Body Positive or Promoting an unhealthy lifestyle
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Some people are larger and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are larger and have unhealthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have unhealthy lifestyles.
Size is not the best indicator of health or healthy lifestyle.
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msjessicamccoy wrote: »Some people are larger and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are larger and have unhealthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have unhealthy lifestyles.
Size is not the best indicator of health or healthy lifestyle.
To a certain extent.0 -
Lourdesong wrote: »Woman Within is one of the most amusing plus size companies I've seen. Not only do they do the most absurd vanity sizing I've ever come across, the models they use are so slim that the clothes are baggy as heck on them, like they belong on someone 75 lbs heavier.
Yet, they're a very popular plus size clothing retailer despite this.
I touched on this in an earlier post...but I really think thin-looking "plus size" models are part of the appeal for many women shopping plus.
I think some women look at those catalogs and others, thinking "well this woman is all proportional and lovely, but she's plus sized" and they aspire to be like that as well. They may naively imagine that's what the slightly smaller sizes like 12-14 look like (assuming they wear larger plus sizes) - I honestly thought that myself for years. I'm sure part of it is also imagining that the clothes' clever designs are really working to disguise "flaws" and unwanted extra pounds.
Is that a little nuts? Of course. Denial plays a huge role. But also, I think most of us have our favorite body parts and not so favorite, regardless of weight. As silly & shallow as it sounds when I'd see photos of plus size models who were truly plus size, even though they might weigh the same as I did, I couldn't help but think "yes but my arms are not quite like that thank goodness" and other ridiculous judgy thoughts. I think for some, seeing clothes on a regular everyday person is more disturbing than seeing them on a thin model and while that may be sad, it's one of the MAJOR reasons you don't see more truly plus models...yet?
Target has a new plus line coming out and I noticed some of the models are very much outside the norm. I looked at the photos and part of me was like "that looks fantastic" while another part of me was thinking "hmmm they are not going to sell skinny jeans to a plus sized teenager when they're on someone who looks (to their eye) like their dowdy History teacher".
http://www.refinery29.com/2015/01/81102/target-plus-size-lookbook-ava-viv#slide
Advertising/marketing is all about fantasy and that is going to take a lot to completely change.
Just my thoughts.
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MireyGal76 wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »
Big people shouldn't be relegated to wearing tarps because the current market doesn't "like" the way they look!
Or America could follow other country leads and make it hard to find clothes above a size 14 or 16. That way, people might be a bit more motivated to lose weight, if they actually had to wear tarps because they are too big.
I don't think it's ok to give the message that you can be morbidly obese like that woman and that it's ok. It's just not ok. And no, I don't like skinny models either, but at least they are 20-30 pounds from a normal weight... not 200+.
So...what... we endeavor to make them feel like crap so that they'll lose weight? You think that will motivate the masses?
Getting healthy is hard work. Losing weight is hard work. You need to invest in yourself in order to make a change that is worth changing. That does not work well with self hatred. Do you think someone in a tarp is going to want to go work out? Do you think they will be able to hold their head high if nothing fits?
Example:
I'm not overweight, I'm at goal weight actually... but I am tall. Very tall (6'1"). And when nothing I try on fits me, I get upset, and angry, and frustrated, and I don't wanna go out. I feel like a mutant and I'm embarrassed.
I have long legs (37" inseam). I have long arms. I have a long torso. Dresses don't fit well. Long sleeve shirts don't fit well. NOTHING fits well, unless I buy from a tall store. But if my clothes don't fit me... I AM MISERABLE. I don't want to go to work. I feel uncomfortable there because I feel like people are staring. And by the end of the day, I am demotivated. I just wanna go home and flop down on the couch.
Being overweight and being tall are very different, I get that. But if my clothes impact me that strongly, how much more so will someone who has too much weight feel EVEN IF THEY'RE TRYING TO LOSE IT?
