80/10/10--I'm doing it!
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwBk2_RFuMo
Be sure to leave your comments on the video page so those people will know exactly (based on your theory) that their diet is silly, wrong, unhealthy and they are destined for a life of degeneration.
Yep, there's a guy to take dietary advice from.0 -
Do you mean the Framingham Heart Study?
They've never made those conclusions.
For all participants, overall. Regarding the cholesterol levels of those who developed CVD and those who didn’t, the actual data was inconclusive. Some of the participants with low cholesterol developed heart disease, and some with high cholesterol did not.
Quote from http://www.healthy-eating-politics.com/high-cholesterol.htmlMore importantly, the Framingham researchers found NO correlation for high cholesterol and heart disease in those participants who were over 50. Since 95% of all CHD deaths occur in people over the age of 55, this was certainly significant.
But here’s the most important result: In 1987, the Framingham researchers published a 30 year follow up report on the “all cause mortality rates” of the Framingham residents.
They looked not only at coronary heart disease deaths, but deaths from stroke, cancer and other illnesses
The researchers reported a surprising outcome.
* For those participants who were over age 50, lower cholesterol rates were associated with a higher risk of death from CHD and all causes. In fact, for every 1 mg/dl drop in cholesterol levels, there was a 14% increase in heart related death, and an 11% increase in overall mortality.
* In other words, declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death from all causes, not just CHD.0 -
Consumption of animal products IS toxic. That is the ONLY place Cholesterol is found. And, what is the number one cause of death in the US right now? Heart disease. What causes heart disease, you ask? Cholesterol.
Saying heart disease is caused by cholesterol is grossly oversimplified to the point of being completely false. Heart disease is caused by the intermingling of many causes, first and foremost being lack of exercise, poor diet, genetics ect ect ect. A poor diet may include too high of cholesterol, but cholesterol is not actually bad for you in and of itself. It's actually essential and the body produces it's own.
Agree. Your BODY produces 85% of your cholesterol REGARDLESS of diet (in fact, if you cut it very low, your body will simply make more to compensate--cholesterol is very important to many functions). And the whole idea that cholesterol is bad for you started on research done on rabbits, who were given cholesterol but, oh hey, guess what? Rabbits are vegetarian by nature and design. The "research" that has "proven" that dietary cholesterol 1) is bad for you and 2) causes heart disease is shady at BEST.
Now, sugar on the other hand....
80/10/10 is like my worst nightmare. I'd have triglycerides and LDL out the window with all that carbohydrate. (I've lowered my ratios and have very low triglycerides from eating a high fat, and--yes--high(ish) CHOL diet). My numbers were way worse with a low-fat, higher carb diet. But, whatever works for you. Just keep track of that bloodwork and don't turn yourself into a diabetic, which is likely with that sort of diet.0 -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RwBk2_RFuMo
Be sure to leave your comments on the video page so those people will know exactly (based on your theory) that their diet is silly, wrong, unhealthy and they are destined for a life of degeneration.
Yep, there's a guy to take dietary advice from.
He'll have no response to this. I applaud your effort though!
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80/10/10
LOL0 -
Do you mean the Framingham Heart Study?
They've never made those conclusions.
For all participants, overall. Regarding the cholesterol levels of those who developed CVD and those who didn’t, the actual data was inconclusive. Some of the participants with low cholesterol developed heart disease, and some with high cholesterol did not.
Quote from http://www.healthy-eating-politics.com/high-cholesterol.htmlMore importantly, the Framingham researchers found NO correlation for high cholesterol and heart disease in those participants who were over 50. Since 95% of all CHD deaths occur in people over the age of 55, this was certainly significant.
But here’s the most important result: In 1987, the Framingham researchers published a 30 year follow up report on the “all cause mortality rates” of the Framingham residents.
They looked not only at coronary heart disease deaths, but deaths from stroke, cancer and other illnesses
The researchers reported a surprising outcome.
* For those participants who were over age 50, lower cholesterol rates were associated with a higher risk of death from CHD and all causes. In fact, for every 1 mg/dl drop in cholesterol levels, there was a 14% increase in heart related death, and an 11% increase in overall mortality.
* In other words, declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death from all causes, not just CHD.
That quote is from an "alternative" food and health source, another non-scientific institution that essentially promotes the paleo diet.
You'll notice that Farmingham Heart Study does not come to the same conclusions based on the results, because they're real scientists that understand that one study that produces contradictory results is cause for more research, but is not conclusive evidence.
