Everything in moderation? Really?
Replies
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For me, this is not a diet. This is a lifestyle change. I love eating fresh clean foods for weeks and weeks on end, but then Ill get a craving for a Mcdonalds sausage mcmuffin. I then have it - and enjoy every salty greasy mouthful! For me this makes sense. I used to diet by restricting my foods: the cabbage soup diet, south beach etc and as soon as I hit that craving and indulge I would 'fail' and then be demotivated to continue. Now my brain has changed, I can have an indulgence and move on without it causing me any issues.
For others maybe that is not the way to go - but we all have our weaknesses and challenges and deal with them differently!0 -
For me, this is not a diet. This is a lifestyle change. I love eating fresh clean foods for weeks and weeks on end, but then Ill get a craving for a Mcdonalds sausage mcmuffin. I then have it - and enjoy every salty greasy mouthful! For me this makes sense. I used to diet by restricting my foods: the cabbage soup diet, south beach etc and as soon as I hit that craving and indulge I would 'fail' and then be demotivated to continue. Now my brain has changed, I can have an indulgence and move on without it causing me any issues.
For others maybe that is not the way to go - but we all have our weaknesses and challenges and deal with them differently!
Something else I should have been clearer in my original post. My idea of eliminating certain foods is nothing like the restrictive diets you listed. I would never consider those for optimal health. My idea of an optimal diet would be more focused on JERF ("just eat real foods"). The foods I would first consider eliminating entirely would be those with a long ingredients list (or foods that need to be artificially fortified to be fit for human consumption).
Oh, and my use of the word "diet" means nothing more than "what one habitually eats"...but I realize that isn't the first definition people think of (especially on MFP). Totally agree with a change to a healthier way of eating as a lifestyle change and not a temporary diet.
Edit: because I hate tpyos...0 -
Just how do you define real food? Is cereal real food? Bread? Cake? Sausage? Crab cake?
As with most things, our choices have to fit our lifestyles. I consider myself to be a foodie, have friends that are as well, and we go out and try new cuisines, new restaurants, etc. I will not go to an exceptionally good restaurant and eat salad (assuming it is offered). I try out a bunch of whatever sounds interesting, or their specialties, and the way I eat normally allows for that. I also own my own company, and take clients/potential clients out to dinners. I can assure you that eating like I'm on a diet is a surefire way to lose business. When my client says 'The banana pudding sounds delicious, but I can't eat it all by myself', the right response is 'Why don't we split it?' not 'I don't eat desserts'.
It usually boils down to 'You do what works for you, and I'll do the same'. Obviously, if it isn't working, then staying on the same course is foolish, but that goes for any diet/fitness regimen, not just eating in moderation.0 -
Not all at one time.0
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Am I the only person on MFP who *doesn't* believe in "everything in moderation"? That some foods just aren't worth eating, so I don't? That some foods are processed to the point that they don't really seem like food anymore and the only reason you *think* they taste good is because you are conditioned to believe they taste good? That the excuse of "if I don't eat it, then I'll just crave it more and that will destroy my diet" is just that, an excuse? That maybe, just maybe, the "secret" to ending a "bad relationship" with certain foods that ultimately cause you to stumble in your diet is to stop eating them entirely (and then learning that once you do, these foods no longer have such power over you)?
:huh:
ETA: And please don't misunderstand, I'm not talking about *never* eating something that isn't totally healthy for you. I understand that sometimes, certain foods *are* worth the dietary hit. I'm talking about the constant insistence that *nothing* is ever off limits (and then the subsequent problem: a frequent indulgence in foods like these).
No, I absolutely, positively agree with you 1000000000%0 -
what is happiness worth?
for some people happiness is a walk on the beach,
for others it's cuddling with their loved ones,
for some it might be that big mac as a once a month treat.
i see no harm in it. regular doses of happiness are good for your health!0 -
what is happiness worth?
for some people happiness is a walk on the beach,
for others it's cuddling with their loved ones,
for some it might be that big mac as a once a month treat.
i see no harm in it. regular doses of happiness are good for your health!
I find it utterly ridiculous to equate happiness with food. That is an unhealthy emotional attachment with something that can be very detrimental to one's health.
Being healthy makes me lead a happy, more loving and productive life. No junk or fake food is worth taking that away.
And, I find that most people now days don't know what it is like to actually feel GOOD.0 -
Since we are friends, you've probably seen me say this before...
