Concealed Carry: good or bad idea
Replies
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Having read the thread in full there seems to be one overriding conclusion:
If everyone around you has the right to own a gun, you feel you need a gun to feel safe.
If nobody around you has the right to own a gun, you don't feel you need a gun to feel safe.
Make of that what you will.
Criminals don't have the right to own a gun, but they own them anyway, and that is why I want one to fell safe. I couldn't care less how many law abiding citizens have them.
I'm not going to bother arguing the main point as we will never agree, I just wanted to thank you for being the first American I've ever come across to use "I couldn't care less" instead of the completely nonsensical (and extremely infuriating) "I could care less"
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I guess if ya'll want to ban guns, we'll have to ban butcher knives, meat cleavers, etc. too. I mean, some of ya'lls argument is that irresponsible gun owners shoot themselves, each other, leave it out for children to find, etc. Ok, people who are irresponsible with other weapons such as knives and meat cleavers can do damage too.
So if a child chokes on a toy or gives a toy to another child who chokes on it, are we going to ban toys, too????0 -
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ETA most home invasions the occupants never have the chance to get their gun out of the locked gun case, then loaded, and ready to be shot. Most trained individuals cannot easily hit a moving target, so even if someone had been armed during the mass shootings the outcome would not have been much different, not to mention once the police show up and realize you have multiple people with weapons drawn...well...you are just asking for trouble at that point.
Statistics have proven my children are much safer in my home without a gun than they are with one.
What kind of idiot stores an unloaded gun for protection? No one I know. I can have my gun in my hand and ready to shoot in 3 seconds from where I sleep.
The two of you have touched on the one of my main concerns in the gun debate. If you have children, or others in your home besides yourself, how can you have a gun ready to shoot in 3 seconds, but still think you are being "safe" or "responsible"? What if you're sleeping and your toddler wanders in your bedroom and grabs your gun and shoots his/herself before you even know what's happening? Or your depressed teen knows it's there, takes it during the night and goes to school the next day and shoots a bunch of classmates? Or you, while you're sleeping? I'm sorry, but I don't see how having a gun lying around loaded is safe for anyone. Either the gun is unloaded and locked up and "safe" but useless in a surprise situation, or it's loaded and accessible, "unsafe", but ready to use.
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Here is the answer to your concerns.
http://www.amazon.com/Gunvault-GV1000S-Mini-Vault-Standard/dp/B001C601KA/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1369323123&sr=8-15&keywords=biometric+gun+safe
[/quote]
Is this a requirement when a person purchases a gun? No? If a person does purchase one of these, are they required to use it? No again, right? So is requiring a biometric gun safe with every gun sale a solution? Not entirely, but it could help. As could requiring permitting and background checks for all residents of the home once they reach a certain age. Or requiring gun insurance or yearly licensing where you have to produce your gun every year for inspection and to prove that it is still in the registered owner's possession and hasn't been sold under the table to a "thug". Most "anti-gun" folks aren't about taking away your guns, you see. Most "anti-gun" folks would just like to see a little more regulation.
But, OP, to answer your question, I haven't really seen compelling evidence either way as to whether or not concealed carry increases or decreases crime. I agree with most of the Europeans/Canadians that have piped in...guns are not part of the "culture" for them, so they don't see a need. Americans have made it part of our culture so we don't see how it's not a need.
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Absolutely I am dont want to see gun bans, but more regulation would be worth looking into I believe anyways.0 -
Brb never going to America, wouldn't be able to trust anyone.
Its not the ones legally carrying that you can't trust....its all of those that carry illegally, or who "legally" cannot carry, but do anyway.
This.0 -
My wife and I carry. My 9 year old has a 22, and my 6 year old also shoots.
It is amazing how well kids understand firearm safety and enforce it if they see an adult/peer using one improperly. IMHO firearm safety should be a mandatory course in school.
To all the gun haters... Take a CCW class even if you are not going to ever shoot a gun. It is a wonderful amount of information about current laws, statistics, and safety.0 -
Okay, since some posters have mentioned their kids and gun safety, here's another twist:
What about Adam Lanza?
His mother was lambasted by the public for taking her "mentally unstable" son to the shooting range.
She's an idiot. Mentally unstable people shouldn't own or operate guns or even cars IMO. And you could tell my looking at that freak that he was unstable.0 -
I don't think the death of a UK soldier gives ANYONE the right to discuss US concealed weapons laws. And how disrespectful that this is in the chit chat fun and games section
Just for the record, and so we are ABSOLUTELY clear on this point, and in absolutely no doubt....
