Your thighs on cheese... HAHAHA!

jcpmoore

Hey i'm vegan and I have NOTHING against people eating cheese. I love cottage cheese. as soon as i'm done being vegan the first thing I'll eat is a bowl of cottage cheese with yogurt and cheese sprinkled on top It's healthy!!

Huh? I respect Vegans. But I'm confused. I thought vegan meant no animal products, meaning no dairy products. Do you eat soy cottage cheese? Are you planning to not be vegan soon? The vegans I know made the choice based on animal rights issues. Was yours a health issue or other issue instead?

Just purely curious. No judgment at all intended. Thanks for sharing!

Contrarian

oh. vegans.

Hey i'm vegan and I have NOTHING against people eating cheese. I love cottage cheese. as soon as i'm done being vegan the first thing I'll eat is a bowl of cottage cheese with yogurt and cheese sprinkled on top It's healthy!!

"Done being vegan?"

CapsFan17

seriously... There is no quick fix to getting people to lose weight. And telling them not to eat someting that they love is not helping any one. I will never give up my cheese, I just make sure I have room for it in MFP

ItsJustK

For this example: Cheese is made from cow's milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows. Why would an adult human need food designed to help a baby cow grow up and be an adult cow? Would you drink a stranger's breast milk? It's meant for baby humans. MILK is not meant to be consumed by adults no matter which'a way you you look at it.

This made my Friday. lolol

MattGetsMad

"Done being vegan?"

Thought that was a little strange myself...

Devonanne

I love cheese and will never stop eating it. I refuse to buy "low-fat" cheese..I want the real stuff! But I don't eat a ton of it, because I'm aware of how many calories and fat are in it. I fit it into my daily calories when I want it..simple. Do the makers of this campaign really think that people will become thin if they stop eating one particular food item? It's beyond ridiculous. The headlines should read "Your thighs on too much of ANY KIND of food"

BrettPGH

Interesting take. Not sure how to follow it though. We would have never made it as a species if eating animals leads to heart disease? That part sounds right, only at first.

To survive, the species most propagate itself. Humans can normally begin making babies right around 13. You don't die of heart disease until a tad later in life than that, so heart disease would not be enough to stop us.

The vast majority of humanity eats meat and has eaten meat throughout history. So if eating meat = heart disease the vast majority of humanity would die from heart disease. If it were really as simple as meat being the cause of this problem we'd have cured heart disease a long time ago.

Are you saying vegans can't get heart disease?

Fat stored in the body and eating animal products have nothing to do with each other??? I'll just give you that one.

You will. Because fat comes from a lot more than just animal products.

Clogged arteries!!! Here we go, I understand this one. Clogged arteries definitely are present in people with heart disease. Clogged arteries are heart disease. Arteries that are clogged are clogged with dietary cholesterol. (Your body makes cholesterol and that cholesterol is necessary, but DOES NOT CLOG ARTERIES)

Age- takes time for that dietary cholesterol to build up and destroy your endothelium!!!

Family History: LOTS of truth here! On your side on this one pal! If there is no history of heart disease in your family anywhere, then you probably won't get it either. For some people, dietary cholesterol does not transfer into artery clogging cholesterol. Those people are super lucky! (my stepdad is one of them)

Exercise is really important too, but more so if you do intend to consume dietary cholesterol as exercise is the best way to control the ratio of bad to good.

I hope you are on of the lucky ones. Good luck to you!

Luck has nothing to do with it. True none of us can change our family history or genetics. But we can monitor our health, dietary intake and exercise. The solution is not "stop eating meat". There are a number of factors at play here and simply being vegan does not equal good health.

umachanxo

I eat cheese every day. I'm not dying, nor am I getting 'fatter'.

If you're alive, you're dying.

You're missing the point.
I eat cheese everyday and I'm not fat. I've lost weight, not gained.

I'm sorry if anyone thinks I said you can't lose weight while eating animal products. I never said that, nor did I intend to imply it. To lose weight you just have to have a calorie deficit. Pretty simple.

Haha.... I was talking about the whole "cheese makes you fat" thing not you xDD Sorry ><

MattGetsMad

Words getting put into my mouth again!!!

I never said vegans can't get heart disease!!!

I never said the only way to good health is through veganism!!!

I am not vegan!!!

Good luck to all of you on your weight-loss, health gain journey whatever path you choose.

auroranflash

Free speech is amazing!

Can't help but love it. Even though people go toe to toe in debates like this, I'm happy to see such disagreement. I'm even happy to see the anti-cheese billboards. Because ... even if it's not MY opinion, or the popular one, people are entitled to it!

Let us preach, come one come all, whatever motivates us, heehee....

