Why do people get so provoked by vegans?

Akimajuktuq

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You've demonstrated the problem well by saying " I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically" and "compassionate eaters". Those statements show intolerance for others choices and that there is only one choice that is "ethical"; yours.

I eat "ethically" and "compassionately" too, but not based on YOUR ethics and idea of compassion.

Rocbola

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

Well put.

GhostPack

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You do see that you just said people who eat meat are unethical, unfair and lacking in compassion...right?

Thanks for clearing that up, I was confused by this one.

kajpen

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

This is exactly why I love people who don't think as I do. I learn so much. Other people's weaknesses become my strengths and their strengths overcome my weaknesses. Pretty soon I'm going to be super human. That's why I acquire people who are contrary to me. Heeee.

^^^^ LOVE this response!! :-)

Contrarian

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

No. Being interested in how others live and learning about it without judging is excellent. Trying to make everyone live the same way as you (not you, personally) is where it goes wrong.

redlady82

I don't think it's people are provoked by vegans in general. I think it's like anyone else preaching their decisions as if we all have to agree with their choices. It's no different than bible thumpers shoving beliefs down your throat, Athiests shoving their non-belief beliefs (wow reads funny) down your throat, etc. While it's not every vegan, bible thumper, or Athiest, it's just a handful who act that way and people just get annoyed. In reality, most don't care and don't act out like that. But like any group, you have SOMEONE who is extreme and annoying about what they believe in.

But the difference is someone wouldn't post "I'M BURNING A BIBLE RIGHT NOW!" on a Christian thread. Why do people feel the need to post "YUM! I WANT STEAK! THOSE COWS DESERVED IT!" on a vegan thread? That happened yesterday after someone posted the results of a study. I don't comment on threads with meat in the title, so non-vegans should do they same if they only intend to upset the others.

Really? On the internet you don't think people would post that on a Christian thread? I beg to differ. Are you new to the internet and forums?

Agreed on this. It's already happened. CNN ran a huge story about why Jesus never exited on Easter Sunday. People were comparing the Bible to believing in pixies. I agree that most don't feel provoked by veganism but I have just had many bad experiences where I see vegans and vegatarians forcing onto meat eaters how "wrong" they are and it gets old. My best friend and her husband are vegatarians and have also been "scolded" by vegans for their "poor lifestyle choice." Feel free to eat how you like just don't be so radical and combative about it. (That is not aimed at the OP so don't take it that way, just people in general.) I like to leave people alone to their lives and be left alone to mine. I don't mind reading about research and whanot as a point of interest but don't need it crammed down throats.

Contrarian

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

I can't speak for the crazy cat lady who you quoted, but I do think you missed her point.

There is a huge difference between sharing ideas, debating, etc. and remaining in the closed-minded web of "what I'm doing is right for me it must be right for all" mindset and insisting that others follow suit.

I do agree with your sentiment that we need to hear different opionions lest we remain ignorant.

Do you truly believe that I missed her point?

You may not have missed my point, but you seem to imagine that it comes from a very different place than it does.

jofjltncb6

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

No. Being interested in how others live and learning about it without judging is excellent. Trying to make everyone live the same way as you (not you, personally) is where it goes wrong.

Yeah, but what do we do if their "own way" is to be preachy and judgmental?

iAMsmiling

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

No. Being interested in how others live and learning about it without judging is excellent. Trying to make everyone live the same way as you (not you, personally) is where it goes wrong.

Yeah, but what do we do if their "own way" is to be preachy and judgmental?

In that case, we have long fruitless discussions on "Why do people get so provoked by vegans?"

Contrarian

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

No. Being interested in how others live and learning about it without judging is excellent. Trying to make everyone live the same way as you (not you, personally) is where it goes wrong.

Yeah, but what do we do if their "own way" is to be preachy and judgmental?

