I keep seeing "you NEED to lift heavy"
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OP if running is giving you results that you want in your fitness goals, then keep doing that. Lifting weights is for body composition. If this is of no interest to you, you do NOT have to lift.
There is also benefits to lifting that does not have to make you look better or prettier, it can also improve your health. The older you get and and as you age, you loose bone and some muscle if you do not do what it takes to preserve as much of as you can. The more lean mass you have, you also get an uptick in metabolism as well. And you also get stronger, and not just psychically, but mentally too.
So in short, happy with running, keep doing that. Hate lifting, nothing wrong with that..All of this is a personal choice.
edited to say: just so you know, I do both.5 -
middlehaitch wrote: »I flog heavy lifting and protein like an old fish wife.
Why? Because I respond to a lot of threads that involve menopausal and older women and some kind of strength/resistance work and a higher level of protein is so important in maintaining muscle mass and bone density. Cardio is too for cardio- vascular fitness and, along with a calorie deficit, decreasing visceral fat.
I had never done any form of exercise until I was a menopausal 54yo. Aqua fit and 2lbs Dumbbells were enough to increase my strength to begin with.
By the time I had graduated to 5 lbs Dumbbells and Pilates I was reading the forums and found the cult of lifting heavy intimidating. This lasted ever such a long time- I had moved on to include Nerdfitness bodyweight as well by then.
One day a light went off in my head- what was meant was 'lift what is heavy for me'.
A whole new world opened. I started reading those cultish threads and the research papers that were often posted. I learnt a lot!
Extra protein was added to my diet, more is needed as you become elderly. And I learnt all about how inactivity as we age leads to muscle atrophy and decreasing bone density.
I found one of those heavy lifting programmes that I thought I could work with, subbed in hand weights or machines when I couldn't do the move using a 45lbs bar, and haven't looked back.
I will never be ripped but will enter old age (62now) knowledgable, strong, independent, and with not a bad looking body to boot.
I would like to thank the cult of heavy lifters for their constant posts.
If lifting isn't your cup of tea, that is fine, you have no need to do it. But, for a lot of people it can, for vanity or health reasons, be just what they are looking for but don't yet know. I didn't.
Cheers, h.
All of this
But also that parkour is pure exhilarating gymnastics...and gymnasts do progressive resistance training0 -
Just a note on bone health: running, gymnastics, plyometrics, basketball...etc are all high impact activities that are just as effective as weight lifting exercises for bone health. You don't NEED to do weight lifting activities for bone health if you participate in high impact activities regularly. Not being underweight also helps in that regard.5
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I'm primarily a runner too but I've seen enough compelling information to include strength training as part of my program and I have (grudgingly at first) started lifting heavier stuff (using the Stronglifts 5 x 5 program) and am enjoying the results.
Strength training (which can be either light weights and/or body weight exercises) can make you a better, more injury resistant runner.
Do you have to lift heavy? No..........
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BrianSharpe wrote: »I'm primarily a runner too but I've seen enough compelling information to include strength training as part of my program and I have (grudgingly at first) started lifting heavier stuff (using the Stronglifts 5 x 5 program) and am enjoying the results.
Strength training (which can be either light weights and/or body weight exercises) can make you a better, more injury resistant runner.
Do you have to lift heavy? No..........
I'm totally with you that resistance training is nice for various reasons and fits a variety of goals, what I disagree with is that it has to be heavy lifting.3 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »BrianSharpe wrote: »I'm primarily a runner too but I've seen enough compelling information to include strength training as part of my program and I have (grudgingly at first) started lifting heavier stuff (using the Stronglifts 5 x 5 program) and am enjoying the results.
Strength training (which can be either light weights and/or body weight exercises) can make you a better, more injury resistant runner.
Do you have to lift heavy? No..........
I'm totally with you that resistance training is nice for various reasons and fits a variety of goals, what I disagree with is that it has to be heavy lifting.
