For Some of Us there ARE Bad Foods
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SingRunTing wrote: »Labeling food as "bad" would be completely detrimental to me (and many others from what we see posted on the forums daily) because:
eating "bad" food --> guilt --> shame --> closet eating --> more shame --> unhealthy relationships with food.
Understanding that I can fit those foods into my diet while trying to hit my nutritional goals helps me find the right balance. Moderation for life!
+1 so much.0 -
As I have said before, good and bad are value laden words. We can apply them (inappropriately in my view) to food, to people (again, inappropriately in my view), to situations - there are so many applications.
The psychologist R. Ellis made a point of telling his students that they would be better at communicating if they eliminated value words from their conversations, instead using more accurate descriptors to describe what they actually were trying to say. So I had a bad day today REALLY means I didnt get enough sleep, I was late for work, I got blamed for a mistake that wasnt mine etc. When you say to a child you were bad today, what you REALLY are saying is that they didnt meet your expectations of them that day, or they behaved in a manner that was not acceptable to you. So again, saying a food is bad is REALLY saying - what? You dont like it? It makes you sick? It doesnt meet your nutritional needs? It doesnt meet your caloric needs? WHATEVER it is, it is that way only for YOU, because you are the only person who CLEARLY understands the meaning of the word "bad" in that context.
Try going through a day without using the words good or bad, and you will see how carelessly it is tossed around, and you may then realize how many times you are leaving yourself open for misinterpretation.0 -
cross2bear wrote: »As I have said before, good and bad are value laden words. We can apply them (inappropriately in my view) to food, to people (again, inappropriately in my view), to situations - there are so many applications.
The psychologist R. Ellis made a point of telling his students that they would be better at communicating if they eliminated value words from their conversations, instead using more accurate descriptors to describe what they actually were trying to say. So I had a bad day today REALLY means I didnt get enough sleep, I was late for work, I got blamed for a mistake that wasnt mine etc. When you say to a child you were bad today, what you REALLY are saying is that they didnt meet your expectations of them that day, or they behaved in a manner that was not acceptable to you. So again, saying a food is bad is REALLY saying - what? You dont like it? It makes you sick? It doesnt meet your nutritional needs? It doesnt meet your caloric needs? WHATEVER it is, it is that way only for YOU, because you are the only person who CLEARLY understands the meaning of the word "bad" in that context.
Try going through a day without using the words good or bad, and you will see how carelessly it is tossed around, and you may then realize how many times you are leaving yourself open for misinterpretation.
Wow, what an interesting point. I'm really prone to using value words. I think I'm going to try being more mindful and using more accurate descriptors to communicate.0 -
I miss Cheetos. A favorite of mine; but sadly, there are no good gluten-free Cheeto alternatives, and I can no longer eat gluten due to Celiac disease.
Cheetos aren't bad. They aren't satiating alone, but a 160 calorie snack isn't meant to be satiating; it's just a pleasing taste of something you enjoy.
@mccindy72 I thought you might appreciate this:
http://www.fritolay.com/nutrition/special-dietary-needs/us-gluten-free-products-and-products-not-containing-gluten-ingredients.htm0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »lemurcat12 wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »1. They are so stupid that when presented with the statement "there are no bad foods" they accept this without question and uncritically and therefore run off to construct their diets entirely out of poptarts and dust and / or
2. They are so emotionally fragile that when presented with a viewpoint that goes against what they believe or may be construed an insensitive to their struggles that it causes a complete collapse in their motivation and they stop their efforts altogether
Would the opposite also be true? Must we say that there are no bad foods because of an assumption that someone is so stupid or emotionally fragile they will assume calling a food bad means they should never ever consume that food, and that doing so in any amount will cause them harm?
Once again, I personally don't object to someone saying a food is a bad food for them. I do think there is enough moralistic and disordered thinking about foods that the message that foods are bad or good (or what you eat makes you bad or good) should be countered. There was just another new thread yesterday from someone feeling guilt and shame when she eats bread.
What frustrates me is people twisting the statement "there are no bad foods" into a claim that nutrition doesn't matter. No one is saying that nutrition does not matter.
I don't know if I will ever get used to what seems to be common thinking on MFP that good and bad always have some moral connotation. If I stub my toe or stain my shirt, that's bad. It’s not morally wrong, but still not good.
I do agree with your last paragraph, though I get just as frustrated when calling foods bad = never eating them and eventually failing or binge eating.
Actually, having a toe stubbed or shirt stained could be morally bad if the ethics system doesn't regard intent and blame. In such ethics, the world where your toe is stubbed is morally worse compared to an identical world where it isn't. Saying you believe morals requires intent doesn't even fix the comparison because almost all adults eating involves the intent of the adults.
