having gastric bypass surgery in September
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newyorkcitymom wrote: »newyorkcitymom wrote: »
My guess is that there is going to be a drastic difference in activity level and accuracy and logging.newyorkcitymom wrote: »People here are astounding. CICO is indeed a fundamental principle - one that has worked quite cleanly (if not without effort) for me personally. But people's bodies are complex organisms affected by a range of factors and will react differently. For example, people who have always been extremely obese my have a glitch in their "calories out" mechanism where their body is able to achieve homeostasis on much Lower calories. There are all sorts of things we don't know exactly. We can understand and work with the General principle while understanding how much variation there can be. Take a look at the people who eat 2,000 calories each day and lose weight while people at the same weight/height eat 1,200 to lose. Clearly there are differences that are influenced by genetics, life circumstances, body shape, etc. The vast, vast majority of people who lose weight through exerciser and nutrition gain it back and then some. That is the reality. And they are not all a bunch of uncontrolled, unmotivated people who don't know how to use a good scale. The majority of people who have weight loss surgery keep the weight off over the long term and significantly improve their health and lives. It is not a decision that should be taken lightly and should be a last resort because it does permanently alter your consumption patterns (high fat, high sugar are pretty much out for life), but it is a valid and potentially life transforming option that people should not be shamed for taking.
The whole concept of WLS is that eating low calorie DOES work. I don't understand your insistence that some overweight people are immune to a calorie deficit. WLS just forces people to stay in a calorie deficit. It's essentially mandated portion control.
See, again you are displaying your ignorance. Weight loss surgery is not simply mandated portion control/calorie deficit. Part of how it works is by making it so that your body is unable to absorb a portion of the calories you consume - it bypasses your stomach, thereby not being digested and thus not part of the calories in calculation. The smaller pouch eventually expands but in the beginning stages it does indeed help you to adjust to smaller portions. If people are going to pronounce judgment, it would be helpful if they at least had some basic knowledge of the scientific processes involved - something patients are educated extensively in.
Please, tell me how I'm ignorant. If you reference my original post from August 11, you'll see my mom has had the surgery and a revision. And she recommended I have it as well. Hope you're enjoying the view from your soap box though.0 -
newyorkcitymom wrote: »newyorkcitymom wrote: »
My guess is that there is going to be a drastic difference in activity level and accuracy and logging.newyorkcitymom wrote: »People here are astounding. CICO is indeed a fundamental principle - one that has worked quite cleanly (if not without effort) for me personally. But people's bodies are complex organisms affected by a range of factors and will react differently. For example, people who have always been extremely obese my have a glitch in their "calories out" mechanism where their body is able to achieve homeostasis on much Lower calories. There are all sorts of things we don't know exactly. We can understand and work with the General principle while understanding how much variation there can be. Take a look at the people who eat 2,000 calories each day and lose weight while people at the same weight/height eat 1,200 to lose. Clearly there are differences that are influenced by genetics, life circumstances, body shape, etc. The vast, vast majority of people who lose weight through exerciser and nutrition gain it back and then some. That is the reality. And they are not all a bunch of uncontrolled, unmotivated people who don't know how to use a good scale. The majority of people who have weight loss surgery keep the weight off over the long term and significantly improve their health and lives. It is not a decision that should be taken lightly and should be a last resort because it does permanently alter your consumption patterns (high fat, high sugar are pretty much out for life), but it is a valid and potentially life transforming option that people should not be shamed for taking.
The whole concept of WLS is that eating low calorie DOES work. I don't understand your insistence that some overweight people are immune to a calorie deficit. WLS just forces people to stay in a calorie deficit. It's essentially mandated portion control.
See, again you are displaying your ignorance. Weight loss surgery is not simply mandated portion control/calorie deficit. Part of how it works is by making it so that your body is unable to absorb a portion of the calories you consume - it bypasses your stomach, thereby not being digested and thus not part of the calories in calculation. The smaller pouch eventually expands but in the beginning stages it does indeed help you to adjust to smaller portions. If people are going to pronounce judgment, it would be helpful if they at least had some basic knowledge of the scientific processes involved - something patients are educated extensively in.
