Which lifting program is the best for you?
Replies
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MeVersusFat wrote: »MeVersusFat wrote: »Are dumbbells less effective than the barbell when doing a progressive weightlifting program?
It's usually more about effectiveness and ability.
Hard to get dumbbells that increase less than 5lbs. Per side. So 10 lb total jump in weight.
That may be too much, so you are doing some workout at below what is possible with a 5lb increase for some amount of time before you can make that 10 lb jump.
Or if doing a method of increasing reps until you increase weight, then lower reps back down - your rep range to allow that 10lb jump could be rather big. But at least then you are progressively making it more difficult.
Some lifts don't translate to dumbbell well either - squats & deadlifts for example.
And since dumbbells rely so much on other supporting muscles for balance - you may not be truly working the main focus muscle to it's max ability because the supporting ones are holding you back.
So there could be a good span of time until they catch up - in some cases they never will to allow main muscle to be overloaded.
Because I can't go to the gym and I don't have much space in my home for a lot of equipment I opted for the M&S dumbbell program I would just add more reps every week like you mentioned. However, I've been reading that dumbbells are less effective particularly with squats like you mentioned, and I just want to do what's most effective so I guess I'm going to have to get a barbell. I do have another question I don't have a bench to do bench presses I've been doing all my presses lying flat on the floor is this also less effective?
Slightly. But safer too.
Couple cinder blocks and 16" wide board, you've just improved things and still safe. Well, depending on how hard to get up and down off floor basically.
You can attempt to keep squat form with dumbbells, like up on shoulder can work.
To the front for deadlift like form would normally dictate.0 -
MeVersusFat wrote: »MeVersusFat wrote: »Are dumbbells less effective than the barbell when doing a progressive weightlifting program?
It's usually more about effectiveness and ability.
Hard to get dumbbells that increase less than 5lbs. Per side. So 10 lb total jump in weight.
That may be too much, so you are doing some workout at below what is possible with a 5lb increase for some amount of time before you can make that 10 lb jump.
Or if doing a method of increasing reps until you increase weight, then lower reps back down - your rep range to allow that 10lb jump could be rather big. But at least then you are progressively making it more difficult.
Some lifts don't translate to dumbbell well either - squats & deadlifts for example.
And since dumbbells rely so much on other supporting muscles for balance - you may not be truly working the main focus muscle to it's max ability because the supporting ones are holding you back.
So there could be a good span of time until they catch up - in some cases they never will to allow main muscle to be overloaded.
Because I can't go to the gym and I don't have much space in my home for a lot of equipment I opted for the M&S dumbbell program I would just add more reps every week like you mentioned. However, I've been reading that dumbbells are less effective particularly with squats like you mentioned, and I just want to do what's most effective so I guess I'm going to have to get a barbell. I do have another question I don't have a bench to do bench presses I've been doing all my presses lying flat on the floor is this also less effective?
Slightly. But safer too.
Couple cinder blocks and 16" wide board, you've just improved things and still safe. Well, depending on how hard to get up and down off floor basically.
You can attempt to keep squat form with dumbbells, like up on shoulder can work.
To the front for deadlift like form would normally dictate.
To add, there are plenty of variations such as pistol or goblet squats which are good. But we have to work within the means of the equipment even if that is at the expense ot effectiveness.0 -
Any issue with changing the order of SL lifts? Basically, I'm finding I can get to the squat rack ahead of others but would like to do the squat then the row before moving to the bench. Just concerned if I go to the bench I'll then have to find somewhere funky to row but if I do the row right after the squat I can use the rack space.
I'm at the Y and there are limited racks. I want to keep with the Y for swimming. I just have noticed lately the one rack is free a couple times a week that fits my schedule so I just started this week. Only doing two a week as I'm more focused on training for a 1/2 marathon right now.
Thanks0 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »Any issue with changing the order of SL lifts? Basically, I'm finding I can get to the squat rack ahead of others but would like to do the squat then the row before moving to the bench. Just concerned if I go to the bench I'll then have to find somewhere funky to row but if I do the row right after the squat I can use the rack space.