What the hell does "lifting heavy" even mean? The only place I've even seen the term is on MFP. At least other than "go heavy or go home" posters in the walls of my alternative gym. Reps of even 20-30 will build muscle. Not everyone needs to be going for 1 rep max lifts. Okay, I know what people mean by it, but it's a silly phrase IMHO. I'm hoping it goes the way of "tone."3 -
amusedmonkey wrote: »BrianSharpe wrote: »I'm primarily a runner too but I've seen enough compelling information to include strength training as part of my program and I have (grudgingly at first) started lifting heavier stuff (using the Stronglifts 5 x 5 program) and am enjoying the results.
Strength training (which can be either light weights and/or body weight exercises) can make you a better, more injury resistant runner.
Do you have to lift heavy? No..........
I'm totally with you that resistance training is nice for various reasons and fits a variety of goals, what I disagree with is that it has to be heavy lifting.
It has to be heavy enough to elicit an adaptation from the muscles, etc. And progressively heavier, to further elicit a response. It doesnt really matter ifthat "heavy enough" comes in the form of resistance bands, body weight or barbells. Depending on goals, it also shouldn't matter what acceptable rep range of strength training you are doing.1 -
Depends on goal ..if you like to run, run ...you can make that progressive through intensity, incline, speed, distance, carrying weight if you choose to
IMHO Progressive resistance makes you look good naked, whereas being the appropriate weight means you look good in clothes
I think this is part of the problem right here, you're telling the OP to run if she likes to run, but then telling her that in your opinion if that is all she is doing that she wont look good naked, and that the 50lbs she lost only means she is going to look good in clothes and I'm not sure what type of message that is telling people. I'm also not sure where this whole notion came from anyways, because there millions and millions of people who look good naked no matter what size they are, or what they do health wise.
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You just need to do what suits your needs, and gets you to your goals, you don't have to lift if you don't want to. I think for the most part you see this, because you have a lot of people come on here, who say that they work out 6 times a week, doing all of these classes and cardio, and have reached their goal, and want to know how to tighten up their body. The fastest way to do that is add progressive lifting to their routine, but it isn't the only way, and not everyone has that problem. They lost the weight how they wanted to, and absolutely love how they look. So you if you love how you look and feel, just keep doing what you are doing.3
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on MFP you'll find there are a lot of people who are all for lifting heavy, I am sort of one of those people, I say sort of as I believe in progressive lifting, lifting whats heavy for me but I still prefer cardio. I do my lifting 3 x week but for no more than 20 mins - it has loads of benefits, top of the list for me being that it will help my bone density and preserve muscle mass which is really important for aging.1
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Depends on goal ..if you like to run, run ...you can make that progressive through intensity, incline, speed, distance, carrying weight if you choose to
IMHO Progressive resistance makes you look good naked, whereas being the appropriate weight means you look good in clothes
I think this is part of the problem right here, you're telling the OP to run if she likes to run, but then telling her that in your opinion if that is all she is doing that she wont look good naked, and that the 50lbs she lost only means she is going to look good in clothes and I'm not sure what type of message that is telling people. I'm also not sure where this whole notion came from anyways, because there millions and millions of people who look good naked no matter what size they are, or what they do health wise.
HERO!!2 -
I think a component of the "heavy lifting" mantra is a differentiation from the idea of "toning" with 3 and 5-pound weights, and a reaction against the "lifting heavy weights makes you bulky" myth of the past.
Like any "trend", the idea and the phrase become overused and somewhat trivialized over time.7 -
Depends on goal ..if you like to run, run ...you can make that progressive through intensity, incline, speed, distance, carrying weight if you choose to
IMHO Progressive resistance makes you look good naked, whereas being the appropriate weight means you look good in clothes
I think this is part of the problem right here, you're telling the OP to run if she likes to run, but then telling her that in your opinion if that is all she is doing that she wont look good naked, and that the 50lbs she lost only means she is going to look good in clothes and I'm not sure what type of message that is telling people. I'm also not sure where this whole notion came from anyways, because there millions and millions of people who look good naked no matter what size they are, or what they do health wise.
