Is it healthy to completely cut out carbs from my diet?
Replies
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annacole94 wrote: »I would say people have been vegetarian/vegan in India for a few thousand years. Does that qualify as "ancestral"?
Eating no wholesome fruits and veggies gets backlash because, generally, the average North American would be more healthy if they ate more fruits and veggies (and less crap).
India could work if we look at their diet from before western contact... That's quite a while back though.
I think the key dietary change for better health could be "less crap". The crap should be eliminated and replaced with something, and the something could be fruits and veggies; it could also be replaced with animal products.1 -
I think most people wouldn't feel better on zero carbs. Our bodies can survive, but it's not generally going to be optimal to live on exclusively animal products. Plus the expense of such a diet. Plus the environmental impact. Plus the idea of population level health advice.annacole94 wrote: »I would say people have been vegetarian/vegan in India for a few thousand years. Does that qualify as "ancestral"?
Eating no wholesome fruits and veggies gets backlash because, generally, the average North American would be more healthy if they ate more fruits and veggies (and less crap).
India could work if we look at their diet from before western contact... That's quite a while back though.
I think the key dietary change for better health could be "less crap". The crap should be eliminated and replaced with something, and the something could be fruits and veggies; it could also be replaced with animal products.
I get what you're saying. I will concede that some humans can have a healthy diet of whale blubber and polar bear. But I don't think it's good advice to give to anyone to do that today, unless they are in fact Inuit and living in that culture. Food is more than fuel.5 -
Is it healthy to completely cut out carbs from my diet?
It's neither healthy nor unhealthy - depends how you do it - and might depend on your body makeup. It does require much more effort to tune the food balance, it's not just a jump in and eat less carbs for 2 weeks [that would be a bad experience]. There can be unwelcome side effects if not done correctly.
My scale tells me it's the right thing for me - lowest weight in 30 years [still more to lose]. My blood tests are totally normal,1 -
Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.1
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Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Lillymoo01 wrote: »So @EbonyDahlia you don't agree that having vegetables everyday is essential? Strange when that should be close to 50% of our diet. That astounds me, unless you are not knowledgeable enough to realise that vegetables have carbs.
Carbs are not an essential nutrient, therefore vegetables are not essential. Vegetables can certainly contribute to a healthy diet but they are by no means needed. There are actually quite a few carnivores and almost zero carbers on MFP who are thriving without plant matter in their diets. As long as you eat quality animal products, it is not difficult to maintain excellent health without plants in one's diet.
Terrible advice and one to avoid.
Vitamins
Minerals
Phytonutrients
Fiber
What do you suggest?
Supplements?
C'mon!
Any good cut of meat (especially eating a varied diet of meats) along with healthy fats from things like eggs and butter will provide all of the vitamins and minerals that the body needs to thrive.
Phytonutrients - a catch-phrase used by the health food gurus backed by lots of correlation studies that do not offer direct cause/results to justify needing them.
Fiber - needed only to clean out the residue of higher carb diets
Again, as has been posted before, carbs are not a required macro and the body can and does manufacture any glycogen that it needs from both protein and fat.
Still not advised.
You'll be hard pressed to find an RD or RN who'd agree with the above statement.
I'm an RN and I do agree that carbs are not required, as do my two cardiologist friends and colleagues.1 -
Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.
Jason Fung is about as far from "proof" as a children's story book...15 -
This thread delivers big style. There is nothing better than a single digit posting, new user coming onto MFP to tell us all where we have been going wrong all these years. Bookmarked!7
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Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.
My n=1 renders this bolded statement incorrect; 40+ lbs lost all while eating my fair share of carbs, sugar, fruits and vegetables, and grazing like a caribou the entire day. Normally people in the sciences, or with a degree that has some science-type stuff in it, know better than to claim that something is absolutely false, as it instantly puts a question mark on their credibility, if not destroying it outright.8 -
Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.
And here we go.....
FYI: I lost around 50lbs by doing that whole calorie in vs calorie out thing. I must be a special snowflake, or something
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Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Lillymoo01 wrote: »So @EbonyDahlia you don't agree that having vegetables everyday is essential? Strange when that should be close to 50% of our diet. That astounds me, unless you are not knowledgeable enough to realise that vegetables have carbs.
