"Clean" or Flexible Eating - food for thought?

When it comes to many aspects of life, not just eating "healthy", there are certain levels of enlightenment or knowledge. At one point in time, we thought the sun revolved around the world. We are more knowledgeable now and realize that the Earth revolves around the sun.
Humans have killed animals for food for hundreds of thousands of years. It's a primitive practice that I feel will eventually go away once we become more enlightened about food and not see it as just carbs, fats, and proteins or even calories. If people knew the harm conventional farming does to our world, or even the conditions of conventional farming, I bet they would think twice about what type of food they ate. Even humane farming practice is primitive because that's how farming was practiced before industrialized farming. So in that sense, we have actually gone backwards with the rise of conventional farming while killing our planet in the process. Yay for us :-/

Before the discovery of calories in the early 19th century, people stayed healthy by being active and eating real, wholesome food. Plain and simple. There was no need to count calories or go to a gym. No need to worry about if someone's getting enough protein or if they need to drink more water. People were just more in tune with their bodies and really listened to them. There was no internet or media to say "you must look like this" or "this diet causes you lose 50 pounds in 12 weeks". If people were more enlightened and had a closer connection with their food, there would be a good chance we would all be healthier, less subconscious about our bodies, and wouldn't have a need to have a "flexible eating" arrangement since the only foods we would consume would be packed with vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, and antioxidants.

People don't realize how great they can feel until they ditch all the foods that cause them to feel anything but great. For me, this includes ditching wheat, dairy, and chocolate. I'm on the fence if I can eat gluten since barley is hit or miss with me. Just need to do more experimenting. I can't remember the last time I felt like running for miles after eating a big steak or downing some ice cream. Although, ice cream (or just dairy in general) is a funny food for me. I have consumed a half pint of ice cream, took a nap, and felt great when I woke up. However, I have always experienced a crash afterwards. Dairy has some very interesting compounds that play with our physiology in different ways. Overall though, for me, it's best to avoid it. There is no need for dairy in the diet.

When it comes to endless energy, my go-to food is sprouted buckwheat and sprouted lentils with a side of salad and veggies (carrots and celery). When I eat this combo, I instantly have a ton of energy and it lasts. There is no crash afterwards. It's boring food compared to the chemically induced feelings we get from processed foods or the opiate-like characteristics we experience from wheat or dairy but in the long run, your body will thank you for it a million times over.

It can be tough to get in tune with your body and really get biofeedback about a food or meal. Maybe one item in the meal causes the whole meal to make someone feel less than optimal. I have noticed this with salsa. If I eat it alone (who would do that?), I feel great. When I eat it with beans and rice, I can notice a difference.

My main point is that if someone really wants to get to a level of endless energy without caffeine, feeling relaxed about life, sleeping better, and just feeling awesome overall, I would suggest that people stop worrying about calories and make being in tune with their body and the food they put into it a main priority in their life. Calories do matter up to a certain point since eating healthy requires one to eat a lot more. However, they do not dictate how healthy you are. The type of food you put in your body is going to dictate the level of physical, mental, and spiritual health you experience.

EvgeniZyntx wrote: »

Smith and colleagues found that flexible dieting was associated with the absence of overeating, lower bodyweight, and the absence of depression and anxiety [22]. They also found that a strict all-or-nothing approach to dieting was associated with overeating and increased bodyweight. Similarly, Stewart and colleagues found that rigid dieting was associated with symptoms of an eating disorder, mood disturbances, and anxiety [23]. Flexible dieting was not highly correlated with these qualities.
[/b]

I think the questions raised by this article are important. I tend to think from personal experience that disordered eating can cause inflexible eating. Restricting certain foods, and following inflexible eating patterns become coping mechanisms for bingers and overeaters.

There are people who successfully lose and maintain weight whose diets lack a lot flexibility, and there are flexible dieters who are equally as successful. In evaluating a person's diet, I suppose the key questions are: 1. Does this diet support this person's health goals? 2. Diet this diet support this person's health?

