Of refeeds and diet breaks
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I wish I could get a DXA scan. I’m clueless as to what my body fat actually is.
My BMI is just within normal around 24.8. My waist-hip ratio is .69 and My waist height ratio .426. (So for a 50+ year old those ratios are darn good). I’m a pear or almost hourglass. Big thunderous thighs but 27 inch waist.
Strength training for 6 months (I can hardly call it lifting ‘heavy’ tho it is heavy for me). But 3 if those months I was still at a considerable deficit and losing quite a bit of weight.
Now that I’m more or less at maintenance I’m so confused. Not happy with how I look, but I’m almost in XS tops with huge hips that look even bigger next to my nice waist. Honestly I think my body just looks weird and I can’t find pants that flatter me.
Lol, I guess I can’t cater to vanity.
You can use visual images of estimated body fat percentages to get a rough estimate. Note that if you fall under a certain image, it's probably best to select the upper end of that range. Many people don't like to admit they carry more fat than they think.
Optionally, you could ask someone to estimate it for you. I've done it for a few people in this thread, and it's purely clinical, albeit unapologetic with the estimate.
Last option would be to get something like a Skulpt body fat analyzer. It's $99 on amazon, and while it's not a DXA, it is reusable and it's fairly more accurate than BIA scales or handheld monitors.
If you're at maintenance weight, but not visually satisfied, just continue to strength train and gradually increase the load. Heavy is always a relative term, so if it's heavy for you, then it's heavy. If you can do more weight, more reps, or more sets, or any combination of all of those, you are gaining an objective measure of strength which helps with muscle development and by extension, will produce a better body shape.This isn't as complicated as Mcdonald makes it sound. Humans are engineered to store calories for lean times, it is an evolutionary survival mechanism. Remember, we have been evolving this survival mechanism over 2 million years as hominids. Just because we are in modern times, doesn't mean we can ignore those 2 million years of evolution into how our bodies handle calorie deficits.
Dieters talk about 'starvation mode' at the extreme, because they recognize when their metabolism shuts down after dieting too fast or too long, and you stop losing and just can't lose any more. But Any time--- any time, that you burn more calories than you take in, your metabolism will slow to compensate. As your metabolism slows to handle the fact you are taking in fewer calories than you burn, you have to manage your body into maintaining its highest metabolism rate. You do that either by continually upping your exercise, or you can take diet breaks and refeeds to reset it. Yes, we're stuck with that evolutionary survival mechanism. But the good news is, it can be tricked into not triggering.
Lyle has talked at length about evolutionary processes and exactly as you said we are designed to store fat and regulate metabolism, which never actually shuts down .. complete shut down = death. But yes, we are using refeeds/diet breaks/increasing NEAT and volitional exercise to optimize hormonal regulation to deal with the downward trend in body weight.
Humans are wired to survive and reproduce for legacy protection. Getting fat and movement are two of those methods for survival. Creating an aesthetic image for attracting a potential mating partner is usually how reproduction begins, though, that's debatable now. In the rawest form, we feed, fight, and fvck. So that's exactly what this thread and entire site is designed to do; optimize our potential for all of those.8 -
Original reason for the birth of this now stickied thread:
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Post-workout impromptu mid-week refeed happened last night for taco Tuesday... which turned into tequila, beer, and taco Tuesday. Not a full out night of partying/bingeing, just about 10 street tacos, 3 beers, and 2 shots of tequila.
Other than the day after drinking grogginess, overall mood was better and felt leaner, which was confirmed by a 1 lb scale weight drop. All good things. Granted this won't always be the case, but I cut pretty hard on Monday, so it fits in the weekly average.
I'm going to Coachella next week which will be interesting. It'll probably end up as a reverse refeed. I doubt I'm going to have any solid food intake that weekend so I'll likely eat Friday and zombie myself around the next two days lol.9 -
Just take care of yourself and stay safePost-workout impromptu mid-week refeed happened last night for taco Tuesday... which turned into tequila, beer, and taco Tuesday. Not a full out night of partying/bingeing, just about 10 street tacos, 3 beers, and 2 shots of tequila.
Other than the day after drinking grogginess, overall mood was better and felt leaner, which was confirmed by a 1 lb scale weight drop. All good things. Granted this won't always be the case, but I cut pretty hard on Monday, so it fits in the weekly average.
I'm going to Coachella next week which will be interesting. It'll probably end up as a reverse refeed. I doubt I'm going to have any solid food intake that weekend so I'll likely eat Friday and zombie myself around the next two days lol.
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Post-workout impromptu mid-week refeed happened last night for taco Tuesday... which turned into tequila, beer, and taco Tuesday. Not a full out night of partying/bingeing, just about 10 street tacos, 3 beers, and 2 shots of tequila.
Other than the day after drinking grogginess, overall mood was better and felt leaner, which was confirmed by a 1 lb scale weight drop. All good things. Granted this won't always be the case, but I cut pretty hard on Monday, so it fits in the weekly average.