Unfortunately you're mistaken here. bypassing the stomach doesn't mean that nutrients don't get absorbed at all; in fact the majority of nutrients get absorbed in the small intestines. The stomach just breaks down the big stuff. Shrinking down the stomach just makes you feel faster.0 -
You know the thread has jumped the shark when the OP left more than a month ago and people who have not bothered to read the thread spend significant time calling each other ignorant.0
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allenpriest wrote: »You know the thread has jumped the shark when the OP left more than a month ago and people who have not bothered to read the thread spend significant time calling each other ignorant.allenpriest wrote: »You know the thread has jumped the shark when the OP left more than a month ago and people who have not bothered to read the thread spend significant time calling each other ignorant.
Regardless of OP, other people read these threads, often without commenting ('lurkers') and need to be properly informed without all the false 'facts' being handed out.0 -
newyorkcitymom wrote: »newyorkcitymom wrote: »
My guess is that there is going to be a drastic difference in activity level and accuracy and logging.newyorkcitymom wrote: »People here are astounding. CICO is indeed a fundamental principle - one that has worked quite cleanly (if not without effort) for me personally. But people's bodies are complex organisms affected by a range of factors and will react differently. For example, people who have always been extremely obese my have a glitch in their "calories out" mechanism where their body is able to achieve homeostasis on much Lower calories. There are all sorts of things we don't know exactly. We can understand and work with the General principle while understanding how much variation there can be. Take a look at the people who eat 2,000 calories each day and lose weight while people at the same weight/height eat 1,200 to lose. Clearly there are differences that are influenced by genetics, life circumstances, body shape, etc. The vast, vast majority of people who lose weight through exerciser and nutrition gain it back and then some. That is the reality. And they are not all a bunch of uncontrolled, unmotivated people who don't know how to use a good scale. The majority of people who have weight loss surgery keep the weight off over the long term and significantly improve their health and lives. It is not a decision that should be taken lightly and should be a last resort because it does permanently alter your consumption patterns (high fat, high sugar are pretty much out for life), but it is a valid and potentially life transforming option that people should not be shamed for taking.
The whole concept of WLS is that eating low calorie DOES work. I don't understand your insistence that some overweight people are immune to a calorie deficit. WLS just forces people to stay in a calorie deficit. It's essentially mandated portion control.
See, again you are displaying your ignorance. Weight loss surgery is not simply mandated portion control/calorie deficit. Part of how it works is by making it so that your body is unable to absorb a portion of the calories you consume - it bypasses your stomach, thereby not being digested and thus not part of the calories in calculation. The smaller pouch eventually expands but in the beginning stages it does indeed help you to adjust to smaller portions. If people are going to pronounce judgment, it would be helpful if they at least had some basic knowledge of the scientific processes involved - something patients are educated extensively in.
Unfortunately you're mistaken here. bypassing the stomach doesn't mean that nutrients don't get absorbed at all; in fact the majority of nutrients get absorbed in the small intestines. The stomach just breaks down the big stuff. Shrinking down the stomach just makes you feel faster.
As I said, PART of how it works is by making your body unable to absorb a PORTION of the nutrients - not just by passing quickly through the stomach but also by bypassing a section of the small intestine. It is the COMBINATION of enforced portion control, malabsorption and changes in the gut that affect hormones controlling hunger, satiety, etc - i.e., chemical and hormonal changes. Say what you want about it, but the idea that this is just "mandated portion control" that forces obese people to do what they could/should do without it is just patently false. The facts are: long lasting obesity from an early age in a portion of the population is not easily explained and at the very least doctors have discovered that there are complex hormonal, genetic and lifestyle factors that all interact with one another to make it qualitatively more difficult for some people to lose weight; weight loss surgery is the most proven effective tool for extremely obese people and has a much higher success rate than any other weight loss program; people who undergo weight loss surgery are able to reverse and treat damaging medical conditions such as diabetes; those who undergo the surgery have to undergo a regimen that involves attempt to lose weight, strict diet modification and education before receiving the procedure. All that being said, you are entitled not to listen to these scientific facts and to maintain your own opinions; my primary objection is not to win a debate about weight loss surgery, but to object to the moralizing and shaming of other posters considering it.0 -
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newyorkcitymom wrote: »newyorkcitymom wrote: »newyorkcitymom wrote: »
My guess is that there is going to be a drastic difference in activity level and accuracy and logging.newyorkcitymom wrote: »People here are astounding. CICO is indeed a fundamental principle - one that has worked quite cleanly (if not without effort) for me personally. But people's bodies are complex organisms affected by a range of factors and will react differently. For example, people who have always been extremely obese my have a glitch in their "calories out" mechanism where their body is able to achieve homeostasis on much Lower calories. There are all sorts of things we don't know exactly. We can understand and work with the General principle while understanding how much variation there can be. Take a look at the people who eat 2,000 calories each day and lose weight while people at the same weight/height eat 1,200 to lose. Clearly there are differences that are influenced by genetics, life circumstances, body shape, etc. The vast, vast majority of people who lose weight through exerciser and nutrition gain it back and then some. That is the reality. And they are not all a bunch of uncontrolled, unmotivated people who don't know how to use a good scale. The majority of people who have weight loss surgery keep the weight off over the long term and significantly improve their health and lives. It is not a decision that should be taken lightly and should be a last resort because it does permanently alter your consumption patterns (high fat, high sugar are pretty much out for life), but it is a valid and potentially life transforming option that people should not be shamed for taking.
