Isagenix, Science or Woo?
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janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Science or woo? That's a potentially condescending question. It's only woo if it never works for anyone. We're all different and what doesn't work for one person might work for the next. Unless it's dangerous (also a bit subjective), then people will just have to try it to find out.
I don't think anyone is saying that this program won't work. Any program of caloric restriction should result in weight loss. The question is whether the specific claims made for this product (that it is a "miracle," that it will work better than a cheaper whey protein shake, that it will "regulate digestion," etc) are backed up by any evidence.
The mental aspect of weight loss can be as if not more important than the physical aspect.
So are you saying the mental aspect outweighs the fact that there is little to support the claims on the website?
Do you think it is legitimate to describe this product as a "miracle"? Do you think it's right for a company to sell over-priced protein powder to people who are desperate to lose weight?
It's not my place to judge the ethics of a company. I don't even I know what the product is. But the mental aspect is a big one. If it's not dangerous, it remains on the table. It might not be the best choice but I'm not going to poopoo people potential tools.
If the OP asked what worked for me, I'd say eating at a deficit and but of exercise for added benefits. No program that cost me money would work for me personall becuase I'm notoriously cheap (hence eating less food and walking) but I cant say definitively what will and what won't work. I mean, every type of weight loss is statistically doomed to fail for the vast majority, doesn't mean I'll discourage people from making the effort. Heck, this product might be nothing but snake oil but there is a vast number of studies that support the existence of what is called the plecebo effect. I'm not going to argu against that sort of overwhelming science.
So you're saying there is nothing a company could say, write, or do that you would feel comfortable objecting to?
Tough to do when you're trying your hardest to be the most supportive person on the forums. I'm not and never will be but just the odds are against me for keeping the weight off, it won't stop me from trying.
I'm not understanding you. What, exactly, is tough to do?
Do you think being supportive extends to supporting any company that is attempting to profit off of people trying to lose weight? If this is what you're saying, I disagree. I think actual support of PEOPLE sometimes requires us to critique the companies that are attempting to profit off of them.
You misunderstand me. I'm supporting the person. Companies are just in it to make money and most aren't ethical enough to be straight forward. That would negatively impact their bottom line. I support the various ways that people seek to achieve their goals. This might be a part of one person's goal. I could provide some excellently done studies on the plecebo effect if that would be useful.
But I'm sorry, OP for entering into a derailment. I will stop now. Good luck with your goals, same to you janejellyroll!
So OP has asked if she should believe the claims made by this company. I think we can support the OP while pointing out the ways in which the company's claims don't make sense. In fact, I think a case can be made that giving the OP exactly what she's asking for (feedback on the claims) is more helpful than a generic "Well, it could be true for you, try it and find out!"0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Science or woo? That's a potentially condescending question. It's only woo if it never works for anyone. We're all different and what doesn't work for one person might work for the next. Unless it's dangerous (also a bit subjective), then people will just have to try it to find out.
I don't think anyone is saying that this program won't work. Any program of caloric restriction should result in weight loss. The question is whether the specific claims made for this product (that it is a "miracle," that it will work better than a cheaper whey protein shake, that it will "regulate digestion," etc) are backed up by any evidence.
The mental aspect of weight loss can be as if not more important than the physical aspect.
So are you saying the mental aspect outweighs the fact that there is little to support the claims on the website?
Do you think it is legitimate to describe this product as a "miracle"? Do you think it's right for a company to sell over-priced protein powder to people who are desperate to lose weight?
It's not my place to judge the ethics of a company. I don't even I know what the product is. But the mental aspect is a big one. If it's not dangerous, it remains on the table. It might not be the best choice but I'm not going to poopoo people potential tools.
If the OP asked what worked for me, I'd say eating at a deficit and but of exercise for added benefits. No program that cost me money would work for me personall becuase I'm notoriously cheap (hence eating less food and walking) but I cant say definitively what will and what won't work. I mean, every type of weight loss is statistically doomed to fail for the vast majority, doesn't mean I'll discourage people from making the effort. Heck, this product might be nothing but snake oil but there is a vast number of studies that support the existence of what is called the plecebo effect. I'm not going to argu against that sort of overwhelming science.
So you're saying there is nothing a company could say, write, or do that you would feel comfortable objecting to?
Tough to do when you're trying your hardest to be the most supportive person on the forums. I'm not and never will be but just the odds are against me for keeping the weight off, it won't stop me from trying.
I'm not understanding you. What, exactly, is tough to do?
Do you think being supportive extends to supporting any company that is attempting to profit off of people trying to lose weight? If this is what you're saying, I disagree. I think actual support of PEOPLE sometimes requires us to critique the companies that are attempting to profit off of them.
You misunderstand me. I'm supporting the person. Companies are just in it to make money and most aren't ethical enough to be straight forward. That would negatively impact their bottom line. I support the various ways that people seek to achieve their goals. This might be a part of one person's goal. I could provide some excellently done studies on the plecebo effect if that would be useful.