If everyone lets others live their own way, then it follows that no one would be preachy and judgemental.

redhousecat

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You've demonstrated the problem well by saying " I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically" and "compassionate eaters". Those statements show intolerance for others choices and that there is only one choice that is "ethical"; yours.

I eat "ethically" and "compassionately" too, but not based on YOUR ethics and idea of compassion.

awwww, snap!

kennethmgreen

I wish everyone would just let others live their lives their own way.

And never learn anything from anyone else and have to discover every little thing on their own? Despite the occasional hard feelings and disagreements, I think I'll keep the system we currently have.

I can't speak for the crazy cat lady who you quoted, but I do think you missed her point.

There is a huge difference between sharing ideas, debating, etc. and remaining in the closed-minded web of "what I'm doing is right for me it must be right for all" mindset and insisting that others follow suit.

I do agree with your sentiment that we need to hear different opinions lest we remain ignorant.

Do you truly believe that I missed her point?

Yes, I do. I think you missed the point, or misread. She specifically used the word "live." To me, that means allowing others to live their lives their own way - you can still learn from someone that way.

You responded as if she was saying something like "close our minds to anything different from ourselves." Or at least implying that her point was in conflict with discovering and learning things from others.

I don't give a vegan about how you live your life. I think you should live your life as you see fit. And yet, I can still learn from you.

_VoV

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You've demonstrated the problem well by saying " I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically" and "compassionate eaters". Those statements show intolerance for others choices and that there is only one choice that is "ethical"; yours.

I eat "ethically" and "compassionately" too, but not based on YOUR ethics and idea of compassion.

What do you think vegans motivated by a desire to reduce animal suffering should call themselves for the sake of brevity? Labels should be useful shorthand to convey a thought in a more efficient way. Actually, the confusion and controversy about the word 'vegan' makes me think it's a word better applied to products than people. I think things like foods, cosmetics and shoes can be labeled 'vegan' to help people find products which are animal-free. That's a way the label can come in handy.

Rocbola

In that case, we have long fruitless discussions on "Why do people get so provoked by vegans?"

This has not been a fruitless discussion for me. Since i have been reading on this thread, i ate 4 peaches.

iAMsmiling

In that case, we have long fruitless discussions on "Why do people get so provoked by vegans?"

This has not been a fruitless discussion for me. Since i have been reading on this thread, i ate 4 peaches.

And there I was, busy eating jerky.

_Mimi_

I don't think people are provoked by veganism. I think people are provoked by others who say "my diet is the only way."

Or "my diet is the only ethical way." Gee, sorry I'm enslaving cows to give me milk instead of enslaving them to till and fertilize my fields like you do, self-righteous vegan person.

LOL This reminds me of a cartoon my husband has hanging in his toolbox. It's a cow standing in a field. The caption is: My dinner just peed and pooped (not those exact words - lol) alll over your dinner. :P

lifescircle

Plants are alive.

Is it because they don't walk around and make noise that makes them "better" (in whatever way) to eat?

If it grows from the dirt, then we should eat it?

If it walks around on the dirt, we shouldn't eat it?

I like cows/cattle, meat and cheese. I don't see that it is "bad" for my body, as I don't get sick or throw up and I thrive.

The "man made" stuff, i.e., processed/chemicals, my body doesn't like, which is why I got so much fat on me right now... live and learn.

Eating healthy doesn't have anything to do with being a "vegan" does it? I mean you can still eat processed food and chemically-laden foods, correct? And still be a vegan?

Only speaking for myself, I don't like labeling myself, which boxes me in... and I'm a bit claustrophobic. One day or week or month or year, I may eat no meat and no dairy products, but that doesn't mean I'm vegan.

Why would one feel the need to tell people that they are "vegan"? Why not just be?

You topic title "Why do people get so provoked by vegans?" is not really the post that you wrote. You post was more like... "Why do vegans provoke people?"

I'm just procrastinating. I need to go workout.