The whole concept of WLS is that eating low calorie DOES work. I don't understand your insistence that some overweight people are immune to a calorie deficit. WLS just forces people to stay in a calorie deficit. It's essentially mandated portion control.
See, again you are displaying your ignorance. Weight loss surgery is not simply mandated portion control/calorie deficit. Part of how it works is by making it so that your body is unable to absorb a portion of the calories you consume - it bypasses your stomach, thereby not being digested and thus not part of the calories in calculation. The smaller pouch eventually expands but in the beginning stages it does indeed help you to adjust to smaller portions. If people are going to pronounce judgment, it would be helpful if they at least had some basic knowledge of the scientific processes involved - something patients are educated extensively in.
Unfortunately you're mistaken here. bypassing the stomach doesn't mean that nutrients don't get absorbed at all; in fact the majority of nutrients get absorbed in the small intestines. The stomach just breaks down the big stuff. Shrinking down the stomach just makes you feel faster.
As I said, PART of how it works is by making your body unable to absorb a PORTION of the nutrients - not just by passing quickly through the stomach but also by bypassing a section of the small intestine. It is the COMBINATION of enforced portion control, malabsorption and changes in the gut that affect hormones controlling hunger, satiety, etc - i.e., chemical and hormonal changes. Say what you want about it, but the idea that this is just "mandated portion control" that forces obese people to do what they could/should do without it is just patently false. The facts are: long lasting obesity from an early age in a portion of the population is not easily explained and at the very least doctors have discovered that there are complex hormonal, genetic and lifestyle factors that all interact with one another to make it qualitatively more difficult for some people to lose weight; weight loss surgery is the most proven effective tool for extremely obese people and has a much higher success rate than any other weight loss program; people who undergo weight loss surgery are able to reverse and treat damaging medical conditions such as diabetes; those who undergo the surgery have to undergo a regimen that involves attempt to lose weight, strict diet modification and education before receiving the procedure. All that being said, you are entitled not to listen to these scientific facts and to maintain your own opinions; my primary objection is not to win a debate about weight loss surgery, but to object to the moralizing and shaming of other posters considering it.
There is also a misconception about the amount of nutrition education given to patients who have bariatric surgery. That varies as much as the doctors who perform it. It's very important for patients to educate themselves, before and after the surgery. Many of them are only taught to eat the smaller portions and to eat a significantly larger amount of protein than they did before. However - the stomach can still be stretched back to its former size. Patients can regain the weight. They need to be taught how to eat properly regarding calorie goals so that once weight loss goals are achieved and they are able to eat normallly, they don't regain all the weight because they don't know how to eat right to avoid that. They aren't taught that.0 -
If she has GERD, then RNY would be better for her, from what I have been reading on the subject. (I'm also looking at having the surgery)OP, why a gastric bypass instead of a gastric sleeve. My BIL had a sleeve--was 450, now 210. Another friend had the sleeve and lost 80 pounds. Both are doing well. Good luck!!!!
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My guess is that there is going to be a drastic difference in activity level and accuracy and logging.newyorkcitymom wrote: »People here are astounding. CICO is indeed a fundamental principle - one that has worked quite cleanly (if not without effort) for me personally. But people's bodies are complex organisms affected by a range of factors and will react differently. For example, people who have always been extremely obese my have a glitch in their "calories out" mechanism where their body is able to achieve homeostasis on much Lower calories. There are all sorts of things we don't know exactly. We can understand and work with the General principle while understanding how much variation there can be. Take a look at the people who eat 2,000 calories each day and lose weight while people at the same weight/height eat 1,200 to lose. Clearly there are differences that are influenced by genetics, life circumstances, body shape, etc. The vast, vast majority of people who lose weight through exerciser and nutrition gain it back and then some. That is the reality. And they are not all a bunch of uncontrolled, unmotivated people who don't know how to use a good scale. The majority of people who have weight loss surgery keep the weight off over the long term and significantly improve their health and lives. It is not a decision that should be taken lightly and should be a last resort because it does permanently alter your consumption patterns (high fat, high sugar are pretty much out for life), but it is a valid and potentially life transforming option that people should not be shamed for taking.