If the answer to questions are both "yes" then the degree of flexibility is probably sufficient.

“They also found that a strict all-or-nothing approach to...” - stop right there. Fill in almost anything, and that activity will become unhealthy and destructive.

girlviernes wrote: »

One thing to consider is that when we think of food as good/bad, or healthy/crap, we can induce a placebo type effect where we eat bad/crap and feel anxious, guilty, physically uncomfortable, etc. This really makes it difficult to objectively sort out how food affects us - although it does not negate that there can be effects.

Re the article, Jolinia. It's hard to comment without the full article. Unfortunately, abstracts do not give an accurate view of scientific findings. I looked up the article, but I'd need to make an interlibrary loan request to get it.

Regarding the abstract, I wanted to add that Jolinia's question about what came first didn't necessarily follow from what was cited. Depression/Anxiety were seen in the patients who had IBS, not the other way around. Depression/Anxiety aren't exactly strangers to people with chronic conditions.

I have heard before, and I don't feel like looking this up, about some research connecting depression and the gut and something about certain receptors being in the intestines (I think this is what I remember reading), but my memory of it is all fuzzy.

TrailBlazerMN wrote: »

When it comes to many aspects of life, not just eating "healthy", there are certain levels of enlightenment or knowledge. At one point in time, we thought the sun revolved around the world. We are more knowledgeable now and realize that the Earth revolves around the sun.
Humans have killed animals for food for hundreds of thousands of years. It's a primitive practice that I feel will eventually go away once we become more enlightened about food and not see it as just carbs, fats, and proteins or even calories. If people knew the harm conventional farming does to our world, or even the conditions of conventional farming, I bet they would think twice about what type of food they ate. Even humane farming practice is primitive because that's how farming was practiced before industrialized farming. So in that sense, we have actually gone backwards with the rise of conventional farming while killing our planet in the process. Yay for us :-/

Before the discovery of calories in the early 19th century, people stayed healthy by being active and eating real, wholesome food. Plain and simple. There was no need to count calories or go to a gym. No need to worry about if someone's getting enough protein or if they need to drink more water. People were just more in tune with their bodies and really listened to them. There was no internet or media to say "you must look like this" or "this diet causes you lose 50 pounds in 12 weeks". If people were more enlightened and had a closer connection with their food, there would be a good chance we would all be healthier, less subconscious about our bodies, and wouldn't have a need to have a "flexible eating" arrangement since the only foods we would consume would be packed with vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, and antioxidants.

People don't realize how great they can feel until they ditch all the foods that cause them to feel anything but great. For me, this includes ditching wheat, dairy, and chocolate. I'm on the fence if I can eat gluten since barley is hit or miss with me. Just need to do more experimenting. I can't remember the last time I felt like running for miles after eating a big steak or downing some ice cream. Although, ice cream (or just dairy in general) is a funny food for me. I have consumed a half pint of ice cream, took a nap, and felt great when I woke up. However, I have always experienced a crash afterwards. Dairy has some very interesting compounds that play with our physiology in different ways. Overall though, for me, it's best to avoid it. There is no need for dairy in the diet.

When it comes to endless energy, my go-to food is sprouted buckwheat and sprouted lentils with a side of salad and veggies (carrots and celery). When I eat this combo, I instantly have a ton of energy and it lasts. There is no crash afterwards. It's boring food compared to the chemically induced feelings we get from processed foods or the opiate-like characteristics we experience from wheat or dairy but in the long run, your body will thank you for it a million times over.

It can be tough to get in tune with your body and really get biofeedback about a food or meal. Maybe one item in the meal causes the whole meal to make someone feel less than optimal. I have noticed this with salsa. If I eat it alone (who would do that?), I feel great. When I eat it with beans and rice, I can notice a difference.

