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Why do people keep defending sugar?
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Pogostickers wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »My mother, my father, my grandmother all died from Diabetes. (And now my sister is diagnosed) diseases that result in too much sugar in the blood (high blood glucose).
Have fun with your Sugar
I'm sorry about your family. My grandmother had it too and I eat sugar in very unmoderated amounts and I'm fine. And old so it's had time to kick in.
Good Luck.
Somehow I don't think you mean that.
I believe the whole sugar causing diabetes thing has been debunked tho so....
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Pogostickers wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »My mother, my father, my grandmother all died from Diabetes. (And now my sister is diagnosed) diseases that result in too much sugar in the blood (high blood glucose).
Have fun with your Sugar
I’m diabetic. My a1c has been in normal range for three years now. Not the ADA approved “normal for a diabetic” range of under 7, it’s consistently under 5, like a normal person’s. I also eat sugar, in appropriate amounts, when appropriate. For example, during a long distance race, or when recovering from exercise.
All things have a time and a place, sugar among them. It’s just as bad to fall on your face as to bend too far and fall over backwards.
That is great for you if you can have it in your life.
You will not catch me eating refined sugar.
great! pass it to me and I'll enjoy it quite well in moderation. Well, me and the hummingbirds......6 -
Pogostickers wrote: »My mother, my father, my grandmother all died from Diabetes. (And now my sister is diagnosed) diseases that result in too much sugar in the blood (high blood glucose).
Have fun with your Sugar
I'm curious: Though there is not a tight link, it's fairly clear that high levels of saturated fat consumption are also significant contributors to the incidence of obesity, heart disease (perhaps via obesity), and probably even diabetes (also via obesity). There's also continuing debate about the role of O-3/O-6 balance, but some evidence that imbalance may have similar consequences (and certainly that excessive intake of either/both can lead to weight gain thus increase risks of obesity-connected disease).
Do you cut saturated fat out of your diet, and argue against it, in a way similar to what you're saying about sugar? Never eat it? Pay attention to O-3/O-6 balance?
I'm aware that the connection of sat fats to heart disease is not as direct as was once believed, but I think that's similar to the change in thinking (based on more recent research) regarding sugar and diabetes. I'm also aware that the O-6/O-3 balance issue continues to be a subject of research.
So, are sat fats and O-3/O-6 imbalance just as bad as sugar? Not as bad (why)? Worse (why?).
Truth in advertising: I eat small amounts of added sugar (generally well less than the WHO recommended max), moderate sat fat (in the 10-20g range, usually low to mid in that), and pay some but not obsessive attention to O-6/ O-3 balance, mostly by not taste-preferring common O-6 sources and consciously including O-3s.11 -
I don't know... because it's a socially accepted drug? 🤔1
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jdecker32356 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »Maybe they never had half their family die from it
Is this a serious comment??
People are not dying from sugar
well, I guess a type 1 diabetic could go into diabetic coma and die if they ate massive amount and did not take their insulin. I knew somebody once who almost did that - was in ICU with BSL of 48 - but did recover.
But, most people can eat sugar in sensible amounts. Even diabetics can eat it in small amounts.
The issue is not sugar per se but over consumption leadng to obesity related diseases or, in case of diabetics, to diabetic complications.
Context. Dosage.
You conflated an instantaneous consequence with an average over time consequence, in order to call someone else dumb. People aren't talking about eating a lot of sugar once, they're talking about eating a lot of it over time, which would why diabetes is called a CHRONIC illness. Lol no one eats sugar in "sensible" amounts in the US. Even taking into account the fact that the US nutrition has increased the RDA max for sugar, even a small Snickers bar is larger than the recommended daily allotment for sugar. Most people eat the whole Snickers bar. And your tolerance for sweetness increases; if you eat sugar regularly, you'll need to eat more over time to attain the same level of sweetness, which means eventually you will eat more sugar. When 2/3 of the population is overweight you have no argument.
*Edited by MFP moderator
I did what???
Where did I call anyone dumb???
Yes i gave an example of instant dying (almost dying in real case I gave) of instantaneous death by sugar.
Because that is really the only type of case eating sugar per se would cause death.
In all other cases it would be over consumption, not sugar per se.
People eating too much over time - that is what over consumption means.
and obesity, as has been pointed out by others, isnt just from over consumption of sugar - it is from over consumption of calories.
calories from various food sources, as people have given examples of.
In my own personal case, someone who eats quite a few sweet products (in portion controlled amounts - yay!! calorie counting!!) I have not noticed any need to eat more over time or any increased sugar amount needed to create same level of sweetness.
and I am over half a century old - I think such effects would be showing up by now.
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fitnessjustin01 wrote: »I don't know... because it's a socially accepted drug? 🤔
oh dear.
No, it is not a drug.
(socially accepted or otherwise)
It is just a food component.
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Pogostickers wrote: »rheddmobile wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »My mother, my father, my grandmother all died from Diabetes. (And now my sister is diagnosed) diseases that result in too much sugar in the blood (high blood glucose).
Have fun with your Sugar
I’m diabetic. My a1c has been in normal range for three years now. Not the ADA approved “normal for a diabetic” range of under 7, it’s consistently under 5, like a normal person’s. I also eat sugar, in appropriate amounts, when appropriate. For example, during a long distance race, or when recovering from exercise.
