Organic...
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Has anyone watched the videos of the organic food taste tests I posted on the previous page?
The second one where they feed organic food experts McDonalds and the experts believe it's organic is hilarious.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »let me link the organic pesticide/chemical list...again...
http://www.ecfr.gov/cgi-bin/text-idx?c=ecfr&SID=9874504b6f1025eb0e6b67cadf9d3b40&rgn=div6&view=text&node=7:3.1.1.9.32.7&idno=7#se7.3.205_1601
That is interesting, and would seem to disprove the statement above that says there is no requirements for natural substances in organic farming. I did not know they already allowed synthetics.
it is indeed unfortunate
although logical because obviously they need to use SOMETHING to get rid of insects, bacteria, and such, as I'm sure you know
also, as @senecarr and I pointed out previously, the volume of organic pesticides and herbicides often has to be higher than synthetics because of the difference in efficacy between the two (among other factors, I'm sure)
not to mention organic practices (as I understand it) require fallow seasons because they are more harmful to the soil than modern agricultural ones
really your best bet if you actually want to limit your intake of pesticides/herbicides, man-made or otherwise, would be to grow your own produce or get locally-sourced stuff from small growers you know and trust
I agree. And I do.0 -
MamaBirdBoss wrote: »withoutasaddle wrote: »I'm not a fan of the amount of pesticides and stuff they use, but I prefer normally grown food to organic. It's not sustainable. If a crop gets a fungus at an organic type farm? There goes that crop for the year, and maybe forever. It's not like crops are being sprayed down by people in hazmat suits like one of the first posters was saying (and seriously, where did he get that idea?). I taste no difference in organic / non organic food, and I don't think it's necessarily healthier.
somehow a 19 year old with 38 posts comes in to a 10 page thread and says the most reasonable *kitten* in the entire thread in like 3 sentences
you win the internet
Except he thinks organic farms don't use pesticides...which isn't true.
hmm I can see how you'd infer that from her post but she doesn't outright state it
either way it's a good summary of the idea that organic sucks
How so? It's completely ignorant of organic farming practices and not true. When an organic garden gets fungus, the crops aren't gone fo the year. There are natural ways to combat fungus.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »MamaBirdBoss wrote: »withoutasaddle wrote: »I'm not a fan of the amount of pesticides and stuff they use, but I prefer normally grown food to organic. It's not sustainable. If a crop gets a fungus at an organic type farm? There goes that crop for the year, and maybe forever. It's not like crops are being sprayed down by people in hazmat suits like one of the first posters was saying (and seriously, where did he get that idea?). I taste no difference in organic / non organic food, and I don't think it's necessarily healthier.
somehow a 19 year old with 38 posts comes in to a 10 page thread and says the most reasonable *kitten* in the entire thread in like 3 sentences
you win the internet
Except he thinks organic farms don't use pesticides...which isn't true.
hmm I can see how you'd infer that from her post but she doesn't outright state it
either way it's a good summary of the idea that organic sucks
How so? It's completely ignorant of organic farming practices and not true. When an organic garden gets fungus, the crops aren't gone fo the year. There are natural ways to combat fungus.
yes, natural ways by using "organic" herbicides
I'm not saying everything she posted was accurate (or even near accurate), but it cut through a fair amount of the back and forth *kitten* in a nicely brief way0 -
Technically, if it is a fungus, it would be fungicide.Need2Exerc1se wrote: »MamaBirdBoss wrote: »withoutasaddle wrote: »I'm not a fan of the amount of pesticides and stuff they use, but I prefer normally grown food to organic. It's not sustainable. If a crop gets a fungus at an organic type farm? There goes that crop for the year, and maybe forever. It's not like crops are being sprayed down by people in hazmat suits like one of the first posters was saying (and seriously, where did he get that idea?). I taste no difference in organic / non organic food, and I don't think it's necessarily healthier.