In other words, Healthy Eating Politics (alternative health source), NOT the Framingham Heart Study (actual scientific source), says declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death.0 -
Do you mean the Framingham Heart Study?
They've never made those conclusions.
For all participants, overall. Regarding the cholesterol levels of those who developed CVD and those who didn’t, the actual data was inconclusive. Some of the participants with low cholesterol developed heart disease, and some with high cholesterol did not.
Quote from http://www.healthy-eating-politics.com/high-cholesterol.htmlMore importantly, the Framingham researchers found NO correlation for high cholesterol and heart disease in those participants who were over 50. Since 95% of all CHD deaths occur in people over the age of 55, this was certainly significant.
But here’s the most important result: In 1987, the Framingham researchers published a 30 year follow up report on the “all cause mortality rates” of the Framingham residents.
They looked not only at coronary heart disease deaths, but deaths from stroke, cancer and other illnesses
The researchers reported a surprising outcome.
* For those participants who were over age 50, lower cholesterol rates were associated with a higher risk of death from CHD and all causes. In fact, for every 1 mg/dl drop in cholesterol levels, there was a 14% increase in heart related death, and an 11% increase in overall mortality.
* In other words, declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death from all causes, not just CHD.
That quote is from an "alternative" food and health source, another non-scientific institution that essentially promotes the paleo diet.
You'll notice that Farmingham Heart Study does not come to the same conclusions based on the results, because they're real scientists that understand that one study that produces contradictory results is cause for more research, but is not conclusive evidence.
In other words, Healthy Eating Politics (alternative health source), NOT the Framingham Heart Study (actual scientific source), says declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death.0 -
That quote is from an "alternative" food and health source, another non-scientific institution that essentially promotes the paleo diet.You'll notice that Farmingham Heart Study does not come to the same conclusions based on the results, because they're real scientists that understand that one study that produces contradictory results is cause for more research, but is not conclusive evidence.
As mentioned, what the original Framingham study reported on cholesterol and heart disease was that it was "inconclusive". Meaning no link exists. Are you blind to that?
However, the same researchers did a follow-up study published in 1987 and clearly stated that there was a 14% CVD death rate increase per 1 mg/dL per year drop in cholesterol levels.
Again I must ask if you're blind. Perhaps at this point 'brainwashed' is a better term.
Also of note, study director William Castelli, M.D., wrote in the Archives of Internal Medicine:
“In Framingham, Mass., the more saturated fat one ate, the more cholesterol one ate, the more calories one ate, the lower the person’s serum cholesterol…we found that people who ate the most cholesterol, ate the most saturated fat and ate the most calories, weighed the least and were the most physically active.”In other words, Healthy Eating Politics (alternative health source), NOT the Framingham Heart Study (actual scientific source), says declining levels of cholesterol increased the risk of death.
In regards to your beliefs on cholesterol, you're wrong. So wrong. Please learn to research before making your wild assumptions and accusations, throwing around your conspiracy theories.
Your continued support of cholesterol myths/bashing of all reports that people post in the face of evidence even from the Framingham researchers themselves, and your continued claim it's all "bias", "alternative", or other conspiracy theory is staggering.0 -
If you were such a great researcher, you'd know the difference between results and conclusions. The FHS has published those results, but they have never made the same conclusions that the article you linked to did, and there's a reason for that.
No legitimate medical research institution has published the conclusion that not eating cholesterol causes elevated blood cholesterol levels or increased rates of mortality.
...
And I'm the one with the wild accusations and conspiracy theories. Right.0 -
If you were such a great researcher, you'd know the difference between results and conclusions. The FHS has published those results, but they have never made the same conclusions that the article you linked to did, and there's a reason for that.
The directory of the study stated: "In Framingham, Mass., the more saturated fat one ate, the more cholesterol one ate, the more calories one ate, the lower the person’s serum cholesterol"
What don't you get?No legitimate medical research institution has published the conclusion that not eating cholesterol causes elevated blood cholesterol levels or increased rates of mortality.
However, since you bring the point up, you realize we DO need cholesterol, right? Our liver can produce it, of course, in the absence of dietary intake, but we DO need it.
What many a "legitimate medical research institution" does say, however, is that increasing dietary fat and cholesterol reduces serum cholesterol.
Do you argue just for arguments sake, or are you confused about something?And I'm the one with the wild accusations and conspiracy theories. Right.