I have the right to discuss what I want, and I do not have to be respectful about your law. Grow up you self important nincompoop.
This didn't seem to be the case when I posted this thread...
http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/960075-31-dead-and-over-200-injured-in-bombings-today?hl=bombings0 -
I guess if ya'll want to ban guns, we'll have to ban butcher knives, meat cleavers, etc. too. I mean, some of ya'lls argument is that irresponsible gun owners shoot themselves, each other, leave it out for children to find, etc. Ok, people who are irresponsible with other weapons such as knives and meat cleavers can do damage too.
So if a child chokes on a toy or gives a toy to another child who chokes on it, are we going to ban toys, too????
no one here has suggested banning guns.0 -
I once tried to open a debate with a "friend" who was all excited about getting her new CCW permit and gun for Christmas. I wanted open, honest, thoughtful, intelligent, debate. Instead i got a lot of "It's my God given right as a Christian AND American to carry a gun and kill anyone who tries to break into my house."
Well, it might be one's right, or one's obligation, but I'm a firm believer that, when it comes down to it, VERY FEW people will actually be able to handle the psychological side effects of killing/maiming someone. If the answer is "not really", then I say a owning a gun is pointless.
AND, that gun needs to be loaded and ready to go.
Another intersting point.
Our cops are put on "administrative duty" until a deadly shooting is investigated.
I'm sure part of this time is used to deal with the psychological effects of taking another person's life.0 -
That phrase drives me crazy tooHaving read the thread in full there seems to be one overriding conclusion:
If everyone around you has the right to own a gun, you feel you need a gun to feel safe.
If nobody around you has the right to own a gun, you don't feel you need a gun to feel safe.
Make of that what you will.
Criminals don't have the right to own a gun, but they own them anyway, and that is why I want one to fell safe. I couldn't care less how many law abiding citizens have them.
I'm not going to bother arguing the main point as we will never agree, I just wanted to thank you for being the first American I've ever come across to use "I couldn't care less" instead of the completely nonsensical (and extremely infuriating) "I could care less"0 -
I love my glock... that is all0
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ETA most home invasions the occupants never have the chance to get their gun out of the locked gun case, then loaded, and ready to be shot. Most trained individuals cannot easily hit a moving target, so even if someone had been armed during the mass shootings the outcome would not have been much different, not to mention once the police show up and realize you have multiple people with weapons drawn...well...you are just asking for trouble at that point.
Statistics have proven my children are much safer in my home without a gun than they are with one.
What kind of idiot stores an unloaded gun for protection? No one I know. I can have my gun in my hand and ready to shoot in 3 seconds from where I sleep.
The two of you have touched on the one of my main concerns in the gun debate. If you have children, or others in your home besides yourself, how can you have a gun ready to shoot in 3 seconds, but still think you are being "safe" or "responsible"? What if you're sleeping and your toddler wanders in your bedroom and grabs your gun and shoots his/herself before you even know what's happening? Or your depressed teen knows it's there, takes it during the night and goes to school the next day and shoots a bunch of classmates? Or you, while you're sleeping? I'm sorry, but I don't see how having a gun lying around loaded is safe for anyone. Either the gun is unloaded and locked up and "safe" but useless in a surprise situation, or it's loaded and accessible, "unsafe", but ready to use.
[/quote]
Here is the answer to your concerns.
http://www.amazon.com/Gunvault-GV1000S-Mini-Vault-Standard/dp/B001C601KA/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1369323123&sr=8-15&keywords=biometric+gun+safe
[/quote]
Is this a requirement when a person purchases a gun? No? If a person does purchase one of these, are they required to use it? No again, right? So is requiring a biometric gun safe with every gun sale a solution? Not entirely, but it could help. As could requiring permitting and background checks for all residents of the home once they reach a certain age. Or requiring gun insurance or yearly licensing where you have to produce your gun every year for inspection and to prove that it is still in the registered owner's possession and hasn't been sold under the table to a "thug". Most "anti-gun" folks aren't about taking away your guns, you see. Most "anti-gun" folks would just like to see a little more regulation.
But, OP, to answer your question, I haven't really seen compelling evidence either way as to whether or not concealed carry increases or decreases crime. I agree with most of the Europeans/Canadians that have piped in...guns are not part of the "culture" for them, so they don't see a need. Americans have made it part of our culture so we don't see how it's not a need.
