Lance Armstrong admits to cheating.
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like i said i wish i could change the title but for some reason MFP does not let you.
and as for the mountains of evidence..there have been countless people that have claimed he cheated.
i dont actually have a problem with him cheating...seems like all cyclists do it. but i hate the way he was so smug.
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
He has never failed a drug test.
There is no evidence. This is why the Federal Gov't dropped their case in February.0 -
For the couple of comments stating he must have doped, otherwise why so good - genetics is big part of it.
Indurain had a lot of tests on him made public too, but nothing this nice as pre and post champion. I'm sure all kinds of other riders have this basically done, but published seems to be the kicker for seeing how unusual this is, though the study does comment on that.
http://www.jappl.org/content/98/6/2191.fullMaximal oxygen uptake (V̇O2 max) in the trained state remained at ∼6 l/min, lean body weight remained at ∼70 kg, and maximal heart rate declined from 207 to 200 beats/min. Blood lactate threshold was typical of competitive cyclists in that it occurred at 76–85% V̇O2 max, yet maximal blood lactate concentration was remarkably low in the trained state. It appears that an 8% improvement in muscular efficiency and thus power production when cycling at a given oxygen uptake (V̇O2) is the characteristic that improved most as this athlete matured from ages 21 to 28 yr. It is noteworthy that at age 25 yr, this champion developed advanced cancer, requiring surgeries and chemotherapy. During the months leading up to each of his Tour de France victories, he reduced body weight and body fat by 4–7 kg (i.e., ∼7%). Therefore, over the 7-yr period, an improvement in muscular efficiency and reduced body fat contributed equally to a remarkable 18% improvement in his steady-state power per kilogram body weight when cycling at a given V̇O2 (e.g., 5 l/min). It is hypothesized that the improved muscular efficiency probably reflects changes in muscle myosin type stimulated from years of training intensely for 3–6 h on most days.0 -
I'm sorry but I have now read 5 different articles about this and not in one of them does it say that he admitted to cheating.
You clearly did NOT read through the article you linked to before you posted it with such a misleading title.
no, he'll never admit that he did. but, if he didn't, he seems to be the only one that had any success in his profession that didn't. and he destroyed all of those that did. so kind of tough to imagine that he was clean that whole time.
and no matter what kind of pretty bow is put on it, he left his wife after she stood by him through all of his cancer treatment. which is pretty weak, too.
But we aren't talking about imagining anything here. Just because there is absence of proof of guilt, does not mean he isn't innocent is all I'm saying. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't like to automatically assume that every athlete who wins is doping, just because there is lack of proof that he isn't.
Regarding his personal life, neither you nor I have a right to judge him. That isn't even related to the discussion. What goes on between a couple is really their own business and no one else's.0 -
like i said i wish i could change the title but for some reason MFP does not let you.
and as for the mountains of evidence..there have been countless people that have claimed he cheated.
i dont actually have a problem with him cheating...seems like all cyclists do it. but i hate the way he was so smug.
If someone walked up to you, and offered you a thousand dollars to lie and someone else cheated... or was some half crazied person wanting some time in the lime light... would you lie? I am sorry, it is still hear say0 -
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
there have been several big-name riders, in fact. and some set to testify.0 -
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
there have been several big-name riders, in fact. and some set to testify.
They remain unnamed in the claim. The USADA refused the right for Lance to face his accusers.0 -
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
there have been several big-name riders, in fact. and some set to testify.
They remain unnamed in the claim. The USADA refused the right for Lance to face his accusers.
the point is there is a lot of evidence against him...and that is probably why he has chosen not to fight it.0 -
Such a disappointment. I'm disappointed if he cheated and I'm disappointed if he didn't cheat but gave up fighting for clearing his name. I don't know all the facts, we probably never will but when you quit fighting your admitting guilt (atleast that's the case most of the time) I wonder if any of his wins were clean, either way I'm sure he'll be stripped of all of them. I absolutely love cycling and I pray one day we have a cleaner sport. It is truely a beautiful sport. I'm already counting down until next years tour
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But we aren't talking about imagining anything here. Just because there is absence of proof of guilt, does not mean he isn't innocent is all I'm saying. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't like to automatically assume that every athlete who wins is doping, just because there is lack of proof that he isn't.
Regarding his personal life, neither you nor I have a right to judge him. That isn't even related to the discussion. What goes on between a couple is really their own business and no one else's.
maybe being a sportswriter for so long has changed the way I view these guys. I'll grant you that. but I believe the preponderance of circumstantial evidence -- and what seemed to be a requirement of success in his field -- say he more than likely cheated than didn't. add to that the fact that he came back and did so well after all of his health battles ... I just can't accept the feel-good story at face value. genetics definitely play a role. and he is and was a freaking specimen of fitness. it just may not have all been natural.0 -
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
there have been several big-name riders, in fact. and some set to testify.