But hey... if we shame them into hiding... at least we don't have to look at them, right? /sarcasm
I'm not talking about shaming at all. I'm talking about awareness. When you grow up in a place where you just can't find clothes over a size 14, it's a totally different mentality, and it's easier to get back on track when your size 12 clothes get snug and you know you're running out of options, than when you're a size 22 and it's so easy to find clothes for your size, or the next size up and that being overweight is so easily accepted as normal.
But it's true that we are WAY past that in this country (and a lot of other countries, really). So, probably a moot point.
And I do agree that it's a nice change to see a woman who is actually a plus size modeling clothes. I'm just not sure if it's going to do any good, especially as, well, she didn't exactly pick the most flattering outfits to model.0 -
honkytonks85 wrote: »What always gets me is the assumption that being big = unhealthy lifestyle and being slim = healthy lifestyle. Not really the case. It is possible to be overweight and still be healthy. It is possible to be slim and be unhealthy.
thank you for your comment honkytonks. I have many friends who are ideal weight and have just as many health issues as I do.0 -
MireyGal76 wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »
Big people shouldn't be relegated to wearing tarps because the current market doesn't "like" the way they look!
Or America could follow other country leads and make it hard to find clothes above a size 14 or 16. That way, people might be a bit more motivated to lose weight, if they actually had to wear tarps because they are too big.
I don't think it's ok to give the message that you can be morbidly obese like that woman and that it's ok. It's just not ok. And no, I don't like skinny models either, but at least they are 20-30 pounds from a normal weight... not 200+.
So...what... we endeavor to make them feel like crap so that they'll lose weight? You think that will motivate the masses?
Getting healthy is hard work. Losing weight is hard work. You need to invest in yourself in order to make a change that is worth changing. That does not work well with self hatred. Do you think someone in a tarp is going to want to go work out? Do you think they will be able to hold their head high if nothing fits?
Example:
I'm not overweight, I'm at goal weight actually... but I am tall. Very tall (6'1"). And when nothing I try on fits me, I get upset, and angry, and frustrated, and I don't wanna go out. I feel like a mutant and I'm embarrassed.
I have long legs (37" inseam). I have long arms. I have a long torso. Dresses don't fit well. Long sleeve shirts don't fit well. NOTHING fits well, unless I buy from a tall store. But if my clothes don't fit me... I AM MISERABLE. I don't want to go to work. I feel uncomfortable there because I feel like people are staring. And by the end of the day, I am demotivated. I just wanna go home and flop down on the couch.
Being overweight and being tall are very different, I get that. But if my clothes impact me that strongly, how much more so will someone who has too much weight feel EVEN IF THEY'RE TRYING TO LOSE IT?
But hey... if we shame them into hiding... at least we don't have to look at them, right? /sarcasm
I'm not talking about shaming at all. I'm talking about awareness. When you grow up in a place where you just can't find clothes over a size 14, it's a totally different mentality, and it's easier to get back on track when your size 12 clothes get snug and you know you're running out of options, than when you're a size 22 and it's so easy to find clothes for your size, or the next size up and that being overweight is so easily accepted as normal.
But it's true that we are WAY past that in this country (and a lot of other countries, really). So, probably a moot point.
And I do agree that it's a nice change to see a woman who is actually a plus size modeling clothes. I'm just not sure if it's going to do any good, especially as, well, she didn't exactly pick the most flattering outfits to model.
why does she have to wear clothing that YOU deem appropriate for her body?
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lemurcat12 wrote: »WillLift4Tats wrote: »But can't you agree that for a significant percent of the female population, this is true? I am sure I can find some past studies that back this up.
No, and none of the studies I've ever seen were convincing at all. It's just not consistent with my understanding of human nature and something that rather bugs me when pushed as a feminist issue (and I'm a feminist, I just don't think that skinny models are really the issue). In particular with something like anorexia the evidence seems to be that it predates current fashion norms and the tendency is probably more biological, from what I've read.
