50 Shades - Great, or the Greatest?

They would have to have 100% trust in their partner which most dont.

Haven't read it. Will probably end up seeing it when it comes out on Video with my wife and/or daughter. Will be uncomfortabele just like Magic Mike was.

As far as realism -- from the little I have heard of it, it's not real at all.

And as far as women who get all worked up over the concept, in real life, they are not ready for submission. They think so, but, when confronted with it, they shy away or want to set boundaries that they can't even begin to approach.

I love it when they can, but it is rare.

Are these women reading about it likely to encounter this type of situation in real life?

Minus the lead male being super rich and hot, very likely actually. And they equate his actions with love rather than obsession.

My point exactly. It's a fun fantasy, because he's super rich and hot. Take that out of the book and I doubt it would be popular at all.

Of course not. Because these women are turned on by the "rich and hot." But they don't seem to have the thinking capacity to realize that he's a psycho and these relationships often end in someone dying. They think the way he treats her is desirable, but they only think that because of his looks and wealth, yet can't seem to separate the two. They think stalking is romantic. Granted, that was something a lot of women thought even before this book, so I guess I shouldn't be so surprised.

It's frightening.

They think it's hot IF the guy is super sexy and rich, or IF he's a mysterious vampire. They would be filing charges if it was Joe from the gas station down the street. Yea, it's obnoxious, but I go back to my most people are stupid statement. My point is that the average woman reading and enjoying these books isn't going to go out and throw herself into an abusive relationship because THAT'S the part she finds hot. Taken out of the context of the fantasy, the behavior is no longer appealing.

Yes, it's Fantasy. Fantasy, people. People fantasize about all sorts of things that they will never actually do. IF someone wants to engage in BDSM activities then there are safe ways of doing that, but this is just a book, not a "how to" guide. I wholeheartedly agree with the criticism that it's poorly written drivel but I disagree with the criticism that it "encourages" or "promotes" abuse.

Or that it can only be read one way.

As an aside, as psychological and physical abuse go, I think "Story of O" is far worse. Of course, that was written in French and while criticized as being anti-feminist, it seems to be widely read and enjoyed in the BDSM "community" without the criticism that it isn't an example of SS&C.

Ever read Justine? Juliette by the M. de Sade? The characters there make Christian look like Mickey Mouse.

Stylistic weaknesses aside - the character development triangle between Elena, Christian and Ana could easily be borrowed from classic works like the Liaisons Dangerous. The author, like Laclos, works to maintain those tensions of lies, sexual betrayal and initiation.

And yet, for all the purported abusive relationship, perhaps it is the happy ending that upsets our readers in their protection of the "real BDSM lifestyle" - if the story had been more littered with corpses (which might not work for mommyporn) they might have kept in mind that it was a fictional construct.

The cries of "It's not the real deal!" will also be the subject of study; this mommyporn audience is voicing both a frustration of style and expectations of suburban standards of BSDM that must be "just so". Perhaps we can dig up Rudyard Kipling and ask him to deliver new volumes to Gothic sub-literature.

Are these women reading about it likely to encounter this type of situation in real life?

Minus the lead male being super rich and hot, very likely actually. And they equate his actions with love rather than obsession.

My point exactly. It's a fun fantasy, because he's super rich and hot. Take that out of the book and I doubt it would be popular at all.

Of course not. Because these women are turned on by the "rich and hot." But they don't seem to have the thinking capacity to realize that he's a psycho and these relationships often end in someone dying. They think the way he treats her is desirable, but they only think that because of his looks and wealth, yet can't seem to separate the two. They think stalking is romantic. Granted, that was something a lot of women thought even before this book, so I guess I shouldn't be so surprised.

It's frightening.

They think it's hot IF the guy is super sexy and rich, or IF he's a mysterious vampire. They would be filing charges if it was Joe from the gas station down the street. Yea, it's obnoxious, but I go back to my most people are stupid statement. My point is that the average woman reading and enjoying these books isn't going to go out and throw herself into an abusive relationship because THAT'S the part she finds hot. Taken out of the context of the fantasy, the behavior is no longer appealing.

Yes, it's Fantasy. Fantasy, people. People fantasize about all sorts of things that they will never actually do. IF someone wants to engage in BDSM activities then there are safe ways of doing that, but this is just a book, not a "how to" guide. I wholeheartedly agree with the criticism that it's poorly written drivel but I disagree with the criticism that it "encourages" or "promotes" abuse.

