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Is the 'fat acceptance' movement a good thing?
Replies
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Elsiebeane wrote: »So, you are a doctor? You PERSONALLY know what it is like to have hypothrodism ?? You are saying besides busting my *kitten* for months and not only NOT losing weight but gaining four pounds had nothing to do with my thyroid?? It was only because I was not in a deficit? It had nothing to do with UNDIAGNOSED thyroid issues??
I wish I had your black and white view of weight loss. Because UNTIL you walk one day in the life of a person with thyroid disorder, DO NOT tell me all I have to do is watch my calories.
Look, I am a healthy male who cuts on kcals that make petite women cry about being hungry. I won't go into the details, but I don't need to walk a day in your shoes to know what extreme caloric deficits feel like. I just happen to get better results with the same numbers than you could.
Clearly, you now know there's a problem, and need to adjust for it, or get the problem solved via hormone therapy.2 -
zachbonner_ wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »Elsiebeane wrote: »So, you are a doctor? You PERSONALLY know what it is like to have hypothrodism ?? You are saying besides busting my *kitten* for months and not only NOT losing weight but gaining four pounds had nothing to do with my thyroid?? It was only because I was not in a deficit? It had nothing to do with UNDIAGNOSED thyroid issues??
I wish I had your black and white view of weight loss. Because UNTIL you walk one day in the life of a person with thyroid disorder, DO NOT tell me all I have to do is watch my calories.
Look, I am a healthy male who cuts on kcals that make petite women cry about being hungry. I won't go into the details, but I don't need to walk a day in your shoes to know what extreme caloric deficits feel like. I just happen to get better results with the same numbers than you could.
Clearly, you now know there's a problem, and need to adjust for it, or get the problem solved via hormone therapy.
wait...why are you on 1200 a day?
Because long cuts anger me. I get it over with fast, so I can get back to real eating and training before my strength has a chance to fall off.0 -
Gallowmere1984 wrote: »heiliskrimsli wrote: »You ever watch that show- my big fat fabulous life? I think that helped me decide how I felt about it! The girl is all about accepting all body types in her dance class- which I think is great, I hate hearing of heavier people being fat shamed when they're being active!
And made a music video where she holds down a thin woman and forces cupcakes into her mouth. For Whitney Way Thore, there is no acceptance of thin, fit bodies.
I've seen her show. It's actually one of my hate-watch pleasures. It's an unending stream of her attempting to do things that are not a huge deal for someone who is healthy and normal weight, but for her result in embarrassing and injurious results. She cannot ride a bicycle for two miles on flat, paved loop. Can't stand still on a pair of skis on level ground. Can't pick the shampoo up in the shower without throwing out her back. Can't complete forty minutes of a dance-a-thon without losing consciousness and heading to the ER via ambulance. Can't fit into a Mazda Miata without the convertible top open. Can't walk the distance of a St. Patrick's Day parade. Can't fit into one airplane seat.
Then there's the constant crying. In every episode, there's something that she's crying about. Her life seems the exact opposite of fabulous.I also know that some people have a thyroid issue or such that can go undiagnosed and cause weight gain,
Not unless they're eating more calories than they're burning.and just with how thin models are and children thinking if they don't look a certain way that they are ugly or fat- I think we should accept all body types, and be positive and encouraging because we don't know what others people's battles are
Much like I will not be promoting meth mouth acceptance or alcoholic liver cirrhosis acceptance, I will never be promoting obesity acceptance.... but in that show I mentioned, she passes out in one episode and is told she has to get ahold of her weight because it's killing her.. THAT is not something I think gets people- you cannot encourage a healthy lifestyle when it's a hazard to your health like that! The line has to be drawn somewhere, that's my point- morbidly obese is definitely where the line should be drawn about!
I draw it at overweight. It's why I am not anymore, and why I continue to strive to optimize my weight, bodyfat, lean mass and cardiovascular health. Because that's the best thing that I can do for my body. That is how I love my body. By making it the most healthy, finely tuned machine that I can.
Miatas actually have pretty strict weight restrictions. She has no business in one anyway.
ETA: from the inside of my door:
She got on a horse, which is abusive to the horse since they should never carry more than 20% of their own weight. I despise her and consider her a horrible person.4 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »heiliskrimsli wrote: »You ever watch that show- my big fat fabulous life? I think that helped me decide how I felt about it! The girl is all about accepting all body types in her dance class- which I think is great, I hate hearing of heavier people being fat shamed when they're being active!