I'm going to Coachella next week which will be interesting. It'll probably end up as a reverse refeed. I doubt I'm going to have any solid food intake that weekend so I'll likely eat Friday and zombie myself around the next two days lol.
I love street tacos! I can down 4 without batting an eye! They are like potato chips! And then with a Michelina (I renamed a Michelada because I hate tomato juice, so I order mine without) that is what is called Supremo!
I agree with Maxxitt, be safe.1 -
Hey guys. This is the first time I've visited this particular thread, and I need some advice.
A little background: I am at a BMI of 25, so just over normal, and therefore don't have a lot to lose. I do own and use a food scale and track my food. I am pretty active as far as exercise (vinyasa type yoga 4-5 x per week, 3 spin classes per week, and 2-3 run days per week) but have a sit down job so I use sedentary to determine my calorie allotment. Since January I have lost 8 pounds and am happy with that rate since I don't have a whole lot to lose.
I recently fell while skiing and have a possible meniscus tear on one knee. I do have an appointment to see an orthopedic surgeon next week. I also let an athletic trainer that comes to my work area look at it, and she thinks it is a meniscus tear. I have been able to carry on with most of my normal exercise routine with very few issues, but I tend to have a lot of missteps that cause quick stabs of pain while doing normal daily activities. I had one yesterday that was a a lot worse than usual and the intense pain lasted several minutes with me limping around most of the morning1 -
It looks like some of my post was cut off... so here goes the rest (hopefully)...
I find myself getting really flustered when these missteps happen and it makes me want to eat a lot more.
So, it seems like now would be a good time for a diet break, maybe until I see the OS and find out exactly what's going on with the knee?
Is setting calories to maintenance the best thing to do?
How long should a diet break last?
Thanks in advance!1 -
It looks like some of my post was cut off... so here goes the rest (hopefully)...
I find myself getting really flustered when these missteps happen and it makes me want to eat a lot more.
So, it seems like now would be a good time for a diet break, maybe until I see the OS and find out exactly what's going on with the knee?
Is setting calories to maintenance the best thing to do?
How long should a diet break last?
Thanks in advance!
Sure. Don't over think it. Eat. Try two weeks. You can decide if you want to keep going after that.8 -
Post-workout impromptu mid-week refeed happened last night for taco Tuesday... which turned into tequila, beer, and taco Tuesday. Not a full out night of partying/bingeing, just about 10 street tacos, 3 beers, and 2 shots of tequila.
Other than the day after drinking grogginess, overall mood was better and felt leaner, which was confirmed by a 1 lb scale weight drop. All good things. Granted this won't always be the case, but I cut pretty hard on Monday, so it fits in the weekly average.
I'm going to Coachella next week which will be interesting. It'll probably end up as a reverse refeed. I doubt I'm going to have any solid food intake that weekend so I'll likely eat Friday and zombie myself around the next two days lol.
Have a blast!2 -
It looks like some of my post was cut off... so here goes the rest (hopefully)...
I find myself getting really flustered when these missteps happen and it makes me want to eat a lot more.
So, it seems like now would be a good time for a diet break, maybe until I see the OS and find out exactly what's going on with the knee?
Is setting calories to maintenance the best thing to do?
How long should a diet break last?
Thanks in advance!
In your longer comment - didn't notice you saying you were using MFP correctly and entering in exercise calories to eat back.
Because even sit down job doesn't mean sedentary lifestyle outside of exercise.
If more than 4000 steps on average, which includes a potentially active weekend, besides active after work - you are Lightly Active.
Exercise would just add more to it.
Anyway, the comment about exercise, you could set MFP to maintenance, but if not adding in some decent portion of exercise calories - won't really being doing a diet break.
Because ya - body needing to heal from injury is not a great time for a diet. Merely eating at prior TDEE level will mean a deficit as body spends more energy on the injury. (say that fast 5 times)5 -
It looks like some of my post was cut off... so here goes the rest (hopefully)...
I find myself getting really flustered when these missteps happen and it makes me want to eat a lot more.
So, it seems like now would be a good time for a diet break, maybe until I see the OS and find out exactly what's going on with the knee?
Is setting calories to maintenance the best thing to do?
How long should a diet break last?
Thanks in advance!
In your longer comment - didn't notice you saying you were using MFP correctly and entering in exercise calories to eat back.
Because even sit down job doesn't mean sedentary lifestyle outside of exercise.
If more than 4000 steps on average, which includes a potentially active weekend, besides active after work - you are Lightly Active.
Exercise would just add more to it.
Anyway, the comment about exercise, you could set MFP to maintenance, but if not adding in some decent portion of exercise calories - won't really being doing a diet break.
Because ya - body needing to heal from injury is not a great time for a diet. Merely eating at prior TDEE level will mean a deficit as body spends more energy on the injury. (say that fast 5 times)
Good point. I didn't say so in my OP, but I do typically eat around 50% of my exercise calories (I feel MFP overestimates CO with most activities) so would continue to do that with calories set at maintenance.1 -
Agreed with @heybales that you want to be at least in maintenance during an injury. Increased need for tissue repair is an added factor to metabolic process, and pain is an additional factor in the form of stress. Essentially, body health > body composition. Fat loss is relatively easy, so when setbacks happen, focus on getting back to as normal as possible. If surgery is needed, consider that the extreme of repair and stress factors to add.