All in good fun... really. :blushing:

iAMsmiling

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You've demonstrated the problem well by saying " I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically" and "compassionate eaters". Those statements show intolerance for others choices and that there is only one choice that is "ethical"; yours.

I eat "ethically" and "compassionately" too, but not based on YOUR ethics and idea of compassion.

What do you think vegans motivated by a desire to reduce animal suffering should call themselves for the sake of brevity? Labels should be useful shorthand to convey a thought in a more efficient way. Actually, the confusion and controversy about the word 'vegan' makes me think it's a word better applied to products than people. I think things like foods, cosmetics and shoes can be labeled 'vegan' to help people find products which are animal-free. That's a way the label can come in handy.

If you don't stop being so reasonable, you're going to have to leave this discussion. :-)

TallCurvyMuscles

Good read while I eat my steak. Thanks!

AnvilHead

I find it ironic that the first post, rather than posing a simple question as per the post title, included several studies touting veganism and statements like "I do it because I want to be around for my family". To me, that seems like provocation toward non-vegans.

I'm not provoked by vegans - nor am I provoked by vegetarians, paleos, low-carbers, low-fatters, etc. I don't care what anybody else eats and I don't try to convince anybody that my way is somehow superior. If it trips your trigger, go for it - just stay the **** out of my 'fridge, don't worry your head about what/how I eat and don't throw propaganda at me in hopes of converting me. Thankyoudrivethrough.

maremare312

Full disclosure: I didn't read your whole post, as it is rather long.

I don't feel provoked by vegans, however I do get highly annoyed by ANYONE who preaches to me about their way as being the only path. This goes for diet (vegan, paleo, no carb, low carb) or religion and everything in between. People getting all preachy is just plain obnoxious and I have no patience for them online or in real life.

Ditto, and Ditto! I've found something that works for me (low carb) but I don't think that's the only way for everyone. Is it the only way for me? Yeah. Do I care what you eat? Nope. I hope you find something that works for you, but otherwise, don't care.

Arexxx

Because they usually have a "holier than thou" attitude that pisses me right off.

zumba89

The vegans I've met (Note: I live in California) they think they now everything about health. It's the something with low carb people, fasting people. Some people found that if their lifestyle works for them they want everyone to know about and forget about what works for you. My thing is if being vegan works then do it but don't tell me that how my style is going to kill because I love meat.

neverstray

The issue here is that vegans usually are vegan because they feel there is an ethical issue with the treatment of animals, amoung other issues. Therefore, it's hard to just simply live and let live (or die, LOL). Being vegan is a statement about being vegan. It's not like someone who is just doing it for health benefits. There's way more to it than just health benefits.

Most people don't chose thier life path. i believe this firmly. Most people take what they have been taught, and go with it. So, they grow up eating hamburger, steak, chicken, and pork. They don't even think about it...at all. It's just food. Some people, when they get a little older, question everything in their life. Why do I eat steak? Why do I wear clothes with names on them? Why do I live in a standard configured house? They turn everything on it's head and ask questions. The answers sometimes are surprising. If you could step back and chose everything, would you chose what you are doing now? If you really put thought into each and every purchase and the long term ramifications of giving Nike, as an example, your money, is that a good choice, or would you rather give your money to a local shoe maker, and skip the swoosh?

I don't think vegans think they are better. But, I think there is a mental process they go through to make their decisions that I don't think 99% of the rest of America consider at all. Most people just do what they were taught without question. So, that makes it kind of weird for a vegan because they know they are talking to someone that has not questioned their values or made choices in a thoughful and more purposeful way.

lifescircle

The issue here is that vegans usually are vegan because they feel there is an ethical issue with the treatment of animals, amoung other issues. Therefore, it's hard to just simply live and let live (or die, LOL). Being vegan is a statement about being vegan. It's not like someone who is just doing it for health benefits. There's way more to it than just health benefits.