somehow a 19 year old with 38 posts comes in to a 10 page thread and says the most reasonable *kitten* in the entire thread in like 3 sentences
you win the internet
Except he thinks organic farms don't use pesticides...which isn't true.
hmm I can see how you'd infer that from her post but she doesn't outright state it
either way it's a good summary of the idea that organic sucks
How so? It's completely ignorant of organic farming practices and not true. When an organic garden gets fungus, the crops aren't gone fo the year. There are natural ways to combat fungus.
yes, natural ways by using "organic" herbicides
I'm not saying everything she posted was accurate (or even near accurate), but it cut through a fair amount of the back and forth *kitten* in a nicely brief way
Pesticide is the generic term for chemicals that get rid of unwanted stuff, fungicides, herbicides, and insecticides are the usual subcategories of such.
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »MamaBirdBoss wrote: »withoutasaddle wrote: »I'm not a fan of the amount of pesticides and stuff they use, but I prefer normally grown food to organic. It's not sustainable. If a crop gets a fungus at an organic type farm? There goes that crop for the year, and maybe forever. It's not like crops are being sprayed down by people in hazmat suits like one of the first posters was saying (and seriously, where did he get that idea?). I taste no difference in organic / non organic food, and I don't think it's necessarily healthier.
somehow a 19 year old with 38 posts comes in to a 10 page thread and says the most reasonable *kitten* in the entire thread in like 3 sentences
you win the internet
Except he thinks organic farms don't use pesticides...which isn't true.
hmm I can see how you'd infer that from her post but she doesn't outright state it
either way it's a good summary of the idea that organic sucks
How so? It's completely ignorant of organic farming practices and not true. When an organic garden gets fungus, the crops aren't gone fo the year. There are natural ways to combat fungus.
yes, natural ways by using "organic" herbicides
I'm not saying everything she posted was accurate (or even near accurate), but it cut through a fair amount of the back and forth *kitten* in a nicely brief way
Brief and inaccurate. And it would an organic fungicide, not herbicide, but yes no matter if it was as simple as plain water, if it was used to kill fugus, it would by definition be a fungicide.0 -
Let's take a seasonal country like Canada. If my plants don't make it by a certain date, there's no use replanting. They'll never ripen in time for harvest. So in a case like that, season's over. An enterprising farmer would cash in his crop insurance.
My zucchini didn't sprout this year, so I "cheated" and got a starter plant from a greenhouse. There'd be no use planting seed again. It wouldn't fruit in time.0 -
What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?0
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »MamaBirdBoss wrote: »withoutasaddle wrote: »I'm not a fan of the amount of pesticides and stuff they use, but I prefer normally grown food to organic. It's not sustainable. If a crop gets a fungus at an organic type farm? There goes that crop for the year, and maybe forever. It's not like crops are being sprayed down by people in hazmat suits like one of the first posters was saying (and seriously, where did he get that idea?). I taste no difference in organic / non organic food, and I don't think it's necessarily healthier.
somehow a 19 year old with 38 posts comes in to a 10 page thread and says the most reasonable *kitten* in the entire thread in like 3 sentences
you win the internet
Except he thinks organic farms don't use pesticides...which isn't true.
hmm I can see how you'd infer that from her post but she doesn't outright state it
either way it's a good summary of the idea that organic sucks
How so? It's completely ignorant of organic farming practices and not true. When an organic garden gets fungus, the crops aren't gone fo the year. There are natural ways to combat fungus.
yes, natural ways by using "organic" herbicides
I'm not saying everything she posted was accurate (or even near accurate), but it cut through a fair amount of the back and forth *kitten* in a nicely brief way
Brief and inaccurate. And it would an organic fungicide, not herbicide, but yes no matter if it was as simple as plain water, if it was used to kill fugus, it would by definition be a fungicide.
