Diet and Exercise vs. Surgery. Thoughts?

abberbabber

The bodybuilder or athlete on steroids who gets incredibly strong and fit--is that on their own? They still have to work out don't they? I bet you'd say it's NOT ..this is a comparable situation. Not the same but comparable. You'll never be the best, steroids or not, without hard work but that doesn't detract from the fact that you got help. It wasn't all within you to be the person you ended up when you have external help (I.e. surgery, steroids, etc)

And there are some of us who are willing and able to admit when we need that help. Asking for help when you actually need it? That's not weakness, it's smart.

Rosytakesoff

One of the biggest causes of regain is NOT stretching of the stomach, which is difficult, but by eating slider foods and drinking caloric drinks.

iAMsmiling

The bodybuilder or athlete on steroids who gets incredibly strong and fit--is that on their own? They still have to work out don't they? I bet you'd say it's NOT ..this is a comparable situation. Not the same but comparable. You'll never be the best, steroids or not, without hard work but that doesn't detract from the fact that you got help. It wasn't all within you to be the person you ended up when you have external help (I.e. surgery, steroids, etc)

And there are some of us who are willing and able to admit when we need that help. Asking for help when you actually need it? That's not weakness, it's smart.

Moreover, attaining a health weight is not a competition, or at least it's not supposed to be. So, "cheating" is not an applicable concept.
(Certain "reality" TV shows excluded.)

love4fitnesslove4food_wechange

My point is not that it's a competition but merely that it's undeniable that the success is not 100% your own. That's all. Like buying a house and your parents gave you the down payment--it's still an accomplishment to own your house buy its not 100% your own. Necessary, yes. By and large a good thing of you need their help but at the end of the day you can't say you did it all yourself.

iAMsmiling

My point is not that it's a competition but merely that it's undeniable that the success is not 100% your own. That's all. Like buying a house and your parents gave you the down payment--it's still an accomplishment to own your house buy its not 100% your own. Necessary, yes. By and large a good thing of you need their help but at the end of the day you can't say you did it all yourself.

If I use the support of the good folks here to succeed, is my success 100% my own?
What does it satisfy to be able to say you did it all by yourself? Is it about health or ego?

abberbabber

My point is not that it's a competition but merely that it's undeniable that the success is not 100% your own. That's all. Like buying a house and your parents gave you the down payment--it's still an accomplishment to own your house buy its not 100% your own. Necessary, yes. By and large a good thing of you need their help but at the end of the day you can't say you did it all yourself.

And your point is....? :huh:

ninerbuff

Surgery is usually PERMANENT. So if there are complications or results aren't what are expected, then there may be no way back. You can muck up a diet plan and still be okay. You can exercise and get sore or even get a small injury, but recover.
Go with the plan that involves less risk.

Edited to say that there will be times that weight loss surgery is needed (we do it at our hospital) and can literally save someone's life. But I've helped many a person lose 100lbs and know that it's very possible with consistency, discipline and a positive outlook to the actual goal. Yeah there's lots of moaning and groaning, but in the end the happiness and gratitude are worth it.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 28+ years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

mccbabe1

I debated the sleeve or gastric band myself until MFP!!! so i can understand why peeps would want or feel they need surgery to loose wt!!.. gastric bypass was originally intended for SEVERELY obese peope.. like "im 600 pounds and I havent left home in 6yrs!!".. that kind... not the 50+ throw on a band like now!.. its DEF over done and over prescribed/allowed by insurance companies (I work for an insurance company) and I see it all the time.. i saw one today in fact! A CASE.. female (older lady) my same height.. and was 6#'s more then my starting wt on MFP! and she was getting gastric Sleeve...
medi-cal also pays for gastric bypass! i just found out...
but its by no means an 'easy way out' i dont think.. a lot of peeps have problems after .. and shoot I love to eat food (duh) so why would I want to get surgery (of one kind or another) that means I literally CANT eat.. but like liquids and deal with band adjustments and all that crud...

valid topic .. good post..

mccbabe1

Surgery should only be used as a 100% last ditch effort for someone to lose weight (like if you're 800 pounds). But surgery doesn't change your mental status. You can lose a bunch of weight, but gain it back because you don't know how to eat properly. A lot of times, people stretch out their new stomachs because they continue binging and eating crap. I thought about surgery for a long time. But honestly, I think I was just way too lazy to put in the effort myself. Now, after losing nearly 75 pounds from my heaviest weight, I'm glad I didn't have surgery. Doing it yourself is so much more rewarding.

BUMP!!!!

i have a friend who was like 300 pounds... had gastric bypass..she has lost a lot and fast.. and bragged on fb about it.. but the othe day she posted "I miss food"!!! and I said "yeah.. i bet =(" sucks...