I'm at the Y and there are limited racks. I want to keep with the Y for swimming. I just have noticed lately the one rack is free a couple times a week that fits my schedule so I just started this week. Only doing two a week as I'm more focused on training for a 1/2 marathon right now.
Thanks
I've always found it useful to move a lift earlier if I wanted more focus on it, because later would be some aspect of tiredness, not truly overload, as factor in difficulty doing it.
So it'll be interesting if you are already at the upper limits slowly progressing, if you see a big change with the swap - easier row, harder bench, at same weight.0 -
Tacklewasher wrote: »Any issue with changing the order of SL lifts? Basically, I'm finding I can get to the squat rack ahead of others but would like to do the squat then the row before moving to the bench. Just concerned if I go to the bench I'll then have to find somewhere funky to row but if I do the row right after the squat I can use the rack space.
I'm at the Y and there are limited racks. I want to keep with the Y for swimming. I just have noticed lately the one rack is free a couple times a week that fits my schedule so I just started this week. Only doing two a week as I'm more focused on training for a 1/2 marathon right now.
Thanks
I've always found it useful to move a lift earlier if I wanted more focus on it, because later would be some aspect of tiredness, not truly overload, as factor in difficulty doing it.
So it'll be interesting if you are already at the upper limits slowly progressing, if you see a big change with the swap - easier row, harder bench, at same weight.
I've done 1 day of SL, so yeah, not at the upper limits. I'm thinking someone has switched gyms as I've just noticed the rack has been empty so decided to switch to it.0 -
So you mean before someone new comes in - you can put an official looking sticker with your name claiming it, as of course the old-timer of the gym (they don't know how long you've been there).1
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Quick question for the group. My wife is looking to add lifting to her routine. She is pretty new to the lifting realm and as limited time. Right now she is looking for something along the lines of a upper/lower split or an A/B split since she only has day days a week she can lift right now. This would be in a home gym so basic equipment and compound movements are fine since I can help instruct on form.
Any program recommendations that she could follow?0 -
Quick question for the group. My wife is looking to add lifting to her routine. She is pretty new to the lifting realm and as limited time. Right now she is looking for something along the lines of a upper/lower split or an A/B split since she only has day days a week she can lift right now. This would be in a home gym so basic equipment and compound movements are fine since I can help instruct on form.
Any program recommendations that she could follow?
I did Stronglifts 5X5 for about 14 months when I started. It was awesome.0 -
Quick question for the group. My wife is looking to add lifting to her routine. She is pretty new to the lifting realm and as limited time. Right now she is looking for something along the lines of a upper/lower split or an A/B split since she only has day days a week she can lift right now. This would be in a home gym so basic equipment and compound movements are fine since I can help instruct on form.
Any program recommendations that she could follow?
StrongCurves, TLS and NROL4W are solid choices for programs.0 -
While I have no idea on TLS and NROL4W (because they are book links and I can't see the setup) most the others are for 3 day a week workouts. Since my wife can only lift twice a week is it fine to just extend out the program for now or would there be a different recommendation?0
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Stronglifts can be done 2x week.
FYI - the typo in your OP didn't make that clear.2 -
While I have no idea on TLS and NROL4W (because they are book links and I can't see the setup) most the others are for 3 day a week workouts. Since my wife can only lift twice a week is it fine to just extend out the program for now or would there be a different recommendation?
NROL4W is a basic A/B lifting program. TLS has a 3, 4, and 5 day programs. StrongCurves is largely lower body focused if your wife wants more booty focused. You could take a 3 day full body and make it a 2 day program if that is all you have availability for; similarly, you could do that with a 4 day program since many are upper/lower. Recognize that in the beginning, it's not optimal, but that can change if your wife enjoys the programs and gets more time for them.0 -
@quiksylver296 sorry about that, it has been a long week already with not enough sleep. Missed that typo.
Thanks for the input from the both of you. I'll pass this on to my wife.