It's a pretty accurate message if you're looking at actual body composition and not a feel good message. There are people on here that want one or the other, and it's a hard line to walk to do both (feel good and honesty). Losing weight (particularly large amounts of weight) while only doing cardio or worse, no exercise at all, will result in significant muscle loss (assuming the person has any to begin with) and fat loss. By strength training and careful diet with plenty of protein one can lose mostly fat and retain (even gain) muscle. The "toned" body that many would like comes through this approach. Otherwise, it's quite possible to end up "skinny fat" with little muscle mass and more than a healthy amount of fat even at an otherwise "healthy" BMI. People certainly have different priorities, but this is reality.4 -
People can give their opinions all day, but if you're not into it, you're not compelled to do it. It's useful for many, but I am wary of declaring that there is a particular thing that ALL people must do.1
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Depends on goal ..if you like to run, run ...you can make that progressive through intensity, incline, speed, distance, carrying weight if you choose to
IMHO Progressive resistance makes you look good naked, whereas being the appropriate weight means you look good in clothes
I think this is part of the problem right here, you're telling the OP to run if she likes to run, but then telling her that in your opinion if that is all she is doing that she wont look good naked, and that the 50lbs she lost only means she is going to look good in clothes and I'm not sure what type of message that is telling people. I'm also not sure where this whole notion came from anyways, because there millions and millions of people who look good naked no matter what size they are, or what they do health wise.
No I'm not
I'm simply stating that being the "right" weight for your height does not mean that you have the body you want...that scale weight is the smallest part of the physique battle, whatever your desired physique is (and we all have different body aesthetics)
In general losing 50lbs will mean you weigh 50lbs less not that your body composition will be what you aspire to ...if you want specific shape at a lower weight it is generally created through musculature on top of bone structure with an element of fat
When you read progressive resistance do you read "lifting weights" only because that would be misunderstanding the term ...progressive resistance can be achieved through running (intensity, speed, incline) ...progressive resistance can mean more reps at lower weights2 -
Also whenever I say lift heavy it is to emphasise that a 5 or 10lb dumbbell is not what is meant
Women have been poorly served in the fitness industry by the concept of greater reps and pink Dumbbells ...IMHO8 -
Do whatever exercise that makes you happy. The end.
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sunnybeaches105 wrote: »amusedmonkey wrote: »BrianSharpe wrote: »I'm primarily a runner too but I've seen enough compelling information to include strength training as part of my program and I have (grudgingly at first) started lifting heavier stuff (using the Stronglifts 5 x 5 program) and am enjoying the results.
Strength training (which can be either light weights and/or body weight exercises) can make you a better, more injury resistant runner.
Do you have to lift heavy? No..........
I'm totally with you that resistance training is nice for various reasons and fits a variety of goals, what I disagree with is that it has to be heavy lifting.
What the hell does "lifting heavy" even mean? The only place I've even seen the term is on MFP. At least other than "go heavy or go home" posters in the walls of my alternative gym. Reps of even 20-30 will build muscle. Not everyone needs to be going for 1 rep max lifts. Okay, I know what people mean by it, but it's a silly phrase IMHO. I'm hoping it goes the way of "tone."
I think "heavy lifting" is a phrased used by people who want to counter the high rep/low weight lifting suggested to many people (especially women.) It's not a helpful phrase, though. I guess it's more catchy than helpful.
I think that everybody, save for a very few people, can benefit from resistance exercise. Bodyweight, suspension systems, dumbbells, barbells, resistance bands, whatever. Getting and staying strong helps you out in your everyday life. Yes, I like the "looks" benefit of lifting but the long term health benefits and ease-of-life are what primarily drove me to wanting to protect and gain muscle when I first started.
However, if you absolutely hate the thought of doing any resistance exercise...don't do it. Who cares what people on the internet say you have to do? Your choice to do or not do an activity has no effect on me and what I do has no effect on you so just keep on doing what makes you happy.1 -
OP, you have my permission to ignore the gung-ho lifters who say lift heavy or you are wasting your time.
I started lifting in 1963 in high school. I took olympic lifting as a PE requirement in college, so lifting heavy was "the" way to go to prepare for competitions.
I started officiating football in 1970 & needed a good way to stay in shape, so I bought a cheapie barbell/dumbell set from Sears. My lifting was done on my patio & the goal was NOT to maintain a Mr Atlas body, but to be in great physical condition.