Or that it can only be read one way.

As an aside, as psychological and physical abuse go, I think "Story of O" is far worse. Of course, that was written in French and while criticized as being anti-feminist, it seems to be widely read and enjoyed in the BDSM "community" without the criticism that it isn't an example of SS&C.

Ever read Justine? Juliette by the M. de Sade? The characters there make Christian look like Mickey Mouse.

Stylistic weaknesses aside - the character development triangle between Elena, Christian and Ana could easily be borrowed from classic works like the Liaisons Dangerous. The author, like Laclos, works to maintain those tensions of lies, sexual betrayal and initiation.

And yet, for all the purported abusive relationship, perhaps it is the happy ending that upsets our readers in their protection of the "real BDSM lifestyle" - if the story had been more littered with corpses (which might not work for mommyporn) they might have kept in mind that it was a fictional construct.

The cries of "It's not the real deal!" will also be the subject of study; this mommyporn audience is voicing both a frustration of style and expectations of suburban standards of BSDM that must be "just so". Perhaps we can dig up Rudyard Kipling and ask him to deliver new volumes to Gothic sub-literature.

You know, I used to think that Sade was a wack job. Then I read Balzac and realized that 1) English Novels of the same period of time followed tight conventions and 2) the French are insane.

God - there's an idea. Maybe I could just modernize some of the old French stuff and make a mint?

http://www.lifesitenews.com/blogs/to-the-christians-who-think-50-shades-is-all-sorts-of-awesome-please-stop-a

A site that's into burning books. What idiocy.

Oh, god. I'd been avoiding them. So silly. Not Tess...Fanny Hall. They should have learned from the history of the genre and put a moralistic warning message on the frontplate and made everybody happy.

I'm sorry, but I found the books horribly written and stupid, as well as promoting an abusive relationship.

I have no intention of seeing the film.

This.

I read them but only because I made the mistake of buying them as a set and felt obligated. The story line was ridiculous, the dialogue trite, and I hit a point where I was so numb to the sex I just began skipping those parts.

I'll fess up: I'm jealous.

I want to make a buttload of money from writing badly.

^The Dame speaks the truth! :drinker:

OP - my choice is Great or the greatest? Can I have another option because, meh!!

50 Shades - not so good... When the hype started and every where I went there was a women reading the book (dentist office, radiologist office) - I thought why not give it a read - but no way was I going to waste $ on it - borrowed it from the library...as it turned out either I read a extremely similar series or had read these way before the hype started.

I wasn't impressed at all. Have read far better erotica. It left me bored and far from hungering for sex...

Horrible! Try the Anne Rice Beauty series, much better

I think she's brilliantly navigating the conventions of the romance genre, incorporating everything from "prince in rags" to Cosmo. I'm halfway through and this thing has settled down to nothing better than Georgette Heyer's Black Moth...which is my second favorite after Cotillion.

Except for a sword fight.

This thing desperately needs a duel.

"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence and fulfills the duty to express the results of his thoughts in clear form."
--Alfred Einstein

It really is some pretty decent sex, no?

"Great spirits have always found violent opposition from mediocre minds. The latter cannot understand it when a man does not thoughtlessly submit to hereditary prejudices but honestly and courageously uses his intelligence and fulfills the duty to express the results of his thoughts in clear form."
--Alfred Einstein

It really is some pretty decent sex, no?

I think we are actually witnessing the rebirth of the Gothic novel with stylistic elements not dissimilar to the 18th Century "Les Bijoux indiscrets".

It's not really that far off from modern erotic/romance writing. What she does is sell us some pretty standard non-missionary sex by starting at "anything goes" and dialing it down fast. My friends who actually do BSDM were uninspired by the sexuality. Three Muskateers easily tops it in terms of twisted sexuality.

The real craft was in selling the standard formula. I mean, the heroine is a virgin. I don't think anybody's been able to do that believably since 1980.

I think she's brilliantly navigating the conventions of the romance genre, incorporating everything from "prince in rags" to Cosmo. I'm halfway through and this thing has settled down to nothing better than Georgette Heyer's Black Moth...which is my second favorite after Cotillion.

Except for a sword fight.

This thing desperately needs a duel.

Why can't I keep my hack fiction straight? It's Devil's Cub. Ah. Dominic.