Relatively light people trying to get leaner

Hi, I have not quite finished reading the whole thread, it is great with lots of good advice, I also wanted to ask some advise.

4 years ago I was just under 9 stone (I am 5'7), I then started training for a marathon and stopped being careful with food as I thought 'I run therefore can eat what I want'. Over the last 4 years I gradually put on around 1.5stone, I have recently lost 1/2stone.

My weightloss has not been that fast as I have not bee v discliplined with my food. I have been having about 1500-1800 cal a day but think I fall into that under reporting catagory.

I have been injured so not been running much recently, instead I have been going to the gym for 1-2hours per day doing a lot of carido to make up for not running (I normally run about 60miles a week and do a lot of marathons/ultra marathons).

My main reason for losing weight is to get faster at running but I also want to rid the flabby bits which have grown! As well as runing I do body pump twice a week but no longer lift weights in the gym.

To achive my goal I know i need to get better control of my eating but should I ditch the body pump in favour of heavier weights in the gym?

Do you mind me asking what was injured? I ask simply b/c almost invariably the women I encounter who log serious running mileage wind up hurt. There's a camp of industry experts who actually believe most women shouldn't run long distance due to their biomechanics and anatomy. Women are wide hipped in general which can create problems at their narrower knees when exposed to repetitive impact from running. Research calls this the Q Angle. Of course there are exceptions to the rule - most females who excel at running don't have large hip-to-knee angles as they're generally built more like a man - no offense intended. It's just that they typically don't have the curvy/wide hips.

Which is why I was wondering about your injury.

Regarding your question, bodypump for most will stand as another form of cardio. Of course for rank novices it can provide adequate overload to enhance strength and muscle. But that will be short lived. In my experience, it's much more effective to program the different attributes (strength, hypertrophy, power, endurance, etc) separately. When you throw them all into one session, there's a watering down effect.

And in truth, I've never been a fan of strength training cardio, if that's what you want to call it. At it's core, lifting weights is built on proper form. Well guess what. Cardio makes you tired. And when people become fatigued, generally speaking, form goes out the window. Thus, it's unnecessarily risky if you ask me, especially when there are more efficient ways of getting stronger and growing muscle.

BodyPump might be a great entry for some people as it's comfortable for them... they're too afraid of the weight room. But beyond that, I think there are much more optimal ways of going about things.

@strout I know you've probably done this several times for people on here but I was wondering if you could help me with my calories. Just like everyone else has said, MFP sets me at 1200/day. My stats are below

Height: 5'8
Age: 25
Weight: 142
Goal Weight (I was at this previously before I started a desk job): 134
Body fat %: 20

What's your exercise like? And what's your lifestyle like?

Should I be eating more? Also, what are your thoughts on eating your exercise calories? Normally if I exercise off 500 calories I eat those back in order to net 1200. I typically exercise 4 days/week for an hour. I used to do only cardio but have begun adding in weights.

Thanks SO much in advance!

Read this thread:

http://www.myfitnesspal.com/topics/show/173853-an-objective-look-at-eating-exercise-calories

I have a desk job from 8-6 everyday but then most days of the week (usually 5 or 6 if I'm good) I hit the gym. I do spring intervals for about 50 minutes (run at 7.5 mph for 2 minutes, then walk at 4 mph for 1 minute) and then I do a bit of weight (2 sets of 15 lunges on each leg, 3 rounds of arm reps with 5 lb weights, ab twists and sit ups).

I'm also trying to eat a lot of protein and don't eat hardly any bread or pasta because i'm borderline gluten intolerant.

I'd probably put you at 1400-1500 cals per day given that. That's where I'd start at least. But if you've been chronically eating 1200 calories I certainly wouldn't jump right up to that. Maybe add 100 calories every week or so until you're there.

More importantly, what has your progress been? You shouldn't be trying to fix something that "ain't broke."

great thread with lots of great info! Im about 5lbs off my goal! But i cant seem to make the last stretch...starting to wonder if I am being unrealistic in my goal. Im around 10% BF and I want to get to 8%. Dig deep for a couple of weeks or adjust goal.

Looking good man.

That's really your call. What I'd be asking is this: "Why do I want to lose these last 5 lbs?" If it's just to say you did it and reach that level of leanness once in your life... so be it. But for most, it's probably not sustainable so some folks simply won't try and reach it. I wouldn't personally. I don't put a big premium on leanness - at least not that level of leanness. But I'm also married with a kid and don't have a large incentive to be extremely lean. Single guys, I can understand a bit more.

Life's all about compromises. For the genetically gifted, they can rock your leanness and below year round with no trouble. For others though, including myself, the trade off would be miserableness. Which is something I'm not willing to trade for.

That said, if it's something you want to hit, I'd be looking at some sort of cyclical diet where I'm doing once or twice per week refeeds. Do you have any knowledge with this?