Carbs are not an essential nutrient, therefore vegetables are not essential. Vegetables can certainly contribute to a healthy diet but they are by no means needed. There are actually quite a few carnivores and almost zero carbers on MFP who are thriving without plant matter in their diets. As long as you eat quality animal products, it is not difficult to maintain excellent health without plants in one's diet.
Terrible advice and one to avoid.
Vitamins
Minerals
Phytonutrients
Fiber
What do you suggest?
Supplements?
C'mon!
Any good cut of meat (especially eating a varied diet of meats) along with healthy fats from things like eggs and butter will provide all of the vitamins and minerals that the body needs to thrive.
Phytonutrients - a catch-phrase used by the health food gurus backed by lots of correlation studies that do not offer direct cause/results to justify needing them.
Fiber - needed only to clean out the residue of higher carb diets
Again, as has been posted before, carbs are not a required macro and the body can and does manufacture any glycogen that it needs from both protein and fat.
Still not advised.
You'll be hard pressed to find an RD or RN who'd agree with the above statement.
I'm an RN and I do agree that carbs are not required, as do my two cardiologist friends and colleagues.
So? I'd be much more interested in your real life experience with weight management. How many pounds have you lost? How many years have you been successfully maintaining your loss?
eta: my sister is an RN and is also obese and a smoker. Being a medical professional doesn't necessarily mean a whole lot, when it comes to weight management and nutrition topics.3 -
Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Lillymoo01 wrote: »So @EbonyDahlia you don't agree that having vegetables everyday is essential? Strange when that should be close to 50% of our diet. That astounds me, unless you are not knowledgeable enough to realise that vegetables have carbs.
Carbs are not an essential nutrient, therefore vegetables are not essential. Vegetables can certainly contribute to a healthy diet but they are by no means needed. There are actually quite a few carnivores and almost zero carbers on MFP who are thriving without plant matter in their diets. As long as you eat quality animal products, it is not difficult to maintain excellent health without plants in one's diet.
Terrible advice and one to avoid.
Vitamins
Minerals
Phytonutrients
Fiber
What do you suggest?
Supplements?
C'mon!
Any good cut of meat (especially eating a varied diet of meats) along with healthy fats from things like eggs and butter will provide all of the vitamins and minerals that the body needs to thrive.
Phytonutrients - a catch-phrase used by the health food gurus backed by lots of correlation studies that do not offer direct cause/results to justify needing them.
Fiber - needed only to clean out the residue of higher carb diets
Again, as has been posted before, carbs are not a required macro and the body can and does manufacture any glycogen that it needs from both protein and fat.
Still not advised.
You'll be hard pressed to find an RD or RN who'd agree with the above statement.
I'm an RN and I do agree that carbs are not required, as do my two cardiologist friends and colleagues.
As someone in the medical profession you would seriously think we are at optimum health by eliminating all fruit, vegetables, grains, nuts and pretty much all dairy living purely on animal products and you claim that your cardiologist and colleagues agree? I highly doubt that. Carbs are not required so I guess in that aspect you are correct. We can live without them but there is a vast difference between living and living to optimum health. I get a LOW carb diet but a ZERO carb diet is nothing we should be striving for.
You can be on anyndiet imaginable but if you consume more calories than you burn you will gain weight and if you burn more than you consume you will l9se weight. This isn't bad advise from the 70's but fact.5 -
ok, just for giggles, @Lillymoo01 (and just to clarify this conversation), please define 'optimum health' for us.1
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ok, just for giggles, @Lillymoo01 (and just to clarify this conversation), please define 'optimum health' for us.
Where you are at your best physically and emotionally without being sick or rundown. Without adequate nutrition including all the required micro nutrients I can not see how this is even close to possible. Why you would get giggles from this is beyond me.0 -
lcrivas4jc wrote: »It's impossible to completely cut out carbs. That said, there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate, unlike protein and fat. Check out the ketogenic lifestyle. Don't believe conventional medical advice about what a healthy diet consists of. Most doctors have less than eight hours of nutritional instruction! Also check out Ancel Keys and his completely flawed study (he blatantly lied and skewed the data) back in the 50s, which our government bought hook and sinker and has been shoving down our throats ever since (https://authoritynutrition.com/modern-nutrition-policy-lies-bad-science/). There used to be a really good video about Ancel Keys on Youtube but I have been unable to find it for several months. Ever since his "findings" were published, we've been told to cut the fat and up our consumption of whole grains.
