Forced flu shot at work

Katmiller73

I work in Labor and Deliver and deal with the babies. I would rather get the flu shot than possibly give the flu to one of my babies. Also we have had a couple of pregnant women die of the flu, alot of our Dr's require the moms to get the flu shot in their office. Our hospital also pays for them. I say get it, but that's just me.

DaddyM1

I work in a hospital as well, and while flu shots where STRONGLY encouraged, they where not mandatory. In fact, I doubt the legality of such a thing and am tempted to call shenanigans.

Now, a bit of critical thinking. Flu shots work because they expose you to a number of virus, active or inactive depending. As a response, your body develops anti-bodies that give you a "head start" in fighting off the virus if you are infected later on.

It DOES NOT mean that some magical anti-flu force field surrounds you and makes you immune and/or keeps any virus from entering your system. In other words, you can still get sick, and you can definitely still spread it even if you have not gotten very sick.

So the argument that it's for the sake of the patients is B.S. It only protects the individual who received the shot. So you see, the real motivation for making all staff take shots is to make sure you don't miss any work due to flu related illness during the season.

Your welcome.
Ed.

felice03

hmmm...my hospital is also requiring.
seems reasonable since it is beneficial to patient care, and they pay me.

this.

I too am required, for the third year now. It is not just for us, more important it helps not spread illness to paitents with weakened immune systems. By the time you realize you are too sick to work, think of how many could be exposed....and as a healthcare worker I KNOW we all push ourselves way past the point of staying home when we should.

sizzle92

I understand it, but I also think it sucks. Here at work if we don't get one, we have to wear a mask all day. I think it sucks because that shot can cause serious damage. A patient of mine just left here......last year she was paralyzed with Guillan Barre syndrome. Luckily, she can walk again. I get the flu shot yearly, but I don't like that they can force us to put toxins into our bodies.

BroiledNotFried

I worked in public accounting and it was very highly recommended. Tax season, audit season - all hit when the flu is high.

But, I don't think it should be mandatory in most workplaces. But, a hospital is different. If a healthcare worker has the flu and tranmits it to patients it could be deadly. Patients are in a precarious situation as it is.

jetabear10

All of a sudden, it would be against my religion to get a flu shot.

I think I'm with you. I don't like the idea of being told to do something. I'd like to say I can see they're reasoning, but working in a hospital, aren't you already more exposed/therefore more immune to certain things?

The last time I got a flu shot I was miserably sick and missed the most work I've ever missed. I won't do it again, until I'm old and it makes complete sense, and then I'm still not positive I will....

You do not develop a natural immunity to the flu. Thats why they push to get all employees vaccinated rather than just testing to see if your immune.

The human body is designed to fight off things such as the flu...yes, your body will make its own antibodies.

A side note...vaccines formulated for one year may be ineffective in the following year, since the influenza virus evolves rapidly, and new strains quickly replace the older one. so you are only immune to the previous years strains.

Persons with compromised immune systems should get the shots...not people with normal healthy immune systems.

DaddyM1

Flu is not a toxin. It's a virus, and I don't think they can force a private citizen. Strongly encourage, coax, create separate rules for those that don't comply, yes. But force someone??? That seems highly doubtful.

snowyd20

So, the forced flu shot thing is going to be Federally mandated by the CDC starting next year! Medicaid and Medicare are jumping on board and will actually withhold payment up to 2% if a certain percentage of hosptial employees have not had the flu shot by 12/31.
2% is a lot of money for any hospital, especially from Medicare which is typically the highest payor for any institution.


Just FYI.....

beckajw

Flu is not a toxin. It's a virus, and I don't think they can force a private citizen. Strongly encourage, coax, create separate rules for those that don't comply, yes. But force someone??? That seems highly doubtful.

But it's not forced. You can choose to get it or not. They can choose to fire you.

agentscully514

It DOES NOT mean that some magical anti-flu force field surrounds you and makes you immune and/or keeps any virus from entering your system. In other words, you can still get sick, and you can definitely still spread it even if you have not gotten very sick.