Consequently, I concentrated on multiple sets of high repetitions with not-so-heavy weights. Worked out great.
Lift heavy to build mass & bulk; back off 30-40% of the weight and boost the number of repetitions to stay fit.
In other words, do what works for YOU.
Um....that's not how it works. You can lift as heavy as possible, but you're not going to build mass / bulk witout the building blocks (calories). People advise an additional heavy lifting program to maintain muscle mass. It's the most efficient way to do so. Heavy lifting can be done at the gym, in the yard, basement...wherever you can progressively overload the muscles. Heavy lifting can even be done with body weight.
But, like what was said up thread.....your goals are different. You're more worried about stamina, so you work on mainly muscle endurance....light weights, high reps.
Others have goals of lowering their BF% as efficiently as possible. That comes from a modest deficit, a good progressive overload program, and cardio if you like it.
When I recomped, cardio was a cornerstone of my exercise program as endurance was very important to me...but heavy lifting was that other corner.
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xjessicaxrx wrote: »I get that weight lifting is a must if you want to tone up, but the way I keep seeing people demand that this is a must for everyone on every post is baffling me!
What if you dont have the time or money to go to a gym, what if you dont enjoy lifting?
For example I have lost around 50lb over the last 12 months and recently started to actually enjoy running, and I am working hard at getting more efficient at it.
But people keep telling me that I "need" to start lifting heavy, why though? Why is my running that I enjoy not a good enough working progress? I cant say that id want to spend the little spare time I get when im not working inside a gym, am I the only person on here that thinks like this...
All lifting heavy means is that you need to lift enough to need a rest in between sets of say 10-15 reps. It depends on the exericise but there are plenty of good all body routines to do at home with just dumbbells and a bench, maybe add an easy curl bar. As others pointed out you aquire an enjoyment just like running if you push through until your body adapts and you crave the good feelings it gives you.
As a 55 year old I can tell you the benefits of just a simple lifting routine at home 3 days a week for one hour will extend your quality of life into older age. It is the fountain of youth, along with keeping the weight off. I love a little running too. But lifting is what has empowered my life and the doctors are amazed, the dexa scan shows my old bones are that of a 30 year old athlete. Now if that is not the fountain of youth I don't know what is.
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xjessicaxrx wrote: »I get that weight lifting is a must if you want to tone up, but the way I keep seeing people demand that this is a must for everyone on every post is baffling me!
What if you dont have the time or money to go to a gym, what if you dont enjoy lifting?
For example I have lost around 50lb over the last 12 months and recently started to actually enjoy running, and I am working hard at getting more efficient at it.
But people keep telling me that I "need" to start lifting heavy, why though? Why is my running that I enjoy not a good enough working progress? I cant say that id want to spend the little spare time I get when im not working inside a gym, am I the only person on here that thinks like this...
What I see mostly is thread after thread of new people who hate doing cardio but think they need to do massive amounts of cardio to lose weight. They dread spending hours plodding along on a treadmill or exercise bike. Many people new to fitness have no idea that they can obtain the goals and bodies they want by starting a resistance training program with linear progression and no cardio at all if they don't want to. They comment (women mostly) they don't want to be "bulky" or overly muscled. There is a lot of misinformation and lack of knowledge (outside a place like this) of the benefits of resistance training.1 -
californiagirl2012 wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I get that weight lifting is a must if you want to tone up, but the way I keep seeing people demand that this is a must for everyone on every post is baffling me!
What if you dont have the time or money to go to a gym, what if you dont enjoy lifting?
For example I have lost around 50lb over the last 12 months and recently started to actually enjoy running, and I am working hard at getting more efficient at it.
But people keep telling me that I "need" to start lifting heavy, why though? Why is my running that I enjoy not a good enough working progress? I cant say that id want to spend the little spare time I get when im not working inside a gym, am I the only person on here that thinks like this...
All lifting heavy means is that you need to lift enough to need a rest in between sets of say 10-15 reps. It depends on the exericise but there are plenty of good all body routines to do at home with just dumbbells and a bench, maybe add an easy curl bar. As others pointed out you aquire an enjoyment just like running if you push through until your body adapts and you crave the good feelings it gives you.