And made a music video where she holds down a thin woman and forces cupcakes into her mouth. For Whitney Way Thore, there is no acceptance of thin, fit bodies.
I've seen her show. It's actually one of my hate-watch pleasures. It's an unending stream of her attempting to do things that are not a huge deal for someone who is healthy and normal weight, but for her result in embarrassing and injurious results. She cannot ride a bicycle for two miles on flat, paved loop. Can't stand still on a pair of skis on level ground. Can't pick the shampoo up in the shower without throwing out her back. Can't complete forty minutes of a dance-a-thon without losing consciousness and heading to the ER via ambulance. Can't fit into a Mazda Miata without the convertible top open. Can't walk the distance of a St. Patrick's Day parade. Can't fit into one airplane seat.
Then there's the constant crying. In every episode, there's something that she's crying about. Her life seems the exact opposite of fabulous.I also know that some people have a thyroid issue or such that can go undiagnosed and cause weight gain,
Not unless they're eating more calories than they're burning.and just with how thin models are and children thinking if they don't look a certain way that they are ugly or fat- I think we should accept all body types, and be positive and encouraging because we don't know what others people's battles are
Much like I will not be promoting meth mouth acceptance or alcoholic liver cirrhosis acceptance, I will never be promoting obesity acceptance.... but in that show I mentioned, she passes out in one episode and is told she has to get ahold of her weight because it's killing her.. THAT is not something I think gets people- you cannot encourage a healthy lifestyle when it's a hazard to your health like that! The line has to be drawn somewhere, that's my point- morbidly obese is definitely where the line should be drawn about!
I draw it at overweight. It's why I am not anymore, and why I continue to strive to optimize my weight, bodyfat, lean mass and cardiovascular health. Because that's the best thing that I can do for my body. That is how I love my body. By making it the most healthy, finely tuned machine that I can.
Miatas actually have pretty strict weight restrictions. She has no business in one anyway.
ETA: from the inside of my door:
She got on a horse, which is abusive to the horse since they should never carry more than 20% of their own weight. I despise her and consider her a horrible person.
Oh, so the horse thing wasn't a joke? Holy hell, that's cruel.1 -
Packerjohn wrote: »It least she's not getting on a horse. The Mazda can't feel pain.
About that: https://goo.gl/images/fyhjBW0 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »It least she's not getting on a horse. The Mazda can't feel pain.
About that: https://goo.gl/images/fyhjBW
What kind of responsible horse owner would allow that? Whitney is awful, let me state that right up front, but so is the owner of the horse who allowed that.2 -
zachbonner_ wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »zachbonner_ wrote: »Gallowmere1984 wrote: »Elsiebeane wrote: »So, you are a doctor? You PERSONALLY know what it is like to have hypothrodism ?? You are saying besides busting my *kitten* for months and not only NOT losing weight but gaining four pounds had nothing to do with my thyroid?? It was only because I was not in a deficit? It had nothing to do with UNDIAGNOSED thyroid issues??
I wish I had your black and white view of weight loss. Because UNTIL you walk one day in the life of a person with thyroid disorder, DO NOT tell me all I have to do is watch my calories.
Look, I am a healthy male who cuts on kcals that make petite women cry about being hungry. I won't go into the details, but I don't need to walk a day in your shoes to know what extreme caloric deficits feel like. I just happen to get better results with the same numbers than you could.
Clearly, you now know there's a problem, and need to adjust for it, or get the problem solved via hormone therapy.
wait...why are you on 1200 a day?
Because long cuts anger me. I get it over with fast, so I can get back to real eating and training before my strength has a chance to fall off.
oh ok good lol. I was gonna say how the *kitten* are you lifting on 1200
I am still lifting on that, and I've actually managed to still hit a couple of PRs.0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »heiliskrimsli wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »It least she's not getting on a horse. The Mazda can't feel pain.
About that: https://goo.gl/images/fyhjBW
What kind of responsible horse owner would allow that? Whitney is awful, let me state that right up front, but so is the owner of the horse who allowed that.
I agree with you that everyone who made that happen is a horrible person.0 -
GottaBurnEmAll wrote: »heiliskrimsli wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »It least she's not getting on a horse. The Mazda can't feel pain.