You've NEVER, EVER done that, have you? So yes, you're making some wild accusations with no basis in reality, let-alone science. Not about everything, mind you, but you're arguing with people about cholesterol and the Framingham study when you have no evidence to back up your claim(s), your own arguments are shown as factually incorrect, and the weight of the evidence is against you.0 -
I'm not disagreeing or arguing about anything, nor am I making any "claims". I was just pointing out sources for conclusions. Go ahead and put more words in my mouth, though. I bet it's very entertaining for everyone who's reading.You're disagreeing with the people that say it's proven that cholesterol does not contribute to CVD.
No I'm not. Read my posts again, this time without inserting your own words into my posts.
I'm not responding to anymore of this. I sent you a PM that you never responded to, but you're ready to flay me on this thread all over again, doing the same thing you did before, arguing on things I haven't even said or done. It's becoming kind of ridiculous.0 -
I'm actually not arguing or disagreeing about anything.
I'm just pointing out what the actual authorities in the field say. Dietary cholesterol is not necessary.
Go ahead and put more words in my mouth, though. I bet it's very entertaining for everyone who's reading.You're disagreeing with the people that say it's proven that cholesterol does not contribute to CVD.
No I'm not. Read my posts again, this time without inserting your own words into my posts.
Somebody else refuted that, offering Framingham up as evidence (although he called it 'Framington')...
Your reply was:"Do you mean the Framingham Heart Study? They've never made those conclusions. "
Perhaps if that's NOT your assertion, you should learn to communicate more clearly and not leave terse replies that claim something is incorrect with no sources to back you up.
Interestingly though, with regards to your claim that you're not arguing or disagreeing, when I challenged your implication that Framingham supports the cholesterol causes CVD myth, you immediately argued with me about source claiming bias, 'alternative' medicine, and paleo conspiracies ... all the while consistently saying Framingham didn't say what it DID say... Claiming my source was a biased site (when my source was the Framingham study itself) and then never admitting you were wrong.
Which just further shows you appear to be either confused, or argumentative simply for an argument's sake. Either way, I'd really like to be done talking to you in this thread.0 -
http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/
http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
If its for belief or religious reasons then veganism, vegetarianism is fine.
However it isnt as healthy as eating omnivorous lifestyle.
You would have to be very knowledgable in Amino Acid consumption as well as getting all micronutrients through supplementation.
Its a shame that this post was brought back from the dead.
OP who was adamant on trying this lifestyle probably hasnt lost any weight and is probably just as unhealthy as before.
No the cow that i'll be consuming tonight was a strict vegan.
He ate only grass that his 4 stomachs and complex digestive tract was able to pull all the nutrients needed to give me a tasty 1/4 burger.
Yum!0 -
If someone wants to do 80/10/10 what's the big deal if it works for them? Does it hurt your own health somehow? If someone wantsto eat nothing but bananas does it somehow threaten your fitness efforts? Ugh.0
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http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/
http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
If its for belief or religious reasons then veganism, vegetarianism is fine.
However it isnt as healthy as eating omnivorous lifestyle.
You would have to be very knowledgable in Amino Acid consumption as well as getting all micronutrients through supplementation.
Its a shame that this post was brought back from the dead.
OP who was adamant on trying this lifestyle probably hasnt lost any weight and is probably just as unhealthy as before.
No the cow that i'll be consuming tonight was a strict vegan.
He ate only grass that his 4 stomachs and complex digestive tract was able to pull all the nutrients needed to give me a tasty 1/4 burger.
Yum!
Sorry, but your statement is totally untrue re vegetarianism not being as healthy as a omnivorous lifestyle. Name me a single micronutient that you cannot get very easily with a vegetarian lifestyle?
Re EAAs, milk has a higher bioavailability than meat and fish.0 -
http://rawfoodsos.com/2010/07/07/the-china-study-fact-or-fallac/
http://www.cholesterol-and-health.com/China-Study.html
If its for belief or religious reasons then veganism, vegetarianism is fine.
However it isnt as healthy as eating omnivorous lifestyle.
You would have to be very knowledgable in Amino Acid consumption as well as getting all micronutrients through supplementation.
Its a shame that this post was brought back from the dead.
OP who was adamant on trying this lifestyle probably hasnt lost any weight and is probably just as unhealthy as before.
No the cow that i'll be consuming tonight was a strict vegan.
He ate only grass that his 4 stomachs and complex digestive tract was able to pull all the nutrients needed to give me a tasty 1/4 burger.
Yum!
