Are you guys for or against childhood vaccines?

I personally don't believe in vaccines. I have all my childhood ones because my mother, despite being a devout Catholic and herself not having been vaccinated and our family being against my bother and I getting vaccinated for religious reasons, decided to get us vaccinated. Good call on her part, because while I was fine as a child, my brother was extremely sickly, and could've died without being vaccinated.

I don't have children, but if I did I would get them all the necessary shots/vaccines when they're little. If they're a sickly child, then maybe they'd get "extras" like the flu shot. There's no way that I wouldn't let my child have a vaccine and put them at risk just because I don't believe in vaccines. To me, that's bad parenting, and honestly I'd feel like the worst person in the world if my child got sick and died from something that I could've easily prevented. However, I wouldn't allow them to get something like the HPV vaccine unless by the time I have children (if I do) there's more information and more studies done about it. Personally, I think it's too new of a vaccine and I don't trust it, it hasn't been around long enough to know all the possible long-term side effects. When the child is 18 they can get whatever shots they want regardless of my opinion on them.

I have a friend of mine who is Mormon, has 8 kids, all that jazz. They don't believe in vaccinations because they're "evil" and they "destroy your immune system" and "cause disease" such as autism. That's their opinion, and that's cool, they can do whatever they like. But they wonder why are their kids always so sick, and they got upset when the whooping cough outbreak here happened and all 8 kids (aged from 2-18) got so sick to the point where one almost died. They believe that eating healthy will prevent all illness, and while I agree that a healthy diet can, and sometimes will, prevent illness, they wouldn't have been in that situation with their kids if they'd gotten vaccinated.

So just purely out of curiosity, after saying all that, how is it that you say you don't believe in vaccines? You just said that they do in fact work, and can potentially prevent fatal illness, so what is it you don't believe in about them?

I was wondering that too!

Also, where in the Bible does it say "Thou shalt not vaccinate"? What specifically is the religious objection? [Not trying to be combative, I've just never heard of that outside of faith healing believers.]

As for the Bible, as far as I know (I'm not particularly devout) it doesn't say crap all. Not sure about Mormons, but my very very Catholic family thinks that vaccinations "go against God" because it's introducing something foreign to your body. (So you can best believe that they take issue with me having tattoos and piercings.) I can't say that all Catholics believe that though. My mother finds that notion hilarious, but her sister sh-ts a brick about it.

I personally don't believe in vaccines. I have all my childhood ones because my mother, despite being a devout Catholic and herself not having been vaccinated and our family being against my bother and I getting vaccinated for religious reasons, decided to get us vaccinated. Good call on her part, because while I was fine as a child, my brother was extremely sickly, and could've died without being vaccinated.

I don't have children, but if I did I would get them all the necessary shots/vaccines when they're little. If they're a sickly child, then maybe they'd get "extras" like the flu shot. There's no way that I wouldn't let my child have a vaccine and put them at risk just because I don't believe in vaccines. To me, that's bad parenting, and honestly I'd feel like the worst person in the world if my child got sick and died from something that I could've easily prevented. However, I wouldn't allow them to get something like the HPV vaccine unless by the time I have children (if I do) there's more information and more studies done about it. Personally, I think it's too new of a vaccine and I don't trust it, it hasn't been around long enough to know all the possible long-term side effects. When the child is 18 they can get whatever shots they want regardless of my opinion on them.

I have a friend of mine who is Mormon, has 8 kids, all that jazz. They don't believe in vaccinations because they're "evil" and they "destroy your immune system" and "cause disease" such as autism. That's their opinion, and that's cool, they can do whatever they like. But they wonder why are their kids always so sick, and they got upset when the whooping cough outbreak here happened and all 8 kids (aged from 2-18) got so sick to the point where one almost died. They believe that eating healthy will prevent all illness, and while I agree that a healthy diet can, and sometimes will, prevent illness, they wouldn't have been in that situation with their kids if they'd gotten vaccinated.

So just purely out of curiosity, after saying all that, how is it that you say you don't believe in vaccines? You just said that they do in fact work, and can potentially prevent fatal illness, so what is it you don't believe in about them?

I was wondering that too!

Also, where in the Bible does it say "Thou shalt not vaccinate"? What specifically is the religious objection? [Not trying to be combative, I've just never heard of that outside of faith healing believers.]

