with vegetarians who eat eggs and dairy products. Especially also with older people who don't absorb the same way. Most sites that I quickly looked at said that it does take a while befroe your body runs out; maybe that's why you don't see it in children.

That bit of logic doesn't make sense. A child would run out of whatever nutrient you're on about faster; if they were vegan from birth, and they don't get them from their diets, then all their store came from their mother during pregnancy.

mgmt7498

I agree its not meat eater vs vegetarian its our bodies vs harmful chemicals!

jenlarz

$8.99/lb is about the price for meat.

All depends on where you are and what you get. $8.99/lb is the cost of good steaks around here.

tigersword

If you don't want to eat meat, don't eat meat, but to try and frame it as it's being cruel to animals, well then, I hope you don't live in a house on property you bought, since some poor animal used to call that home, and their habitat was wrecked to clear the land for it. I hope you don't drive a car, because cars can hit animals and kill them, and also the fumes from the exhaust can poison the animals, not to mention all the deadly chemicals required for the car to function properly that could also be deadly to animals. And of course, the destruction of animal habitats to pave roads for cars to drive on, destruction of habitats to build factories to build the cars, and on and on and on.

Eat meat if you want, or don't eat meat if you don't want, but if you're going to go all holier than though about animal treatment, you're being hypocritical, as just about everything that causes modern convenient living does damage to other animals, yes, even using the internet. And I don't need some random documentary to convince me of how I should eat, I have a brain, and I know how to think.

vim_n_vigor

I'm a huge animal lover. Grew up on a farm, but still, we harvested our own meat. This is my stance on it. I grew up eating 'home grown' meat (beef, chicken, and pork). With that said, these animals were treated in the upmost respect. They were not force fed, didn't have homones injected into them to grow faster/fatter. They got to enjoy mother nature, felt the sun on their backs, ate the green grass etc. Also, grew up with hunting, and still eat wild game (my husband hunts). Many think hunters are just out to KILL an animal--a TRUE hunter respects any animal he/she harvests, as well loves nature and just seeing the animals period. Also, wild game is one of the leanest, cleanest meat proteins there is. I much rather feed my children wild game than store bought meat any day. As some said before, it's a fact of life, we eat meat. I just want the animals I do eat to have had a good life before it ended. (SIde note- I feel sorry for dairy cows who are in barns 24/7 365 days a year...they never get to lay in a field, feel the warmth of the sun...so think about that when you drink your morning milk, or the chickens who are in tiny cages producing eggs...These are animals we dont eat, but we still eat the product they produce...do you agree with this standard of animal treatment?)

'Harvest' is a distancing word. 'Killed animals' for our own meat is a more honest way to say this.

Do you say 'killed carrots' for our own veggies? I grew up in a farm community with a local slaughterhouse that was good to the animals too - they were still able to move around outdoors until their slaughter - in fact - it was a frequent occurance that an animal would end up getting out of the pens and wandering around the town. It is possible to be respectful of everything we eat, plant or animal. It seems you and your husband are trying to get this thread shut down.

fteale

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

"Healthier" is subjective.

The meat ones look a million times tastier to me.


Really? They look gross and dripping in fat to me.


What's wrong with fat? It's a necessary component to your body's function


Some is. I eat dairy so I have a reasonably high fat intake. If it is dripping off your food that's a different matter IMO.


How much fat is dripping here?




If you cooked it....All the white bits.


And the problem would be?


It looks gross?


It looks like what it is. Lumps of bloody muscle. The thought of eating that turns my stomach. It's probably full of parasitical worms too. Gross.

Looks doesn't equal health value. And yes, the plant based foods are most likely invested with deadly mold too. I mean come on. Really?


If you are going to debate by adding pictures of gross looking lumps of meat, I am going to reply with equally inane reactions to it. See the vegan food pictures.


What's inane about it? I had no problem wtih the vegan foods? Did I post anything derogatory about those pics?

Contributing to a debate about meat eating vs vegetarianism with countless close up pictures of meat is deliberately inflammatory. I appreciate the humour and was reciprocating in kind.



But I still think the meat looks gross.

artemis222

When people say they were unhealthy, anaemic, had vit B12 deficiency (seriously? I have NEVER heard of that one anywhere but here, and I know many many vegetarians), it is clear they just weren't doing it very well. If you eat junk, you'll be unhealthy. Doesn't matter if that junk is vegan or not. If you eat healthily, you won't get deficiencies. The fact that most vegans manage perfectly fine and are in fact of above average health pretty much clinches that one.

I'm surprised that you haven't heard this before. If you google it, you'll find many vegan/vegetarian promoting websites that state this. (They advocate Vitamin B supplementation of course rather than eating animal products.)

Maybe the average diet in America isn't as good as European? I know, as a said, a lot of vegetarians. In fact well over half of all the people I know, and the only person I have ever known get anaemia was my sister, who ISN'T a vegetarian. And I have never heard of anyone with a B12 deficiency. Ever. I did hear a programme on the radio a few years ago saying that IN THEORY some vegan children could get a B12 deficiency if they were so strict they didn't eat yeast, but in that study (on vegetarian and vegan diets for children, across the whole of the UK), they hadn't actually encountered any.