The current American food pyramid should be turned upside down with the grains section deleted. Of course you can lose weight on a lowfat diet but it won't last long and it definitely won't make you healthy. The other thing about the keto lifestyle is that food cravings are dramatically diminished!
I've been eating 25-30 carbs per day for a while and my blood sugars (previously in the low 200s almost immediately went to an average of 80-90.
Totally agree with you on the Ancel keys thing! There are SO many people that are uneducated about this fact. I teach this to my clients (I am a personal trainer). Question, do you exercise regularly? I have thought about trying the ketogenesis diet just to see if it could work for me to help cut body fat but I exercise alot and sweat alot so Im afraid to go that low with carbs.0 -
Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.
15 -
Lillymoo01 wrote: »Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Hello_its_Dan wrote: »Lillymoo01 wrote: »So @EbonyDahlia you don't agree that having vegetables everyday is essential? Strange when that should be close to 50% of our diet. That astounds me, unless you are not knowledgeable enough to realise that vegetables have carbs.
Carbs are not an essential nutrient, therefore vegetables are not essential. Vegetables can certainly contribute to a healthy diet but they are by no means needed. There are actually quite a few carnivores and almost zero carbers on MFP who are thriving without plant matter in their diets. As long as you eat quality animal products, it is not difficult to maintain excellent health without plants in one's diet.
Terrible advice and one to avoid.
Vitamins
Minerals
Phytonutrients
Fiber
What do you suggest?
Supplements?
C'mon!
Any good cut of meat (especially eating a varied diet of meats) along with healthy fats from things like eggs and butter will provide all of the vitamins and minerals that the body needs to thrive.
Phytonutrients - a catch-phrase used by the health food gurus backed by lots of correlation studies that do not offer direct cause/results to justify needing them.
Fiber - needed only to clean out the residue of higher carb diets
Again, as has been posted before, carbs are not a required macro and the body can and does manufacture any glycogen that it needs from both protein and fat.
Still not advised.
You'll be hard pressed to find an RD or RN who'd agree with the above statement.
I'm an RN and I do agree that carbs are not required, as do my two cardiologist friends and colleagues.
As someone in the medical profession you would seriously think we are at optimum health by eliminating all fruit, vegetables, grains, nuts and pretty much all dairy living purely on animal products and you claim that your cardiologist and colleagues agree? I highly doubt that. Carbs are not required so I guess in that aspect you are correct. We can live without them but there is a vast difference between living and living to optimum health. I get a LOW carb diet but a ZERO carb diet is nothing we should be striving for.
You can be on anyndiet imaginable but if you consume more calories than you burn you will gain weight and if you burn more than you consume you will l9se weight. This isn't bad advise from the 70's but fact.
You. I like you.
Most of the people who come to MFP inquiring about giving up all carbs are speaking erroneously about "grains" or "junk food" or "starches" and they were ignorant to begin with that carbohydrates are a part of many nutrient dense foods like fruits and vegetables, dairy, etc. The conversation gets off track in a very predictable way...
A poster says" "I'm thinking of giving up all carbs, is it possible and can it be healthy?"
Many posters: "Why do you think that is necessary? Do you have a medical reason to give up carbs? Do you really mean ZERO carbs or do you mean just giving up starchy foods, grains, sugary 'junk' foods? Do you realize that fruits and vegetables contain carbs as their primary macro nutrient"
Other posters: "I feel great on LCHF! I've finally been able to lose weight and keep it off and it helped me with XYZ medical condition"
Couple of posters "Carbs are ESSENTIAL for health! Of course it isn't healthy to eat nothing but meat and oil!"
Hard core defenders of LC: "WELL.... technically they aren't necessary. Look at the Innuits! You can get all the nutrients you need from animal products (maybe not explicitly stating that it would involve eating rare/raw meat and organ meats"
The conversation is the same, EVERY. SINGLE. TIME. Right down to the fact that the OP almost never makes another appearance, either put off by the fighting, or embarrassed that they didn't realize that carbs are part of fruits and veggies, or they are frightened by the concept of eating organ meat!