So the argument that it's for the sake of the patients is B.S. It only protects the individual who received the shot. So you see, the real motivation for making all staff take shots is to make sure you don't miss any work due to flu related illness during the season.

sorry, but that is not true. There is lots of research that shows vaccinating healthcare workers really does reduce case of flu in patients.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15566025

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8985189

http://sphhs.gwu.edu/departments/healthpolicy/influenza/Influenza Vaccination of the Health Care Workforce Lit Review UPDATED 06 15 11.pdf

Elzecat

I used to get the flu shot every year when I taught preschool special education because I worked with a lot of little kids with compromised immune systems--out of about 10 years of getting the shot, I think I actually got a mild version of the flu once. I was much more likely to get a cold or bronchitis (which the shot did not help with, unfortunately). I now work in an office job and haven't had a flu shot in about 3 years.


Someone mentioned thimerosal (preservative) as the reason they don't get the shot--that used to be the big argument with childhood vaccines, but according to the CDC website, at least two variations of the flu vaccine no longer contain thimerosal:

http://www.cdc.gov/flu/protect/vaccine/thimerosal.htm

agentscully514

The human body is designed to fight off things such as the flu...yes, your body will make its own antibodies.

A side note...vaccines formulated for one year may be ineffective in the following year, since the influenza virus evolves rapidly, and new strains quickly replace the older one. so you are only immune to the previous years strains.

Persons with compromised immune systems should get the shots...not people with normal healthy immune systems.

Persons with compromised immune systems often CAN'T get the shot, that's why it's important for people around them to get vaccinated.

crimsoncat

I get my flu shot every year, so it little matters to me. I do it because as a member of the medical profession I have to be able to tell clients that I trust in vaccines. If I couldn't say that, I'd have to do a lot of soul searching.

Plus, herd immunity protects those with weakened immune systems. Even if it doesn't work, at least I tried.

kelseyhere

that depends, are you a right to work state?

kids have to have shots to go to school, why not adults?

VanessaGS

If that was my job then I would say heck no, but then again I don't work in a hospital. If I worked in a hospital then I prolly would do it.

beckajw

that depends, are you a right to work state?

kids have to have shots to go to school, why not adults?

What does right to work have to do with this requirement?

ARDuBaie

I didn't read every response here.

First, let's look at how germs are spread. The respiratory flu virus spreads via droplets. If you are coughed or sneezed upon or if the virus is on someone's hands and they touch you and you breath them in or touch your eyes or mouth, you will get the flu virus.

How can this chain be broken?

Via respiratory etiquette and washing of hands. Additionally, don't touch your mouth, eyes, or nose unless you wash your hands.

What other ways will prevent the spread of respiratory flu?

A respiratory mask.

How effective is the respiratory flu vaccine?

It is not very effective for those groups that need it most. For those from 25-55 years of age, the shot is about 60% effective. This means that 4 out of 10 people receiving the shot will not be protected. For infants and the elderly, it drops to less than 20%.

What does effectiveness mean?

This means that if a nurse gets the vaccine and it is not effective, they will unknowingly contract the virus and spread the virus because they did not develop the immunity to it.

What does this all mean?

Well, if you develop an immunity to the virus, it means that you will either not get the virus or you will get the virus but your symptoms will be mild. It does not mean that you cannot transmit the virus. If you are taking care of two patients and one unknowingly has the respiratory flu and you get it on you shirt and go to another patient who does not have it, you could potentially give the virus to them. The key word is potentially. Hand to patient transfer of the virus is not uncommon. Surface to patient transfer is not uncommon either.

This means that even if a health care worker has received the vaccination, they still could be a vector in carrying the virus.

What are the risks for the flu vaccine?

The risks for the vaccine can vary from mild discomfort to death. I watched the 72 year old mother of my best friend die from the respiratory flu vaccination.