For me personally, my biggest problem is that categorical statements are usually wrong (though to avoid the trap myself, I won't say they are always wrong!). A Twinkie is a bad food - well unless you're starving to death, or you're about to go into hypoglycemic shock, or you've been eating some odd diet that has left you thiamine deficient and now that oh-so-unclean food's B vitamin enrichment will fill in the deficiency - suddenly it is a good food because the food can't be judged outside of the context of use. It is like saying a tool like a hammer is bad - well sure, if you try to recreate the 3 Stooges with it, it is very bad, but most people use it for something good like building birdhouses or whatnot.
For someone that is starving would you say that a Twinkie, while maybe lifesaving, is not the best food for that person? That there would a better food if it were available?0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
I agree with this. I had "bad" food last night. It was a bite of a 100% Cacao Chocolate bar that looked like it would be a yummy candy bar, but tasted like ... just, it was gross. Bluk. Bad.0 -
janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
But the multiple posts I've seen here from people talking about the guilt they feel for making "bad" choices indicate that, for many people, "bad" is used in a moral sense.
Especially for many women, choosing "good" foods (and denying oneself "bad" ones) has a heavy component of moralism. Self-control is seen as moral, indulgence is seen as bad.
Yes, some people may be using "bad" to mean "substandard." But many people clearly are not.
Well sure, people are different. I don't think anyone has said that everyone needs to call foods bad, have they? To each his own.
I was attempting to provide some context as to why so many people consider "bad" to be an unhelpful description of a food. By your own point, if it can mean so many different things, it may not be the best choice to describe a food.
Perhaps not, though I've never had anyone question what I meant by "bad food" IRL. I'm sure a lot of phrases I use aren't the best, especially to those not from my area.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
But the multiple posts I've seen here from people talking about the guilt they feel for making "bad" choices indicate that, for many people, "bad" is used in a moral sense.
Especially for many women, choosing "good" foods (and denying oneself "bad" ones) has a heavy component of moralism. Self-control is seen as moral, indulgence is seen as bad.
Yes, some people may be using "bad" to mean "substandard." But many people clearly are not.
Well sure, people are different. I don't think anyone has said that everyone needs to call foods bad, have they? To each his own.
I was attempting to provide some context as to why so many people consider "bad" to be an unhelpful description of a food. By your own point, if it can mean so many different things, it may not be the best choice to describe a food.
Perhaps not, though I've never had anyone question what I meant by "bad food" IRL. I'm sure a lot of phrases I use aren't the best, especially to those not from my area.
My guess is that most people "in real life" don't spend as much time thinking about food as we tend to do here.
When I think back to the last few times I've heard the term used (outside of this forum), people were using it to mean "something that I shouldn't have eaten." The very last time I heard it, the person followed it up by saying "I'm terrible."0 -
Kimberly_Harper wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
I agree with this. I had "bad" food last night. It was a bite of a 100% Cacao Chocolate bar that looked like it would be a yummy candy bar, but tasted like ... just, it was gross. Bluk. Bad.
100% cacao? Wouldn't that be unsweetened, like baking chocolate? Yeah, tried that as a child and learned my lesson.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Kimberly_Harper wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
I agree with this. I had "bad" food last night. It was a bite of a 100% Cacao Chocolate bar that looked like it would be a yummy candy bar, but tasted like ... just, it was gross. Bluk. Bad.
100% cacao? Wouldn't that be unsweetened, like baking chocolate? Yeah, tried that as a child and learned my lesson.
Yes for some reason I didn't make the connection. It was packaged like a regular candy bar so I was expecting something else. Bluk. I can still taste it. lol0 -
I hear it IRL all the time- from people I roll my eyes at though!
Oh that is so bad for you- look how many carbs it has!
Oh I dont eat muffins, those are so bad for you all that sugar.
I wonder how much fat is in that hamburger- that has to be bad for you.
You know how bad it is that that's not organic milk, right?
I cant eat subway- all that processed turkey is so bad for you.
Everything in the vending machine is bad for me!