[/quote]
Absolutely I am dont want to see gun bans, but more regulation would be worth looking into I believe anyways.
[/quote]
Well show us some states or countries where this regulation has worked.0 -
I feel safer knowing only police and criminals carry firearms, I'm Canadian bTW.
If that were actually the case, maybe. Criminals who want guns, will have and carry guns. Why shouldn't the law abiding people be able to carry as well?
I have a permit, I'm all for it.0 -
Okay, since some posters have mentioned their kids and gun safety, here's another twist:
What about Adam Lanza?
His mother was lambasted by the public for taking her "mentally unstable" son to the shooting range.
Yup. That's why I mentioned in my prior post that more regulation in necessary, up to and including requiring the entire household of a certain age to submit to a background check before a firearm can legally be brought into and kept in the home. I just think of situations like campus housing...6 dudes living as roommates, maybe one has a gun permit and therefore has a gun in the home. Maybe he doesn't have a biometric safe because one isn't required. Maybe his buddies get drunk one night and find his gun and accidentally shoot someone. Who's at fault? The gun owner for being irresponsible or the buddies for doing the drinking and shooting? Answer: Both.0 -
Not the people with concealed carry licenses you need to worry about...and yes I have one) 0
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Okay, since some posters have mentioned their kids and gun safety, here's another twist:
What about Adam Lanza?
His mother was lambasted by the public for taking her "mentally unstable" son to the shooting range.
She's an idiot. Mentally unstable people shouldn't own or operate guns or even cars IMO. And you could tell my looking at that freak that he was unstable.
Here is an example of why I think gun regulations would have helped....maybe. Had a physician expressed concern for Adams obvious mental instability perhaps they could have forced the mother to keep her guns at a gun range or storage facility instead of in her home. He could have taken a knife to the school and killed children anyways but I dont think it would have been as many.0 -
The only thing to stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun. I'm armed, educated and proud.
Ditto
I carry, but not gonna make myself a target.0 -
I prefer personally to carry opeanly.0
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LoL, love this post. Actually when I reach 190lbs my reward is to go take the conceal carry class so I can get my permit.
thanks for reminding me :-)0 -
I don't think the death of a UK soldier gives ANYONE the right to discuss US concealed weapons laws. And how disrespectful that this is in the chit chat fun and games section
Just for the record, and so we are ABSOLUTELY clear on this point, and in absolutely no doubt....
I have the right to discuss what I want, and I do not have to be respectful about your law. Grow up you self important nincompoop.
I think you'll find that politics are not allowed on the forums, I didn't ask anyone to respect "my law", the respect was intended for the poor man who was killed. I'd love to know where that makes me self important or a nincompoop. No need for childish name calling :flowerforyou:0 -
Really? Because I'm not too concerned with thugs that shoot each other (I know innocent victims to get hit sometimes but it is rare)
FYI: It is NOT "rare" that innocent, uninvolved people get shot when "thugs" shoot at each other where I live. It's just "rare" that people with your attitude really care about it when it does happen.
Did you see the footage of the Mother's Day shooting in New Orleans? I wouldn't be surprised if you didn't even hear about it. 20 people were shot at a parade -- a guy with a gun just walked up and started firing away, and no one stopped him. This was barely discussed in the national news. Think about the coverage at Sandy Hook, or the Boston Marathon, and ask yourself why this tragedy has barely been covered. (And if it would have been any different if even one other person in that crowd had been able to shoot back before the shooter just ran off on foot.) One of the children who was killed? He had already been shot before and survived. Yeah, that's the kind of life some of the innocents have when people "aren't too concerned" about what happens to everyone around them in areas where "thugs shoot at each other."
Ignorance is such bliss...0 -
My wife and I carry. My 9 year old has a 22, and my 6 year old also shoots.
It is amazing how well kids understand firearm safety and enforce it if they see an adult/peer using one improperly. IMHO firearm safety should be a mandatory course in school.
To all the gun haters... Take a CCW class even if you are not going to ever shoot a gun. It is a wonderful amount of information about current laws, statistics, and safety.
My 9 year old son is an excellent shot! Knowledge is power0 -
Let me help the original poster in the quote out.I guess if ya'll want to ban guns, we'll have to ban butcher knives, meat cleavers, etc. too. I mean, some of ya'lls argument is that irresponsible gun owners shoot themselves, each other, leave it out for children to find, etc. Ok, people who are irresponsible with other weapons such as knives and meat cleavers can do damage too.
