Glute Imbalance and Scapular Winging
Replies
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Visited the chiropractor and he told me that I can start doing full body workouts with light weight.
I was a bit surprised, especially since I told him that my left hip is still over-activating and over-compensating during my squats.
He told me that a bit of hip flexion is normal, as it will happen whenever your hip bends. Just keep stretching it out!
So I tried squatting, benching, and rowing in the gym today, and I felt weak as hell!
My squats were partly uneven in regards to glute activation symmetry (could feel either the right or the left one working more than the other). When I focused on pushing evenly from both heels, I got the best results. Just gotta keep working with little-to-no weight. I think I'm almost at the point of accepting the fact that I'm never going to be perfectly even in regards to bilateral glute activation. As long as I can feel my left glute activating, it doesn't bother me that much that my left hip is also firing (or that my right glute is working more on certain reps). Doesn't mean that I'm going to stop trying to release that hip though; it just means that I gotta have realistic expectations.
I did 5 sets of 5 reps bench press with 5 lb DB's (seriously all I could do... not even joking)... Focused on having that nice pinch in the shoulder blades, and pushing up with just my pecs. Didn't experience any pain in my left arm after, which is good, because I was sort of expecting some. Chiropractor says he's gonna work on my scapular winging in the upcoming weeks.
Gonna try deadlifting and shoulder pressing with DB's during my next workout... prep myself for StrongLifts.
Stoked for what the future holds!1 -
Picked up a solid pair of training shoes from Nike. They are super comfortable and I can barely feel my orthotics when I'm wearing them!
https://www.nike.com/ca/t/zoom-train-command-training-shoe-LBTglgRR/922478-003
Squatted with no weight today, and I felt so good. Surprisingly, both glutes were activating evenly, despite the fact that the left one felt different than the right when firing.
Gonna start loading up the weight now to see if I can keep this up.3 -
My left leg still hurts after. It feels like a faint, nagging pain running down the back of my leg. I have to stretch the hell out of my hammies after in order to relieve some of the tension. Rest helps too, but sometimes the pain lasts for more than a day.
My chiropractor says it's because I'm working out too hard, but I'm using little-to-no weight right now, and it's only my left leg hurting, so I'll have to talk with him again.0 -
Chiropractic is non-science hokum.
Look it up.
You might as well consult a witch doctor in Haiti.
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Going to the chiropractor has greatly helped me increase left glute activation (moreso than seeing kinesiologists, physiotherapists, and personal trainers), but I am unsure on how to relieve and prevent the pain going down the back of my left leg after I perform light squats and deadlifts...0
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My squat and deadlift have improved significantly since the new year. I feel both glutes activating now. The important cue is to imaging pushing from both heels, especially the left one.
No more pain running down the left side of my leg anymore. Just had to keep stretching and strengthening it.
However, my scapular winging is still bothering me during the upper body exercises (bench, rows, and ohp). It's like I don't feel my left scap retracting as much as the right one. The result (during the bench) is that I feel stress on my left shoulder and I don't feel my left pec working.
I have been stretching my scaps and doing a few exercises that I've learned from physios in the past, but am pretty lost at this point.
I am no longer seeing the chiropractor, and am wondering if I should find a good physio in town.5 -
You should think about finding a strong first or Rkc certified kettlebell trainer.
You should not have all the se problems at your age.
If i were you i would do the following.
Day 1
Goblet squat
Kettlebell swings
A walk with a tight band around your ankles ( one band it’s total )
One arm shoulder press
Batwing exercise
If you have to do barbell work
Barbell back squat - just choose a position that feels comfertable, low bar or high bar it doesn’t matter, you can actually have a set up the middle of those two you know. That vid you posted is a mixture of both so not very good to be honest. Just get under the bar get a grip that feels comfertable and a stance that feels comfertable and just practice.
Lunges with no weight on both sides.
Bench - again just get a set up you like it doesn’t matter whether its wide or narrow.
Deadlift - just practise don’t chase weight.
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How will those exercises you listed help me?
How will working with a kettlebell trainer help cure my scapular winging?
Have you experienced my problems before?
I am doing StrongLifts right now... and I can hardly feel my left scap retracting during the upper body exercises.
I keep stretching them though out... and I have been doing the last two exercises shown in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aL2N9ixQMFU 1 -
Wow, that is weird.