But I'm sorry, OP for entering into a derailment. I will stop now. Good luck with your goals, same to you janejellyroll!
How exactly is it supportive of a person to tell them, "Sure! Waste your money! It won't work in any meaningful way but hey, I SUPPORT you!" Blind support is not helpful. In addition, this OP did not say that they're taking this and want high fives for it, they specifically asked whether or not it was something useful. I'm afraid I just don't understand patting people on the head for literally anything rather than trying to give them factual information that might actually help them to achieve their goals.0 -
I get it. You don't approve of my post or a few others here.janejellyroll wrote: »It probably works. Anything that helps you cut your calories will work! You needn't pay for some specific product in order to cut your calories, though.
Personally, I prefer healthy food and watching my calories. There is no way I'd pay for powders or shakes...but I know people who drink the shakes and like to do things that way.
It's just a personal preference - how do you want to lose your weight?
But OP isn't asking if it will work as just as well as any calorie deficit plan. OP is specifically asking if it is a "miracle" and if the claims made for the product are based in science. That isn't personal preference. Just based on the claims on the website and what we currently know about weight loss, I think we can answer her question with a fair degree of confidence.
We all get that you don't like some of the posts. You've made that abundantly clear.
I don't like the shakes. I don't like companies promising detoxes, weight losses, big muscles, et cetera, whether it be in shake or pill or whatever form. But if people want to drink the shakes and the shakes help lead them to their goal, it doesn't hurt me.
Like I said, a friend of mine drinks the shakes. She asked my opinion and I gave it and she drinks them anyway. It didn't turn me into the Tasmanian Devil. We didn't have a big fight. We are still friends. And I continue to be interested in her weight loss. When I see her, I want to taste the shake. I'm confident that she will let me.
It isn't the end of the world if someone doesn't take you advice. It isn't the end of the world if they use shakes to lose weight.
It's just not that big a deal.
Whatever works!
But, again, I get that you disapprove of some of these posts. Noted.0 -
Any program out there can be successful if someone uses it as directed. The thing is ALL of the programs rely on calorie deficit to lose weight. They will all state "with proper diet and exercise" as the de facto statement to assure that people won't claim against them.I have two soon to be sister in laws who SWEAR by (and one of them sells in the pyramid scheme) Isagenix and the whole platform. Once has claimed MIRACLES in her life and they really want me to 'get on board' and "believe in the miracles".
I've done SOME research but it's hard to find anything real since it's so heavily marketed by the pyramid scheme people...
So, what's the consensus Woo or Science?
In short, there is nothing special about any meal replacement, supplement, etc. for weight loss because it still boils down to CICO for weight gain/loss/maintenance.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.0 -
quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
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See that's the stuff I worry about ... people passing out or become obsessive over these things...it makes me wonder what is in them that turns people into crazed fanatics.tracyannk28 wrote: »
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
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tracyannk28 wrote: »quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
Is she okay?0 -
tracyannk28 wrote: »quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
Is she okay?
She was ok...but the scary part is that she's a single mom and was home alone with her 10 year old daughter.
When I told her that maybe she passed out because of the cleanses she was like "well the doctor didn't say anything and couldn't find any reason why I passed out". Her doctor appointment was a few days after the 'incident' so I'm guessing by then her blood sugar or whatever was probably back to normal.
She still insists on doing the weird cleanses and the shakes. She was totally 'wooed'.
ETA: Any weight she's lost doing this craziness has never stayed off.0 -
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tracyannk28 wrote: »quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
My husband's boss has also passed out during a cleanse.0 -
It's quite expensive...a friend of mine did it and lost quite a bit of weight which she has kept off to this day, she now only uses some of their 'energy' products and eats standard food..thankfully she wasn't interested in trying to sell to her friends and family.
Like any weight loss tool it works if you work it, but its a pretty expensive tool and looks like people can get caught up easily in the hype. I would say there are much cheaper ways to lose weight and regain health.
I have someone in my office who is using it, she uses work time to try and flog it, I can hear her on the phone telling people that she is only mentioning it to them because she cares about their health.0 -
I used Isagenix about ten years ago and lowered my cholesterol about 50 points at a time when my doctor had been about to put me on cholesterol medication. I did not lose a significant amount of weight but I was purchasing their maintenance pack at the time and doing the one day cleanse every week, never could do 2 days. So my experience was that the program does haves some health benefits.0
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This seems to be the biggest problem with people who do cleanses and very unhealthy intake levels "just for a few days". Everyone seems to be okay with it because it's just a few days. But, what if your friend wasn't ok? What if her ten year old found her dead in the bathroom? Or what if she had been driving? Or standing on the top of some stairs?tracyannk28 wrote: »quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
And how is any of that an acceptable risk just to lose weight faster or because someone said it will remove "toxins" from you?