"Bad" is everywhere.0 -
obviously calling any food bad is problematic because of how it can be interpreted.
but certainly for ME there are bad foods.
anything with splenda gives me seizures. i consider them bad foods, period. that *kitten*'s poison to me, and not to my husband, but the fact that he doesn't get seizures does not, in my opinion, qualify the chemical as "good". the reaction is so severe i really don't consider it good for anyone regardless of whether it gives them seizures.
other lab-created sweeteners are also known to cause bad health effects to a lot of people, so to me those are "bad" too. sugar isn't good, but unless you're diabetic, it's not going to kill you, so i do no consider sugar inherently bad (especially when it is natural form such as eating a slice of pineapple, since the sugar is tagging along with its buddies fibre and vitamins).
other stuff is more personalized, like doritos. they're designed to be addictive. they have next to nothing for actual nutrients. they induce terrible cravings that makes it extremely unpleasant to eat one little serving and not dive into the whole bag. while it is POSSIBLE to do so, i think the fact that those types of foods are engineered to make you fail at portion control makes them bad. that to me does NOT mean that i can never have one again, but it does mean it's bad for me.
the title of the thread is about bad foods existing for some of us, and i agree with the statement insofar as it applies to my examples and similar situations.0 -
MommyMeggo wrote: »I hear it IRL all the time- from people I roll my eyes at though!
Oh that is so bad for you- look how many carbs it has!
Oh I dont eat muffins, those are so bad for you all that sugar.
I wonder how much fat is in that hamburger- that has to be bad for you.
You know how bad it is that that's not organic milk, right?
I cant eat subway- all that processed turkey is so bad for you.
Everything in the vending machine is bad for me!
"Bad" is everywhere.
When you hear those IRL what is your reaction? Do you go into a rant about there not being bad foods?0 -
When I think back to the last few times I've heard the term used (outside of this forum), people were using it to mean "something that I shouldn't have eaten." The very last time I heard it, the person followed it up by saying "I'm terrible."
Precisely - the value gets transferred from the inanimate object to the person. With "bad" results, meaning that their self worth is negatively affected, they experience shame and self loathing, they express through their speech, demeanor and postings (here) that they are somehow less worthy of the respect of others and themselves.
Speech (words) are powerful - they can affect how we feel about others and ourselves. They can instill passion, anger, love, so many emotional responses.0 -
obviously calling any food bad is problematic because of how it can be interpreted.
but certainly for ME there are bad foods.
anything with splenda gives me seizures. i consider them bad foods, period. that *kitten*'s poison to me, and not to my husband, but the fact that he doesn't get seizures does not, in my opinion, qualify the chemical as "good". the reaction is so severe i really don't consider it good for anyone regardless of whether it gives them seizures.
other lab-created sweeteners are also known to cause bad health effects to a lot of people, so to me those are "bad" too. sugar isn't good, but unless you're diabetic, it's not going to kill you, so i do no consider sugar inherently bad (especially when it is natural form such as eating a slice of pineapple, since the sugar is tagging along with its buddies fibre and vitamins).
other stuff is more personalized, like doritos. they're designed to be addictive. they have next to nothing for actual nutrients. they induce terrible cravings that makes it extremely unpleasant to eat one little serving and not dive into the whole bag. while it is POSSIBLE to do so, i think the fact that those types of foods are engineered to make you fail at portion control makes them bad. that to me does NOT mean that i can never have one again, but it does mean it's bad for me.
the title of the thread is about bad foods existing for some of us, and i agree with the statement insofar as it applies to my examples and similar situations.
If to you bad = hard to control. Then thats what it means to you.
But thats not the "bad" we go up in arms over.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Kimberly_Harper wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
I agree with this. I had "bad" food last night. It was a bite of a 100% Cacao Chocolate bar that looked like it would be a yummy candy bar, but tasted like ... just, it was gross. Bluk. Bad.
100% cacao? Wouldn't that be unsweetened, like baking chocolate? Yeah, tried that as a child and learned my lesson.
Ha! Me too!0 -
Kimberly_Harper wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »Kimberly_Harper wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
I agree with this. I had "bad" food last night. It was a bite of a 100% Cacao Chocolate bar that looked like it would be a yummy candy bar, but tasted like ... just, it was gross. Bluk. Bad.
100% cacao? Wouldn't that be unsweetened, like baking chocolate? Yeah, tried that as a child and learned my lesson.
Yes for some reason I didn't make the connection. It was packaged like a regular candy bar so I was expecting something else. Bluk. I can still taste it. lol
I'm so surprised they sell those. I saw 90% and 100% at the store last week and told my husband how funny it was. Every child I know has been duped into tasting the baking chocolate for a laugh, and now they are sold as treats.