Are you intentionally making it do that?
Is that a birth defect that you born with?0 -
Wow, that is weird.
Are you intentionally making it do that?
Is that a birth defect that you born with?
I'm pretty sure it's related to my horrible posture... a result of spending my entire childhood hunched over in front of a screen. However, the picture in that video is a very extreme case... my winging is not that bad.
In fact, the chiropractor (that I don't see anymore) said that my scaps don't wing anymore than the normal person. He says that I am a young and healthy individual, and that my problems are mostly self-inflicted.
I don't believe him though, because I can hardly feel my left scap retracting during upper body exercises as compared to the right scap.
The right scap just gets a nicer pinch, and feels much more stable and supportive.
Past physiotherapists have noticed my slight scapular winging, but none of their exercise routines have helped me.
I am pretty lost at this point...
I googled "scapular winging Vancouver" and the only thing that showed up were blogs from a couple physiotherapists and chiropractors in my city... should I see one of these guys? Seems sort of counterintuitive as no specialist has been able to help me much yet.
In the meantime, I'm just working on releasing the scaps and the surrounding muscles (pecs, anterior deltoids). Doing a couple simple scapular exercises and lifting progressive overload (StrongLifts).
I don't care if I can't feel my left scap as much as my right. I'm tired of rehabbing. It's been 3 years and I'm ready to lift.
I'll stop when I experience pain... something that has happened in the past, especially during the bench. But ever since starting StrongLifts, I haven't experienced any pain in my left arm yet.
I've purposely plateaued at 45 lbs for the bench so that I can just work on refining my form. It pisses me off that my left pec isn't activating. My left scap is unstable and doesn't move properly. I feel this discrepancy the most on the bench and it makes me angry.
Rows and OHP I don't care about not having feeling. I just keep increasing that weight because I need to get jacked. Hopefully my scapular winging slowly corrects itself overtime. At the beginning of StrongLifts, my left scap used to get sore after my workouts, maybe indicating that it is getting stronger? I can only hope...
Squats and deadlifts are coming along nicely. I'm not deadlifting from the floor yet because the weight is still too low to put on the ground. Once I can get a 25 lb plate on each side, my gym has these foam squares that I can stack on top of each other for deadlifts. So I can stack like 3 foams on top of one another for each side so that the bar can get high enough off the ground.
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Just got off the phone with my chiropractor whom I don't see anymore.
I know you guys think that all chiropractors are witch doctors from Haiti, but I seriously just need someone to talk to...
Anyways, nothing really new. He just told me to keep doing those serratus anterior and scapular exercises that I'm already doing. Told me that I can look online to find more.
It's annoying because in the spring of 2016, I went through a 2-month phase where I did a bunch of these exercises (prescribed by my PT) every second day. However, when I tried lifting, the problem still didn't go away.
So I dunno man. I guess I just have to be patient and keep at it.
At least I'm lifting now. Just supplementing my lifts with these activation exercises beforehand. It used to be that I never lifted and would only do these activation exercises.
I googled "I can't feel my left scap" and a bunch of reddit fitness posts popped up where people had the same problem as me. People just recommended that they do exercises such as face pulls and shoulder shrugs.2 -
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VCPp1DUypo0&t=9s
I just finished watching this athlean-x video and he said that if you are tight, then you should be stretching out your levator scapula, rhomboids, lats, pecs, and rotator cuffs before moving onto the activation stage. He shows you a couple of the stretches and then links the rest in the video description.
However, he doesn't specify how long you should stay in this stretching stage before moving onto the activation phase. Weeks? Months?
I'm thinking for me, it's going to be at least 1-2 months of stretching before I can do any sort of exercise.
I found the video very insightful, as he gives the same advice as my chiropractor (but in terms of scap activation rather than glute activation): you have to release the tension in the opposing muscles before you can start to strengthen the weak muscle.0 -
So I've been stretching and releasing my pecs, lats, and levator scapulae for the past 2 months... nothing.
No improvement.
Nada.
Decided to bite the bullet and see a shoulder specialist in town.
At first, he didn't notice anything off with my scaps, but when he got me to raise and lower a wooden stick, he could see that my left scap was actually popping out when i lowered the stick.
"Aha!" he said. "So that's the problem: your left scap is popping off your rib cage."