They remain unnamed in the claim. The USADA refused the right for Lance to face his accusers.
the point is there is a lot of evidence against him...and that is probably why he has chosen not to fight it.
What evidence?0 -
But we aren't talking about imagining anything here. Just because there is absence of proof of guilt, does not mean he isn't innocent is all I'm saying. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't like to automatically assume that every athlete who wins is doping, just because there is lack of proof that he isn't.
Regarding his personal life, neither you nor I have a right to judge him. That isn't even related to the discussion. What goes on between a couple is really their own business and no one else's.
maybe being a sportswriter for so long has changed the way I view these guys. I'll grant you that. but I believe the preponderance of circumstantial evidence -- and what seemed to be a requirement of success in his field -- say he more than likely cheated than didn't. add to that the fact that he came back and did so well after all of his health battles ... I just can't accept the feel-good story at face value. genetics definitely play a role. and he is and was a freaking specimen of fitness. it just may not have all been natural.
I'm not saying he is clean but there is no way to prove it.0 -
The people who claim he cheated are all "anonymous"
there have been several big-name riders, in fact. and some set to testify.
They remain unnamed in the claim. The USADA refused the right for Lance to face his accusers.
the point is there is a lot of evidence against him...and that is probably why he has chosen not to fight it.
What evidence?
all the evidence the US doping agency has. or do you have some silly notion they are going after him just for the fun of it?
if their evidence was weak or they had none he would not give up.
how can you not see that?0 -
He was tested after every race. He always tested clean. The "Anti's" don't believe the tests? Sounds like a witch hunt to me. Where is the evidence? Present it. Get it over with. Shouldn't take forever. He has another life now and wants to get on with it. He knows he won the races and didn't or did use drugs. There are more important battles to fight these days.
BALCO made a fortune creating and distributing "designer" steroids, specifically made to allow the user to pass current drug testing. Barry Bonds didn't fail a drug test for YEARS, but admitted to using 2 of these designer steroids under oath (a failed test later turned up during the BALCO trial). As long as there are tests, there will be cheaters and outside entities facilitating the cheating. Not saying that Armstrong cheated, but uh... 7 consecutive Tour de France titles... the race which The New York Times has called "... arguably the most physiologically demanding of athletic events..." in an era of stealth steroids and human growth hormone that can elude the most Clouseau-esque drug testing... suspicions abound.0 -
He never admitted to cheating...he simply said he's tired of fighting.
Armstrong, who retired last year, declined to enter USADA's arbitration process — his last option — because he said he was weary of fighting accusations that have dogged him for years. He has consistently pointed to the hundreds of drug tests that he has passed as proof of his innocence during his extraordinary run of Tour titles stretchingfrom1999-2005.
"There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now," Armstrong said in a statement sent to The Associated Press. He called the USADA investigation an "unconstitutional witch hunt."
"I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in winning my seven Tours since 1999," he said. "The toll this has taken on my family and my work for our foundation and on me leads me to where I am today - finished with this nonsense."
The USADA simply took that as an admission of guilty on his part. Is he clean? Unless he flat out says, "Yes, I took steroids, performance enhancing drugs or what have you", I don't think we'll know for sure.0 -
I don't think is about him passing the tests because anyone can beat any of these tests. Evidence such as his name tied down to a supplier list, supplier, or teammates ratting him out with evidence. Pretty much what the earlier poster said.0
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How the heck didn't he get caught over all those years ESPECIALLY with them trying so hard to catch him. If he cheated, they would have found it. I don't think he cheated... I think he's that good.
Using this logic, Bolt must be a cheater too, right?0 -
I don't think is about him passhttp://sports.yahoo.com/news/usada-strip-lance-armstrong-7-tour-titles-031949504--spt.htmling the tests because anyone can beat any of these tests. Evidence such as his name tied down to a supplier list, supplier, or teammates ratting him out with evidence. Pretty much what the earlier poster said.
Very true...but even the judge who decided in favor of the USADA when Armstrong sued them questioned their motives, according to this article:
"USADA's conduct raises serious questions about whether its real interest in charging Armstrong is to combat doping, or if it is acting according to less noble motives," such as politics or publicity, U.S. District Judge Sam Sparks wrote.
Here is the link to the article on Yahoo: http://sports.yahoo.com/news/usada-strip-lance-armstrong-7-tour-titles-031949504--spt.html0 -
Lance Armstong's Statement of August 23, 2012
AUSTIN, Texas - August 23rd, 2012 - There comes a point in every man's life when he has to say, "Enough is enough." For me, that time is now. I have been dealing with claims that I cheated and had an unfair advantage in winning my seven Tours since 1999. Over the past three years, I have been subjected to a two-year federal criminal investigation followed by Travis Tygart's unconstitutional witch hunt. The toll this has taken on my family, and my work for our foundation and on me leads me to where I am today – finished with this nonsense.