The issue I have with the "everything in moderation" atitude is that people use it to describe products - Coke, big macs, twinkies. Okay. You may be moderating your intake of certain types of foods, but what you're NOT moderating is the ingredients that go into those foods.
Unless their consumption of "in moderation" foods is extremely rare, many people who think they are eating in moderation are still consuming a lot more high fructose corn syrup, partially hydrogenated oils (trans fat), etc. than they would believe. Does anyone really keep a weekly or daily total in grams or miligrams of these ingredients? That's unrealistic, right?
If they are fine with that, then what do I care? Eat what you want, you live the way you live in order to be happy. But to me personally, food is the sum of all its parts (ingredients). If the ingredients themselves are a turn-off, the food as a whole is not appetizing.0 -
I don't believe in fast food, soda, or processed foods, things like potato chips, fritos, things like that. Other than that, I'm pretty open to the everything in moderation theory. Yesterday, I had 2 donuts. It's not like I do that all the time. I just felt like it. I'm maintaining and exercising and I wanted them.0
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It seems some people need an “all-or-nothing” approach and that’s what works best for them. Other people respond better to small adjustments over time.
I’m in the smaller adjustment camp. My good health habits have been built over several years. And I’m far from “there” yet. There are still things I’m working on. But I can see where I was to where I am now and feel good about my progress.
I will say I believe in all things in moderation, but “moderation” is in the eye of the beholder. Once upon a time that might have meant fast food only once a week. Now it means fast food a couple of times a year, if that. As you adopt better habits they become just that, habits. And then it’s easier to take on more change. And tastes change over time as well. The healthier you eat, the healthier you tend to want to eat.0 -
For the most part I eat everything in moderation, like sometimes I'll have cake or cookies or Pringles or whatever. But there are still things I WON'T eat. I won't eat McDonalds, I haven't been there in over a year now. And I used to dump Splenda on pretty much everything I put in my mouth. It was hard at first but now I domt miss them.0
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I think the "everything in moderation" principle works for the majority of people.
However, I think it is a terrible idea for a minority who have clear food triggers leading to binging. Some people simply cannot stop at one cookie or one slice of cake. These people have to go hardcore / all or nothing.
I don't see what the big deal is really. Do what works for your individual situation.0 -
I think many of these arguements can be ended with one simple statement.
Mind ya damn business.
Worry about YOUR body and leave mine the heck alone!!0 -
i don't dismiss other people's enjoyments as ridiculous. i'm sure a lot of people out there hate cats and would find my 'playing with the cat' dose of happiness utterly ridiculous... but i'd just think they were being muppets.what is happiness worth?
for some people happiness is a walk on the beach,
for others it's cuddling with their loved ones,
for some it might be that big mac as a once a month treat.
i see no harm in it. regular doses of happiness are good for your health!
I find it utterly ridiculous to equate happiness with food. That is an unhealthy emotional attachment with something that can be very detrimental to one's health.
Being healthy makes me lead a happy, more loving and productive life. No junk or fake food is worth taking that away.
And, I find that most people now days don't know what it is like to actually feel GOOD.
if chocolate makes a person happy, if they can find a way to have it without it damaging their health, then who are you to judge them? it's only an unhealthy attachment if they cannot control it, if they rely on it, if they indulge too often.
judgy mcjudgypants.0 -
I think many of these arguements can be ended with one simple statement.
Mind ya damn business.
Worry about YOUR body and leave mine the heck alone!!
It's possible to start a discussion on the internet without it being an attempt to pry that quadruple big mac from your meaty fists0 -
i don't dismiss other people's enjoyments as ridiculous. i'm sure a lot of people out there hate cats and would find my 'playing with the cat' dose of happiness utterly ridiculous... but i'd just think they were being muppets.what is happiness worth?
for some people happiness is a walk on the beach,
for others it's cuddling with their loved ones,
for some it might be that big mac as a once a month treat.
i see no harm in it. regular doses of happiness are good for your health!
I find it utterly ridiculous to equate happiness with food. That is an unhealthy emotional attachment with something that can be very detrimental to one's health.
Being healthy makes me lead a happy, more loving and productive life. No junk or fake food is worth taking that away.
And, I find that most people now days don't know what it is like to actually feel GOOD.
if chocolate makes a person happy, if they can find a way to have it without it damaging their health, then who are you to judge them? it's only an unhealthy attachment if they cannot control it, if they rely on it, if they indulge too often.
judgy mcjudgypants.
Ha! Love it.