But I'm sorry to have brought this off topic, so will drop it now.
I must disagree. There are plenty of studies to back this up. Not to say ads/models are the sole factor, not at all. They do play a part in some young adults, not just young women.
And to speak to Virgoddess, yes I completely agree that this starts at home with good modeling (no pun intended)0 -
salembambi wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »
Big people shouldn't be relegated to wearing tarps because the current market doesn't "like" the way they look!
Or America could follow other country leads and make it hard to find clothes above a size 14 or 16. That way, people might be a bit more motivated to lose weight, if they actually had to wear tarps because they are too big.
I don't think it's ok to give the message that you can be morbidly obese like that woman and that it's ok. It's just not ok. And no, I don't like skinny models either, but at least they are 20-30 pounds from a normal weight... not 200+.
So...what... we endeavor to make them feel like crap so that they'll lose weight? You think that will motivate the masses?
Getting healthy is hard work. Losing weight is hard work. You need to invest in yourself in order to make a change that is worth changing. That does not work well with self hatred. Do you think someone in a tarp is going to want to go work out? Do you think they will be able to hold their head high if nothing fits?
Example:
I'm not overweight, I'm at goal weight actually... but I am tall. Very tall (6'1"). And when nothing I try on fits me, I get upset, and angry, and frustrated, and I don't wanna go out. I feel like a mutant and I'm embarrassed.
I have long legs (37" inseam). I have long arms. I have a long torso. Dresses don't fit well. Long sleeve shirts don't fit well. NOTHING fits well, unless I buy from a tall store. But if my clothes don't fit me... I AM MISERABLE. I don't want to go to work. I feel uncomfortable there because I feel like people are staring. And by the end of the day, I am demotivated. I just wanna go home and flop down on the couch.
Being overweight and being tall are very different, I get that. But if my clothes impact me that strongly, how much more so will someone who has too much weight feel EVEN IF THEY'RE TRYING TO LOSE IT?
But hey... if we shame them into hiding... at least we don't have to look at them, right? /sarcasm
I'm not talking about shaming at all. I'm talking about awareness. When you grow up in a place where you just can't find clothes over a size 14, it's a totally different mentality, and it's easier to get back on track when your size 12 clothes get snug and you know you're running out of options, than when you're a size 22 and it's so easy to find clothes for your size, or the next size up and that being overweight is so easily accepted as normal.
But it's true that we are WAY past that in this country (and a lot of other countries, really). So, probably a moot point.
And I do agree that it's a nice change to see a woman who is actually a plus size modeling clothes. I'm just not sure if it's going to do any good, especially as, well, she didn't exactly pick the most flattering outfits to model.
why does she have to wear clothing that YOU deem appropriate for her body?
*shrug* whatever floats people's boats.0 -
MireyGal76 wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »
Big people shouldn't be relegated to wearing tarps because the current market doesn't "like" the way they look!
Or America could follow other country leads and make it hard to find clothes above a size 14 or 16. That way, people might be a bit more motivated to lose weight, if they actually had to wear tarps because they are too big.
I don't think it's ok to give the message that you can be morbidly obese like that woman and that it's ok. It's just not ok. And no, I don't like skinny models either, but at least they are 20-30 pounds from a normal weight... not 200+.
So...what... we endeavor to make them feel like crap so that they'll lose weight? You think that will motivate the masses?
Getting healthy is hard work. Losing weight is hard work. You need to invest in yourself in order to make a change that is worth changing. That does not work well with self hatred. Do you think someone in a tarp is going to want to go work out? Do you think they will be able to hold their head high if nothing fits?
Example:
I'm not overweight, I'm at goal weight actually... but I am tall. Very tall (6'1"). And when nothing I try on fits me, I get upset, and angry, and frustrated, and I don't wanna go out. I feel like a mutant and I'm embarrassed.