The whole concept of WLS is that eating low calorie DOES work. I don't understand your insistence that some overweight people are immune to a calorie deficit. WLS just forces people to stay in a calorie deficit. It's essentially mandated portion control.[/quote]
I have wasted a whole lot of time typing in this thread when I should have just said this.0 -
allenpriest wrote: »You know the thread has jumped the shark when the OP left more than a month ago and people who have not bothered to read the thread spend significant time calling each other ignorant.
Welcome to MFP??0 -
@jgnatca is one of those people who has been motivated to make lifestyle changes, which is why she's so successful. However, it has been my perception she's more the exception than the rule.
This is where the (vocal) internet gives skewed results. The success rate is more like 45% of post-bariatric patients are successful over the long term. And most experience years of improved health outcomes.
I was entered in to a program here in Canada that works hard to improve outcomes by providing the counselling and education to assure success. Patients who may be poor candidates are screened from the program.
@jgnatca - I appreciate you continuing to post and share your experience despite the anti-WLS sentiment in this thread.
I wonder if the people in the failure anecdotes had such a good support program.
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It's essentially mandated portion control.
Except there are a few other things going on. There are changes in ghrelin production for instance, and for many type 2 diabetics, a nearly instant remission of symptoms that cannot be explained by weight loss alone. There's something in the way the body takes in food that is changed, that is not yet completely understood.0 -
peter56765 wrote: »No. It's the combination of the weight loss surgery with the lifestyle change that has proved more successful than anything else. Everyone who starts any diet is motivated to eat at a calorie deficit to lose weight but more people are successful at maintaining the required lifestyle if they've also had surgery. Those are the findings. It's not hard to imagine why this is so. As others upthread have noticed, you will become physically sick if you overeat after surgery. That's a powerful motivating tool, albeit a pretty harsh one. In contrast, without surgery, you only get the pleasure that comes from overeating, and then are stuck with the guilt afterwards.
Edit: I am editing this post to add that I have not had weight loss surgery so I really have no dog in this fight. As humans, we'd like to think that we are not slaves to our instincts like overeating when excess food is available (a very valuable instinct for our ancestors), but the truth is that our rational mind does not always win the battle. But it also means we can be responsive to negative stimuli like when you pull on your dog's collar to make him heel. That's what weight loss surgery is and yes, it's pretty draconian. But we need solutions that address the reality of who we are, not the ideal that we wish we all were.
Well said! ...and an excellent post!
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It's essentially mandated portion control.
Except there are a few other things going on. There are changes in ghrelin production for instance, and for many type 2 diabetics, a nearly instant remission of symptoms that cannot be explained by weight loss alone. There's something in the way the body takes in food that is changed, that is not yet completely understood.
Except in case after case, without proper education regarding maintenance, patients regain weight and can revert to prediabetic and diabetic status.0 -
first off, I wish you the best of luck. ultimately, everyone on here wants to truly see others reach their health goals. I was 314 at my heaviest. It was devastating seeing that number. Knowing I had over 120 pounds to lose to even be close to a "healthy" weight for my height.. it was daunting. But I really wish you would take the time to reconsider this. It can be done 100% naturally without any surgery. I was like you once and tried every diet under the sun with no success. It all comes down to calories in vs calories out. based on your weight, you naturally burn x amount of calories per day just from daily functions. MFP has all the research done for you- you just put in your height and weight and it gives you x number of calories to eat per day and you don't go over it. Your body does the rest of the work. You don't even have to exercise- I didn't exercise the first 3 or 4 weeks of starting this and I still lost 2 pounds (sometimes more) every week. I am not trying to be rude or tell you what you are doing is wrong. I know you've done your research, but I also know, if you would do it on this site, you would see it's really easy. Yeah, it might take a little longer to get to your goal weight but you will lose the weight a healthier way and you wont have any doctor bills or possible health complications. Whatever you chose, I truly do wish you the best of luck. I'm adding you so I can see the progress you make in the future!