@psuLemon yeah I'm hoping that the lifting bug will bite her and this will become more frequent but twice a week is all I could get out of her for the moment.0 -
@quiksylver296 sorry about that, it has been a long week already with not enough sleep. Missed that typo.
Thanks for the input from the both of you. I'll pass this on to my wife.
@psuLemon yeah I'm hoping that the lifting bug will bite her and this will become more frequent but twice a week is all I could get out of her for the moment.
FYI - Stronglifts 5X5 has a free app you can download. It takes all the guesswork out of the program. It tells you what exercise to do at what weight. I found that feature super helpful. @azercord2 -
@quiksylver296 I'll have to give it a peek then. I've got some free time this week before I head home for the weekend.0
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quiksylver296 wrote: »@quiksylver296 sorry about that, it has been a long week already with not enough sleep. Missed that typo.
Thanks for the input from the both of you. I'll pass this on to my wife.
@psuLemon yeah I'm hoping that the lifting bug will bite her and this will become more frequent but twice a week is all I could get out of her for the moment.
FYI - Stronglifts 5X5 has a free app you can download. It takes all the guesswork out of the program. It tells you what exercise to do at what weight. I found that feature super helpful. @azercord
The Stronglifts 5x5 smartphone app (using the Android version) is the reason I started and stuck with it for the past few months.
Paying for the bonus upgrades? Honestly, is worth it.
I started with just the Olympic bar back on December 23rd, 2017 and I've made great strength gains overall.
Today, was workout B, and I just did, for the first time, Overhead Press of 135 lbs. for 5x5 and it feels awesome.
My Squat was 240 lbs. and Deadlift was 265 lbs.
Also the app, in paid form, gives you assistance work options: So I chose for workout B, Barbell Curls and Close Grip Bench Press.
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I've always wondered why most programs are upper body focused? Like if it's not a split format, there is usually 1 day for legs and every other day for upper body. Or when it's 3 days of full body there is only 2-3 exercises for lower body and 10 other for upper body. Is this because they are mostly written for men who usually don't really care about building muscles for their lower body? Or is 1 day a week enough to build leg muscles for real? I know there are programs which are more lower body focused, I'm just curious.0
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I've always wondered why most programs are upper body focused? Like if it's not a split format, there is usually 1 day for legs and every other day for upper body. Or when it's 3 days of full body there is only 2-3 exercises for lower body and 10 other for upper body. Is this because they are mostly written for men who usually don't really care about building muscles for their lower body? Or is 1 day a week enough to build leg muscles for real? I know there are programs which are more lower body focused, I'm just curious.
Mostly because the lower body is simpler in structure/muscle groups than the upper body. Comparing legs to upper body isn't a fair comparison. It would be more accurate to compare lower body/legs to only working the arms and shoulders in the upper body (and even then, the shoulders are more complex than the glutes/hips).
As for whether one day a week is enough to build leg muscles, the general consensus in the evidence-based community right now is that working a muscle group twice per week is optimal in terms of gains.2 -
I've always wondered why most programs are upper body focused? Like if it's not a split format, there is usually 1 day for legs and every other day for upper body. Or when it's 3 days of full body there is only 2-3 exercises for lower body and 10 other for upper body. Is this because they are mostly written for men who usually don't really care about building muscles for their lower body? Or is 1 day a week enough to build leg muscles for real? I know there are programs which are more lower body focused, I'm just curious.
I have no idea either. Maybe some of those programs are written for more advanced bodybuilders who are just adding a little extra to their already developed physiques, they are already satisfied with their lower body progress.
I focus on lower body 4x per week so working it only once a week would be so suboptimal for my goals. Before I knew what I was doing I did a typical "bro split" with one leg day a week.. and my lack of results reflected that ... Yikes
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Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/21711480 -
GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.2 -
I've always wondered why most programs are upper body focused? Like if it's not a split format, there is usually 1 day for legs and every other day for upper body. Or when it's 3 days of full body there is only 2-3 exercises for lower body and 10 other for upper body. Is this because they are mostly written for men who usually don't really care about building muscles for their lower body? Or is 1 day a week enough to build leg muscles for real? I know there are programs which are more lower body focused, I'm just curious.