Let's just be tolerant and respectful of each other in the process. That is the key, no?

moujie

Thank you all for participating in this round of carnivore vs. vegan! It's been a healthy match with moments of intensity that have kept the rest of us on the edge of our seats. Unfortunately there was no clear winner in this round. Round 2 will be called, "whole wheat cookies, to egg or not to egg?"

Stay tuned next week when we pit the weight lifters against the cario-aholics! Should be a nail biter!

KBGirts

My thighs and stomach do not look like that. I eat cheese all the time.

BrettPGH

Words getting put into my mouth again!!!

Oh I'm putting words in your mouth am I? I love a good fact check.

I never said vegans can't get heart disease!!!

So you believe there is no link between consuming animals and heart disease?

So which is it? Does consuming animals cause heart disease or not? Because you keep saying it and then backing off it.

I never said the only way to good health is through veganism!!!

I am not vegan!!!

Some of us plant eaters think the way you guys talk about your meat and cheese sounds pretty similar to drug addicts. The game we play (an I'm letting you in on a little secret here) is to substitute whatever animal product you are defending be it beef, pork, or in this case cheese with a drug.

Then when people talk about it, we laugh.

If you aren't in fact a vegan you probably shouldn't refer to yourself as a "plant eater" and spend so much time mocking those who eat meat. It's a bit silly.

MattGetsMad

If you aren't in fact a vegan you probably shouldn't refer to yourself as a "plant eater" and spend so much time mocking those who eat meat. It's a bit silly.

Yes, mocking is silly. I agree and I was guilty.

I am not a vegan, I am a plant eater following plant based nutrition.

Like I said in my msg, I do not wish to debate in this public forum as I think I've struck a nerve and that we are at an impasse.

Again, I wish you the best and hope that you are able to accomplish all of your goals regardless witch path you choose to follow.

jenbusick

if someone can explain something to me, please do it. Without offending anyone:

I eat clean and most things in moderataion. Life is too short in a sense to ban something like cheese or chocolate or Insert guilty food pleasure here.

That being said, I have an acquaintance of mine who now turned vegan and all she does it gets on her soap box about how much weight she is losing (she is thin to begin with) doesnt eat cheese, only vegetables and carbs and no dairy and works out for 2 hours a day and has seen so much improvement. I cannot understand this concept for the life of me.

I eat red meat maybe once or twice a month, eat lean proteins, low fat dairy, few carbs, and lots of fruits and veggies. Who is right here and who is wrong on the "healthy way to live"?

Unless she is watching her diet with a very serious eye, and probably taking some nutritional supplements (B12 and iron at least), she (like all vegans) is putting herself at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies.

Humans are omnivores. We are not designed to get all of the nutrients we need from plants, the way that cows (ruminants) are, nor are we designed to only digest meat (like, say, cats). Your diet is healthier because it has the potential to provide all of the essential nutrients you need without supplementation or rigorous balancing.

MattGetsMad

It's been pointed out by someone involved in this thread that I started out mocking all people that eat cheese and meat and that was in turn "demonizing" these people.

I wanted to say: "I didn't do that!" But I did, and it was small and petty and did not help the course of the conversation.

I agree demonizing people for what they eat is unfair and unwarranted especially if you wish to engage in polite intelligent discourse.

I am sorry.

BrettPGH

It's been pointed out by someone involved in this thread that I started out mocking all people that eat cheese and meat and that was in turn "demonizing" these people.

I wanted to say: "I didn't do that!" But I did, and it was small and petty and did not help the course of the conversation.

I agree demonizing people for what they eat is unfair and unwarranted especially if you wish to engage in polite intelligent discourse.

I am sorry.

Aw Matt don't take it too hard. Nobody loves a good debate more than me. If I came off as harsh I apologize. I enjoyed our exchange and wish you all the best.

darkling_glory

Unless she is watching her diet with a very serious eye, and probably taking some nutritional supplements (B12 and iron at least), she (like all vegans) is putting herself at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies.

Humans are omnivores. We are not designed to get all of the nutrients we need from plants, the way that cows (ruminants) are, nor are we designed to only digest meat (like, say, cats). Your diet is healthier because it has the potential to provide all of the essential nutrients you need without supplementation or rigorous balancing.

While I agree that some vegans can have issues with nutritional deficiency, so can some omnivores. If all you eat is junkfood every day, you will have nutritional problems.

I am a vegan and just got my blood work back. I don't pay particularly special attention to my diet and I take a children's multi-vitamin daily. My levels are perfect -- iron, b12, protein. I'm as healthy as I've ever been. And despite not losing a lot of scale weight my cholesterol and trycliderides have also gone down.

Eating a vegan diet is very simple and not at all difficult.

