Very low calorie diets and metabolic damage

ThereAreFour;

Since pretty much EVERY "myth", "wives tale", and closed minded opinion of what "everybody knows", has already been demonstrated in this thread, I'll assume that the arrival of the pitchforks in response to your "phentermine" comments - is imminent.

...., and I was prescribed an appetite suppressant, Phentermine or I would have fell victim to cravings and binge eating without the help of modern medicine. (snipped for brevity)
Without the appetite suppressant I don't know how anyone could possibly do a VLCD, especially when most morbidly obese individuals have a distorted relationship with food.

"But, but, but, you KNOW that phentermine was half of Phen-Fen and that was PULLED by the FDA before it KILLED more people, long ago".

Yup, it was (both a component of PhenFen, and PhenFen WAS "pulled".
BUT, it was also demonstrated in clinical studies that the "FEN" portion was what caused the problems NOT the Phen.

Lack of knowledge, combined with an insatiable desire to post dogma, is the result.

This drug eliminated my food cravings, the fatigue and headaches associated with dieting. It makes me more likely to make the right choices now and hopefully I will be able to continue making good choices after I am finished with the medication.

Hunger is reduced and nearly eliminated with Phentermine, as an FDA approved appetite suppressant only available by prescription from a medical doctor.

All that you say is true, but so too is it virtually guaranteed that it bring out the legions of "I'd never put any chemical in my body...", "...all you need is willpower...", or "I did it without drugs, why can't you", holier than thou's.

Ignore the lunacy of someone currently taking medication for their hypertension or diabetes joining in the "chemicals?, NEVER" chants.
Ignore the "...willpower" true believers who have a problem explaining why a third of the US population (and more in other countries) are clinically "obese" if all it took was "willpower" (are they ALL, willpower "challenged"?).
And ignore the fact that, were it not for "chemicals", and many of the other advances that Science has introduced to medicine, the astounding increases in longevity and quality of life we have witnessed over the last decades would likely never have occurred.

I decided to take full advantage of my time on this drug by doing something that would have been impossible for me without it. I restricted my diet to eight hundred calories a day. Something I could not do normally due to fatigue, cravings, headaches and I love to eat. The Phentermine is a tool to kick start your weight loss and assist you, but you must do the heavy lifting.

My prior comments notwithstanding, and despite recognizing the successes you have achieved, I still cannot "endorse" or let your comments (regarding Phen) stand (at least) un-discussed or unchallenged and perceived of as the "way to go" for those who have made the decision to include a prescription medication as part of their weight loss program.

BUT, NOT for the reasons the pitchforks will proclaim as gospel, and especially not for the reasons (?) those spouting "we don't talk about that here" closed minded nonsense.

Rather because, Phentermine (like almost ALL other meds) does have "side-effects" of its own, it's a relatively "old" drug (generic), it is an appetite "suppressant" but it is also a "stimulant" and carries with it many of the negative, long term, effects on the heart that are common to all stimulants.

"Old" doesn't necessarily mean "bad" (trust me, I know). In fact, some would cite the fact that having been around for so many years is a benefit in that we have a long history of experience with it. BUT, in the interim, Science (and documented research) has produced a number of "new" pharmaceuticals and at least in the case of one of these, a completely new "discovery" based on specific brain receptors responsible for the body's innate "hunger" feelings and cravings.

As a result of the "Fen-Phen" fiasco (and completely understandable reaction of Docs and the general public alike) there were NO new "diet drugs" approved by the FDA/DEA for a period of (I think) 13 years. But, during that 13 hiatus, research continued and medical science "marched on" in its quest for the "magic bullet" - a safe and effective "diet pill" that society has craved since who knows when.

One can debate whether their quest truly was in the interest of scientific knowledge for its own sake, the "greater good", or the corporate profits bound to be generated by discovering and marketing the "magic pill". In the end, it's likely all three were involved but it's the results that actually "matter" to those of us interested as "end users".

Approximately two years ago, two new drugs gained FDA approval, coincidentally within weeks of each other.

But that's about the only thing the two have in common.
One, "qysemia" was simply a new "combo" of two existing (and then generic) drugs (as was Phen-Fen). Since both components had been previously approved by the FDA (and since the "combo" was already being prescribed "off label" by a number of docs) the clinical studies were limited to the specifics of the combo itself and DEA "labeling" concerns were pretty much known.
The one "major" difference between the new combo and those being used "off label" involved a "time release" quality incorporated in the drug design.