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To all the ones on this post who are just saying negative things you can leave... i am doing this for me. Yes it is a long a hard road basically im starting out eating as if i was a baby learning tp eat again and having a healthy relationship with food. I do plan on seeing a therapist and possibly a nutritionist after. I have known a lot of people with success but also a lot with regain. This is a TOOL not a fix. Im excited but nervous as this is my first surgery. And i am not a child i have done so much research and planning it would makd your head spin. And to the others giving great advice and support thank you
I am disappointed you didn't get more support. It is your life and your choice. Please come back as you learn to eat healthy and let us cheer your successes. It isn't easy no matter how you choose to do it. Best of luck to you.
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So you would rather risk death from major surgery (which is a very real possibility from anesthesia, the surgery itself, malnutrition after the fact) than try to adhere to a calorie deficit and see if that leads to more reasonable weight loss?
Gastric bypass is supposed to be a last resort, usually for those with multiple comorbidities who are at risk of death in the near future from their weight, not an alternative to putting in the hard work/lack of determination to stick with something long term.
I had the sleeve surgery almost two years ago. I have lost over 200 lbs. It saved my life. I actually haven't even heard of anyone dying from having the surgery but I have sure heard of people dying without it. Complications can happen with any surgery. People die from every day surgeries every day but they still take that risk if it means that the surgery will improve their health or situation.
Part of my success is that before I ever considered surgery, I started therapy, which I have continued throughout the process, to make sure my head was in the right place. I also made lifestyle changes, and now I work out regularly and have a trainer.
It's true that some people think surgery is like a magic pill and will change everything, and those people probably won't see much success, but for people who use surgery as a tool rather than a crutch will see great results.
Could I have lost the weight without surgery? Maybe. I have lost 100s of lbs during my lifetime. Maybe was not good enough for me so I chose to take my health into my own hands, and now, I have great health and a great quality of life. I would do it all over again.
Congratulations! I am so happy for you! We all have our own paths and how we get to our health goals isn't as important as getting there.
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innerfatty91 wrote: »Gastric band is a cheat way out and won't help you deal with your issues. A lot of people gain the weight back when the band stretches.
People saying that WLS is 'cheating', or saying 'it's the easy way out' really need to get informed. It's no magic pill and still requires exactly the same amount of dieting/lifestyle changes that losing weight without surgery does.
It does help for those who binge, being that they can no longer do that anymore. And it also prevents you from over eating. You can stretch your stomach back out, but you'd have to be pretty stupid to do that.
I'm getting WLS in a few months myself. Previously, I've lost 220lbs by myself a decade ago, which was only half of the 450lbs I needed to lose. I'd started out weighing almost 600lbs. Unfortunately one week I put on a cpl of pounds and was so discouraged by it that I stopped seeing my dietition and went back to my old ways. I've now put almost of that weight back on.
A month ago I began dieting in prep for the surgery and have lost 45lbs in that time (from 540 to 495). I've been saving for 2-years to pay for this surgery and have had many friends who have had it with great success. WLS is a TOOL, it helps but it doesn't do the work for you, that's still on you!
For those who think its 'cheating', saying things like that is really discouraging and negates the work those ppl have done to lose weight. There's plenty of stories of WLS failing isn't there, so how is it cheating if ppl can still put weight back on? You have to work to keep it off, and work to lose it – with or without the surgery. The only difference is with WLS the weight drops off you a little faster.
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I did it! 8 years ago 116 pounds later! It's not easy at all! One of the hardest things I have ever done. But, I would do it again in a heartbeat. I dieted since I was 12 years old. Lost probably 500 pounds over the years but my metabolism would not allow me to keep it off unless I was eating 800 calories a day! If any of you have tried that you know you stay pretty hungry all the time. with the surgery I'm not hungry all the time and my weight doesn't go up and down all the time. Good luck! Do Not Ever eat sugar!!! Those people that I know that it did not work went back to eating sugar!!!0
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Hi Honey! I recently had WLS I did the band though....listen you do what's right for you! everyone will have their opinions positive or negative. No one knows your journey but you. I too am 5'1 and was pushing 275lbs and making my decision for me turned out to be the best thing for me. I am currently 219lbs and counting...Therapy is definitely suggested as it helps with the emotional and mental part of this journey. People may feel that having the surgery is an easy way out, but it isn't. You still have to put in the same work as the rest of them. It is really up to each individual dedication and commitment to the process. Ask yourself are you ready for the commitment to investing in yourself? If the answer is YES, then you will do just fine! There is no sugar-coating! It will be tough! There will days when you want to give up just as if you were doing it on "your own" but your strength will come through! I wish you all the best in this time! Blessings!!!0
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