I have long legs (37" inseam). I have long arms. I have a long torso. Dresses don't fit well. Long sleeve shirts don't fit well. NOTHING fits well, unless I buy from a tall store. But if my clothes don't fit me... I AM MISERABLE. I don't want to go to work. I feel uncomfortable there because I feel like people are staring. And by the end of the day, I am demotivated. I just wanna go home and flop down on the couch.
Being overweight and being tall are very different, I get that. But if my clothes impact me that strongly, how much more so will someone who has too much weight feel EVEN IF THEY'RE TRYING TO LOSE IT?
But hey... if we shame them into hiding... at least we don't have to look at them, right? /sarcasm
I'm not talking about shaming at all. I'm talking about awareness. When you grow up in a place where you just can't find clothes over a size 14, it's a totally different mentality, and it's easier to get back on track when your size 12 clothes get snug and you know you're running out of options, than when you're a size 22 and it's so easy to find clothes for your size, or the next size up and that being overweight is so easily accepted as normal.
But it's true that we are WAY past that in this country (and a lot of other countries, really). So, probably a moot point.
And I do agree that it's a nice change to see a woman who is actually a plus size modeling clothes. I'm just not sure if it's going to do any good, especially as, well, she didn't exactly pick the most flattering outfits to model.
There's no way to argue that having to wear a tarp instead of real clothing is not shaming.
Sorry, but no.0 -
MireyGal76 wrote: »azulvioleta6 wrote: »I think that there is a difference between feeling good about having a healthy, strong but imperfect/real body, vs. being defiant about being 100+ pounds overweight. The latter doesn't seem very psychologically healthy to me.
I don't understand why people think she is attractive--even if she got down to a more average weight, she doesn't have a unique or interesting look and her features aren't very nice.
If she were thin, nobody would look twice at her. Maybe that is why she is fighting so hard for this--she just wants the attention.
She is WAY too short to model--it is really quite silly, weight aside.
FALSE.
I looked twice at her, while she was overweight. And attractiveness is so much more than facial features. Confidence, that shine in a person's eyes.. that is where a lot of attraction comes from. And I DO believe that she is attractive, and if she were thin, she probably WOULD turn heads.
Hmmm...I find her extremely plain.0 -
As far as the model is concerned I think she looks beautiful. I really don't care for tattoos so that bothers me more.
What I do appreciate is that there are finally companies out there that have attractive clothes for larger sizes. I remember being an overweight kid and having to go to lane bryant in the chubbies section to get clothes. It was terrible having to wear things that made me feel like a little old lady.
No matter what size I am I want to look as good as I can.0 -
azulvioleta6 wrote: »MireyGal76 wrote: »azulvioleta6 wrote: »I think that there is a difference between feeling good about having a healthy, strong but imperfect/real body, vs. being defiant about being 100+ pounds overweight. The latter doesn't seem very psychologically healthy to me.
I don't understand why people think she is attractive--even if she got down to a more average weight, she doesn't have a unique or interesting look and her features aren't very nice.
If she were thin, nobody would look twice at her. Maybe that is why she is fighting so hard for this--she just wants the attention.
She is WAY too short to model--it is really quite silly, weight aside.
FALSE.
I looked twice at her, while she was overweight. And attractiveness is so much more than facial features. Confidence, that shine in a person's eyes.. that is where a lot of attraction comes from. And I DO believe that she is attractive, and if she were thin, she probably WOULD turn heads.
Hmmm...I find her extremely plain.
Yeah, we all find different things attractive. I think she's really pretty. Love her hair, tattoos, facial features, lips.0 -
It's all good if you don't mind panting like a hound after a flight of stairs... I don't mean to sound harsh at all and this has nothing to do with her looks or her confidence. Being a size 20 is just bad for your heart... and the notion that someone size 20 is "as healthy" as lower weight women (barring other health factors) is just not true. I am not trying to trash her by any means... I need to lose weight myself, but I am also a realist.0
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bainsworth1a wrote: »As far as the model is concerned I think she looks beautiful. I really don't care for tattoos so that bothers me more.