Hi! After reading through the thread I am convinced it is time for me to start lifting. I am 39 year old female and am sedentary. I exercise very little (jog 3x week for 30 min with my baby in a jogger-just for the shear enjoyment)

I have almost reached my goal weight of 116lbs (I'm 5'4" with a very small frame) This is my prepregnancy weight.

So my question is; are there any good videos to follow that can help me with weight training. I do NOT want one that combines cardio with weights. Going to a gym is not an option nor is hiring a PT. We do own free weights, a bench and adjustable dumbells. I'm just at a loss, as far as, where do I start :-/

While I'm not a fan of it, p90x is probably the only thing out there that does the actual program of strength training on video. And the reason they're the only ones is because in my opinion, strength training can't be treated like conditioning. We've all of these cardio dvds on the market and that's fine for fat loss. Not so great for true conditioning for sports, in my opinion, but that's besides the point. Strength training is like conditioning for sports. You need to tailor it to the individual.

Did you read my resistance training articles I linked to on I believe the previous page?

Haha, okay...

I'm biased. I think pretty much everyone should be strength training. Why? Because in my experience, to reach the physical goals that most have, they're not going to be able to attain them without it save for a very select group of genetically superior folks.

So yea, I think it's important and you should be doing it. Not just for the physique stuff.... but it's great for overall health and function as well.

Doing loads of pushups, situps and crunches aren't going to be the answer. And you're only working your beach muscles. You're neglecting a lot of muscle which, in time, can lead to a number of nagging injuries. Strength training should be balanced or if anything, have more pulling than pushing exercises since we live in an "anterior-dominant" world, meaning everything is in front of us.

Should you clean up your diet? I can't really answer that. I eat a bunch of crap I'm sure others here wouldn't dare. I'm not some clean food nazi, that's for dang sure. If you're moving towards your goals, my gut would say don't muddy the waters until you have to. But I do make sure I'm getting adequate amounts of essentials like protein, healthy fats, fruits and veggies.

I planned on increasing the weight wednesday night, but with your advise I will do it tonight. I think I'll follow the same workout plan, but with the increased weight (40 lbs bicep curl and test to find a dumbbell press weight) move back to week 1.

Strength training is why I started doing the workout, as before I was only doing the spin class. I am going to start including back exercises tonight as I have started having some lower back pain (strained lower back muscles). I know I should have a balanced workout, which is why I also started doing to bicep curls (not part of the website, just following the pushup plan), but what else should I do?

Also, my bicep curls are not those sitting, elbow on knee, staring at the weight curls. I am standing and let my arms move freely; I feel a lot more muscles working this way.
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Personally I wouldn't worry about bicep curls. If you do, throw them then at the end. My primary concerns when picking exercises are:

quad dominant leg exercises like goblet squats, barbell squats, front squats, leg presses, step ups, lunge variations, etc.

glute/hamstring dominant exercises like conventional deadlifts, rack pulls, trap bar deads, dumbbell suitcase deads, barbell hip thrusts, pull throughs, etc

pulling exercises like barbell rows, pendlay rows, dumbbell rows (single arm, double arm, head supported, etc), inverted rows, pullups, cable rows, pulldowns, trap raises, etc.

pushing exercises like barbell or dumbbell bench press at varying angles, pushups, overhead press, push press, etc.

You focus on these big movements and your arms will get plenty of work. Be sure to read the posts I've made over the last few pages regarding program design.

thanks for the great advice, motivation is power to weight ratio - i do a little bike racing to keep me busy and the lighter you are the less energy it takes to go as fast, particularly uphill ;-) Every time Im able to get under 170 I just cant seem to hold it. Alot of what you have written has given me motivation to look at my goals in a new light!

married 10 years wtih 4 boys so I am not worried about leaning out for the ladies, just my lady :-) No idea what a refeed is but im a master googler and will try to educate myself.

Thanks again!

Biologically our bodies simply don't want to be extremely lean. Save for drugs and freaky genetics, most people are fighting a losing battle trying to maintain sub 10% (for men) levels year round. Of course there are exceptions... the folks who are extremely driven and take an almost psychotic approach can beat out their genetic proclivity to survive. But at the end of the day, most aren't going to be able to make the necessary compromises.

That said, I get where you're coming from on the performance end of things. Do you feel your training is optimized on the conditioning and strength fronts for bike racing? If not, I wonder what would give you more bang for your buck... improved "fitness" or losing another 5 lbs?

Regarding refeeds, they're structured periods of overfeeding where fat intake is minimized, protein is held constant, and particular carbs are consumed in large quantities. And it's just not more carbs. It's more of the right carbs. Fructose and sucrose should be limited, for the most part.

There are various reasons for doing this but suffice it so say that the primary one is to offset some of the metabolic adaptation that's associated with dieting - especially at lean levels. They can also help with partitioning (where calories are coming from and going to). Frequency and length of refeeds vary due to fat mass, diet, training, etc.

This is refeeds the birds eye view.