TheRealParisLove

I didn't think it was an either/or proposition. I've known someone who had bariatric surgery and she still had to watch what she ate and exercise regularly. the surgery was a last resort for her, because diet and exercise alone wasn't working and her health was deteriorating.

dpeeler28

I see a lot of people stating that they "tried every diet out there" before getting the surgery. I think that's the issue.. a lot of people tried to fad DIET their way out of it and didn't deal with their overeating issues upfront.

If you have an overeating issue, you shouldn't resolve that by removing most of your stomach. Go through therapy and FIGHT to avoid the cravings. It's completely possible.. to say that you /had/ to get part of your stomach removed to lose weight seems silly to me. That is why people say it's the "easy way out". Everybody knows that surgery itself is not fun or easy.

i appreciate your point of view, but if you have never been a food addict, then you really cannot even begin to understand what our "cravings" do to us. i have been to counseling, therapy. weight watchers, take a buddy to the gym, high protein-low carb, low fat etc etc....they haven't been all fad diets. when people have an emotional attachment to food, it is literally like giving up your best friend. and if you have never had to deal with that, it may sound silly because "it's just food." you can buffalo a counselor, you can talk your way right out of therapy and hell, i can even convince myself that i'm ok without it.....but like any "addict" that needs help, at the end of the day, i always caved.......because it was that one thing that made me feel good(maybe only for a minute)for 20 some years of my life....that's not something you can just "fight" off the urge for. the problem with food addiction is that it is NOT like a drug addiction, you cannot be "cured" because unfortunately even food addicts HAVE to eat to survive....i dont need drugs or alcohol to SURVIVE......there is NO being "sober" from food ever! People who have not had to fight this type of addiction will never understand the reasoning behind surgery(if so chosen) and they will always see it as a simple solution.....i for one am/ was addicted to food, i fight that battle everyday of my life and i always will......when i had surgery, i willingly gave up my "best friend, comfort, security blanket, and companion" to be a better me, to be a better mother and girlfriend. without having done so i would be NO kind of example for my children, because i would still be a very fat, unhealthy and unhappy addict. there is no dealing with the issue upfront because sometimes even us addicts will never know what the real issue ever was.....no amount of counseling or therapy can MAKE me understand why I chose food for comfort instead of the loving and understanding family i had.

TheRealParisLove

I used to follow a fitness blogger who lost a bunch of weight and would share her before and after photos and she now eats all these healthy things and exercises all the time, blah, blah, blah.

Eventually it came out that she had weight loss surgery, and the "before" photos she posted were before her surgery. She really angered her audience, so I'm guessing that she never intended to gain such a large following and was using the blog for personal/ vanity reasons.

It was too bad, because she was a talented writer. Had she been honest with the internet from the outset, she may have been able to establish a lucrative career as a writer.

Melampus

Although a little competition can be motivating I am losing weight to improve my health rather than to outdo anyone else. As such I would not regard having surgery as cheating in the same way that drug taking in sport is cheating.

On the other hand surgery has it's own risks, complications and time required to recover and here in the UK it may well be done on the NHS at the expense of the taxpayer so for all those reasons it should always be a last resort.

jenjen0214

I will start with the fact that I have had the gastric sleeve procedure. I have never been lazy, but I do have a sedentary job and by the end of my crazy day, it is easier to justify not exercising than it is to force myself to exercise. At the end of the week, I would have maybe gotten in an hour of cardiac exercise all week long. Before I made the decision for this, I decided that no matter what the outcome of the surgery that I would make significant changes in my life that would aide the surgical procedure I was having done. I laughingly read the posts that fools write stating that it is the "easy" way out. Nothing about this was easy. The changes I have made in my life, with the surgical changes that physically limit my poor mental roadblocks of portion control, the exercise that I hated in the beginning and now just live with part of my normal life have yielded me to currently weighing 130 pounds less than when I started. I have a long journey ahead of me simply because it is easy to get too tired to want to work out. Plan to go shopping with my sister instead of hanging out on my treadmill...but the results are that I am much healthier and I know I will live to annoy the crap out of my husband for years to come.

Your junk attitude will direct your every thought, and the self-righteous garbage that you spew in judgement of those around you will simply make you as ugly outside are you are inside.

For me and my lazy, worthless and degenerate waste on human space.... we are quite happy and will be walking again tonight and tomorrow morning....continuing on our pattern to learning to live healthier and hopefully be the adorable me on the outside that the inside already is.

