Do young adults in the UK not want to work?
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:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....0 -
:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....
Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle. When you are done using it you return it. If you need a chicken to eat, you receive a chicken to eat.
Almost all boring jobs, and tasks can be replaced by mechinization with current day technology and can only become more advanced if we concentrate efforts into these automation technologies. You can see this has happened in factories that use robots to replace workers. They are cheaper than humans, produce more work than humans, and take jobs from humans. It can be used for the betterment of everyone instead of seen as a negative. We as humans utilize tools and improved upon tools for generations. Why? Is it not to liberate us from the repetitive and hard tasks of labor? robots, mechinization is all tools we have and can create but lack direction towards its use for humanity. In current structure it is all focused towards profit.0 -
:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....
Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle. When you are done using it you return it. If you need a chicken to eat, you receive a chicken to eat.
Almost all boring jobs, and tasks can be replaced by mechinization with current day technology and can only become more advanced if we concentrate efforts into these automation technologies. You can see this has happened in factories that use robots to replace workers. They are cheaper than humans, produce more work than humans, and take jobs from humans. It can be used for the betterment of everyone instead of seen as a negative. We as humans utilize tools and improved upon tools for generations. Why? Is it not to liberate us from the repetitive and hard tasks of labor? robots, mechinization is all tools we have and can create but lack direction towards its use for humanity. In current structure it is all focused towards profit.
I'm all for ridding the world of drudgery and bettering everyone, but what you're talking about is impossible. How would you incentivize the people driving the system to start valuing the lives and wellbeing of those who've been shut out of it (because it's just other people at the end of 'profit'), without disrupting the system that makes the robot drudges possible? We can plainly see the value of human life at the front end of the news, any night. I think we can set 'asking nicely' to one side, ditto the rising of the proletariat (because who really would admit to being a member of that [or any] club, these days)? Making countries and systems and fortunes is bloody work.0 -
:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....
Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle. When you are done using it you return it. If you need a chicken to eat, you receive a chicken to eat.
Almost all boring jobs, and tasks can be replaced by mechinization with current day technology and can only become more advanced if we concentrate efforts into these automation technologies. You can see this has happened in factories that use robots to replace workers. They are cheaper than humans, produce more work than humans, and take jobs from humans. It can be used for the betterment of everyone instead of seen as a negative. We as humans utilize tools and improved upon tools for generations. Why? Is it not to liberate us from the repetitive and hard tasks of labor? robots, mechinization is all tools we have and can create but lack direction towards its use for humanity. In current structure it is all focused towards profit.
A thought suppose I'm a robotics engineer with 8-10 years of education and 10 years experience what incentives would you give me to continue designing and producing these beneficial technologies? I kind of enjoy my 6 figure income right now, trips to Europe, and sending my children to a private school.0 -
I'm just ever so relieved to learn that the British are so lazy.
As an American, I support this message of reverse-continentism . . .0 -
I suspect a robotics engineer would be strung up for daring to produce things that take work from the workers!
Who defines 'need'? Is it purely utilitarian?[Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle.
I'm currently typing this while lying in the back of a lorry, which I'm living in. Does that mean no else NEEDS more than that?
(Ok, it's converted to a motorhome and suits my contracting work etc - though the bit I'm lying in was the motorbike garage area.)0 -
So back to the original question, beyond vague generalities about the purpose of benefits, which I think few would disagree with. The benefit system contains a number of perverse incentives, the clearest being a threshold at which it's just not cost effective to go into employment, but a wide range of others.
How would you structure it in such a way that it provides a safety net, rather than a choice that one might make?
Narrow the margins either end - raise the minimum wage considerably and pay for it by taxing the fat cats and millionaires. Have a maximum earning capacity of, say, £250k. And a minimum of £30k.
I'll have to leave you to crunch the numbers... I'm going to bed.