My main point is that if someone really wants to get to a level of endless energy without caffeine, feeling relaxed about life, sleeping better, and just feeling awesome overall, I would suggest that people stop worrying about calories and make being in tune with their body and the food they put into it a main priority in their life. Calories do matter up to a certain point since eating healthy requires one to eat a lot more. However, they do not dictate how healthy you are. The type of food you put in your body is going to dictate the level of physical, mental, and spiritual health you experience.

This!

eunhyuk12 wrote: »

Maybe if vegetables didnt taste so bad, it would be alot easier. Fruits are great, but vegetables are literally disgusting.

Good, more veggies for me!

Here's the thing that always boggles my mind when a thread on orthorexia comes up. People are so quick to board the "Healthy eating isn't bad! I cannot believe you all are suggesting that eating ice cream all day is healthy!" train when just eating healthy is not what orthorexia is.

They're not talking about being the person bringing the fruit bowl or veggie tray to a Super Bowl party. They're talking about the person who is so paralyzed with fear due to lack of control or knowledge of every item of food that they are going to be in contact with that he or she just stays home from social events rather than face the anxiety it would cause.

"Eating healthy" is no more orthorexia than feeling sad on one isolated day is clinical depression.

MrM27 wrote: »

Tedebearduff wrote: »

mamapeach910 wrote: »

I would tend to think lack of flexibility leads to binge behaviors. Control snaps, the binge and overeating happens because you swear you'll get back on track and never eat the offending substance again. BUT... while you're eating the forbidden fruit, you shove as much as you can into your face because you're never ever having it. Lather, rinse, repeat.

As for food and mood? I used to think they were connected, now I disagree. My moods are entirely separate from my food. Food can't make me anything except not hungry. I enjoy something that's tasty, I get satisfaction from having cooked something delicious, but food has no control over how I feel.

I spent a while trying to untangle wanting to eat to soothe myself. I guess I'm finally there. I think the idea of a restrictive diet is appealing to people who like control, who feel that if they can just do xyz, everything will fall into place. That sort of thinking does go hand in hand with anxiety. It's not related to the eating, but it's typical thinking of someone with anxiety. The peace of surrender and the surety of their own strength hasn't settled into their bones yet.

Hey this is false, your body has a different hormonal response to foods which can/will effect your mood.

Tell me what food will cause someone to be depressed or angry since you are quick to say the statement is false. Let me guess you're talking about dopamine release and want to lump that into a broad statement.

I'm not sure if food can cause depression (I've not heard of it), but some foods are natural anti-depressants. Carbs can increase serotonin production, which is one reason why people who binge due to mood or "eat their feelings" tend to go for carbs. It does make them feel better.

I know at least one user on here experimented with low carb and her depression got worse, and so she had to abandon that eating style and incorporate carbs back into her diet. I tried low carb and had issues with low blood sugars and anxiety.

I agree you need to find eating habits that work for you. My body does react differently to different things. I cannot drink coffee. It gives me the shakes as if I have low blood sugar. Even black decaf (and diet soda and tea don't affect me the same way, so it's not the caffeine). Not sure what the hell it is, but no coffee for me (which makes me very sad). I'd never tell anyone else not to drink coffee though.

It seems like all these arguments start because we all try to insist that someone else eats like us. However, I do think there is a difference between people who have tried different eating styles and have found what works for them and someone who watched a video or read a blog and because of that they've decided to cut out x, y, and z from their diet. I think it's important to let them know that eating a particular way is not required. They should experiment and then adjust based on how it affects them, what they like to eat (and do they binge if they miss what they cut out), and how satiated the new diet is keeping them.