What I do appreciate is that there are finally companies out there that have attractive clothes for larger sizes. I remember being an overweight kid and having to go to lane bryant in the chubbies section to get clothes. It was terrible having to wear things that made me feel like a little old lady.
No matter what size I am I want to look as good as I can.
This! My mom is overweight... her clothing options are basically mom jeans, oversized tshirts and hoodies. I guess cuz she's "fat", she should give up on life.
NOT.
And really, she isn't fat... but because she too is 6'1", her overweight is a small person's obese. :grumble:0 -
It's all good if you don't mind panting like a hound after a flight of stairs... I don't mean to sound harsh at all and this has nothing to do with her looks or her confidence. Being a size 20 is just bad for your heart... and the notion that someone size 20 is "as healthy" as lower weight women (barring other health factors) is just not true. I am not trying to trash her by any means... I need to lose weight myself, but I am also a realist.
I was a size 20 when I started this whole thing, and I assure you that I never panted like a dog.0 -
TheVirgoddess wrote: »It's all good if you don't mind panting like a hound after a flight of stairs... I don't mean to sound harsh at all and this has nothing to do with her looks or her confidence. Being a size 20 is just bad for your heart... and the notion that someone size 20 is "as healthy" as lower weight women (barring other health factors) is just not true. I am not trying to trash her by any means... I need to lose weight myself, but I am also a realist.
I was a size 20 when I started this whole thing, and I assure you that I never panted like a dog.
My sister in law was quite large when she started running. She didn't lose any weight, but she ran her first half marathon. And noone believed her... because she is quite large.
Appearances are deceptive. Never assume.
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TheVirgoddess wrote: »Lourdesong wrote: »I have body image issues, but I find it condescending when any movement tries to get me to chant that I'm beautiful.
You don't have to convince beautiful people to chant that they are beautiful.
The whole self-esteem stuff just comes off as false to me, like giving everyone a sticker or a participation ribbon. Who showcases that on their mantel?
For me the whole self esteem stuff matters, because I'm raising two girls. I want them to know it's okay to think they are good at something, or smart, or kind - that it's not immodest or wrong to celebrate things you like about yourself. I don't want them to fall into the same self loathing trap loop that I did.
I do agree about the chanting stuff though. I don't think I'm beautiful (and I'm super okay with that), so being told I must think that makes me uncomfortable. But I hate to be bossed around
Ugh… oh yes. I remember telling a couple of friends of mine that I started losing weight after I reached an overweight BMI and started feeling uncomfortable and the reply I gout was, "PFF who cares about the BMI? You should not worry about that. You can be overweight and beautiful!"
Thanks, but… beyond the point.0 -
TheVirgoddess wrote: »It's all good if you don't mind panting like a hound after a flight of stairs... I don't mean to sound harsh at all and this has nothing to do with her looks or her confidence. Being a size 20 is just bad for your heart... and the notion that someone size 20 is "as healthy" as lower weight women (barring other health factors) is just not true. I am not trying to trash her by any means... I need to lose weight myself, but I am also a realist.
I was a size 20 when I started this whole thing, and I assure you that I never panted like a dog.
The expression was not ment literally... but it's factual that when you are heavy your heart rate rate goes up more even when doing less.0 -
TheVirgoddess wrote: »It's all good if you don't mind panting like a hound after a flight of stairs... I don't mean to sound harsh at all and this has nothing to do with her looks or her confidence. Being a size 20 is just bad for your heart... and the notion that someone size 20 is "as healthy" as lower weight women (barring other health factors) is just not true. I am not trying to trash her by any means... I need to lose weight myself, but I am also a realist.
I was a size 20 when I started this whole thing, and I assure you that I never panted like a dog.