However... living a vegan lifestyle is very different than eating a plant based diet. Which is what caddymatt was trying to distinguish himself from. He's a very inspirational person. He has lost a lot of weight and gotten healthier by adopting a plant-based diet.

However, he does not classify himself as vegan and that is OK.

VegesaurusRex

I am a member of PCRM, meaning I donate to it. I have also met Neil Barnard serveral times. Dr Barnard does know what he is talking about. I don't believe he has an excess ounce of fat on his body. I am also a member of PETA by the way. To make it even more interesting, I lived in France for three years (Paris) and I can tell you there is about as much similarity between what a typical French woman eats, and what American women eat as there is between what a gazelle eats to what a hippopotamus eats, The French only have one major meal per day,and they usually take about four hours to eat it, even though the major meal of the day is smaller than most American snacks. Anyway, that is the way it was when I lived there (late '70's).

Finally anyone who thinks eating copious gobs of processed cholesterol and fat won't do him or her any harm has no clue.

Audddua

I find the ad offensive. I am a vegan and I still have cottage cheese thighs.

To whom do I express my outrage at this travesty?

:laugh: Literally laughed out loud for that one.

Tenoreo90

How silly. I eat cheese in small amounts, usually fat-free or part-skim (I especially love Laughing Cow Light mmm). Yes, full-fat cheese isn't very good for you, but it's just silly to single that out.

jenbusick

Unless she is watching her diet with a very serious eye, and probably taking some nutritional supplements (B12 and iron at least), she (like all vegans) is putting herself at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies.

Humans are omnivores. We are not designed to get all of the nutrients we need from plants, the way that cows (ruminants) are, nor are we designed to only digest meat (like, say, cats). Your diet is healthier because it has the potential to provide all of the essential nutrients you need without supplementation or rigorous balancing.

While I agree that some vegans can have issues with nutritional deficiency, so can some omnivores. If all you eat is junkfood every day, you will have nutritional problems.

Absolutely. Not eating a balanced diet will cause nutritional problems, period. But an omnivore with a reasonably balanced diet that includes high quality protein and lots of fruits and vegetables probably has the least to worry about.

april522

Wow....

ahmpierce1

I'm not saying i *never* eat cheese, but very seldom. For this example: Cheese is made from cow's milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows. Why would an adult human need food designed to help a baby cow grow up and be an adult cow? Would you drink a stranger's breast milk? It's meant for baby humans. MILK is not meant to be consumed by adults no matter which'a way you you look at it.

Someones been reading Skinny B*tch

FearAnLoathing

Nope. Because it's not just "consuming animals". It's a combination of fat stored in the body, lack of exercise, clogged arteries, age, family history, etc. etc. It's not as laughably simple as "eat animals, get heart disease." Because as I previously stated, the entire human species wouldn't have made it if it were.

Interesting take. Not sure how to follow it though. We would have never made it as a species if eating animals leads to heart disease? That part sounds right, only at first.

To survive, the species most propagate itself. Humans can normally begin making babies right around 13. You don't die of heart disease until a tad later in life than that, so heart disease would not be enough to stop us.

Fat stored in the body and eating animal products have nothing to do with each other??? I'll just give you that one.

Clogged arteries!!! Here we go, I understand this one. Clogged arteries definitely are present in people with heart disease. Clogged arteries are heart disease. Arteries that are clogged are clogged with dietary cholesterol. (Your body makes cholesterol and that cholesterol is necessary, but DOES NOT CLOG ARTERIES)

Age- takes time for that dietary cholesterol to build up and destroy your endothelium!!!

Family History: LOTS of truth here! On your side on this one pal! If there is no history of heart disease in your family anywhere, then you probably won't get it either. For some people, dietary cholesterol does not transfer into artery clogging cholesterol. Those people are super lucky! (my stepdad is one of them)

Exercise is really important too, but more so if you do intend to consume dietary cholesterol as exercise is the best way to control the ratio of bad to good.

I hope you are on of the lucky ones. Good luck to you!

Hi there! So ok I grew up in a house eating meat EVERY SINGLE MEAL. Breakfast,lunch dinner all had meat.I still eat that way.
Im almost 35 and 2 weeks ago got a full physical,choleserol numbers great,blood pressure great,the dr said my heart is as strong as someone 10 years younger than me.100% perfect health even though i eat cheese as well.

Reasie26

Unless she is watching her diet with a very serious eye, and probably taking some nutritional supplements (B12 and iron at least), she (like all vegans) is putting herself at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies.

Humans are omnivores. We are not designed to get all of the nutrients we need from plants, the way that cows (ruminants) are, nor are we designed to only digest meat (like, say, cats). Your diet is healthier because it has the potential to provide all of the essential nutrients you need without supplementation or rigorous balancing.