0 -
obviously calling any food bad is problematic because of how it can be interpreted.
but certainly for ME there are bad foods.
anything with splenda gives me seizures. i consider them bad foods, period. that *kitten*'s poison to me, and not to my husband, but the fact that he doesn't get seizures does not, in my opinion, qualify the chemical as "good". the reaction is so severe i really don't consider it good for anyone regardless of whether it gives them seizures.
other lab-created sweeteners are also known to cause bad health effects to a lot of people, so to me those are "bad" too. sugar isn't good, but unless you're diabetic, it's not going to kill you, so i do no consider sugar inherently bad (especially when it is natural form such as eating a slice of pineapple, since the sugar is tagging along with its buddies fibre and vitamins).
other stuff is more personalized, like doritos. they're designed to be addictive. they have next to nothing for actual nutrients. they induce terrible cravings that makes it extremely unpleasant to eat one little serving and not dive into the whole bag. while it is POSSIBLE to do so, i think the fact that those types of foods are engineered to make you fail at portion control makes them bad. that to me does NOT mean that i can never have one again, but it does mean it's bad for me.
the title of the thread is about bad foods existing for some of us, and i agree with the statement insofar as it applies to my examples and similar situations.
Doritos are designed to be *tasty*. Do some people have trouble moderating their consumption? Sure.
But lots of other people are able to moderate their consumption of them, even though they taste good. Just yesterday I saw someone put Doritos on top of a taco salad, eat about 60% of the salad, and then stop. She was full and didn't want any more.
A personalized decision that one has trouble moderating consumption of Doritos makes sense to me. Successful weight loss does, in my experience, require some self-awareness. But this would be extremely individual. One of the foods you praise, pineapple, happens to be a food that I struggle to moderate. When pineapple is in front of me, I want to eat it all until it is gone. Does this make pineapple "bad"? No. It just means I have to be self-aware.0 -
Need2Exerc1se wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
But the multiple posts I've seen here from people talking about the guilt they feel for making "bad" choices indicate that, for many people, "bad" is used in a moral sense.
Especially for many women, choosing "good" foods (and denying oneself "bad" ones) has a heavy component of moralism. Self-control is seen as moral, indulgence is seen as bad.
Yes, some people may be using "bad" to mean "substandard." But many people clearly are not.
Well sure, people are different. I don't think anyone has said that everyone needs to call foods bad, have they? To each his own.
There was a thread not long ago where the OP was arguing just that -- she was saying "admit it, these foods ARE bad, you just don't want to admit you are eating BAD food."0 -
lemurcat12 wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »janejellyroll wrote: »Need2Exerc1se wrote: »distinctlybeautiful wrote: »I have been using MFP for some time, but have only recently started visiting this board. I find myself surprised at the number of people who say such things as "there are no bad foods" or "you can eat whatever you want" when they no nothing of the individual circumstances of the poster.
We know that people respond differently to medicines; we know that they respond differently to alcohol. Yet people seem to assume that whatever works for them apply to everyone else.
I find that most of the "itos" food group are bad foods for me. Consider the following situation:
I typically save calories so that if I get hungry in the evening, there is room for a snack. So lets assume I am going to "spend" 160 calories.
My choices:
A. Eat 1/4 cup of nuts B. 160 calories of raw veggies with hummus or C. 160 calories of Cheetos
If I were to select A or B, I would end up more full the whole evening, and I would experiences no strong urges to eat the entire pantry. If I were to select C., I would be REALLY hungry 15 minutes later and would have to fight back INTENSE cravings to eat more.
Now my willpower is usually very good; but even if it holds up, I am starving all night. However, if I have had a really bad day or am otherwise exhausted and feeling stressed, I may be vulnerable to succumbing.
Success for me means eliminating "itos". I have gone as long as 6-7 years without touching these foods, and my weight fluctuations are within about a 15-20 pound band. This band is much larger when I eat these kind of foods.
I understand that this does not apply to everyone. But I think we need to be careful about telling people they can succeed while eating everything they like to eat, because there are people for whom this generalization is simply not true.
It's the word "bad" people tend to object to. You're attaching morals to food.
Bad has many meaning that have nothing to do with morals. Substandard, poor, inferior, faulty, etc.
But the multiple posts I've seen here from people talking about the guilt they feel for making "bad" choices indicate that, for many people, "bad" is used in a moral sense.
Especially for many women, choosing "good" foods (and denying oneself "bad" ones) has a heavy component of moralism. Self-control is seen as moral, indulgence is seen as bad.
Yes, some people may be using "bad" to mean "substandard." But many people clearly are not.
Well sure, people are different. I don't think anyone has said that everyone needs to call foods bad, have they? To each his own.
There was a thread not long ago where the OP was arguing just that -- she was saying "admit it, these foods ARE bad, you just don't want to admit you are eating BAD food."
Oh, well I stand corrected. One poster has said it. Still think the posts saying "you shouldn't think of food as good/bad" are in the lead, though. 0
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