About that: https://goo.gl/images/fyhjBW
What kind of responsible horse owner would allow that? Whitney is awful, let me state that right up front, but so is the owner of the horse who allowed that.
The producers probably have their phones and email blowing up from PETA supporters and the Humane Society of the US. (The name of the owner has been changed for their protection.)1 -
heiliskrimsli wrote: »Packerjohn wrote: »It least she's not getting on a horse. The Mazda can't feel pain.
About that: https://goo.gl/images/fyhjBW
Where is the ASPCA when you need them?0 -
The show sounds like it's nothing but fat shaming.0
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The show sounds like it's nothing but fat shaming.
Well, it's supposed to be about body acceptance and how the main character has come to love herself despite being obese. The last two seasons have had a lot of episodes about how awful and hateful people are by trying to fat shame her. It's kind of a train wreck. Hard to look away. I keep watching in the hopes that she will actually take some long term action to improve her health.0 -
Dija92, I'm going to be a bit contentious in what I'm going to say and I hope people don't leap upon me for having said it. No, of course, we all know that being overweight by 100 lbs or even 50 isn't considered to be "healthy" by today's standards, studies etc. but, let me say that there are quite a few "skinny" people who are walking around, less healthy than someone who is nearly 300 lbs in differing ways. Both can be under-nourished in spite of weight (being contrary to what one would think). Someone who "shames" a Plus Sized person is a SHALLOW person in the first place. Society tends to like and adore thin people and, unfortunately that's what they've come to think of as "healthy" or "beautiful" vs a Plus Sized person. Even those on this site who are "judging" and even, sadly, "fat shaming" are coming from a place of trained thinking by today's Society's standards. And, it's a shame because the very people who are in this forum, are the same people who are/have struggling/struggled with their own weight to one extent or another. However, there is often nothing worse than someone who has dropped a habit or weight and somehow, thinks that they are qualified to pass judgement on others. Sadly, many of the same people who are "fat shaming" in here, will very likely also find themselves being the very same people who have to battle getting weight off again. It's easier to get weight off than to KEEP it off. The shoe might be on the other foot one day for these people again. Nothing is worse than an ex-smoker who shames the crap out of those who still smoke. Part of that is because they, themselves, want to smoke again or...as in "fat shaming" feel the need to say, "I did it so, you should too!" Not necessarily because they care about the smoker but, also because they don't like people around them who smoke as it *may* stir up cravings???? Who knows but, everyone's psyche is different. I can also say that I know people who are slim, and allegedly physically fit and always have been because they run, work out, eat in moderation and STILL are on blood pressure meds, cholestrol pills and are diabetic.
Likewise, those who say, "you need to work on your own psyche" are more than likely, the very same people who either have had problems with theirs or are still having problems. They know what they *should* say and say it but, they're still struggling within themselves too and would love nothing better than to dive into a chocolate cake, head-first
One thing that I can say, having gotten down to goal weight many times throughout my life (I'm 60 years old and started with weight loss plans, including Weight Watchers and became a lifetime member) is that we also have to be HAPPY in life. Health also entails Mental Health too. So, if you're ok with yourself at perhaps, a higher weight than you should be, according to charts and stats and studies etc., try just keeping as fit as possible for your weight and lower your expectations of being "thin". Be you. Be proud of you no matter what your weight, as long as you can do the things that you like to do in Life. The numbers on your scale or the numbers on your size label are not indicative of being HAPPY. There's plenty of thin folk out there who are NOT happy or even healthy (physically, mentally or both).
As for Society and smokers...you're right. Society is repulsed by both but, as long as a smoker doesn't blow smoke in their faces, they will not kick up as much of a fuss as they will over a plus sized person. People will say less about a stoned person or a drunk than they will about plus sized people. That's how shallow society can be. Of course, we have the "Health Nuts" who don't want to even be around a smoker even if not smoking (smells...ooooo...nooooo!), eat only organic/vegan/vegetarian and puff out their chests that they're superior because they don't eat anything with a face or anything that the face produces and turn it into a religion.