To fix this problem, I need to shrug my shoulders up, engage my upper traps, and protract my arms/shoulders forward.
"8+ weeks it's gonna take you" he said. "Here are some exercises to do."
I'm still a long ways from being able to do a proper row, let alone bench...
But at least now, I can see the light.5 -
Been having some major breakthroughs lately.
After seeing the shoulder specialist, and realizing how important it is to find someone who specializes in your problem, I booked an appointment with an athletic therapist who specializes in pelvic alignment and lower-body dysfunctions.
I explained to him how my former chiropractor had helped me to activate my left glute, but now that I can activate it, it actually hurts after I exercise.
After examining my body, the therapist explained to me what I've been suspecting all along: I do not actually have a true leg length discrepancy... it is only because my pelvis is tilted that it gives off the impression that one leg is shorter than the other.
He then performed some manual therapy to pull my hip back into place.
"You are easily correctable," he said to me. "But that also means you'll easily fall back apart. I have to keep fixing you until your body gets used to the correct form."
He watched me squat and noted the shift to my right as I descended.
He also got me to look at myself in the mirror with my shirt off so that I could note how my body/spine shifted to the left a bit.
Finally, he noted how my left hamstring fires before my left glute.
These are all issues that we're going to be working on.
My body is so weird.5 -
A few hours after my physio appointment, I started experiencing a deep pain running down my left leg.
I stretched out my legs and it felt a lot better, so I decided to do 30 reps of a prescribed glute initiation exercise.
Woke up today, and I felt the pain running down my left leg again. Called the physio and asked him what was up.
He said that such pain is normal after treatment because my glute has been so inactive, and a lot of stress has been placed on my sciatic nerve as a result.
He told me to take it easy for the next few days: do nothing but ice and stretch.
Then I can get back into trying the exercises he prescribed for me. Maybe do like 10 reps a day only.
"There is no other way to get past this," he told me. "You must strengthen that glute."0 -
Lol so I just called my chiropractor, and he pretty much told me that what the athletic therapist said was false.
"I already tried realigning your pelvis several times... you always go back to being uneven," he said to me. "That's why I prescribed you the orthotics with the heel lift. If the therapist fixes you, then I'd be happy to modify the orthotics for you so that they only correct for pronation. But I can almost guarantee you, that's not going to happen. I already tried. Many times."
Lol at retarded health professionals disagreeing with one another.
I have to say that I believe my chiropractor more because he's actually seen me several times over the course of a few months, whereas the athletic therapist has only seen me once.
I bet that if I saw the therapist more, he would keep trying to correct me, and then eventually realize that his attempts were futile. But I'm not going to spend more $ trying to find out.
What bothers me is that I still feel uneven on my left side (e.g. single-leg squats), my glutes aren't activating evenly on squats, and my left hips and hamstrings refuse to be quiet, despite all the stretching that I've been doing.
Anyways, I left the therapist a message today, and will be speaking with him tomorrow. I'm interested in what he has to say lol.0 -
Stop going backward and forward between different health professionals that you've seen in the past; they are not going to change their original diagnosis which you've already discounted, hence you seeing another health professional.
Give this pelvic specialist a chance.4 -
Lol so I just called my chiropractor, and he pretty much told me that what the athletic therapist said was false.
"I already tried realigning your pelvis several times... you always go back to being uneven," he said to me. "That's why I prescribed you the orthotics with the heel lift. If the therapist fixes you, then I'd be happy to modify the orthotics for you so that they only correct for pronation. But I can almost guarantee you, that's not going to happen. I already tried. Many times."
Lol at retarded health professionals disagreeing with one another.
I have to say that I believe my chiropractor more because he's actually seen me several times over the course of a few months, whereas the athletic therapist has only seen me once.
I bet that if I saw the therapist more, he would keep trying to correct me, and then eventually realize that his attempts were futile. But I'm not going to spend more $ trying to find out.
What bothers me is that I still feel uneven on my left side (e.g. single-leg squats), my glutes aren't activating evenly on squats, and my left hips and hamstrings refuse to be quiet, despite all the stretching that I've been doing.
Anyways, I left the therapist a message today, and will be speaking with him tomorrow. I'm interested in what he has to say lol.
Mate this is really offensive. First chiropractors are not proper health professionals. They are quacks at best. There is a reason you had to keep going back.