*****In Tomorrow's MFP Chit Chat Forum: World Peace - How do we achieve THAT, exactly?*****
But thats Socialism! *gasp*
And apparently that would lead to economic meltdown. Glad nobody told the Chinese....0 -
Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle. When you are done using it you return it. If you need a chicken to eat, you receive a chicken to eat.
Almost all boring jobs, and tasks can be replaced by mechinization with current day technology and can only become more advanced if we concentrate efforts into these automation technologies. You can see this has happened in factories that use robots to replace workers. They are cheaper than humans, produce more work than humans, and take jobs from humans. It can be used for the betterment of everyone instead of seen as a negative. We as humans utilize tools and improved upon tools for generations. Why? Is it not to liberate us from the repetitive and hard tasks of labor? robots, mechinization is all tools we have and can create but lack direction towards its use for humanity. In current structure it is all focused towards profit.
Blimey - more flavours of Anarchy on MFP...0 -
Yea, because it did so well for the Chinese - it's the capitalist economy that's driving their growth, I would suggestAnd apparently that would lead to economic meltdown. Glad nobody told the Chinese....0 -
I'm just ever so relieved to learn that the British are so lazy.
As an American, I support this message of reverse-continentism . . .
We all have bad teeth and drink tea too...
0 -
But thats Socialism! *gasp*
And apparently that would lead to economic meltdown. Glad nobody told the Chinese....
China is as close to socialism these days as I am to being crowned next Miss Universe. There's not a whole lot of 'from each according to his ability, to each according to his need' going on in a place where there are millions upon millions living in abject poverty on less than $1 a day, whilst the super-rich at the top are busy cashing in on the bubble of manufacturing industry.
The most 'equal' countries on the planet tend to be the Nordic ones, but I believe they only manage it because they have high levels of tax and low populations.
And ultimately it's population that's the problem. Whilst there is unfettered increase in human population on a global level there is competition over resources, even the most basic ones. The more the population grows, the greater the competition for those resources will be and the greater the gulf in all societies will be as those who 'can' get ahead and those who 'can't' flounder in deeper and deeper levels of poverty. We're already starting to see the impact of that - rich retreating into gated communities in some countries, some poor areas being total 'no go' areas and, of course, the foreign policies of the rich countries getting ever more aggressive....if the foreign territory in the crap happens to have strategic or resource value.
It doesn't matter whether what your brand of economics is; whilst the human race explodes like rats in a sewer, any brand of economics is simply an exercise in rearranging the deck-chairs on the Titanic.0 -
:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....
the barter system doesn't mean this exactly (although it is an example of barter trade)
the barter system means that the money has value in itself, e.g. gold coins that are worth their weight in the gold they're made of, rather than bits of paper/coins printed/minted by the bank that only have value because the bank and government say that it does. So in the barter system, the means of currency in circulation (e.g. gold coins) retain their value as long as people consider gold to be desirable. Non-barter money loses value over time (inflation) because its value depends on the relative amounts of money in circulation compared to the amount of goods in circulation that could be bought or traded with money, and banks can control inflation by how much money they put into circulation. In the barter system there is no inflation, although the relative values of goods fluctuates depending on demand, e.g. how much gold is worth relative to (say) potatoes, which would affect how many potatoes you could buy with a 1g gold coin.
The value of gold may appear to go up and up and up and up over time, but it doesn't, it stays roughly the same (barring fluctuations in value caused by how much demand there is for it at any time) - the value of money goes down and down and down and down and down...
I'm not going to get into the pros cons or anything else in this debate (or even join in the debate at all for that matter). I'm just explaining what the barter system is, as a lot of people wrongly believe that barter = no currency. It doesn't, it means that the currency is made out of a tradeable commodity and worth its weight in that commodity (usually precious metals).0 -
I'm by no way young, I am 38 years old and have recently found myself out of work for personal reasons and now I am desperate to get back into work, it is so hard to even get an interview! These young people obviously don't realise how lucky they are to even get an interview when the older ones like myself struggle! I have a great CV too!0
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Hi, Where are you?