Most people don't chose thier life path. i believe this firmly. Most people take what they have been taught, and go with it. So, they grow up eating hamburger, steak, chicken, and pork. They don't even think about it...at all. It's just food. Some people, when they get a little older, question everything in their life. Why do I eat steak? Why do I wear clothes with names on them? Why do I live in a standard configured house? They turn everything on it's head and ask questions. The answers sometimes are surprising. If you could step back and chose everything, would you chose what you are doing now? If you really put thought into each and every purchase and the long term ramifications of giving Nike, as an example, your money, is that a good choice, or would you rather give your money to a local shoe maker, and skip the swoosh?

I don't think vegans think they are better. But, I think there is a mental process they go through to make their decisions that I don't think 99% of the rest of America consider at all. Most people just do what they were taught without question. So, that makes it kind of weird for a vegan because they know they are talking to someone that has not questioned their values or made choices in a thoughful and more purposeful way.

No.

_VoV

The issue here is that vegans usually are vegan because they feel there is an ethical issue with the treatment of animals, amoung other issues. Therefore, it's hard to just simply live and let live (or die, LOL). Being vegan is a statement about being vegan. It's not like someone who is just doing it for health benefits. There's way more to it than just health benefits.

Most people don't chose thier life path. i believe this firmly. Most people take what they have been taught, and go with it. So, they grow up eating hamburger, steak, chicken, and pork. They don't even think about it...at all. It's just food. Some people, when they get a little older, question everything in their life. Why do I eat steak? Why do I wear clothes with names on them? Why do I live in a standard configured house? They turn everything on it's head and ask questions. The answers sometimes are surprising. If you could step back and chose everything, would you chose what you are doing now? If you really put thought into each and every purchase and the long term ramifications of giving Nike, as an example, your money, is that a good choice, or would you rather give your money to a local shoe maker, and skip the swoosh?

I don't think vegans think they are better. But, I think there is a mental process they go through to make their decisions that I don't think 99% of the rest of America consider at all. Most people just do what they were taught without question. So, that makes it kind of weird for a vegan because they know they are talking to someone that has not questioned their values or made choices in a thoughful and more purposeful way.

If you aren't a professional writer, you *should* be. Well said, and well reasoned.

iAMsmiling

The issue here is that vegans usually are vegan because they feel there is an ethical issue with the treatment of animals, amoung other issues. Therefore, it's hard to just simply live and let live (or die, LOL). Being vegan is a statement about being vegan. It's not like someone who is just doing it for health benefits. There's way more to it than just health benefits.

Most people don't chose thier life path. i believe this firmly. Most people take what they have been taught, and go with it. So, they grow up eating hamburger, steak, chicken, and pork. They don't even think about it...at all. It's just food. Some people, when they get a little older, question everything in their life. Why do I eat steak? Why do I wear clothes with names on them? Why do I live in a standard configured house? They turn everything on it's head and ask questions. The answers sometimes are surprising. If you could step back and chose everything, would you chose what you are doing now? If you really put thought into each and every purchase and the long term ramifications of giving Nike, as an example, your money, is that a good choice, or would you rather give your money to a local shoe maker, and skip the swoosh?

I don't think vegans think they are better. But, I think there is a mental process they go through to make their decisions that I don't think 99% of the rest of America consider at all. Most people just do what they were taught without question. So, that makes it kind of weird for a vegan because they know they are talking to someone that has not questioned their values or made choices in a thoughful and more purposeful way.

So...meat eaters just suffer from herd mentality? Thoughtless? Living unexamined lives of doing what has always been done?
Seems just about every defense of Vegan attitude just ooozes the type of arrogance that others find so irritating.
I wonder if that's a coincidence?

Akimajuktuq

Honestly, I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically. It's just, ya know, right there in your face, "I don't gobble down cheeseburgers, because I realize that it is unfair to the earth and unfair to living creatures to sacrifice their well=being for my own whims."