As always, protein becomes a priority macro if it's not already. During rehab therapy, it's a point to use it as a precursor of strength building/training to pulse inflammation around the affected site because some inflammation is needed to signal cells for repair, so do enough, but not too much.
https://bodyrecomposition.com/dogs/rehabbing-an-injury.html/
https://store.bodyrecomposition.com/product/optimal-nutrition-for-injury-recovery/3 -
@anubis609 - you gotten Lyle's book on injury recovery?
at only $10, I'm almost enough curious to review my recovery from injury that was worse than his injury and see if I did good or bad.
Actually, on reflection considering I didn't think about food much - probably bad.
Maybe the $10 isn't worth it until I get hurt again. ;-)3 -
@anubis609 - you gotten Lyle's book on injury recovery?
at only $10, I'm almost enough curious to review my recovery from injury that was worse than his injury and see if I did good or bad.
Actually, on reflection considering I didn't think about food much - probably bad.
Maybe the $10 isn't worth it until I get hurt again. ;-)
I wanted to get it just because I wanted to read it. The day it arrived, I tripped and fell down the porch stairs and practically done near kilt myself lol So it came in handy!8 -
@anubis609 - you gotten Lyle's book on injury recovery?
at only $10, I'm almost enough curious to review my recovery from injury that was worse than his injury and see if I did good or bad.
Actually, on reflection considering I didn't think about food much - probably bad.
Maybe the $10 isn't worth it until I get hurt again. ;-)
@heybales - Yep, I got it. It actually is his most comprehensive book lol. There's no bogged down history of a diet's origin or cellular evolution. Of course he touches on nutrition and training to the degree that it applies to injury and recovery, but it's a quick read and good reference considering injury is probably inevitable at some point in training. I think Lyle writing it while half medicated and rehabbing kept the word length to a minimum.
Funny enough, to what @Maxxitt said, a lot of people seemed to have injured themselves shortly after purchasing it. It's like the curse of Zordon.3 -
I have a question: I knew that when one started a diet break, they could expect to see the scale jump up for a few days; however, I was under the impression that it would settle back down to about where you started within a few days.
I started a full diet break last Friday, and as expected, I saw the scale jump up about 3 lbs. However, its been a week, and those 3 lbs are still there.
am I missing something here?0 -
bmeadows380 wrote: »I have a question: I knew that when one started a diet break, they could expect to see the scale jump up for a few days; however, I was under the impression that it would settle back down to about where you started within a few days.
I started a full diet break last Friday, and as expected, I saw the scale jump up about 3 lbs. However, its been a week, and those 3 lbs are still there.
am I missing something here?
My jumps didn't go down until a few days 'after' my diet break and I was back into deficit.5 -
Although I did my last diet break without a scale so can't give very precise information, I can say that right after I finished the break I had a whoosh that took half an inch off my waist.3
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When you are eating more, you are carrying more food.
Usually eating more sodium, so water weight.
Usually topped off glucose stores, so water weight.
No - when you go up to maintenance - you should expect to gain the fast water weight that was lost when you started a diet.
That's the freak-out response most people don't realize when they come out of a diet, because they never really appreciated the big loss when they went into it. "wow, I lost 5 lbs in the last 2 weeks!"7 -
Well, I have a bit of a confession for the refeed thread crew: I’ve been pretty vocal on the forums about my success losing weight while calorie cycling/refeeding/banking calories. The point that I haven’t always been specific on was that this whole way of eating has basically been my way to compensate for too-frequent binge drinking and the subsequent drunk munchies. Increased alcohol use was a big part of my weight gain in the first place, and controlling it has been a big part of my success losing.
Since I might consume 800-1000 calories in alcohol on a high calorie day, I’ve felt like a bit of a fraud responding to threads about banking or cycling calories, although I do like reassuring people that you don’t have to stick to a strict daily goal to be successful. So with that embarrassing background out of the way, I’m happy to report that refeed days are a lot of fun even without lots of booze!
As of late last month, my husband and I quit smoking, which has also meant no more nights out drinking. I’m still hitting my glass of red wine most evenings and have had a couple of beers over the last few weeks, but only rarely more than one drink in a sitting. So instead of just hoping I can keep my weekly calories down enough to balance my semi-uncontrolled overeating, I actually have to plan where those extra carbs are going to come from. It’s pretty cool! Plus, I’ve been seeing consistent weight drops the day after a high-calorie/carb day, which never happened before presumably because of booze bloat.
Anyhow, I’ve been less active on the boards recently due to work, but I’ve been thinking about this a lot the last couple of weeks and wanted to share. Hope everyone is doing great and enjoying whatever phase of eating they happen to be in right now.18
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