The second drug "lorcaserin/Belviq" is an entirely new discovery with its modus based on previously unknown characteristics of the human brain receptors involved in the "hunger" responses they communicate. The clinical studies required over 8 years, multiple phases with study participants in the thousands and studies designed to include specific "target" groups including diabetics. FDA required redesign and repeating of some of the studies when initial results were rejected due to questions raised that could not be totally answered due to the prior study protocols and design. Upon final FDA approval a total of over 8000 participants and more than 8 years of clinical study data had been incorporated and all of that subsequent to the initial "lab" time involved in actually "discovering" the newly identified knowledge on which it is all based.

I know it probably sounds like I'm a "shill" for Belviq and to some extent I guess I am although I prefer the term "advocate".
I am, however, in no way connected to either the company that discovered and now produces the drug, nor the company that markets it. I have been "watching" the progress fairly closely out of intellectual curiosity since before the initial application for FDA approval was submitted and have, at various times held a (small) position in the stock (which, overall, resulted in a net "loss").
I am also personally acquainted with a few individuals that were trial participants, and a number of current (and past) "end users" - ALL (with a couple of exceptions) who have had positive results and positive experiences with the medication.

I tell you all of this, not in anticipation (let alone "hope") that either of us are likely to even mute the tone of the pitchfork contingent, or in an attempt to "convince" anyone that medication is a required component of a successful "diet" plan - it most certainly IS NOT.

It is; however, my "hope" that for those considering it as a "possible" alternative to what has not worked for them in the past (for whatever reasons) will AT LEAST research the available options, consult with their physicians, and determine for THEMSELVES

Well I haven't read the whole tread but enough to know that I just might get nailed to a tree and flogged because I was on a vlcd 600calorie diet.

The first 10 days were quite difficult. Bad head ache and serious mood swings but after that it was easy enough. Social occasions can be auckward because well you can't eat and if you drink alcohol even in limited amounts you can pass out easily. I found that one out the hard way.

Does it work, yes. Is it a long term solution, no. Will you put the weight back on, likely.

In my case I put some back. First is the glycogen, but then if you go low carb the same thing happens when you give it up. That can add up to quite a bit. You haven't ate regular food in a while so it's like a child that's been set free in a candy store.

Lucily, in my case. Once I got to a manageable weight I dumped all my old cloths. I was determined to never go back the way I came. I did go back but only as far as my new trousers would let me. Me and those pants had many a struggle but in the end the pants won.

I decided the way forward was a healthy lifestyle rather than starvation and I'm healthier and happier for it.

Would I be where I am now without going vlcd? We will never know but in my heart I don't think so. Not that I would advocate vlcd, after all it did cost me a gawl bladder. Or maybe the years of abusing my body did that, again we may never know for sure.

What interests me is the talk of vlcd killing your motabolism. Just wondering if mine is dead? If it is how do I know. I mean no one has sent any flowers or anything. Maybe I was away that day and no one told me. Maybe it hasn't happened yet. I'll let you know if I find that one out.

So now I guess I'm a social lepper? I have one friend on my list at the moment but stay tuned. I'll let you know if I get dumped.

As my fav comedian used to say "May you'er god go with you"

For the life of me I don't know why anyone would try to eat next to nothing for days and days. it's just not necessary and it's not sustainable.

Equally why would anyone consume double or triple there bodies requirement. Is that necessary or sustainable?

I used to eat a little bit all the time and I found that I was never really full. And then over time my choices got bad. A few chocolate-covered almonds here, a mini Snickers there. Hey, it was just a bite - what harm could it do? Except it was just a bite of crap food every 30-60 minutes! And then the cravings start as they always do when my diet gets too high in sugar.

I've been trying to do the opposite: eat some really nice meals of a good size that make me feel FULL rather than just knock the edge off my hunger. I find, when I do that, I'm not hungry again for hours instead of wanting to snack again 30 minutes later.

Also, I am always reading about how whole grains keep you full longer. I think they do keep you full longer than processed grains. But not longer than proteins and fat. All carbs break down into simple sugars in the end even whole grains. I avoid them, myself.

CrossFit definitely needs to be modified if doing a VLCD. An intense workout with a very low energy index can tax the adrenal glands and cause them to go into failure. No Bueno. You definitely need more calories.