As a 55 year old I can tell you the benefits of just a simple lifting routine at home 3 days a week for one hour will extend your quality of life into older age. It is the fountain of youth, along with keeping the weight off. I love a little running too. But lifting is what has empowered my life and the doctors are amazed, the dexa scan shows my old bones are that of a 30 year old athlete. Now if that is not the fountain of youth I don't know what is.
The definitions I've seen for "lifting heavy" around this board are more of the 5-8 reps/set range. I've seen a more technical answer of a certain percent of your 1RM but I can't recall it off the top of my head.
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BillMcKay1 wrote: »xjessicaxrx wrote: »I get that weight lifting is a must if you want to tone up, but the way I keep seeing people demand that this is a must for everyone on every post is baffling me!
What if you dont have the time or money to go to a gym, what if you dont enjoy lifting?
For example I have lost around 50lb over the last 12 months and recently started to actually enjoy running, and I am working hard at getting more efficient at it.
But people keep telling me that I "need" to start lifting heavy, why though? Why is my running that I enjoy not a good enough working progress? I cant say that id want to spend the little spare time I get when im not working inside a gym, am I the only person on here that thinks like this...
What I see mostly is thread after thread of new people who hate doing cardio but think they need to do massive amounts of cardio to lose weight. They dread spending hours plodding along on a treadmill or exercise bike. Many people new to fitness have no idea that they can obtain the goals and bodies they want by starting a resistance training program with linear progression and no cardio at all if they don't want to. They comment (women mostly) they don't want to be "bulky" or overly muscled. There is a lot of misinformation and lack of knowledge (outside a place like this) of the benefits of resistance training.
There's a lot of this, IMHO where I comment mostly and see it is: When an OP has lost a most of their weight to the point they're only a couple pounds from goal, are already at a healthy weight, aren't the biggest fans of their aesthetic appearance and want to know what to do to lose more weight. Most of the time to meet their aesthetic goal they don't need to lose weight, but need to get on some sort of structured program to assist with muscle maintenance to lower BF%. It is what it is.3 -
That's funny, when I look around the forums and people are giving out advice I see a lot of "pick an activity you enjoy". Where I do see lifting suggested mightily is in threads where people are complaining about being flabby but at their goal weight. Or people specifically asking about activities to try when they are starting out.
"Lifting heavy" is pretty much lifting at what's heavy/challenging for you, not the suggestion that everyone be an Olympic/Power lifter and constantly try to up weight. Just that strength and resistance training, however you choose to do that, yields results that some people do not get entirely from cardio and find beneficial.2 -
It's MFP, where the only right answer is heavy lifting. Don't agree? GTFO!1
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I never interpreted it as, 'you need to lift'... but more as, 'if you are lifting, you should be lifting the heaviest weight you can manage'.
A lot of people kind of go through the motions with resistance training, and a lot of people-- particularly women-- will use tiny weights and machines that aren't actually forcing them to work, because they think they'll 'get bulky'.
If you enjoy running, I think you're absolutely right in doing that. Do whatever you enjoy.1 -
It all depends on your goal. If you're trying to get lean, you need both strength and cardio. However, the weights should be modest and do enough reps to induce muscle failure. If, on the other hand, you're trying to get big, then, yah - lift lots.0
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Because if you don't do something to keep building the muscle, you're losing muscle along with fat. Nothing wrong with that if you like a flabby body and loose skin. Lifting heavy weights is the easiest way to grow muscle. You can do this without going to a gym. Look into resistance band workouts and get creative. You can wait a while until you lose more fat if that's your goal... but it'll just mean more muscle you need to put back on...
Weight loss is not the only important thing, muscle matters...1 -
Also whenever I say lift heavy it is to emphasise that a 5 or 10lb dumbbell is not what is meant
Women have been poorly served in the fitness industry by the concept of greater reps and pink Dumbbells ...IMHO
Win!
rather the words heavy lifting is a named trend or not, the term is used here that most of us come to see a lot and very used to in which we mean to specially say heavy lifting always means not the 5, 10 pound weenie weights!
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I use 5-10 pound weights regularly for my shoulders.3
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