The fact of the matter remains, that while it may be possible to achieve adequate levels of nutrition from nothing but animal products and supplements, it is just not necessary for anyone to eat that way, nor is it realistic for most people to commit that heavily to such an extreme diet. I don't understand, and this is a sincere question for those LCHF proponents who are stating that carbs are not required... do you eat a zero carb diet? Do you tell your doctor that you eat this way? What is their reaction? Is your lifestyle one that you really enjoy? When you go to dinner at a restaurant, or a friend's house - do you really eat nothing but meat? How do people in your life respond to that? Do you have children? Do you encourage them to eat carbs in the form of grains, dairy, fruits and veggies? If not, what do their pediatricians think?
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3rdof7sisters wrote: »So, for the average person, you are saying they do not need
Fruits, vegetables, whole grains, legumes
Just lean protein, healthy fats are all you need.
I am serious about this, where do the fruits, vegetables come into a healthy diet?
Sorry that I am so ignorant. Correct me if I am wrong, but the UK is advocating for 10 servings of fruit and vegetables daily.
You are not ignorant nor are you wrong. What the folks have been arguing is that fruits/veggies/grains/etc are not ESSENTIAL for a healthy diet. The only two macros that are ESSENTIAL for a healthy diet are protein and fat. Note that the definition of ESSENTIAL is that it is a macro that the human body cannot manufacture on it's own, therefore it must come from outside the body. Carbs are not ESSENTIAL because the body can manufacture the small amounts of glucose that are actually required for proper function from the fats and protein consumed and use ketones for energy in place of glucose.
Yes, all of the carbs can be a part of a healthy diet, and lots of people include them in a healthy diet, but they are not ESSENTIAL to a healthy diet. In fact, there are people for whom certain carbs are poison - like Celiacs, and others for whom fiber is a major no-no - those with certain forms of IBS can have horrible symptoms from consuming even very small amounts of fiber.
The biggest problem with government guidelines is that they are always a 'one size fits all' approach and humans are very complex and very diversified and it is a rare occasion when the 'one size fits all' approach actually covers everyone.
Carbs aren't poison to celiacs.... gluten is. They can still have a very high carb diet or even a vegan diet and be celiac. And then there are healthy issues that highly benefit from whole grains and high fiber, such as diverticulitis.
It's true, that carbs are non essential nutrients, but it doesn't make them optimal. Good luck building muscle without carbs. Even the best keto diets (CKD/TKD) diets will not produce the same results as a well designed program with carbs, especially in an energy deficit.
Proof that carbs can be beneficial: Blue zones.6 -
ok, just for giggles, @Lillymoo01 (and just to clarify this conversation), please define 'optimum health' for us.
Not littlymoo01 but I'll play
-healthy weight for your stats
-no medical conditions/no need to take prescriptions
-healthy range waist circumference
-consistent good blood work panels (I know there's debate about what that actually looks like, but I go by what my doctor recommends as I respect and trust his judgment)
-normal blood pressure
-good mental health
-no detrimental habits like smoking, excessive alcohol consumption etc
And I personally think you can hit all of these by eating all sorts of macros ratios combinations. You can also be doing everything 'right' and still not be in optimal health due to genetics/medical conditions that are out of your control etc.
One thing I've learned over the past few years is to not take things so seriously. I eat how I like, am successfully managing my weight, have solid feedback from my doctor and I enjoy life. That's good enough for me 4 -
I will also note, that you can have optimal health regardless of the lifestyle that you live. But I will also say this, if you have to supplement, your diet is not optimal (unless you a medical condition that would make it impossible through diet alone, like POTS).5
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Pretty much the vast majority of people "trying" to lose weight are still back in the seventies and reading questionable research. All one needs to read is "The Obesity Code" by Dr. Jason Fung. It is not about calories in vs calories out. This has been proven to be a complete falsehood. If you eat more, your body boosts its metabolic rate to burn those extra calories. Ever notice how you sometimes feel really warm/hot after a big meal? That is your metabolism at work. As for carbohydrates, your body doesn't need them, it can manufacture all the sugar it needs. I challenge anyone here to name me one essential carbohydrate. The body requires essential amino acids (that's protein) and it requires essential fatty acids (that's fat), but there is no such thing as an essential carbohydrate. We also eat too often. 3 meals and 3 snacks per day is overkill and unnecessary. Try cutting out the least important meal of the day and the 3 snacks.
Jason Fung is about as far from "proof" as a children's story book...
One might argue that Dr. Seuss is more credible.11
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