While I agree that some vegans can have issues with nutritional deficiency, so can some omnivores. If all you eat is junkfood every day, you will have nutritional problems.

I am a vegan and just got my blood work back. I don't pay particularly special attention to my diet and I take a children's multi-vitamin daily. My levels are perfect -- iron, b12, protein. I'm as healthy as I've ever been. And despite not losing a lot of scale weight my cholesterol and trycliderides have also gone down.

Eating a vegan diet is very simple and not at all difficult.

However... living a vegan lifestyle is very different than eating a plant based diet. Which is what caddymatt was trying to distinguish himself from. He's a very inspirational person. He has lost a lot of weight and gotten healthier by adopting a plant-based diet.

However, he does not classify himself as vegan and that is OK.

This.

Humans can easily survive and THRIVE on a vegan diet. We can get ALL of our nutrients from a plant-based diet. Even B12! If we didn't have to wash our produce so thouroughly due to all the trash in our environment (pesticides, fertilizers, etc.), we would get the B12 there; it is found in the soil. So, it's only because humans have screwed that up that we can't get ALL of our nutrients from a plant-based diet without supplements. But, there are still plenty of ways to get ALL the nutrients you need on a vegan diet without tracking every nutrient you consume and taking multiple pills. So, I think it's pure idiocy to say that all vegans are putting themselves at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies. No, very few are. Just like very few omnivores are.

VegesaurusRex

Unless she is watching her diet with a very serious eye, and probably taking some nutritional supplements (B12 and iron at least), she (like all vegans) is putting herself at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies.

Humans are omnivores. We are not designed to get all of the nutrients we need from plants, the way that cows (ruminants) are, nor are we designed to only digest meat (like, say, cats). Your diet is healthier because it has the potential to provide all of the essential nutrients you need without supplementation or rigorous balancing.

While I agree that some vegans can have issues with nutritional deficiency, so can some omnivores. If all you eat is junkfood every day, you will have nutritional problems.

I am a vegan and just got my blood work back. I don't pay particularly special attention to my diet and I take a children's multi-vitamin daily. My levels are perfect -- iron, b12, protein. I'm as healthy as I've ever been. And despite not losing a lot of scale weight my cholesterol and trycliderides have also gone down.

Eating a vegan diet is very simple and not at all difficult.

However... living a vegan lifestyle is very different than eating a plant based diet. Which is what caddymatt was trying to distinguish himself from. He's a very inspirational person. He has lost a lot of weight and gotten healthier by adopting a plant-based diet.

However, he does not classify himself as vegan and that is OK.

This.

Humans can easily survive and THRIVE on a vegan diet. We can get ALL of our nutrients from a plant-based diet. Even B12! If we didn't have to wash our produce so thouroughly due to all the trash in our environment (pesticides, fertilizers, etc.), we would get the B12 there; it is found in the soil. So, it's only because humans have screwed that up that we can't get ALL of our nutrients from a plant-based diet without supplements. But, there are still plenty of ways to get ALL the nutrients you need on a vegan diet without tracking every nutrient you consume and taking multiple pills. So, I think it's pure idiocy to say that all vegans are putting themselves at risk of serious nutritional deficiencies. No, very few are. Just like very few omnivores are.

100% agree! Except there are no such things as omnivores. Herbivores eat most, or all vegetables. Carnivores eat mostly meat, or all meat. A mouse can eat meat and a wofl can eat berries. I have yet to hear a good definition of an omnivore. Eventually, a herbivore, such as a human who eats too much meat will develop a chronic disease. A true carnivore never will, even if it eats hundreds of times as much cholesterol as normal.

VegesaurusRex

FearanLothin, I am happy for you that you had a great phsyical at 35. Considering your diet I hope you live to 65. Most chronic diseases caused by eating meat do not present at 35 but later, although of course that is not always true.

delilah47

I'm not saying i *never* eat cheese, but very seldom. For this example: Cheese is made from cow's milk. Cow's milk is for baby cows. Why would an adult human need food designed to help a baby cow grow up and be an adult cow? Would you drink a stranger's breast milk? It's meant for baby humans. MILK is not meant to be consumed by adults no matter which'a way you you look at it.

Someones been reading Skinny B*tch

no, never have. this has been my viewpoint for the past 40 years.

FearAnLoathing

FearanLothin, I am happy for you that you had a great phsyical at 35. Considering your diet I hope you live to 65. Most chronic diseases caused by eating meat do not present at 35 but later, although of course that is not always true.

well lets see i come from a family of meat eaters my grandma lived to 75,my other grandma 73,my great grandma 99.all meat eaters who died from nothing people "claim" is related to eating meat.my moms 63 and in perfect health,my grandfather lived to his 70s the other granfatherdied fairly early but that was from lung cancer.