I have only had the flu vaccination once and, remarkably, that was the year I got the flu. Funny that. While your system is developing antibodies to the vaccination, it is unable to protect the body from the flu if you are exposed within a short period of time before or after receiving the vaccination. Thus, many people do get the flu after receiving the vaccination, but it is not from the vaccination, but from the inability of the immune system to deal with the vaccination and the virus that the person was exposed to.

I believe that mandated respiratory flu vaccinations are wrong. I believe this for two reasons: 1) I did not go into healthcare at the time that it was mandated and, therefore, it is not my choice once it is mandated. I can't just up and change my way of earning money overnight, so I would be stuck with being forced to get the vaccination or find a reason not to; and 2) I watched my second child die from the MMR vaccination and have not gotten a vaccination since. I also ceased getting my first child vaccination and never had my second child vaccinated. Vaccinations come with their share of problems. My children were much healthier than children who received vaccinations and, as adults, they don't seem to be sick as often as their friends, even when exposed to their friends' germs.

I understand that this is for patient safety, especially when the person is already so ill or has a compromised immune system. There are other bacteria and viruses that are present in the hospital that can harm those patients and be passed around via nurse, other staff, and visitors. Visitors may not be vaccinated for the respiratory flu and may give it to the patient. Some patients were exposed prior to coming to hospital. There are a variety of contributing factors to patients getting the flu and it should not all be blamed on the nursing staff. Any hospital mandating nursing staff receiving the flu vaccine should also mandate that doctors receive the vaccine.

I fear, though, that the mandating of the flu vaccine may create an atmosphere in which nursing staff will become lax, feeling that since they received the vaccine they will not give the flu to their patients. Thus, they may not always cover their mouth when they cough. Remember, 4 out of 10 will not be protected. Will the nurse coughing on you be one of those? You don't know and they don't know. So why not require all nursing staff to practice the two surefire ways of preventing the spread of this disease and other diseases: 1) proper hand washing; and 2) respiratory etiquette.

Where I work, if you don't get the vaccination, you must wear a mask around the patients during the flu season. I think this is a fair compromise, but still does not address the fact that during the non-flu season, colds can be spread in the same manner as the flu. The answer is washing of hands and respiratory etiquette.

_Timmeh_

My hospital is demanding that everyone take the flu shot this year. You will be fired unless you have a Dr. Note or religous conviction. How would you feel about this at your work place?

I'd ask where the line started.

crimsoncat

I fear, though, that the mandating of the flu vaccine may create an atmosphere in which nursing staff will become lax, feeling that since they received the vaccine they will not give the flu to their patients.

As much as I want to disagree with this, I have seen it before. No vaccine is 100% protective for a variety of reasons. A vaccine CAN help, but it is not a magical prick that solves all the world's problems. People still need to do smart things to stop the spread of disease. I just hope people who are responsible for people's health can see that clearly.

Andrewsvan

I would claim religious conviction all of a sudden.

VanessaHeartsMasr

I work for a hospital too. Even though I don't work directly with patients, EVERYONE has to get it. I guess I'm neutral about it. I can see where they are coming from. I mean, they make kids get their immunizations for school, I can understand.

fbmandy55

No thankyou.

flu shot = sick with the flu within a week

Same here. It's BS to force that upon you unless they can prove it will be beneficial. Every time I've ever had a flu shot I get the worst flu of my life that season...

jessicamarie81

I agree with DaddyM1 all the way....I worked in a hospital last year that the flu shot was made optional but people looked at you like you had 3 heads if you didn't get it...you had to wear a sticker on your badge saying you didn't get it and you had to wear a mask if you came within 4 feet of patients, therefore you were made to look like an outcast. I never got the flu shot in my 30 years of life until last year and it made me sicker than a dog when I took it, never have felt so bad in my life, I got immediately sick. I didn't even come in contact with patients but still got one anyways because of the stigma. I don't think hospitals should force anyone to get it.