As for the Bible, as far as I know (I'm not particularly devout) it doesn't say crap all. Not sure about Mormons, but my very very Catholic family thinks that vaccinations "go against God" because it's introducing something foreign to your body. (So you can best believe that they take issue with me having tattoos and piercings.) I can't say that all Catholics believe that though. My mother finds that notion hilarious, but her sister sh-ts a brick about it.

For all of you who say you have your children vaccinated against most things, but not chicken pox, please reconsider, especially for girls! Like rubella/German measles, if a pregnant woman gets chicken pox it can cause birth defects. I was too old to get the chicken pox vaccine as a kid, but never caught it, so my gyno had me get vaccinated as an adult.

that is why chicken pox parties exist for kids in elementary school.

Great idea. Be sure they exchange email addys so they can schedule Let's-Celebrate-Our-Shingles parties when they're older.:drinker:

I personally have NEVER met a person that has had shingles. Just saying it is not very common. I was involved with chicken pox party as a kid so was my sister, wife, sister in law and parents/uncle/aunts. So i will let you know if any ever get shingles.

My mom got shingles in the middle of her chemo treatments. Last thing she needed. She said it was painful, and this from a woman who didn't accept freezing at the dentist. My husband's mom got it during a particularly stressful time in her life. Also said it was very painful. In fact, this thread is a good reminder to me to have a look at the shingles vaccine. Thanks.

My father and just recently my father-n-law have had the shingles.

I work in public health and am very VERY much pro-vaccine.

I also encourage people to get their flu shot, for several reasons. I know I'm probably banging my head against a brick wall here, but I have to try.

-Influenza is the only infectious disease (yes not even HIV/AIDS) that is in the top 10 causes of death in the USA.

-In 2010 over 50,000 people died due to Influenza or Pneumonia. That's not a couple of people.

-Even if you are young and healthy, flu can still kill you or cause lasting complications. H1N1 is a great example. H1N1 is more deadly in younger and healthier people BECAUSE they are healthier. It induces a cytokine storm response which can lead to Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome (ARDS) that even today 1/3 of people who have ARDS will die.

-I have a friend (I can even link to her story if you want it) that got H1N1. She went septic and by the time she was out of the hospital she had: lost both legs below the knees, partial amputations of all of her digits, a large thoracotomy scar, and numerous surgeries.

The problem is a lot of people will say they have the 'flu' when in reality, they probably don't, they just have a nasty cold.

Unless you are immunocompromised or extremely ill with chronic conditions THE FLU SHOT CANNOT GIVE YOU THE FLU. The vaccines contain inactivated (non-infectious) viruses or in some cases don't contain the virus (microbial DNA). The mild fever you MAY get shortly after the vaccine is a side effect.

But! I ALWAYS get the Flu when I get the Flu shot! One, make sure you ACTUALLY have the flu, you can get an antiretroviral for it (tamiflu). Second, the efficacy of the shot varies from year to year (usually it's in the 60% to 70% range) because vaccine manufacturers have to guess (by looking at the Southern Hemisphere) what viruses are going to be circulating and they don't always guess correctly. So if you do get the flu (and they will type your flu b/c it's reportable to the state and Feds) you most likely were 1) exposed to the virus before you were vaccinated and 2) you contracted a strain that wasn't in the vaccine.

I'm not very good at checking back on threads so if you have a question feel free to send me a message.

"...It's disturbing how these viruses were allowed to mingle. But I wouldn't call it a violation of public trust because the vaccine was not for public use. It was sent to research labs for further testing where it killed the ferrets. The process WORKED, the problem was caught and the public was safe. There are many, many steps before the flu vaccine is ready for market and here the mistake was caught..."



This time. It should be remembered that, in the case of influenza vaccine, time is of the essence and flu vaccines are often rushed to market before being fully tested. Also, in the case of the Baxter incident, experts are demanding to know how the contamination occurred because:

"...The shocking answer is that this couldn’t have been an accident. Why? Because Baxter International adheres to something called BSL3(Biosafety Level 3) – a set of laboratory safety protocols that prevent the cross-contamination of materials. As explained on Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Biosaf…):

'Laboratory personnel have specific training in handling pathogenic and potentially lethal agents, and are supervised by competent scientists who are experienced in working with these agents. This is considered a neutral or warm zone. All procedures involving the manipulation of infectious materials are conducted within biological safety cabinets or other physical containment devices, or by personnel wearing appropriate personal protective clothing and equipment. The laboratory has special engineering and design features..' ”

I work in public health and am very VERY much pro-vaccine.