So, even if the vegan or veggie in question ISN'T one of those obnoxious "MY WAY OR NO WAY AT ALL, I AM BETTER THAN YOU AND YOU ARE UNEDUCATED ABOUT EATING" types that taint the whole image for all other compassionate eaters, those who choose to keep eating meat are often made to feel as though they have to justify their eating habits in the face of compassionate eating.

Or at least that's how I always felt before I went vegetarian three years ago.

You've demonstrated the problem well by saying " I think people are made UNCOMFORTABLE on a very deep level by people who choose to eat ethically" and "compassionate eaters". Those statements show intolerance for others choices and that there is only one choice that is "ethical"; yours.

I eat "ethically" and "compassionately" too, but not based on YOUR ethics and idea of compassion.

What do you think vegans motivated by a desire to reduce animal suffering should call themselves for the sake of brevity? Labels should be useful shorthand to convey a thought in a more efficient way. Actually, the confusion and controversy about the word 'vegan' makes me think it's a word better applied to products than people. I think things like foods, cosmetics and shoes can be labeled 'vegan' to help people find products which are animal-free. That's a way the label can come in handy.

I don't have any issues with the term "vegan" or that people choose to be vegan for their own ethical reasons, or labelling things "vegan". This person is basically saying vegans are eating "ethically" and those who aren't vegan are not eating ethically. Are you saying that vegans should be labeled "ethical eaters" or "compassionate" eaters? i don't agree with that because I eat ethically as well, based on my ethics. (For instance I do have HUGE issues with modern industrial farming and GMO. I also have issues with the idea that synthetic materials are better for the environment.) LOL

I'm not looking for a war with you; I respect your views. I do have issue with the "my way is the only way" attitude and that's why I commented on why I get provoked by vegans (mostly just one).

JennyLisT

I'm not vegan myself but one of my good friends has been for most of her life and often face the same scrutiny because people don't realize they were heavily raised in a culture of eating meat that they can't fathom the idea of having a meal without it. Most people can't respect the lifestyle choice and often their reactions draw negative effects from vegans, who are constantly bombarded with questions and cynicism.

I for one have had my eyes opened and love vegan cooking or any dish prepared by vegetarian. I find people who embrace this diet handle food much more seriously and know how to play around with all spectrum of taste, like umami.

This. It's really insulting when someone says veganism is a "cult", as in yesterday's thread. At least most vegans chose it for themselves. Everyone else on the standard diet is 'brainwashed' technically.

THIS is the holier-than-thou bull**** that everyone is talking about. You're not better than anyone else because of your diet choices.

I was a vegetarian for 6 years. I got some light teasing from family, but that's it. I have several friends who are vegan or vegetarian, and they're not obnoxious about it. However, even THEY get fed up with people like you.

Serafimangel

As with many other replies, I am not provoked by vegans, I am provoked by anyone who tries to provoke me. And at university, there were quite a few vegans/vegetarians who did lecture their peers about this. What probably annoyed me the most was the assumption that I was completely unaware of the arguments posed in the veganism/veggie debate. The 'oh you couldn't know about this', especailly by ones who wear leather and eat sweets with gelatin, which is typically 99% bones, pig skin and cow skin. I know a lot of veggies who don't lecture, do it for health/religious etc reasons and I eat meals without meat from time to time (especially when tesco switches supplier and all the chicken stinks for some reason).

However it is the deliberately provocative nature of many vegans that irks me, (as can be with advocates of other contentious issues). Being a vegan doesn't make you a better person, in the grand scheme of things it tends to be their own ego they are soothing. And in many cases (again not the majority), they are a vegan because they have absolutely nothing else going for them and need something to make themselves seem interesting/intelligent, like the office worker who always wears a silly tie.

Again, I cannot stress enough how there are many vegans that this does not apply to, if you are, more power to you, but when you feel the need to enlighten me about it, don't. Being a vegan doesn't make you better nor more intelligant then I am (or more interesting). There are plenty of other ways you can be more intelligent/better/interesting then I am, it wouldnt actually be that hard.