Secondly stick to one person. If you are going to go to physio stick with them for a bit, give them a chance.
Lastly I don't doubt you have an issue, you are way over thinking this. You almost need to step back and have a break because you are running yourself in circles.
My biggest advice, stick with the pelvic specialist, give him a chance, drop the chiropractor - you can always go back later. And RELAX. It takes time. Months even.6 -
Yeah I'm going to be talking with the pelvic specialist over the phone tomorrow, so maybe I'll end up booking a follow-up appointment with him.
Each appointment costs over $100, so I'm just worried that I'll end up spending more $ for no reason.
Do you guys really think that my pelvis can be aligned despite my chiropractor saying that it can't?
He said that when the therapist yanks my leg to supposedly pull my hip into place, all that he's doing is actually pulling it out of the hip socket.
The orthotics help my glute activate, but they don't seem to be helping my muscle asymmetries (e.g., right abs working more than left, overactive left hips, hamstrings, and IT band, harder to do a left-single-leg squat than a right one).
Health professionals are not retarded. They've given me a lot of insight into my body. It's just frustrating when their advice doesn't work, and they give contradicting information, especially when I've been trying to fix this problem for years.
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Im not an expert but it depends why it is misaligned, IMO. How did they ascertain that one leg is shorter than the other? Did they take an actual scan or xray or just test with their hands/visually? Be aware that some times problems felt in one area, can be a sign of a problem further up (or down) the body. My Osteo realigned my pelvis by making an adjustment in my neck.
I'd say listen to the current specialist that you are seeing. A lot of health professionals are going to disagree about the causes or treatment of a problem but if you've given that professional a fair crack at the whip, it is time to try something else. I had an Osteo that originally told me that he could fix me in 6 sessions. 14 sessions later, I wasn't fixed so I left. He maintained his position but the results or lack of, spoke for themselves.
Instead of worrying about not getting results for your money, try to think of it as eliminating another avenue of investigation.2 -
Wow!!! I just watched your video from your previous post. I had a very similar issue when squatting with weight - I never noticed the shift when squatting down but in the way up I have the same movement. Its like my hips and glutes on my right side give out. I dont have this issue with body weight only when loaded up with weights. I think I started to notice when lifting 40 kgs???
I have never really looked into it, except for working with a trainer for a couple of months. Unfortunately it didn't help
I now do yoga as my main form of exercise and have noticed no other issues.
I know this post doesn't help you but it has helped me. I hope you are able to fix your imbalance and get the results you want. All the best!!0 -
My boyfriend has these same issues, he has lifted since he was a teenager (just turned 50 this year). When he was in his 20s he noticed the same issues you were having and went to several doctors who told him nothing was wrong with him because he was so muscular. After 1 or 2 years of searching he finally found a doctor that diagnosed him with a rare form of MD which causes uneven muscle development. He is still ok and still has a strict work out regimen, but had to work to find exercised that really worked for him, he also takes a lot of time between sets to give his body time to recover. Co-Q10 helps a lot as well.
If you notice that your older t-shirts look a little twisted when you hold them up or if you sleep with your eyes someone open at times, it is something to consider looking into. Good luck!0 -
Honesty you cannot yank a femur out of its socket. The muscles keeping your hip in its joint are too sturdy to allow a simple pulling to pull it out. That's why I say chiropractors are quacks. They rely on pseudoscience and don't look at the whole body.its all bones and "subluxations” which it a term they missuse.
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Just got off the phone with the athletic therapist.
He said that he believes he can permanently fix my pelvis with enough manual manipulation, fascial release, and strengthening work.
"Give it a few more sessions," he told me. "Then we'll see."
Hopefully he can help me, because if not, then I dunno what my remaining options are.
Maybe get x-rays from the doctor or find an osteo?3 -
Have you not had xrays yet? You could have a mild scoliosis which could explain your uneven hips. I'm a little surprised the chiropractor did not suggest it, though you should go through a proper Dr and get a radiologist to do a formal report.2
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The athletic therapist looked at my spine and didn't notice any scoliosis.
He said that people with scoliosis have a spine that is shaped like the letter "S"
However, according to google, the curve can also be C-shaped... the athletic therapist said that my spine/body constantly shifts to the left (while my glute and hip imbalance causes me to lean towards the right during the squat lol).