I also encourage people to get their flu shot, for several reasons. I know I'm probably banging my head against a brick wall here, but I have to try.

-Influenza is the only infectious disease (yes not even HIV/AIDS) that is in the top 10 causes of death in the USA.

-In 2010 over 50,000 people died due to Influenza or Pneumonia. That's not a couple of people.

-Even if you are young and healthy, flu can still kill you or cause lasting complications. H1N1 is a great example. H1N1 is more deadly in younger and healthier people BECAUSE they are healthier. It induces a cytokine storm response which can lead to Acute Respiratory Distress Syndrome (ARDS) that even today 1/3 of people who have ARDS will die.

-I have a friend (I can even link to her story if you want it) that got H1N1. She went septic and by the time she was out of the hospital she had: lost both legs below the knees, partial amputations of all of her digits, a large thoracotomy scar, and numerous surgeries.

The problem is a lot of people will say they have the 'flu' when in reality, they probably don't, they just have a nasty cold.

Unless you are immunocompromised or extremely ill with chronic conditions THE FLU SHOT CANNOT GIVE YOU THE FLU. The vaccines contain inactivated (non-infectious) viruses or in some cases don't contain the virus (microbial DNA). The mild fever you MAY get shortly after the vaccine is a side effect.

But! I ALWAYS get the Flu when I get the Flu shot! One, make sure you ACTUALLY have the flu, you can get an antiretroviral for it (tamiflu). Second, the efficacy of the shot varies from year to year (usually it's in the 60% to 70% range) because vaccine manufacturers have to guess (by looking at the Southern Hemisphere) what viruses are going to be circulating and they don't always guess correctly. So if you do get the flu (and they will type your flu b/c it's reportable to the state and Feds) you most likely were 1) exposed to the virus before you were vaccinated and 2) you contracted a strain that wasn't in the vaccine.

I'm not very good at checking back on threads so if you have a question feel free to send me a message.

The flu shot that you get from Bayer or Baxter Pharmaceutical could be laced with avian flu (60% kill rate) or HIV. Both of which has happened recently. Read about it in my post above.

ETA: Also, cytokine storm is likely caused by a vitamin D deficiency. Vitamin D down-regulates an over-active immune response.

p.s. Tamiflu is a very bad drug BUT it made certain people a LOT richer. Most knowledgeable docs won't even give it to anyone.

Cytokine storm and vitamin D deficiency? While vitamin D does effect the immune system, it is highly unlikely to the point of preventing a cytokine storm (PS: one study =/= likely). Keep in mind the Spanish Flu pandemic started in the United States in August and September and reached its height in October.

The answer really lies in whether you want your children to attend public schools.

No federal vaccination laws exist, but all 50 states require certain vaccinations for children entering public schools. Depending on the state, children must be vaccinated against some or all of the following diseases: mumps, measles, rubella, diphtheria, pertussis, tetanus, and polio.

Many have sued the school system, none of those children are currently in public schools. I personally would never allow my child to associate with someone who has not been immunized.....not taking any chances with that.

The only thing regarding vaccines that I don't necessarily believe in would be the HPV/ Gardasil vaccine, but only because it's a relatively new vaccine and I don't believe that there's enough research done about it yet to rationalize getting it. Perhaps on that one I could or should do more research, and perhaps by the time I have a girl child (if I do) and she's old enough to get that particular vaccine there will be a lot more information available, but that would probably (hopefully) be at least 15 years from now.

Wrong wrong wrong. The HPV vaccine was already under development over 15 years ago. In order to be approved by the FDA, vaccines have to go through numerous levels of research. First, animal trials are done extensively. Then, trials are conducted with a small number of subjects. Phase 2 consists of clinical trials with a few hundred subjects, followed by Phase 3 with thousands of subjects. If the vaccine fails to show any efficacy or has harmful effects at any of those stages, it will not be approved. Because the vaccine (and it's competitor, Cervarix) were both approved by the FDA, we KNOW that they work and are safe.