Sorry, I couldn't read your post past the first sentence.

All your posts (that I've read so-far in this thread) are self-righteous and a bit mean-spirited.

Edit: Though I agree with the 'stop with the meat pictures' thing you just posted.

sunnyday789

It apparently occurs more with vegans than with vegetarians who eat eggs and dairy products. Especially also with older people who don't absorb the same way. Most sites that I quickly looked at said that it does take a while befroe your body runs out; maybe that's why you don't see it in children.

That bit of logic doesn't make sense. A child would run out of whatever nutrient you're on about faster; if they were vegan from birth, and they don't get them from their diets, then all their store came from their mother during pregnancy.

I assumed (maybe incorrectly) that vegans more likely to breastfeed and for longer than average but truthfully don't know if breastmilk contains vitamin B12

tigersword

I think after watching FOOD INC. and other documentaries, the question should really be "At What price do we eat? PERIOD." The herbicides, fungicides, and pesticides that are used in farming the beloved fruits and veggies you are eating aren't much better for you than the fat on some meat.
(I eat plants and animals, though I'm slowly moving more toward organic produce and meat. But I'm not blind. I realize even organics contain run off, winds blow pesticides onto crops, etc.)
So if the treatment of the animals bothers you, the treatment of our entire food supply as a whole should have you reeling.

Just so you know, organic doesn't mean "pesticide free." It just means they use pesticides that are certified organic.

rbryntes

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

Really? All but one look rather fried and not low calorie to me.

Nope, one had breadcrumbs, but they are mostly just raw vegetables and salad ingredients.

Huh. Well, the meat looked better to me, anyway. (and yes, I've eaten raw food and vegan and vegetarian diets in the past. I always come back to adding meat back in.)

Helice

I wouldn't want to watch a show like that, but it's natural for humans to eat meat. I'm an animal lover and it does hurt to think of animals being treated badly and killed for my food, but at the same time I just have to accept that it IS the industry I rely on for my food.

I used to disassociate animals and food much more. I was brought up on chicken nuggets, sausages and burgers, so I had no problems eating cow, pig, sheep and chicken, but when I was suggested venison or duck by a good friend who loves his cooking I found it hard to come to terms with eating that beautiful deer or the fluffy duck (especially as I once had a pet duck). It's only in the past year or so that I've been able to tell myself that in reality eating deer or duck is no different to eating cow or chicken. Now, I'm much less picky about the meats I eat.

I have to agree with this post.
I hate to think of all the animals being killed..
But meat is an important part of our diet.
And yes we could live without it, but only because we can eat formulated food with the nutrients meat includes, ( i mean i think anyway).
Eating meat is natural.. i like to think back to when i was a kid and i use to watch lion king..
Its just the circle of like. We eat the cows, then when we die if were burried bugs eat us and we nourish the soil. Other animals eat the bugs, and cows eat the grass, which we then eat in return..
I like this view! lol.
.. I forgot to add we nourish the soil which makes the grass grow for cows to eat..

IronmanPanda

I don't eat meat. I am too much of an animal lover.

I'm an animal lover. I love them fried, roast, baked, poached, etc.

This. I also eat BBQ Babies.

sarahsmom1

Just a question do any of the vegetarians or vegans eat marshmallows?

Jeff92se

All the photos I have posted are of vegan recipes, by the way. In case anyone was wondering. Just pointing out vegetables can look good. And a damn sight healthier than the meat pictures posted on this thread.

"Healthier" is subjective.

The meat ones look a million times tastier to me.


Really? They look gross and dripping in fat to me.


What's wrong with fat? It's a necessary component to your body's function


Some is. I eat dairy so I have a reasonably high fat intake. If it is dripping off your food that's a different matter IMO.


How much fat is dripping here?




If you cooked it....All the white bits.


And the problem would be?


It looks gross?


It looks like what it is. Lumps of bloody muscle. The thought of eating that turns my stomach. It's probably full of parasitical worms too. Gross.

Looks doesn't equal health value. And yes, the plant based foods are most likely invested with deadly mold too. I mean come on. Really?


If you are going to debate by adding pictures of gross looking lumps of meat, I am going to reply with equally inane reactions to it. See the vegan food pictures.


What's inane about it? I had no problem wtih the vegan foods? Did I post anything derogatory about those pics?

Contributing to a debate about meat eating vs vegetarianism with countless close up pictures of meat is deliberately inflammatory. I appreciate the humour and was reciprocating in kind.



But I still think the meat looks gross.

I think veggies trying to parade as meat is pretty gross. But what the hell, it's on them, not me

fteale

When people say they were unhealthy, anaemic, had vit B12 deficiency (seriously? I have NEVER heard of that one anywhere but here, and I know many many vegetarians), it is clear they just weren't doing it very well. If you eat junk, you'll be unhealthy. Doesn't matter if that junk is vegan or not. If you eat healthily, you won't get deficiencies. The fact that most vegans manage perfectly fine and are in fact of above average health pretty much clinches that one.

I'm surprised that you haven't heard this before. If you google it, you'll find many vegan/vegetarian promoting websites that state this. (They advocate Vitamin B supplementation of course rather than eating animal products.)