TrailBlazerMN wrote: »

When it comes to many aspects of life, not just eating "healthy", there are certain levels of enlightenment or knowledge. At one point in time, we thought the sun revolved around the world. We are more knowledgeable now and realize that the Earth revolves around the sun.
Humans have killed animals for food for hundreds of thousands of years. It's a primitive practice that I feel will eventually go away once we become more enlightened about food and not see it as just carbs, fats, and proteins or even calories. If people knew the harm conventional farming does to our world, or even the conditions of conventional farming, I bet they would think twice about what type of food they ate. Even humane farming practice is primitive because that's how farming was practiced before industrialized farming. So in that sense, we have actually gone backwards with the rise of conventional farming while killing our planet in the process. Yay for us :-/

Before the discovery of calories in the early 19th century, people stayed healthy by being active and eating real, wholesome food. Plain and simple. There was no need to count calories or go to a gym. No need to worry about if someone's getting enough protein or if they need to drink more water. People were just more in tune with their bodies and really listened to them. There was no internet or media to say "you must look like this" or "this diet causes you lose 50 pounds in 12 weeks". If people were more enlightened and had a closer connection with their food, there would be a good chance we would all be healthier, less subconscious about our bodies, and wouldn't have a need to have a "flexible eating" arrangement since the only foods we would consume would be packed with vitamins, minerals, phytonutrients, and antioxidants.

People don't realize how great they can feel until they ditch all the foods that cause them to feel anything but great. For me, this includes ditching wheat, dairy, and chocolate. I'm on the fence if I can eat gluten since barley is hit or miss with me. Just need to do more experimenting. I can't remember the last time I felt like running for miles after eating a big steak or downing some ice cream. Although, ice cream (or just dairy in general) is a funny food for me. I have consumed a half pint of ice cream, took a nap, and felt great when I woke up. However, I have always experienced a crash afterwards. Dairy has some very interesting compounds that play with our physiology in different ways. Overall though, for me, it's best to avoid it. There is no need for dairy in the diet.

When it comes to endless energy, my go-to food is sprouted buckwheat and sprouted lentils with a side of salad and veggies (carrots and celery). When I eat this combo, I instantly have a ton of energy and it lasts. There is no crash afterwards. It's boring food compared to the chemically induced feelings we get from processed foods or the opiate-like characteristics we experience from wheat or dairy but in the long run, your body will thank you for it a million times over.

It can be tough to get in tune with your body and really get biofeedback about a food or meal. Maybe one item in the meal causes the whole meal to make someone feel less than optimal. I have noticed this with salsa. If I eat it alone (who would do that?), I feel great. When I eat it with beans and rice, I can notice a difference.

My main point is that if someone really wants to get to a level of endless energy without caffeine, feeling relaxed about life, sleeping better, and just feeling awesome overall, I would suggest that people stop worrying about calories and make being in tune with their body and the food they put into it a main priority in their life. Calories do matter up to a certain point since eating healthy requires one to eat a lot more. However, they do not dictate how healthy you are. The type of food you put in your body is going to dictate the level of physical, mental, and spiritual health you experience.

This whole romanticized version of what people "used to eat" has got to go away.

The people who used to live in crushing poverty and who faced things like drought, crop failure and coming up empty when they hunted were all too common in the good ol' days.

I'll pass on the once a day gruel and weak ale and have my processed tap water and yogurt.

mamapeach910 wrote: »

girlviernes wrote: »

re: OP post, I think it is certainly possible to adhere to dietary restrictions long-term, as so many with religious restrictions or ethical restrictions (vegan, vegetarian) do. It's really a matter of seeing how restrictions function in your life. If they increase anxiety and/or obsessiveness to a problematic level, that is a problem, if more restrictions are continually added, that is a problem, if there is a restrict/over-indulge pattern, that is a problem, if there is an underlying sense of shame or lack of control, that is a problem.

However, if you choose an eating style and it fits your values, there is room for variety, and you aren't constantly struggling with yourself over your eating, then that is great!

Good points, but don't you think, then, it comes down to motivation for the restriction being key to sustainability?

You and I both moderate our carbs for medical reasons. I don't eat gluten for a medical reason.

I'm a vegetarian because I don't like meat and because it doesn't like me back.

Those are very different reasons for restricting than some of the magical thinking involved in the typical dieting restricting that you can see on the boards.

It may be magical thinking, but is it the inaccuracy of the thinking that leads to functional problems?