I have no idea either. Maybe some of those programs are written for more advanced bodybuilders who are just adding a little extra to their already developed physiques, they are already satisfied with their lower body progress.
I focus on lower body 4x per week so working it only once a week would be so suboptimal for my goals. Before I knew what I was doing I did a typical "bro split" with one leg day a week.. and my lack of results reflected that ... Yikes
Well your body is GOALS now
I suspected that 1 day for gains is like doing nothing at all... 
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GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.
can I go without the squat rack or use something else that wont take up so much space?0 -
GirlVersusFat wrote: »GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.
can I go without the squat rack or use something else that wont take up so much space?
Google "squat rack stands."0 -
I know what a squat rack stand is, I just wanted to know if it was really that important particularly for a beginner like myself, I thought it was for lifting very heavy.GirlVersusFat wrote: »GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.
can I go without the squat rack or use something else that wont take up so much space?
Google "squat rack stands."
I guess I will either not do barbell squats or opted out of buying a barbell all together1 -
If you are looking into doing Stronglifts, even as a beginner, you will need a squat rack pretty fast, and a bar and plates that will take you through that beginners programme to an intermediate level.
Look for equipment that will allow you to lift 2x+ your body weight in a deadlift and squat (as a minimum). You don't want to keep out growing and having to reinvest in the basics.
Before investing in equipment you may want to try a gym (if this is an option) for a couple of months to see how you progress and what you need to invest in for a home gym.
Cheers, h.
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GirlVersusFat wrote: »
I know what a squat rack stand is, I just wanted to know if it was really that important particularly for a beginner like myself, I thought it was for lifting very heavy.GirlVersusFat wrote: »GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.
can I go without the squat rack or use something else that wont take up so much space?
Google "squat rack stands."
I guess I will either not do barbell squats or opted out of buying a barbell all together
A squat rack stand (and full rack) is mainly a SAFETY device.
A squat rack stand would be suitable for lower weights (I'd guess around 250) but should labeled with specific weight rating.
They make it easier to place the bar on (and get it off) your shoulders but the safety arms on the rack (if positioned properly) prevent the bar from pinning you to the ground and injuring you, if you fail doing a squat.
If you are going to do bad squats w/a barbell, you should get a pair or join a gym and use the rack there for your own safety.
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@Lee1st1974, you might want to check this thread out0
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I've always wondered why most programs are upper body focused? Like if it's not a split format, there is usually 1 day for legs and every other day for upper body. Or when it's 3 days of full body there is only 2-3 exercises for lower body and 10 other for upper body. Is this because they are mostly written for men who usually don't really care about building muscles for their lower body? Or is 1 day a week enough to build leg muscles for real? I know there are programs which are more lower body focused, I'm just curious.
I have no idea either. Maybe some of those programs are written for more advanced bodybuilders who are just adding a little extra to their already developed physiques, they are already satisfied with their lower body progress.
I focus on lower body 4x per week so working it only once a week would be so suboptimal for my goals. Before I knew what I was doing I did a typical "bro split" with one leg day a week.. and my lack of results reflected that ... Yikes
I think it’s the bodybuilding centric mentality. Lower body just doesn’t stand out gym bro whose looking for bicep peaks.
I run a upper lower split that gives equal billing to both part. If I didn’t have a hang up with the bench I’d focus more on lower. It means more to total in competition.
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GirlVersusFat wrote: »GirlVersusFat wrote: »Is this a good barbell to start off with? I want to move on to stronglifts but I've seen a bunch of different barbells I'm not even sure if I'm supposed to be looking for something in particular.
https://www.walmart.com/ip/US-Weight-55-lbs-Aerobic-Weight-Set/2171148
Look for a 45lb olympic barbell. You need a squat rack.
This barbell and weights is good for "exercising" but not for a strength program.
can I go without the squat rack or use something else that wont take up so much space?
You're going to be up to 100 lbs + before you know it. You gonna press that over your head?1
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