Yes. Isn't it offensive when people assume? I feel similarly when I read about sweating & chafing. WTF
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I ran a half marathon at 180 lbs... it can be done. It's all about pacing yourself. That did not make me as healthy as the ladies who ran it at 150lbs. My body was working harder then theirs was, at the same speeds. More blood needed to pump, pulling more weight... that is not saying that you can't be in better shape as an overweight runner, like I was then someone completely inactive but that would be comparing apples and oranges.0
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TheVirgoddess wrote: »Lourdesong wrote: »I have body image issues, but I find it condescending when any movement tries to get me to chant that I'm beautiful.
You don't have to convince beautiful people to chant that they are beautiful.
The whole self-esteem stuff just comes off as false to me, like giving everyone a sticker or a participation ribbon. Who showcases that on their mantel?
For me the whole self esteem stuff matters, because I'm raising two girls. I want them to know it's okay to think they are good at something, or smart, or kind - that it's not immodest or wrong to celebrate things you like about yourself. I don't want them to fall into the same self loathing trap loop that I did.
I do agree about the chanting stuff though. I don't think I'm beautiful (and I'm super okay with that), so being told I must think that makes me uncomfortable. But I hate to be bossed around
A healthy self-image, sure. But encouraging boasting for sake of "self-esteem" seems to me to be something we tolerate and/or encourage from people who probably have a lot of legitimate reasons to not think too highly of themselves. Reasons such as, being overweight and out-of-shape, not taking good care of themselves, etc.
We don't like it when people with actual talents and enviable qualities boast about it. We expect them to be modest and hold back on expressing any thought that might even resemble that they have very high opinions of themselves.
So encouraging certain people to do it seems to me to only be out of pity and because their boasts are not actually true and everyone knows it.
It's like the participation ribbon. Intended to help self-esteem but it might as well be the "You lose" ribbon. Only the losers get that ribbon and a condescending pat on the head.
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Again I said I did not mean it literally, I certainly did not mean to offend anyone. However, I opinion is as valid as anyone elses...0
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Not a big fan of the title of this, but I understand you apologized in advance. I've seen other articles about fit moms with photos of their 6 packs, tanned skin, and white smiles that say "what's your excuse?" As some women might find that motivational, some won't. I've seen so many other mothers comment back with their own versions of their bodies with a caption that says "Because I'm okay with this." I'm a big fan of the phrase "don't worry about what I'm doing, worry about why you're worried about what I'm doing," and frankly if someone is imminent causing self-harm, I WILL BE CONCERNED, but if a person is okay with their weight/body size, I couldn't care less. When I first saw the article I focused more on her tattoos than I did her weight. I've also been on the receiving end of the "you're over weight, you're unhealthy" argument and it pisses me off profusely. I am over weight, but my over-all health is standard.0
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Reminds me of taking my nephew to soccer, where every kid on the team got a throphy... and the kids that actually got the most goals and such got the exact same one... I thought "wow" a lot has changed.Lourdesong wrote: »TheVirgoddess wrote: »Lourdesong wrote: »I have body image issues, but I find it condescending when any movement tries to get me to chant that I'm beautiful.
You don't have to convince beautiful people to chant that they are beautiful.
The whole self-esteem stuff just comes off as false to me, like giving everyone a sticker or a participation ribbon. Who showcases that on their mantel?
For me the whole self esteem stuff matters, because I'm raising two girls. I want them to know it's okay to think they are good at something, or smart, or kind - that it's not immodest or wrong to celebrate things you like about yourself. I don't want them to fall into the same self loathing trap loop that I did.
I do agree about the chanting stuff though. I don't think I'm beautiful (and I'm super okay with that), so being told I must think that makes me uncomfortable. But I hate to be bossed around
A healthy self-image, sure. But encouraging boasting for sake of "self-esteem" seems to me to be something we tolerate and/or encourage from people who probably have a lot of legitimate reasons to not think too highly of themselves. Reasons such as, being overweight and out-of-shape, not taking good care of themselves, etc.
We don't like it when people with actual talents and enviable qualities boast about it. We expect them to be modest and hold back on expressing any thought that might even resemble that they have very high opinions of themselves.