Maybe the average diet in America isn't as good as European? I know, as a said, a lot of vegetarians. In fact well over half of all the people I know, and the only person I have ever known get anaemia was my sister, who ISN'T a vegetarian. And I have never heard of anyone with a B12 deficiency. Ever. I did hear a programme on the radio a few years ago saying that IN THEORY some vegan children could get a B12 deficiency if they were so strict they didn't eat yeast, but in that study (on vegetarian and vegan diets for children, across the whole of the UK), they hadn't actually encountered any.

Sorry, I couldn't read your post past the first sentence.

All your posts (that I've read so-far in this thread) are self-righteous and a bit mean-spirited.

Edit: Though I agree with the 'stop with the meat pictures' thing you just posted.

Well isn't that charming of you to say?!

"Is your daughter teenage? It is very common for teenagers to become anaemic as their bodies get used to having periods. Anaemia is not limited to vegetarians." My first post on this thread. Is that mean spirited?


Second post on this thread "No they don't. Lions kill with a quick bite to the back of the neck, severing the spinal cord. Same as domestic cats." Merely stating a fact. Is that mean spirited?


Third post "When people say they were unhealthy, anaemic, had vit B12 deficiency (seriously? I have NEVER heard of that one anywhere but here, and I know many many vegetarians), it is clear they just weren't doing it very well. If you eat junk, you'll be unhealthy. Doesn't matter if that junk is vegan or not. If you eat healthily, you won't get deficiencies. The fact that most vegans manage perfectly fine and are in fact of above average health pretty much clinches that one." Again, if you could point out where I am being mean in that one, that would be great.



I have no idea what you are reading, but I don't think it's my posts.

fteale

Just a question do any of the vegetarians or vegans eat marshmallows?

Only vegetarian or vegan ones. Not ones with gelatine in.

vs1023

The last Netflix show I "watched" was FOOD INC. I challenge all carnivores to watch that show for more than 5 - 10 minutes. I could not.

A very sad tribute to our food industries such as McDonalds and others.

I was headed towards plant based foods anyway, but although I love the taste of meat, I look at my 4 legged buddy Cody and can't help but think that all animals given the opportunity have charm and personality, like he does. I just don't think it is right to eat animals. Not when plants can sustain us. Dr. Fuhrman and his Eat To Live book. That cinches the deal for me.

I have watched Food Inc several times.

I only eat farm raised, pastured meats, eggs and raw dairy. My fruits and vegetables come from a local CSA and a Coop and they have yummy farm raised meats also.

It is natural for us as Omnivores to eat both plants and animals. We need the nutrients that come from both places, not taking pill formed supplements to replace what we are not getting.

Same for me and I don't care what vegans/vegetarians, etc do or eat. Food Inc discussed conventional commercial farming and I agree it's awful and I'm glad to be in an area where I can see the cows I may later eat.

I also love animals. I think you can eat meat and still feel the same way.

I agree with the poster who said it's about avoiding harmful chemicals, antibiotics, hormones, etc. Plus the feed they give the cows at these commercial farms isn't a great quality either.

On the other side I do see how meat consumption and the process of having animals to eat can have an effect on the environment.

rbryntes

Just a question do any of the vegetarians or vegans eat marshmallows?

Most of the ones I know do not.

CharityEaton

My uncle was a dairy farmer and we spent time there. My father spent all his summers there helping. And our local dairy farms give tours and answer questions about their practices and animals. We are friends with a few farmers who raise beef cattle too. We travel out west and south every year. I see tons of land with cattle out in the fields with plenty of food and clean water. Cows in people's front yards. Lots of space. And on occassion I even see them playing and running. EVERY single farmer I've spoken too (not that I've spoken to every farmer) name their cows, take care of them, talk to them, listen to them, feed them healthy food, etc. Not like house pets, but not abusive lives either. Death always sucks. No matter what. I just hope and pray that their death comes quickly and painlessly. And I try to make sure that we use as much of every animal we eat to not waste their sacrifice.

While some farms are defintely not awesome and slaughtering is terrible, I hesitate to take any of those food documentaries as the final say on anything. They are there to make money for the people who make them - good intentions but still one-sided. So they will be skewed.

Just MHO

We raise our own beef and have indeed named ALL of our cows and their calves. Our "momma cows " are Princess(she is very bossy and the dominate cows) and Half Pint. We also have named our calves, Ribeye, T-Bone, Ruby and Rose are just a few of the names we have given....ribeye did make some tasty steaks. I'm not a huge meat eater but I do enjoy a nice steak from time to time and knowing that I fed the cow and watered it and helped it enter this world during calving season, I watched it play and grow and when it was time to eat it I had no guilt in doing so. Nature is a beautiful thing and yes it is hard to look at a wet calf as it wobbles to its feet and think that in a years time it will be in my crock pot as a roast BUT if we don't eat them at some point there will be way too many roaming around trampling and eating all of the vegetables the vegetarians are trying to live off of. Nature is about balance. I would rather kill and eat then kill to control population and waste a beautiful animal. When we eat them they are not being wasted.