They will also head to the gym 6 or 7 days a week and spend at least an hour or more, run, ride bikes (to save on pollution for some as "The Green People") and they won't touch anything that isn't considered "healthy". I know those types of people as well. Guess what? Several of them are no longer living for differing reasons. There is NO guarantee for any longevity no matter what you do. You can have the best of genes, the best of lifestyle and be hit by a bus, die in a traffic accident or fall off a cliff while mountain climbing or hiking!
I know that I'm late in coming into this convo and I haven't read every single response but, that's my 2 cent's worth. Yes, Society does look down upon people who are not "average" but, is anyone really "average"? We're all individuals with our warts, flaws and faults. Some of the healthiest, slimmest, wealthiest people on the planet are still not happy with themselves or their lives and are into drugs, plastic surgery/procedures etc.. Just be HAPPY no matter what you do. Losing some weight is healthier but, not the be-all and end-all to everything. Trust someone who has been at both ends of the spectrum many times now. I'm only trying again now because I'm tired of the "shaming" and tired of trying to find reasonably priced, fashionable clothing as well as because my doc is and always has been thin and bugs the crap out of me to "lose weight". I'm just fed up with hearing it all again and again. If you're ok with whatever weight you are, just work at being a bit more physically fit at your weight level.
Be well! Be YOU! Be HAPPY!!!!!
Best of wishes!0 -
RaeBeeBaby wrote: »The show sounds like it's nothing but fat shaming.
Well, it's supposed to be about body acceptance and how the main character has come to love herself despite being obese. The last two seasons have had a lot of episodes about how awful and hateful people are by trying to fat shame her. It's kind of a train wreck. Hard to look away. I keep watching in the hopes that she will actually take some long term action to improve her health.
Is it her "health" that you're concerned with or, is it her above average size and looks? Be honest. What if she were to have perfect blood pressure, perfect cholesterol, perfect blood glucose, fit and able to do things even some thinner people can't do? Would you be saying the same things? Just curious as to how people think.0 -
Just watched the first two episodes.
Don't understand parents who enable their child like that.
If the girl can't shave her legs, then she will have hairy legs.
Or she can recognize that there is something wrong with her.
Loved her dance class, too bad she didn't combine it with some calorie control.1 -
In my opinion Fat Acceptance is not a good thing. Now self love is a great thing! But I think too many people get those two things confused. You can love your body but still want to be healthy but promoting a unhealthy lifestyle of obesity is not good for anyone especially young people who struggle with a unhealthy weight already. Like someone else said either extreme is not healthy. Of course everyone's body type is different and we don't know someone's story so no one should judge or be cruel. However, we as a society need to promote healthy eating and getting away from the laziness that is taking over our society and instead getting out side and being active! Fat acceptance goes beyond looks, it's accepting the possibility of heart disease, diabetes, bone illnesses, and the list goes on... Everyone should love themselves how they are right now but they also need to love themselves enough to take care of the only body they are given.
I'm not disagreeing that being severely overweight is "not healthy" by any means nor, are people necessarily able to "love themselves" as an overweight person. Society won't let them. Deep down inside, everyone knows that in spite of what they say, they're not happy with being overweight either. No one truly is.
That being said though...what about the thin and "beautiful people" who are also not happy with themselves or their lives in spite of being thin, gorgeous, wealthy and having a plethora of yes people around them at all times? They're into drugs, drinking, plastic surgery, cosmetic procedures and end up living a lifestyle of every chasing that happiness, youth or whatever it is that they need to feel happy within themselves.
Is happiness really only in a scale number or clothing size or fitting into the "normality of society"? There are thin people who are just as unhealthy as a plus sized person. They are on meds for blood pressure, heart disease, diabetes etc., get cancers or even hit by cars, trucks and buses.
So, while I am agreeing with you, there's also a flip side to this as well. There is no size or weight that makes people happy in life in all reality, is there? Health is all subjective and while studies have said that it's healthier to be slimmer/weigh less, there are all sorts of other factors that make people "healthy", right? Mental health is one factor as well. Being slim doesn't necessarily mean either.
As you've said, be as healthy as we can be with the body that we have....and I'll add...no matter what our weight...as long as we can do what we need and want to do in Life.
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Lovetobeslimmer2 wrote: »RaeBeeBaby wrote: »The show sounds like it's nothing but fat shaming.
Well, it's supposed to be about body acceptance and how the main character has come to love herself despite being obese. The last two seasons have had a lot of episodes about how awful and hateful people are by trying to fat shame her. It's kind of a train wreck. Hard to look away. I keep watching in the hopes that she will actually take some long term action to improve her health.