So encouraging certain people to do it seems to me to only be out of pity and because their boasts are not actually true and everyone knows it.
It's like the participation ribbon. Intended to help self-esteem but it might as well be the "You lose" ribbon. Only the losers get that ribbon and a condescending pat on the head.0 -
honkytonks85 wrote: »What always gets me is the assumption that being big = unhealthy lifestyle and being slim = healthy lifestyle. Not really the case. It is possible to be overweight and still be healthy. It is possible to be slim and be unhealthy.
THIS. We don't know her life.0 -
arditarose wrote: »msjessicamccoy wrote: »Some people are larger and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are larger and have unhealthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have unhealthy lifestyles.
Size is not the best indicator of health or healthy lifestyle.
To a certain extent.
Yup. I'm not sure you'd find a lot of morbidly obese people that are healthy overall.
Right. I had typed more but didn't want to start that thread here.
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Lourdesong wrote: »TheVirgoddess wrote: »Lourdesong wrote: »I have body image issues, but I find it condescending when any movement tries to get me to chant that I'm beautiful.
You don't have to convince beautiful people to chant that they are beautiful.
The whole self-esteem stuff just comes off as false to me, like giving everyone a sticker or a participation ribbon. Who showcases that on their mantel?
For me the whole self esteem stuff matters, because I'm raising two girls. I want them to know it's okay to think they are good at something, or smart, or kind - that it's not immodest or wrong to celebrate things you like about yourself. I don't want them to fall into the same self loathing trap loop that I did.
I do agree about the chanting stuff though. I don't think I'm beautiful (and I'm super okay with that), so being told I must think that makes me uncomfortable. But I hate to be bossed around
A healthy self-image, sure. But encouraging boasting for sake of "self-esteem" seems to me to be something we tolerate and/or encourage from people who probably have a lot of legitimate reasons to not think too highly of themselves. Reasons such as, being overweight and out-of-shape, not taking good care of themselves, etc.
We don't like it when people with actual talents and enviable qualities boast about it. We expect them to be modest and hold back on expressing any thought that might even resemble that they have very high opinions of themselves.
So encouraging certain people to do it seems to me to only be out of pity and because their boasts are not actually true and everyone knows it.
It's like the participation ribbon. Intended to help self-esteem but it might as well be the "You lose" ribbon. Only the losers get that ribbon and a condescending pat on the head.
Self esteem does not, in any way, equal boastfulness though.
Just because I know I'm smart doesn't mean I go around telling everyone that I am. It means I'm okay admitting so as it pertains to the conversation (as opposed to trying to deflect or minimize).
I don't expect anyone to be modest and I don't think talking about a talent you have (again, as it pertains to whatever conversation you're having) is a negative thing. I love watching people talk about things they are good at.
Boasting is talking with excessive pride. Just like anything else - in excess it's obnoxious. *shrug*
I don't like participation ribbons, but I don't think they are comparable to self esteem. Those contribute to an "everyone's a winner" mentality.0 -
arditarose wrote: »arditarose wrote: »msjessicamccoy wrote: »Some people are larger and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have healthy lifestyles. Some people are larger and have unhealthy lifestyles. Some people are smaller and have unhealthy lifestyles.
Size is not the best indicator of health or healthy lifestyle.
To a certain extent.
Yup. I'm not sure you'd find a lot of morbidly obese people that are healthy overall.
Right. I had typed more but didn't want to start that thread here.
Except obesity is the single most important risk indicator for a variety of metabolic diseases. Individually, doesn't mean a thing.
As to her personal health, I don't care, it's her business. Kate Moss, don't care, her business. Neither properly falls into my esthetic cannon. (And that's my business.)
If she's selling a lifestyle, yeah, that is going to bother me. But it doesn't seem to be the case. If she's selling style, clothes, self acceptance - Good for her. Money in the bank.0 -
I don't care what she does.
0
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