Sorry, but your statement is totally untrue re vegetarianism not being as healthy as a omnivorous lifestyle. Name me a single micronutient that you cannot get very easily with a vegetarian lifestyle?
Re EAAs, milk has a higher bioavailability than meat and fish.0 -
You would have to be very knowledgable in Amino Acid consumption as well as getting all micronutrients through supplementation.
some people are very meticulous about making sure they get all their aminio acids and all that through their foods and supplementation. Vegan, vegetarian, or neither...0 -
I'm actually not arguing or disagreeing about anything.
I'm just pointing out what the actual authorities in the field say. Dietary cholesterol is not necessary.
Go ahead and put more words in my mouth, though. I bet it's very entertaining for everyone who's reading.You're disagreeing with the people that say it's proven that cholesterol does not contribute to CVD.
No I'm not. Read my posts again, this time without inserting your own words into my posts.
Somebody else refuted that, offering Framingham up as evidence (although he called it 'Framington')...
Your reply was:"Do you mean the Framingham Heart Study? They've never made those conclusions. "
Perhaps if that's NOT your assertion, you should learn to communicate more clearly and not leave terse replies that claim something is incorrect with no sources to back you up.
Interestingly though, with regards to your claim that you're not arguing or disagreeing, when I challenged your implication that Framingham supports the cholesterol causes CVD myth, you immediately argued with me about source claiming bias, 'alternative' medicine, and paleo conspiracies ... all the while consistently saying Framingham didn't say what it DID say... Claiming my source was a biased site (when my source was the Framingham study itself) and then never admitting you were wrong.
Which just further shows you appear to be either confused, or argumentative simply for an argument's sake. Either way, I'd really like to be done talking to you in this thread.
Well...I still say it's Framington dangit!!! lol
Sorry holothuroidea but I have to agree with albertabeefy. Your posts have been confusing. Your response to me was strange, I wasn't sure if you were agreeing with the cholesterol-CVD myth or not. Framingham has made it clear that elevated cholesterol is not responsible for CVD. Since it's the longest longitudinal study of its kind it is clear that using cholesterol as a predictor of heart disease is nonsense. The idiot who started it all, Dr. Ancel Keyes, lied and he should have been brought up on ethics charges and research denounced but instead he was made Time magazine's Man of the Year. Quite a number of physicians testified before Congress to denounce this ridiculous idea and to stop the nation from going down the "low fat" rabbit hole but to no avail. Decades later people are still dying from CVD, and even those who watch their cholesterol, and yet very few want to question that their hypothesis is wrong. There's too much invested and yet those who eat buckets of cholesterol sans glucose have higher cholesterol but less incidence of CVD.
As for the vegetarians...I love them. The tastiest meat are vegetarians. I love cow! Then again omnivores are also tasty; chicken and pig... yum! I'm hungry!0 -
Here's my stance on cholesterol, for all who are confused:
A) Dietary cholesterol has not been proven to cause health problems.
Dietary cholesterol has not been proven to be a necessary nutrient.
C) While it is uncommon, some individuals are sensitive to dietary cholesterol and should restrict it. People with family histories of this condition should watch their cholesterol levels closely even when at a healthy weight.
D) While it is uncommon, some individuals have difficulty synthesizing cholesterol in the liver and they should consume an adequate amount of dietary cholesterol for health. People with a family history of this condition should be very cautious about pursuing a vegan diet and should watch their levels closely.
With the caveat that I've only heard about points C and D through anecdotal experience and they may very well be wrong.
There you go.0 -
Here's my stance on cholesterol, for all who are confused:
A) Dietary cholesterol has not been proven to cause health problems.
Dietary cholesterol has not been proven to be a necessary nutrient.
C) While it is uncommon, some individuals are sensitive to dietary cholesterol and should restrict it. People with family histories of this condition should watch their cholesterol levels closely even when at a healthy weight.
D) While it is uncommon, some individuals have difficulty synthesizing cholesterol in the liver and they should consume an adequate amount of dietary cholesterol for health. People with a family history of this condition should be very cautious about pursuing a vegan diet and should watch their levels closely.
With the caveat that I've only heard about points C and D through anecdotal experience and they may very well be wrong.
There you go.
How is dietary cholesterol not a necessary nutrient if it's found in every cell membrane in the body? Are you aware that the body's synthesis of cholesterol is a very ineffective process because we have evolved or were created to eat cholesterol? Cholesterol and saturated fat are our friends not to be shunned or avoided.0
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