So if a child chokes on a toy or gives a toy to another child who chokes on it, are we going to ban toys, too????
no one here has suggested banning guns.
How about we impose more regulations on the above mentioned items? Is that pedantic enough for you?0 -
Here is the answer to your concerns.
ETA most home invasions the occupants never have the chance to get their gun out of the locked gun case, then loaded, and ready to be shot. Most trained individuals cannot easily hit a moving target, so even if someone had been armed during the mass shootings the outcome would not have been much different, not to mention once the police show up and realize you have multiple people with weapons drawn...well...you are just asking for trouble at that point.
Statistics have proven my children are much safer in my home without a gun than they are with one.
What kind of idiot stores an unloaded gun for protection? No one I know. I can have my gun in my hand and ready to shoot in 3 seconds from where I sleep.
The two of you have touched on the one of my main concerns in the gun debate. If you have children, or others in your home besides yourself, how can you have a gun ready to shoot in 3 seconds, but still think you are being "safe" or "responsible"? What if you're sleeping and your toddler wanders in your bedroom and grabs your gun and shoots his/herself before you even know what's happening? Or your depressed teen knows it's there, takes it during the night and goes to school the next day and shoots a bunch of classmates? Or you, while you're sleeping? I'm sorry, but I don't see how having a gun lying around loaded is safe for anyone. Either the gun is unloaded and locked up and "safe" but useless in a surprise situation, or it's loaded and accessible, "unsafe", but ready to use.
http://www.amazon.com/Gunvault-GV1000S-Mini-Vault-Standard/dp/B001C601KA/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1369323123&sr=8-15&keywords=biometric+gun+safe
[/quote]
Is this a requirement when a person purchases a gun? No? If a person does purchase one of these, are they required to use it? No again, right? So is requiring a biometric gun safe with every gun sale a solution? Not entirely, but it could help. As could requiring permitting and background checks for all residents of the home once they reach a certain age. Or requiring gun insurance or yearly licensing where you have to produce your gun every year for inspection and to prove that it is still in the registered owner's possession and hasn't been sold under the table to a "thug". Most "anti-gun" folks aren't about taking away your guns, you see. Most "anti-gun" folks would just like to see a little more regulation.
But, OP, to answer your question, I haven't really seen compelling evidence either way as to whether or not concealed carry increases or decreases crime. I agree with most of the Europeans/Canadians that have piped in...guns are not part of the "culture" for them, so they don't see a need. Americans have made it part of our culture so we don't see how it's not a need.
[/quote]
Absolutely I am dont want to see gun bans, but more regulation would be worth looking into I believe anyways.
[/quote]
Well show us some states or countries where this regulation has worked.
[/quote]
Most countries where citizens do not have access to guns school shootings are unheard of.0 -
That phrase drives me crazy tooHaving read the thread in full there seems to be one overriding conclusion:
If everyone around you has the right to own a gun, you feel you need a gun to feel safe.
If nobody around you has the right to own a gun, you don't feel you need a gun to feel safe.
Make of that what you will.
Criminals don't have the right to own a gun, but they own them anyway, and that is why I want one to fell safe. I couldn't care less how many law abiding citizens have them.
I'm not going to bother arguing the main point as we will never agree, I just wanted to thank you for being the first American I've ever come across to use "I couldn't care less" instead of the completely nonsensical (and extremely infuriating) "I could care less"
Me too, did you see the David Mitchell (Peep Show) piss take on Google?0 -
Here is the answer to your concerns.
ETA most home invasions the occupants never have the chance to get their gun out of the locked gun case, then loaded, and ready to be shot. Most trained individuals cannot easily hit a moving target, so even if someone had been armed during the mass shootings the outcome would not have been much different, not to mention once the police show up and realize you have multiple people with weapons drawn...well...you are just asking for trouble at that point.
Right! They just assult kids with knives (like in China!) Oh so much better.
Statistics have proven my children are much safer in my home without a gun than they are with one.
What kind of idiot stores an unloaded gun for protection? No one I know. I can have my gun in my hand and ready to shoot in 3 seconds from where I sleep.