Andrewsvan

I worked in public accounting and it was very highly recommended. Tax season, audit season - all hit when the flu is high.

But, I don't think it should be mandatory in most workplaces. But, a hospital is different. If a healthcare worker has the flu and tranmits it to patients it could be deadly. Patients are in a precarious situation as it is.

If a hospital worker has the flu he/ she shouldn't be working in the hospital until they are better.

Rhea30

its a good idea to get it WHEN YOU WORK AT A HOSPITAL....jeez realy, come on now use ur head

Many people do not have the best reactions to that shot. Not getting the shot doesn't equal to spreading it. Heck, they can get the shot which may or may not protect themselves and still touch something with the virus on it and if they do not do the proper hygienic procedures they can end up spreading it. I do think when health care professionals do get sick that they should stay home since they may get in contact with someone with a week immune system.

Tuffjourney

I am happy. I work at a hospital X30 years. I am glad for the free shot. Damn, I hate the flu.. It is forced but not only for our safety but for the patients, and that is why I am here to take care of the patients.

Oh, they wont fire you if you dont get the shot.You just need to wear the mask at all times when around patients.

dayone987

There are other bacteria and viruses that are present in the hospital that can harm those patients and be passed around via nurse, other staff, and visitors.
I fear, though, that the mandating of the flu vaccine may create an atmosphere in which nursing staff will become lax, feeling that since they received the vaccine they will not give the flu to their patients. Thus, they may not always cover their mouth when they cough. Remember, 4 out of 10 will not be protected. Will the nurse coughing on you be one of those? You don't know and they don't know. So why not require all nursing staff to practice the two surefire ways of preventing the spread of this disease and other diseases: 1) proper hand washing; and 2) respiratory etiquette.

Where I work, if you don't get the vaccination, you must wear a mask around the patients during the flu season. I think this is a fair compromise, but still does not address the fact that during the non-flu season, colds can be spread in the same manner as the flu. The answer is washing of hands and respiratory etiquette.

As you state, there are many other viruses and bacteria that can be spread. Many of them have no vaccine. So why would a health care worker get lax about washing of hands and respiratory etiquette just because she/he got the flu vaccine?

Getting the flu shot means that your patient won't get it directly from your infection and you are less likely to get sick from exposure to your patients flu virus as you will be more likely to have antbodies against the virus.

If you don't wash your hands between patients you can carry it from one patient to the next.

cobes24

tell them you're allergic to chicken eggs & they can't make you get it (the vaccine is cultured using eggs). i had mine at work last week and had the wicked butt flu for 2 days, had to leave work early and was out the day after......... picture that scene from Bridesmaids where all the girls are sweating profusely and then explode from food poisoning........... ya, that was me, right after that damn flu shot. I also work in a hospital and it is highly encouraged, but you can sign a waiver and decline it....... unless you're allergic to eggs........hint hint

THAT"S NOT THE FLU THAT THE FLU SHOT IS FOR. The shot is for respiratory influenza. If your butt was exploding a la Bridesmaids, it wasn't the flu.

Sheesh.

insectseige

I work in a UK NHS hospital & whilst we are encouraged to have the flu jab, we are not forced to and it would be hard for management to implement something like this. I have a couple of colleagues who had the jab last year & had to go home later that day as they felt unwell. This was only a short term thing but now with our sick days being reduced and us being penalised to save money I wouldn't risk anything that would make me ill. The bigger issue for patient safety than not having the jab is staff being forced to come into work sick because of punitive sickness policies. Hospitals = people with compromised immune systems, sick staff = infections, viruses. They should be kept apart not forced together.

DaughterOfTheMostHighKing

I work at a school so I'm working with children who carry the germs, so I can see the concern. I never get the flu shot. and My children only had it once and they got sick. :P I don't like being forced into doing something. that's wrong.