9JANE

The surgery is necessary forsome people it is NOT the easy way out. That being said surgery is not at all easy and your stomach is not removed it is still there you can bypass the surgery and gain the weightback but why would you? You have to understand some of the people who have had the surgery have been overweight all of their lives and have never had a day that went by that some one wasn't telling them to just use their will power and to deal with their food issues. Most surgeons will not operate on people who are not at least 100 pounds overweight most people also have other health issues. You also have the wrong idea about no exercise and no diet you are on a very strict diet and you have to exercise every day. Some people will gain the weight back but it is a very few and most people went thru to much to ever bypass the surgery.

Christylee76

Well, I was planning on having gastric Bypass about 4 years ago and was turned down by my insurance company twice..I was devastated...However, I buckled down and lost a 100 pounds on my own. I don't look down on the people that have the surgery, I mean some really seem to have no option. However I do know people that have it done and they gain all the weight back that they lost. I think if you use it as a tool, not a ticket out, it will be successful. it just worries me there are no long term studies on the side effects of this surgery..

schustc

from personal experience, and from having done both, here is my take:

8 yrs ago, at 35, I was depressed and desperate, I had tried everything, and lost and regained over and over. On weight watchers some years prior, I had lost 60 lbs, and then, gained it all back. I was 272 ish at that time. I gave up. I figured there was no hope, that my stomach was so large, that I'd never be able to eat like a normal person. That I was DAMAGED and that I truly could never lose and stay at a healthy weight without surgical intervention. I BELIEVED this, beyond a shadow of a doubt.

This was NOT a cop out, not a desire to do this the 'easy' way, but a desperate attempt to keep myself from ballooning yearly until I became one of those people you see on TV that cannot get out of their homes.

I feared this. And I wanted to have a baby too - and figured I'd only gain a ton more weight if I got pregnant and - well - I was absolutely desperate.

Insurance was out of the question - it was out of pocket - and at $24k + as an the price, I began researching other options. I finally found a solution. Surgery in Mexico -at 7k for the band. I researched the band dr's and found one that had done over 1000 of the surgeries - which back then - was a BIG deal.

I Hopped on a plane on a wednesday night, flew to texas, stayed in a hotel until Thursday morning, was driven across the border to mexico with another patient. Checked in, and had surgery with in a few hours. Stayed the night in the mexican hospital, picked up my medication at the mexican pharmacy, and was driven back over the border Friday afternoon to stay in a hotel in texas until Saturday morning when I flew back home. I forget how many hours - but I think it was probably 3 or 4, on a plane, 2 days after surgery. Easy???? Cop Out???? Seriously???

I was alone - i forgot to mention that. my husband and family were still back here, I did this all by myself. Strangers, foreign country, surgery, flying back for hours on a plane so soon after...

ANYONE who says this is the lazy way out, seriously has no idea what they are talking about. They are coming from a point in their lives where they truly believe that anyone can do it if they try hard enough. What they don't understand, is that people that do this, believe with all their heart, that conventional methods will NOT work for them. That they are damaged, broken, and can't make it work without help. I don't believe anyone that goes under the knife with complication risks - including death - does so because they are too lazy to do it the other way.

Fast forward 7 years. I played with the same 40 or so lbs up and down until one day, i found I couldn't eat or drink easily anymore. Food and water wasn't going past the band easily, and I ended up sleeping in a chair because the water I drank was coming back up at night and I was choking in my sleep - waking up gagging and coughing. I had to get the band 'unfilled' which basically turns it off. It's a belt around the stomach that they tighten to squeeze close so you eat less. They loosened the belt all the way - I could eat anything I wanted, as much as I wanted - I was back to square one.

For other reasons, I never went back and had it 'filled' back up - I left it go. After a few months, the weight had started to come back on, and by march of this year, I had gained back to 268.

I was tired of the complications with the Band and was willing to give the diet and exercise one more attempt. I was half hearted, not convinced, and barely motivated because of how much I had failed in the past.

I started seeing a personal trainer, and counting calories. AND. Something happened. I began to figure it out. I began to understand, and - AND - I began to BELIEVE I could do this with out the assistance of surgery. I learned you don't have to be perfect, that it's NOT all or nothing. That you can have good days and bad, and as long as the good happen more often than the bad, you can still have progress. you don't have to be PERFECT.. you can have high calorie days dispersed among the lower days - you CAN eat treats and pizza and etc - in moderation. Life is not all about deprivation - and misery. I WAS LEARNING how to eat - and eat like a thin person eats. Not perfect all the time, but good most of the time. AND I realized I CAN DO THAT. I can be good 80-90% of the time and get results. I may not get 10-15 lbs a month results, but 5-10 lbs a month is fine, and I can handle that long term.