The two of you have touched on the one of my main concerns in the gun debate. If you have children, or others in your home besides yourself, how can you have a gun ready to shoot in 3 seconds, but still think you are being "safe" or "responsible"? What if you're sleeping and your toddler wanders in your bedroom and grabs your gun and shoots his/herself before you even know what's happening? Or your depressed teen knows it's there, takes it during the night and goes to school the next day and shoots a bunch of classmates? Or you, while you're sleeping? I'm sorry, but I don't see how having a gun lying around loaded is safe for anyone. Either the gun is unloaded and locked up and "safe" but useless in a surprise situation, or it's loaded and accessible, "unsafe", but ready to use.
http://www.amazon.com/Gunvault-GV1000S-Mini-Vault-Standard/dp/B001C601KA/ref=sr_1_15?ie=UTF8&qid=1369323123&sr=8-15&keywords=biometric+gun+safe
Is this a requirement when a person purchases a gun? No? If a person does purchase one of these, are they required to use it? No again, right? So is requiring a biometric gun safe with every gun sale a solution? Not entirely, but it could help. As could requiring permitting and background checks for all residents of the home once they reach a certain age. Or requiring gun insurance or yearly licensing where you have to produce your gun every year for inspection and to prove that it is still in the registered owner's possession and hasn't been sold under the table to a "thug". Most "anti-gun" folks aren't about taking away your guns, you see. Most "anti-gun" folks would just like to see a little more regulation.
But, OP, to answer your question, I haven't really seen compelling evidence either way as to whether or not concealed carry increases or decreases crime. I agree with most of the Europeans/Canadians that have piped in...guns are not part of the "culture" for them, so they don't see a need. Americans have made it part of our culture so we don't see how it's not a need.
[/quote]
Absolutely I am dont want to see gun bans, but more regulation would be worth looking into I believe anyways.
[/quote]
Well show us some states or countries where this regulation has worked.
[/quote]
Most countries where citizens do not have access to guns school shootings are unheard of.
[/quote]
That's correct. Instead, they take knives in to schools full of helpless children and cut them up. (If you want examples, look at China).0 -
Population 311,591,917
US Violent Crimes 2011 1,203,564
Violent Crimes/100,000 386
Population 56,000,000
UK Violent Crimes 2011 762,515
Violent Crimes/ 100,000 1361
*Ban on guns since 1997
Percentage higher than US 352.59%0 -
Let me help the original poster in the quote out.I guess if ya'll want to ban guns, we'll have to ban butcher knives, meat cleavers, etc. too. I mean, some of ya'lls argument is that irresponsible gun owners shoot themselves, each other, leave it out for children to find, etc. Ok, people who are irresponsible with other weapons such as knives and meat cleavers can do damage too.
So if a child chokes on a toy or gives a toy to another child who chokes on it, are we going to ban toys, too????
no one here has suggested banning guns.
How about we impose more regulations on the above mentioned items? Is that pedantic enough for you?
Those items are not designed to kill, they can kill but it is not even close to be the same thing as a gun. Their purpose is not to kill. The sole purpose of a gun is to kill and therefore should be regulated.0 -
I carry when I go running in the morning. I was followed by a coyote ones and refuse to feel that scared ever again. And as far as feeling safer knowing that only police and military carry guns....I believe we had a mass murderer here in the states that was also a police officer....just sayin.
How many people are killed every year by coyotes vs. people carrying guns? Answer, only two people in the US have ever died from coyote attacks although there are about 50 bites per year and most of those are to children under 5 years old. You are WAY more likely to be killed by a domestic dog. Gun deaths in the US are in the thousands every year.
I live in an area full of coyotes and see them all the time. They rarely come close. They are curious creatures but keep their distance.
On the other hand there are 90 guns per 100 people in the US. If you conceal you are by no means the only ones doing so. Pulling out a gun is just as likely to get you shot as the person you are confronting.
Yes, Im Canadian0 -
You said YOU couldn't keep a gun in your house because of kids, I gave you a solution. I can't control what everyone else does. I can't make sure they lock up the tylenol, cleaning chemicals, Drano, etc so that kids can't get in it and die either, which happens. Should we require all of that nonsense for those items also?
I said no such thing, actually. There is more than one person in this forum who has a different opinion than yours. But you missed my point completely...I was asking why CAN'T there be a control of what other people do with their guns in their homes, i.e. requiring a biometric gun safe be purchased along with every gun? Are you seriously comparing a gun to Drano? Besides, if a person doesn't know enough to keep their Drano away from their kids, I'd hate to think how they'd store their guns...0
This discussion has been closed.
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