I was gonna say... Food and nutrition is one of my favorite hobbies. I positively LOVE to cook. It is relaxing and makes me incredibly happy. Mastering a new recipe, cooking for friends, all of that. And my love of cooking was spawned from me learning to eat healthier, making healthier food at home for myself. My love of food is far from unhealthy - it's made me healthier.
We all have hobbies and passions. Food can most certainly be one of them.0 -
No, you aren't.
Everyone has their opinion, and we all have things that work for us and things that don't. To each, their own. I do believe in everything in moderation but can see how it doesn't work for all.
Indeed...and here is another of my opinions:
My thought is that many of the biggest proponents in "everything in moderation" are using it as a crutch and they may not even know it. And that belief may be what is making their attempts at a new dietary lifestyle so difficult to keep. That overcoming what some may even call an "addiction" (but I will just call a "strong reliance on") may not be a lifetime of deprivation that they think it will be, but instead a liberation from the power that food has over their lives. But until they get out from under "everything in moderation", it's a liberation they may never know.
You are making an assumption here that a 'moderation' lifestyle is 'so difficult to keep'. It is the easiest thing I've done. I eat pretty much the same way I always have, just in smaller quantities. What's so hard about that?
This is an easy one. Are you telling me that people (on MFP and elsewhere) do not struggle in reaching their dietary goals? That "EIM" has a great track record for success and longevity? I don't believe that's the case and I also don't believe it's just my assumption.
Now, I'll admit, it *is* my assumption that "EIM" is part of the problem for the failure rate of dietary changes, but that "moderation" lifestyle is often not effective seems to be supported by plenty of evidence.
"SEEMS to be supported" is where I have a problem. I have seen no study, anywhere, that suggests EIM is ineffective. I have, however, seen many, many studies that suggest that deprevation diets are ineffective. And yes, eliminating all fast food, sugar, etc. all at once can be considered a deprevation diet.0 -
You've already edited your original post, so I have to assume you've read it more than once. It seems like you are contradicting yourself, or dancing around what you are really trying to say.Am I the only person on MFP who *doesn't* believe in "everything in moderation"? That some foods just aren't worth eating, so I don't? That some foods are processed to the point that they don't really seem like food anymore and the only reason you *think* they taste good is because you are conditioned to believe they taste good? That the excuse of "if I don't eat it, then I'll just crave it more and that will destroy my diet" is just that, an excuse? That maybe, just maybe, the "secret" to ending a "bad relationship" with certain foods that ultimately cause you to stumble in your diet is to stop eating them entirely (and then learning that once you do, these foods no longer have such power over you)?
:huh:
ETA: And please don't misunderstand, I'm not talking about *never* eating something that isn't totally healthy for you. I understand that sometimes, certain foods *are* worth the dietary hit. I'm talking about the constant insistence that *nothing* is ever off limits (and then the subsequent problem: a frequent indulgence in foods like these).
Then I read some of your subsequent posts and I figured it out. You just wanted to judge other people's choices and point out why they are doing it wrong. That's your prerogative, of course. But I wish you had been cleaner about it up front.0 -
It's possible to disagree with someone's choices without "judgment" of their character or worth as a human being. "Stop judging me!" is just an easier way of saying "it's your fault I am terrible at civil discourse".0
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I agree 100%
Some foods just aren't worth it. With alcoholics or drug addicts they have to give up entirely the things they're addicted to. With people who overeat uncontrollably they have to give up the things that trigger the overeating.
I wouldn't go to a Chinese buffet because I know I can't control myself to eat sensibly there. Denying myself it won't ruin my diet.0 -
Everything in moderation doesn't mean that you go out purposely to eat anything and everything. There are foods that I don't necessarily enjoy, foods that I never really felt it was worth eating, for whatever reason. I am not going to go out and eat them now either. There are some things that I will eat only very occasionally, maybe a few times a year, but I won't say never to them. I also won't cut something out that I can reasonably have frequently that I really enjoy just because someone else has decided that this means I have some imaginary 'big issue' with that food.0
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Eat to live. Not live to eat.0
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Moderation of certain foods works well for many people. I don't label the way I eat, and I certainly don't eat "everything" in moderatin, because I don't like everything. But I do eat less healthy foods that I like less often, and healthy foods that I like more often.
Others have to cut out certain foods altogether to avoid overeating them because they simply can't keep it at "moderation". Some even cut out healthy foods or entire food groups in order to keep their cravings in check. And that's perfectly fine as long as they don't take it to an extreme that causes malnutrition.