my mistake
fungicide, herbicide, pesticide
the crux of all this is that organic farming uses just as many "chemicals" as modern agriculture (possibly more in volume, possibly less in number)
but you seem content to continue to argue this to your dying breath by going back and forth over semantics0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
because it's more expensive and it's sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious
just like body wraps and other woo
people on MFP don't like woo0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
what I can't wrap my head around is why you have spent 11 pages arguing so strongly in favor of it
I totally get that some people like it0 -
I have to use my food budget carefully. If I were to have extra to spend based on the source of the food, I think I would choose to get milk, eggs, and meat products from local farms and butchers that give their livestock a good quality of life.0
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
because it's more expensive and it's sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious
just like body wraps and other woo
people on MFP don't like woo
So you hate the food or practice because of advertising?0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
Because it promotes woo and a lack of critical thinking. When it gets to the level of fanatacism that you see in people like Green Peace, you get people who burn down crops that can fix vitamin a deficiency - a problem that causes hundreds of thousands of children a year to go blind, or die.
I also see it as a life style choice wealthy people and countries are promoting and purposely handicapping their food production that in a long chain of events, promotes continued colonialism of Africa and India. Right now, Europe could switch their agricultural practices to be more modern, and stop becoming importers. Instead they continue to encourage Africa and India to grow cash crop like cotton to the detriment of feed their own people. At the same time, they even provide loans towards growing this stuff, then turn around and tell them not to use advances like GMOs - technology that would make their crops more efficient and potentially lead to them getting out of debt.
Those are my major social reasons for being against organic.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »
When the consumer demands "no antibiotics" certification, they put the farmer in a dilemma. It has the potential to cause unneeded suffering, which the consumer never sees. And I was annoyed that you judged the farmer stupid.While the options are raised on antibiotics vs. no antibiotics ever. I'm going for zero antibiotics.
Customers demand no antibiotics because of the choices available.
and those choices lead to animals pointless suffering because they cannot be treated for very curable diseases.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »
When the consumer demands "no antibiotics" certification, they put the farmer in a dilemma. It has the potential to cause unneeded suffering, which the consumer never sees. And I was annoyed that you judged the farmer stupid.While the options are raised on antibiotics vs. no antibiotics ever. I'm going for zero antibiotics.
Customers demand no antibiotics because of the choices available.
and those choices lead to animals pointless suffering because they cannot be treated for very curable diseases.
I don't see why farmers that mistreat animals should be reason to dislike organic farming in general. It's not as if non-organic commercial animals are living in the lap of luxury.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
because it's more expensive and it's sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious
just like body wraps and other woo
people on MFP don't like woo
So you hate the food or practice because of advertising?
Hate is a strong word. I just dislike it.
Like I said, it is sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious.
Why would any rational person then advocate this?
The only people who benefit from this are the ones selling it.0 -
Local cattle raised on an organic farm:
Local cattle raised on a regular farm, not certified organic:
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Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
because it's more expensive and it's sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious
just like body wraps and other woo
people on MFP don't like woo
So you hate the food or practice because of advertising?
Hate is a strong word. I just dislike it.
Like I said, it is sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious.
Why would any rational person then advocate this?
The only people who benefit from this are the ones selling it.
But I didn't ask about advocating it. I asked about being against it (hate, dislike, whatever). And is there any proof that it's not safer or healthier?0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »What I can't wrap my head around is why anyone would be against organic gardening or think that organic food "sucks". I mean I totally get thinking it's not necessary, doesn't taste better, not more nutritious, but why the hate?
because it's more expensive and it's sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious
just like body wraps and other woo
people on MFP don't like woo
So you hate the food or practice because of advertising?
Hate is a strong word. I just dislike it.
Like I said, it is sold on a lie that it is healthier, safer, and more nutritious.
Why would any rational person then advocate this?
The only people who benefit from this are the ones selling it.
But I didn't ask about advocating it. I asked about being against it (hate, dislike, whatever). And is there any proof that it's not safer or healthier?
There's certainly evidence that organic has a higher than normal case of recall for contamination.0
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