I have a 17 year old son just finishing an apprenticeship who is desperate for a job when it finishes! He already gets up at half 5 and gets to work.
We are in Nottingham. Please send details!
Aimee0 -
Just like to let you all know that not all young adults in the UK are lazy. My daughter was trying to get work for two years, she was in lower sets at school and didn't get above a grade C in GCSE, but she is a worker and has taken course after course to improve herself, the job centre sent her on courses some of which she had to leave at 6am and take a train and a bus to get there. She would daily put in application forms for jobs, but wouldn't even get an interview, it was so frustrating, but she carried on and didn't let it get her down. We were just hoping someone would see her potential and give her a chance, finally this summer she was offered a part time job on minimum wage but she was over the moon, finally she would be earning her own money, we were so happy for her. The hours are not great sometimes she works until 3am, but she never complains and is just happy to have a job even though it's part time. So not all young adults in the UK are lazy, just wanted to let you know.0
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I am very fortunate in that I have a business that is relatively successful in the UK
This last few weeks I have been holding interviews to fill a position..the wage is only slightly above minimum wage, but, it is a little above.
I am looking to train this person up into a better skill.
I have not been looking for a rocket scientist or brain surgeon, just someone that would seem to have reliability and some work ethic.
5 people never bothered to turn up for the interviews...3 were late... 1 had the mother phone up to make an excuse.. a few people turned up wearing jeans....2 people actually told me they had to come for the interviews or they would lose their entitlement to social security benefits...
I was hoping to try to help someone from benefits into the workplace. Is it that young adults do not want to work?
Firstly, that is a really rude and sweeping statement. Sure there are people who don't want to work, but they range from the age of entiltement to benefits through to state pension age - it is not purely a 'young person' problem.
Do you know why those 5 people didn't turn up? Personal problems, finding other work etc. It isn't always as clear cut as "they can't be bothered".
Did you ask why those 3 were late?
Did you just automatically assume that person's mother was making an excuse?
Did you wonder why those people couldn't afford to get proper interview clothes, or why they never had help in interview prepping?
Maybe the problem isn't those people, but yourself in not asking, or for outside factors not preparing them for such environments.
Plus, most unemployed 'young' people I know aren't looking for training - most of them already have qualifications from college or univerisity and want to do something in that field, something they will enjoy and will make them happy. Yes, it is easier to find work while in employment, but not a lot of people want to join a company and do something they won't enjoy in the hopes of finding something better.
QFT0 -
Not all young people are lazy, it's a shame some of the older generations are so quick to generalise. Attitudes like this are not helpful to anyone. I'm a young person, and until recently I was unemployed. That doesn't make me lazy - it makes me a university graduate!0
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*pops in to see how thread has developed...*:huh:
If we're reintroducing the barter system. I would like to offer to swap a chicken for a Bugatti Veyron please. Any takers....
Actually in a Resource Based Economy (RBE) You would be able to make that trade. Just not exact in how you view the value between the two. All people of the earth would have to come to an conclusion that all resources belong to everyone and no one owns something not needed. IF you need a vehicle to travel some place you would simply put in a request order and reserve the time you need the vehicle. When you are done using it you return it. If you need a chicken to eat, you receive a chicken to eat.
*smacks head on desk*0 -
But thats Socialism! *gasp*
And apparently that would lead to economic meltdown. Glad nobody told the Chinese....
Socialism..... in China....
:laugh: :laugh: :laugh:0 -
Hmm I work part time, just had hours cut. Now £40 a week worse off than signing on and claiming for a couples allowance. I want to work but I can't get full time unless I take a 0 hour contract with no promise I would get 40 hours per week. I walk 45 mins to work daily and get up at 4:30am to do so.
I can see why people don't want to work and I've been on both sides of it.0
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