There is no 'one size fits all' guide to healthy eating.0 -
Since I started trying to lose weight, I have also started reading the back of packages when food shopping. Hard work with my eyesight. I even started carrying a small magnifying glass.
I don't actually rule out any food that I like. I just note the number of calories, so I am aware of the effect of eating one thing rather than another.
One strange thing I have found is with sweets and chocolate. Before I started dieting I used to eat loads of sweets and chocolate - which is what got me where I am today. The same applied to Fast Foods. I loved them.
Oddly enough I seem to have trained myself not to want them. In the old days when I had a packet of sweets or a chocolate bar they would be gone in minutes. Yesterday I received two boxes of Maltesers for my Birthday and although I have started one of them I don't feel much like eating them. I still like the taste, but I am not really that bothered whether I eat them or not.
Once upon a time I would have been horrified at that idea - to lose the taste for sweets :noway:0 -
I can't say i agree with "Everything in Moderation"...there are some things that i just can't eat if i want to be successful on this journey. Fast food has always been a big addiction for me. It's a "gateway drug" in my opinion. If i allow myself to eat a McDonald's cheeseburger once, then i'll want the fries to go with it, and the soda, and then i might go back the next day. I don't think i'm at the point where i can stop it after i start. So i cut it out of my life completely. I get no value from it...no health, no nutrients, and it makes me feel like crap. So, I do believe that there are some people (such as myself) that have to completely eliminate certain foods in order to be successful. Of course on the drive home from work i still crave some of that stuff...but i don't allow myself to indulge. I know where it will lead and You are correct, i would just have to start all over again. I would rather find healthier alternatives to that cheesburger than enjoy "everthing in moderation".0
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There are things I will not eat..... but I do believe in "everything I like in moderation". And I do happen to like wine and Taco Bell quite well. Also, large sushi binge dinners with my husband. And tator tots.
I don't like artificial sweeteners, super greasy burgers, or super greasy anything for that matter. (Except Taco Bell. I'm all about some Nachos Bellgrande... but they have veggies on and don't seem that greasy.)
I also hate salt and omit it in nearly every recipe.
So I guess I say "everything in moderation that doesn't suck to ME".0 -
Some foods aren't worth eating, but those foods are different for everybody. So if I truly want it, then I will have it, usually in moderation unless of course TOM is involved then the moderation theory occasionally gets kicked to the curb.0
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You've already edited your original post, so I have to assume you've read it more than once. It seems like you are contradicting yourself, or dancing around what you are really trying to say.Am I the only person on MFP who *doesn't* believe in "everything in moderation"? That some foods just aren't worth eating, so I don't? That some foods are processed to the point that they don't really seem like food anymore and the only reason you *think* they taste good is because you are conditioned to believe they taste good? That the excuse of "if I don't eat it, then I'll just crave it more and that will destroy my diet" is just that, an excuse? That maybe, just maybe, the "secret" to ending a "bad relationship" with certain foods that ultimately cause you to stumble in your diet is to stop eating them entirely (and then learning that once you do, these foods no longer have such power over you)?
:huh:
ETA: And please don't misunderstand, I'm not talking about *never* eating something that isn't totally healthy for you. I understand that sometimes, certain foods *are* worth the dietary hit. I'm talking about the constant insistence that *nothing* is ever off limits (and then the subsequent problem: a frequent indulgence in foods like these).
Then I read some of your subsequent posts and I figured it out. You just wanted to judge other people's choices and point out why they are doing it wrong. That's your prerogative, of course. But I wish you had been cleaner about it up front.
This. I'm happy whatever works for each person works for them, and I know what works for me. I know what my goals are. I'm not going to change my everything because someone on the internet told me I should.0 -
I think that 'everything in moderation' can be dangerous for some people, but it can be the key to longterm sustainability for others. But I do think that you have to exercise moderation even when practicing the 'everything in moderation' mantra. For example, for some people, 'everything in moderation' might mean eating clean all month and then on one Saturday night polishing off a whole pizza in one sitting (which, IMO, is a binge). I tend to think of moderation in terms of having pizza on a more regular basis, but only eating two slices and organizing your other meals that day so that you're staying within an acceptable calorie range for the day.0
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It's great to hear that EIM is working for many of you. (And I'm admittedly disappointed that more "not EIM" haven't responded.)
I still say that there are some out there for whom it has *not* worked, but have been told that it is the only way. For those who have not been able to reach and maintain their goals, I believe EIM is worth questioning.
Who do you think has told them it is the only way?0
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