Is it her "health" that you're concerned with or, is it her above average size and looks? Be honest. What if she were to have perfect blood pressure, perfect cholesterol, perfect blood glucose, fit and able to do things even some thinner people can't do? Would you be saying the same things? Just curious as to how people think.
Actually, and "being completely honest" as you say I could care less about her size or her looks (although she is a pretty woman). I like the people on this show, especially her parents who very apparently care about her, as do her close friends. The parents had really nothing to do with her weight gain, as she was not a heavy child growing up and she gained almost all of her weight after she went to college (vague references to an emotional break-up) and a lot of talk about PCOS. During the first season she talked a lot about maintaining her health despite her size, but that has not been the case. She has not maintained her health. She seems to make an effort, but then doesn't stick with it. For such a young age, her health has deteriorated over each season, rather than improved. Her vitals are definitely not perfect and she's had a couple serious scares including a heart event. I do care about her health and I want to see her wake up and take control of her life. So I will still be watching and hoping for the best for her. However, then it would have to be renamed to "My Smaller Yet Still Fabulous Life" and I bet a lot of people would still watch and cheer her on.0 -
cbminstrel wrote: »Is this a very American thing? I'm over in England and haven't really heard of this 'Fat Acceptance' thing (far from it lol)...or have I just been hiding under a rock?! On the surface, it seemed like it might be a nice thing, but the more I've been reading the thread, the more it seems like a campaign dreamt up to keep high fat/calorie/cheap to make foods in the supermarkets.....
I'm so sorry but, I'm chuckling here because I know quite a few people in the U.K. who aren't exactly eating healthfully. The mashed potatoes, gravies, chips, etc., booze and whatever, consumed over there with pot pies are not really "health food fare", are they? So, how is it that you can say that fat acceptance is a campaign dreamt up to keep high fat/calorie/cheap to make foods in supermarkets when England's supermarkets are filled with high fat/high sugar/calorie dense foods that get washed down with a pint or two or 10?
Ok, I have to straighten up here and stop laughing as I'm not American but, I've heard of it.
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divinehipster69 wrote: »No, it's not a good thing. Obesity causes medical conditions that cost taxpayers money. Not to mention the heartbreak when a loved one dies over something that could have been prevented. More children have type 2 diabetes than ever before. Obese women that decide to have children before losing weight put their kids at risk for all sorts of crap (I've had friends whose doctors warned them about their diets, their kids almost died because they didn't listen!!). People should be taught how to love their bodies by feeding themselves properly. Otherwise it's just saying, "I don't care if you die from preventable causes." Nothing positive about that!! If you're overweight or obese and working on it, great. But claiming to be at optimal health at a BMI of 30+ is delusional.
You know what people are finding "delusional" is that being a certain size or weight range is the Holy Grail to perfect health. I don't disagree that being overweight puts people at more risk for certain health issues than thin people but, I know plenty of thin people who have always been thin/slim who have more health issues than overweight/obese people. It's not a guarantee or cure-all to be "normal weight" either. And, no...I am here because I'm NOT accepting myself at the weight that I'm at for all sorts of reasons but, I'm never going to "fat shame" those who are ok with it because I've lost all of my family and several friends (who were all of normal weights and not overweight by more than 5 lbs) through differing diseases/accidents/suicides. Life is full of surprise endings no matter what weight one is at. That's my only point so, to "shame" someone by using those types of statements about hurting others by preventable causes, is not exactly accurate. If that were true...no one would get into a car, work a dangerous job or have activities that are considered "risky". We'd have no cops, fire fighters or rescue workers, would we? 1 -
[/quote]
Because the fat acceptance movement is a pretty divisive topic, mostly due to the extremists in the group who want obesity to not only be accepted, but normalized and encouraged.[/quote]
Really? You think it's that simple and all boils down to that simple a statement or thought?
Do you really think that the majority of people who ask about fat acceptance are all trying to be "extremists...who want obesity to not only be accepted, but normalized and encouraged?"
Ask yourself why the OP is in the site at all then? Do you think that she's here to be an "extremist" and convert you and everyone else into "fat acceptors"?
Wow...what a naive and prejudiced statement to have made.
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