He got me to anchor my hips along the wall using a foam roller to prevent it from moving, and just got me to shift my body to the right. Lol. I dunno how useful this exercise is... but I haven't been doing it. Just been doing one glute initiation exercise every second day, while working on my shoulder physio exercises.
Regardless of if I have mild scoliosis or not, I definitely have sciatica, caused by piriformis syndrome. The pain that runs down my left leg after doing too many glute exercises accurately falls in line with the syndrome's description.
So do you think that I should make an appointment with my family doctor to get x-rays done?
Or should I go to one of the health professionals that show up when I google "sciatica Vancouver?"
For example:
https://www.electrahealth.ca/massage-therapy-downtown-vancouver/sciatica
This sciatica treatment article was written by Mike Dixon, a registered massage therapist with 25 years experience in treating sciatica pain.
From the article:
"There are a variety of tests used to diagnose this condition. The first step is to go through a history of symptoms and activities with the client. Muscle and neurological tests are then done. An Xray, CT Scan or MRI might be needed, depending on the initial findings."
The article then goes on to describe how they treat sciatica using massage therapy.
Another link I found:
http://www.vancouverspineanddisccentre.ca/about-vancouver-spine-and-disc-centre.html
This is an actual doctor from the University of Sydney Medical School. He also has written an article on sciatica and suggests to:
"Contact our office at 604-689-HEAL (4325) to schedule an initial consultation with the Doctor to determine your individual situation. Medical Evaluation and Diagnostic testing procedures should be performed prior to beginning any treatment in order to determine the most effective process. After carefully studying your case history and exam findings, the Doctor will sit down and explain his recommended plan of action for you. After answering any questions you may have about the recommended plan, you may begin your care."
So should I go see one of these guys, or should I just go to my family doctor and get the x-rays done for free?
I could always bring the x-ray pictures to one of these "sciatica" medical professionals, right?
Because I'm afraid that if I get x-rays from the doctor, and they come back with the confirmation that I do have sciatica, the doctor won't be able to do much for me except maybe refer me to a physio (who may just be as unknowledgeable as my past physios).
Also, should I wait for x-rays to be done first, before booking my second appointment with the athletic therapist? Because if this is a problem that is out of his reach, then there's no point in seeing him again. However, he did mention that the pain is a result of the sciatica nerve being overly stressed, so I assume that he knows I have sciatica, and that he is trying to help me fix it.
I dunno... I feel so lost right now!5 -
Can you please briefly recap how many medical professionals you've seen over the last year since you first posted, and how long you spent with / following the recommendations of each?6
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Well you can't see sciatica on an xray. And scoliosis comes in many forms, some are just mild and aren't visible without a couple of specific tests. I slightly regret mentioning it now because I have fueled your obsession. I reiterate my previous post. Take a HUGE step back, stick with one health professional for a decent length of time - several months. Also you may just have issues with a particular exercise that nothing can fix. Stop fixating on what you can't do and spinning yourself into tighter and tighter circles. Concentrate on what you CAN do.
Also have you done the basic sciatic nerve release stretch? It's a supine deep glute stretch. It's a godsend4 -
Well you can't see sciatica on an xray. And scoliosis comes in many forms, some are just mild and aren't visible without a couple of specific tests. I slightly regret mentioning it now because I have fueled your obsession. I reiterate my previous post. Take a HUGE step back, stick with one health professional for a decent length of time - several months. Also you may just have issues with a particular exercise that nothing can fix. Stop fixating on what you can't do and spinning yourself into tighter and tighter circles. Concentrate on what you CAN do.
Also have you done the basic sciatic nerve release stretch? It's a supine deep glute stretch. It's a godsendWell you can't see sciatica on an xray. And scoliosis comes in many forms, some are just mild and aren't visible without a couple of specific tests. I slightly regret mentioning it now because I have fueled your obsession. I reiterate my previous post. Take a HUGE step back, stick with one health professional for a decent length of time - several months. Also you may just have issues with a particular exercise that nothing can fix. Stop fixating on what you can't do and spinning yourself into tighter and tighter circles. Concentrate on what you CAN do.
Also have you done the basic sciatic nerve release stretch? It's a supine deep glute stretch. It's a godsend
Agree with your advice. Too many cooks spoil the broth.
What is the basic sciatic nerve release stretch?2
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