I had hoped that a federal court would stop USADA’s charade. Although the court was sympathetic to my concerns and recognized the many improprieties and deficiencies in USADA’s motives, its conduct, and its process, the court ultimately decided that it could not intervene.
If I thought for one moment that by participating in USADA’s process, I could confront these allegations in a fair setting and – once and for all – put these charges to rest, I would jump at the chance. But I refuse to participate in a process that is so one-sided and unfair. Regardless of what Travis Tygart says, there is zero physical evidence to support his outlandish and heinous claims. The only physical evidence here is the hundreds of controls I have passed with flying colors. I made myself available around the clock and around the world. In-competition. Out of competition. Blood. Urine. Whatever they asked for I provided. What is the point of all this testing if, in the end, USADA will not stand by it?
From the beginning, however, this investigation has not been about learning the truth or cleaning up cycling, but about punishing me at all costs. I am a retired cyclist, yet USADA has lodged charges over 17 years old despite its own 8-year limitation. As respected organizations such as UCI and USA Cycling have made clear, USADA lacks jurisdiction even to bring these charges. The international bodies governing cycling have ordered USADA to stop, have given notice that no one should participate in USADA’s improper proceedings, and have made it clear the pronouncements by USADA that it has banned people for life or stripped them of their accomplishments are made without authority. And as many others, including USADA’s own arbitrators, have found, there is nothing even remotely fair about its process. USADA has broken the law, turned its back on its own rules, and stiff-armed those who have tried to persuade USADA to honor its obligations. At every turn, USADA has played the role of a bully, threatening everyone in its way and challenging the good faith of anyone who questions its motives or its methods, all at U.S. taxpayers’ expense. For the last two months, USADA has endlessly repeated the mantra that there should be a single set of rules, applicable to all, but they have arrogantly refused to practice what they preach. On top of all that, USADA has allegedly made deals with other riders that circumvent their own rules as long as they said I cheated. Many of those riders continue to race today.
The bottom line is I played by the rules that were put in place by the UCI, WADA and USADA when I raced. The idea that athletes can be convicted today without positive A and B samples, under the same rules and procedures that apply to athletes with positive tests, perverts the system and creates a process where any begrudged ex-teammate can open a USADA case out of spite or for personal gain or a cheating cyclist can cut a sweetheart deal for themselves. It’s an unfair approach, applied selectively, in opposition to all the rules. It’s just not right.
USADA cannot assert control of a professional international sport and attempt to strip my seven Tour de France titles. I know who won those seven Tours, my teammates know who won those seven Tours, and everyone I competed against knows who won those seven Tours. We all raced together. For three weeks over the same roads, the same mountains, and against all the weather and elements that we had to confront. There were no shortcuts, there was no special treatment. The same courses, the same rules. The toughest event in the world where the strongest man wins. Nobody can ever change that. Especially not Travis Tygart.
Today I turn the page. I will no longer address this issue, regardless of the circumstances. I will commit myself to the work I began before ever winning a single Tour de France title: serving people and families affected by cancer, especially those in underserved communities. This October, my Foundation will celebrate 15 years of service to cancer survivors and the milestone of raising nearly $500 million. We have a lot of work to do and I'm looking forward to an end to this pointless distraction. I have a responsibility to all those who have stepped forward to devote their time and energy to the cancer cause. I will not stop fighting for that mission. Going forward, I am going to devote myself to raising my five beautiful (and energetic) kids, fighting cancer, and attempting to be the fittest 40-year old on the planet.0 -
How the heck didn't he get caught over all those years ESPECIALLY with them trying so hard to catch him. If he cheated, they would have found it. I don't think he cheated... I think he's that good.
Using this logic, Bolt must be a cheater too, right?
like someone said a few posts above yours...Bonds said the same thing and passed tests for years because he had good chemists on his side that could outwit the tests.
they now say they ahve blood samples that prove he was doping as part of their evidence.0 -
It would have been interesting to hear all of the evidence. Maybe his buddy Johan Bruyneel will take the fall?0
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It would have been interesting to hear all of the evidence. Maybe his buddy Johan Bruyneel will take the fall?
thats why i think he is gving up. he doesnt want this to be shown in public so that people will always wonder.0 -
But we aren't talking about imagining anything here. Just because there is absence of proof of guilt, does not mean he isn't innocent is all I'm saying. Maybe I'm naive, but I don't like to automatically assume that every athlete who wins is doping, just because there is lack of proof that he isn't.