AND - I don't have the complications. I CAN do this - without surgery, but, I had to learn how. Knowledge is power. Understanding you don't have to be perfect. Love yourself, forgive yourself when you have bad days. I'm not doing anyone's diet or fad - I'm just burning more than I eat, 90% of the time and it's Simple. Not always easy. But simple.


So - from my place here, now, I say Diet and Exercise. but I understand it from both camps..

:flowerforyou:

fuego84

I've thought about it a lot. On one hand it's a "quick fix" but you usually have to lose some weight to begin with before being allowed to have the surgery so why not just continue to lose weight on your own. Of the people I know that have had some sort of surgery they have all had problems to some degree or another. One person had to have a tummy tuck because of the excess skin and it causing infections all the time. Another lady had the same problem with saggy skin but on her legs and it was deemed not a medical problem so insurance wouldn't cover the surgery to remove the skin and she's not able to afford it on her own. Another person gained a lot of weight back. And the last one I know of had a ton of health problems afterwards; about 5 years later she's finally starting to look and feel healthy after her surgery. If I personally knew of more people that had great results I would probably seriously contemplate having some form of surgery done. But with what I do know of the people that have had surgeries done, the risks outweigh the benefits.

ARDuBaie

I'm a nurse and I have seen the good things and bad things that go along with bariatric surgery.

I know that I am going to get lambasted for my comment, but here goes: People who need bariatric surgery are people who have weak minds and constitutions.

Yep, I just said that and I will hold to it.

Why do I say this?

I say this because every person that I know who has had bariatric surgery has learned nothing about eating healthy. They continue on with their old, junk food eating habits and then wonder why they are lacking in vitamins and mineral, why their hair is falling out, why they lack energy, etc. They also wonder why their stomach stretched back out and why they are gaining weight again.

Usually, before a person has bariatric surgery, they must go on a diet to show that they are capable of following the strict diet that people who get the surgery have to follow.

Say what??? They have to go on a diet!!!!

If they can maintain a diet before surgery, than why can't they lose the weight without the surgery.

Because they lack motivation. Bariatric surgery appeals to people who want the quick solution to a complicated problem. Just as people want the pill to control their blood pressure or diabetes instead of losing weight, some people want bariatric surgery to help them lose weight quickly instead of taking the long route where they really would learn how to eat healthy.

The motivation to follow a diet prior to bariatric surgery is the bariatric surgery itself. If only these same people would find a different motivation to get themselves to follow a diet, they would lose the weight without the surgery.

Are these people happy with their decision to have bariatric surgery? I would say that half of the people that I know that have had it (I know about 20) wish they never had it. They can't eat anything with sugar without experiencing dumping syndrome. Two of them have to wear wigs because they are losing hair in patches. One can't eat more than half a cup of food or she gets nauseous. Half of them have to be near a bathroom for an hour after eating.

Oh what fun that sounds like!

Then we have a MFP friend who I unfriended who was losing 5-6 pounds a week by eating only 500-700 calories a day post bariatric surgery. You want to eat like that, fine. Just don't friend me.

Do they have bragging rights?

I don't feel that they do. They didn't really work hard to lose the weight. Yeah, maybe they exercised a bit, but they certainly are limited in the number of calories they can eat because the stomach is smaller. Additionally, they don't learn to listen to their body or eat healthy, unless they really go out of their way to do so. Some just continue eating their crappy food, like Fritos or potato chips, just in smaller portions.

So, no, I don't think that they should have bragging rights. If I had a person who had bariatric surgery and lost 100 pounds and another person who lost 100 pounds the old fashion way standing in front of me, I would respect the later more than the former because they worked hard in order to lose that weight. The person who had bariatric surgery took the easy route.

Basically, you gained the weight shoveling food in your mouth and sitting on your butt all day. Do the opposite and you will lose weight.

And don't give me that "I have a disease that causes me to eat" story. There are only two diseases that cause people to eat - Bardet-Biedl syndrome and Prader-Willi syndrome. Look them up. They are very uncommon, so you better have proof to show me that you have either of those two if you are going to say you have a disease that causes you to eat. Unless you have either of those two diseases, the only disease that you have is what I call hand-to-mouth syndrome.

love4fitnesslove4food_wechange

My point is not that it's a competition but merely that it's undeniable that the success is not 100% your own. That's all. Like buying a house and your parents gave you the down payment--it's still an accomplishment to own your house buy its not 100% your own. Necessary, yes. By and large a good thing of you need their help but at the end of the day you can't say you did it all yourself.

And your point is....? :huh:

Can you read? I think it's pretty damn clear. Ugh.