/rant0 -
This seems to be the biggest problem with people who do cleanses and very unhealthy intake levels "just for a few days". Everyone seems to be okay with it because it's just a few days. But, what if your friend wasn't ok? What if her ten year old found her dead in the bathroom? Or what if she had been driving? Or standing on the top of some stairs?tracyannk28 wrote: »quiltlovinlisa wrote: »My husband's boss is totally hooked on isagenix and lost quite a bit of weight using it, however the immense amount of misinformation he peddles is horrifying! He's told my husband our children are malnourished because we don't buy organic. He labels foods "good" and "bad" and will put himself on a three day cleanse if he feels he's eaten poorly.
His whole relationship with food is just crazy.
So, scamwoo as stated above, lol.
I have a friend who does the isagenix shakes and these weird cleanses. I told her once and only once that your body does the cleansing for you naturally and weight loss from the shakes come from a calorie deficit that she can achieve by just watching her food intake. She said "no - this is the only thing that works for me". She actually passed out in her bathroom and bit her head on the side of her bathtub while on one of these 'cleanses'.
And how is any of that an acceptable risk just to lose weight faster or because someone said it will remove "toxins" from you?
/rant
That's what I tried to explain to her. But some people just don't want to listen to reason and would rather look for a 'quick fix' to lose weight.
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Lol, Isagenix is not a pyramid scheme. It's called network marketing. When I lived in Thailand I met a few guys in their thirties who made their fortune from network marketing.
Now, does it work? IMO, a diet rich in vegetables, fruits and lean meats is a better choice. Want to get rid of toxins? Go on a juice cleanse instead. Most of this stuff hasn't even been tested yet. We don't know the long-term effects yet, or if it even works or not.
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Actually unless you've tried the product I'm not sure how you can judge it. I've been on it since August Have lost 20 pounds and feel the best I have ever felt. It is easy and convenient to use and the company uses a third party vendor to validate the contents of the shakes vitamins and products being consumed.0
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Three posts and two of them are to necro a dormant isogenix thread. Not a shill, no not at all.0
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jamiemerc7 wrote: »Actually unless you've tried the product I'm not sure how you can judge it. I've been on it since August Have lost 20 pounds and feel the best I have ever felt. It is easy and convenient to use and the company uses a third party vendor to validate the contents of the shakes vitamins and products being consumed.
I have never tried cocaine but it doesnt mean i dont understand the effects.
Btw, how many calories are you eating on that plan? My friends was 900 to 1000 and the lack of quality nutrition put her in the hospital.0 -
jamiemerc7 wrote: »Actually unless you've tried the product I'm not sure how you can judge it. I've been on it since August Have lost 20 pounds and feel the best I have ever felt. It is easy and convenient to use and the company uses a third party vendor to validate the contents of the shakes vitamins and products being consumed.
I have never tried cocaine but it doesnt mean i dont understand the effects.
Btw, how many calories are you eating on that plan? My friends was 900 to 1000 and the lack of quality nutrition put her in the hospital.
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I don't count calories and if I'm hungry I eat healthy snacks throughout the day and I eat a healthy dinner at night. I've already surpassed my goal loss weight but feel so good that I'd like to challenge myself I'm on a 16 week challenge to get to the gym and try new activities and firm up! I'm 52 and have never been a very active person. I'm taking it slow doing my best to make healthy choices. Also when I started Isagenix my goal was only to loose 15 pounds nothing more. But so far I feel great have been tested by my doctor and thyroid levels and cholesterol is great. I also have no desire for any Alcohol which has been my relaxation choice for weekends since 1989. So say what you want while I continue on my happy healthy path!0
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It's still snake oil. SMH0
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jamiemerc7 wrote: »I don't count calories and if I'm hungry I eat healthy snacks throughout the day and I eat a healthy dinner at night. I've already surpassed my goal loss weight but feel so good that I'd like to challenge myself I'm on a 16 week challenge to get to the gym and try new activities and firm up! I'm 52 and have never been a very active person. I'm taking it slow doing my best to make healthy choices. Also when I started Isagenix my goal was only to loose 15 pounds nothing more. But so far I feel great have been tested by my doctor and thyroid levels and cholesterol is great. I also have no desire for any Alcohol which has been my relaxation choice for weekends since 1989. So say what you want while I continue on my happy healthy path!
You don't count calories but you're logged in to MFP?
Are you selling any bridges too?0 -
Boy you guys are so supportive! Glad today was my first day on this site!0
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jamiemerc7 wrote: »Boy you guys are so supportive! Glad today was my first day on this site!
Stick around kid, you'll get to love us here!0 -
I've never tried doing the dishes while balancing on one foot with a pasta strainer on my head, but that doesn't mean i need to try it before i can say it isn't necessary for clean dishes.0
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Alatariel75 wrote: »I've never tried doing the dishes while balancing on one foot with a pasta strainer on my head, but that doesn't mean i need to try it before i can say it isn't necessary for clean dishes.
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Seems that if people have their own opinion which differs from the majority then they are bullied here. First day first impression Maybe you should try the product to get some b vitamins in ya and be happy. But knowing your past responses you'd rather bully and be negative. Enjoy0
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Wait a minute? B vitamins are psychoactive? Do you have to be in Colorado to buy them?0
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