Regarding his personal life, neither you nor I have a right to judge him. That isn't even related to the discussion. What goes on between a couple is really their own business and no one else's.
maybe being a sportswriter for so long has changed the way I view these guys. I'll grant you that. but I believe the preponderance of circumstantial evidence -- and what seemed to be a requirement of success in his field -- say he more than likely cheated than didn't. add to that the fact that he came back and did so well after all of his health battles ... I just can't accept the feel-good story at face value. genetics definitely play a role. and he is and was a freaking specimen of fitness. it just may not have all been natural.
I'm not saying he is clean but there is no way to prove it.
no, but look at the rest of the sport. then look at all the guys that were with and around him at the time. and, you want evidence? nothing here is a smoking gun ... but there are sure A LOT of folks trying to take this guy down, lying under oath, if this isn't legit stuff:
* floyd landis says he saw him blood doping along with him.
* landis also said he heard rumors of the team selling off gear to pay for the doping. george hincapie was said to have been there for the transfusions, too, but we don't know what he was going to say.
* landis, again, said that armstrong made several 'donations' to UCI in an effort to hush test results. armstrong says that the donations were honest, but the man did give $125,000 to a testing agency. which seems odd.
* a former teammate and his wife said, under oath in 96, that armstrong admitted to his doctors that he had taken EPO, growth hormone, testosterone and other drugs.
* SI had a report in the early 90s talking about three tests that indicated testosterone. but then there were screwups at the lab with the testing agents. can't be confirmed, of course, but the story seemed to color the relationship between the testers and the riders wasn't all the way up-and-up.
* SI also reported that armstrong had gotten his hands on HemAssist, a drug that was pulled from clinical trials and was illegal to own.
* his soigneur said that in 1999, the team forged a back-dated prescription to explain a positive test after the first stage of that Tour.
* for many years, armstrong was coached and trained by, and defended, dr. michele ferrari -- who was linked to many doping cases. he was actually finally convicted, and armstrong officially dumped him.
* then there are the '99 samples that allegedly show EPO.0 -
The power of the internet to spread rumors just makes me sick. The OP was very irresponsible in posting this topic. It's shameful.0
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The power of the internet to spread rumors just makes me sick. The OP was very irresponsible in posting this topic. It's shameful.
i admit the title is wrong but the article is legit. this isnt rumor. he is giving up. and there is evidence against him.0 -
I hope he didn't cheat. I don't think he did. I read an article just a few mins ago about this and it doesn't seem like they have any hard evidence to prove what they claim. Just because he gave up the fight doesn't mean he's guilty. It specifically says in the article I read on MSN that they took that as an admission of guilt. How long can you keep fighting to prove your innocence? How many drug test can you take and pass, but still be called a liar/cheat? It's a shame all the hard work he did and titles he won will be wiped away.0
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How the heck didn't he get caught over all those years ESPECIALLY with them trying so hard to catch him. If he cheated, they would have found it. I don't think he cheated... I think he's that good.
Using this logic, Bolt must be a cheater too, right?
like someone said a few posts above yours...Bonds said the same thing and passed tests for years because he had good chemists on his side that could outwit the tests.
they now say they ahve blood samples that prove he was doping as part of their evidence.
and, actually, testosterone can leave the body in 6 to 8 hours. if taken in low enough doses, too, it can boost the numbers but not high enough to trigger a positive test result. that's how victor conte got away with stuff for so long with baseball players.0 -
Whether or not he cheated, and whether or not this whole shameful incident is just a "witch hunt", it is still very, very sad. Millions of people have looked to him for motivation, inspiration and hope... And for more then just cycling.
Its a sad day if you ask me. :frown:0 -
* a former teammate and his wife said, under oath in 96, that armstrong admitted to his doctors that he had taken EPO, growth hormone, testosterone and other drugs.
out of all the evidence, this one is the most outstanding to me.... how ironic that it is in the same year HIPAA was signed. Making it illegal for this kind of information to be spread.0 -
* a former teammate and his wife said, under oath in 96, that armstrong admitted to his doctors that he had taken EPO, growth hormone, testosterone and other drugs.
out of all the evidence, this one is the most outstanding to me.... how ironic that it is in the same year HIPAA was signed. Making it illegal for this kind of information to be spread.
HIPAA wouldn't apply here, because the doctors didn't share the information. the two people in the room at the time armstrong made the admission did.0 -
* a former teammate and his wife said, under oath in 96, that armstrong admitted to his doctors that he had taken EPO, growth hormone, testosterone and other drugs.
out of all the evidence, this one is the most outstanding to me.... how ironic that it is in the same year HIPAA was signed. Making it illegal for this kind of information to be spread.
HIPAA wouldn't apply here, because the doctors didn't share the information. the two people in the room at the time armstrong made the admission did.
Anyone besides me not go into a medical examination room, with other people with me?0
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