All things have a time and a place, sugar among them. It’s just as bad to fall on your face as to bend too far and fall over backwards.
That is great for you if you can have it in your life.
You will not catch me eating refined sugar.
Well you dont have to have it in your life if you dont want to.
There are things I feel that way about too - liver, tripe, cucumber.
But I dont expect everybody else to not want them in their life.
Refined sugar is great for most people - we can all have it in our lives if we want to
Obviously in portion controlled amounts if we want to be a healthy weight - but that goes for all food sources.
and obviously in even more tightly controlled portions if we are diabetic - but that goes for all food sources for which people have relevant medical conditions9 -
I think people defend sugar consumption because in a normal community it is basically impossible to avoid completely, and people like sugar the way crack addicts like crack.
oh dear.
yes it is basically impossible to avoid it completely - because it is a food component of many foods.
People like it in said foods (most people eat sugar in foods, not on its own) because they like the taste of said foods and they enjoy eating them.
Nothing wrong with enjoying food.
(of course in controlled calorie amounts, and in amounts consistent with any medical conditions or allergies - usual disclaimer)
Comparing it to crack addiction is silly scraping bottom of barrell argument - as well as being insulting to those who struggle with real addictions.
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jdecker32356 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »Maybe they never had half their family die from it
Is this a serious comment??
People are not dying from sugar
well, I guess a type 1 diabetic could go into diabetic coma and die if they ate massive amount and did not take their insulin. I knew somebody once who almost did that - was in ICU with BSL of 48 - but did recover.
But, most people can eat sugar in sensible amounts. Even diabetics can eat it in small amounts.
The issue is not sugar per se but over consumption leadng to obesity related diseases or, in case of diabetics, to diabetic complications.
Context. Dosage.
You conflated an instantaneous consequence with an average over time consequence, in order to call someone else dumb. People aren't talking about eating a lot of sugar once, they're talking about eating a lot of it over time, which would why diabetes is called a CHRONIC illness.
Um, no. The debate in this thread seems definitely to be between those who think sugar (or added sugar) in any amount is terrible and those of us saying it's fine in moderate amounts in the context of a healthful overall diet.Lol no one eats sugar in "sensible" amounts in the US.
No one? I think many of us here do.
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well I think I do too - but then I am not in US so maybe I dont count4
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Sugar, like most foods, can be part of a healthy diet. As a T2D I can eat an occasional serving of full strength chocolate ice cream (with all its sugary goodness) without spiking my blood sugar or adding so much as an ounce of fat. What I can't do is eat 3, 4, 5 servings (as I used to) and not suffer the consequences. But that goes for many non-sugary foods, too.
If ya'll want to believe that eating any amount of sugar (added, refined, or what-have-you), is a cardinal sin, or that the world really is flat, no one here will laugh. Well, at least most of us won't let you see us laugh. 🤣🤣🤣
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Why do people defend sugar? I think many of us like it and don't want to give it up entirely. That is me. Two teaspoonfuls in my coffee in the morning.2
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Pogostickers wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »
Well you dont have to have it in your life if you dont want to.
There are things I feel that way about too - liver, tripe, cucumber.
But I dont expect everybody else to not want them in their life.
I don't eat or use refined sugar. I also do not expect anything from anyone.
Well your posts in this thread have given the impression you think everyone should not eat or use refined sugar.
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fitnessjustin01 wrote: »I don't know... because it's a socially accepted drug? 🤔
<---- is currently mainlining his apple right now..... ahhh...., sweet, pun intended, bliss!jdecker32356 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »Maybe they never had half their family die from it
Is this a serious comment??
People are not dying from sugar
well, I guess a type 1 diabetic could go into diabetic coma and die if they ate massive amount and did not take their insulin. I knew somebody once who almost did that - was in ICU with BSL of 48 - but did recover.
But, most people can eat sugar in sensible amounts. Even diabetics can eat it in small amounts.
The issue is not sugar per se but over consumption leadng to obesity related diseases or, in case of diabetics, to diabetic complications.
Context. Dosage.
You conflated an instantaneous consequence with an average over time consequence, in order to call someone else dumb. People aren't talking about eating a lot of sugar once, they're talking about eating a lot of it over time, which would why diabetes is called a CHRONIC illness.
Um, no. The debate in this thread seems definitely to be between those who think sugar (or added sugar) in any amount is terrible and those of us saying it's fine in moderate amounts in the context of a healthful overall diet.Lol no one eats sugar in "sensible" amounts in the US.
No one? I think many of us here do.
It usually comes in a small package, with loads of fat, that is easy to over eat on. I have seen the research, a high sugar diet can actually lower overall fasting blood sugars in HEALTHY adults. It is because they lose weight and insulin sensitivity goes up usually when people lower adiposity.
@Pogostickers , I am with you ma'am, personally added sugars are just not worth the added calories or lack of satiety for me. I prefer my sugars to come from fruits and veggies. I noticed when I gave up added sugar, fruit became super sweet. Taste can change.
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Pogostickers wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »
Well you dont have to have it in your life if you dont want to.
There are things I feel that way about too - liver, tripe, cucumber.
But I dont expect everybody else to not want them in their life.
I don't eat or use refined sugar. I also do not expect anything from anyone.
Well your posts in this thread have given the impression you think everyone should not eat or use refined sugar.
That is your interpretation.
I think the throwing it out there that sugar killed half your family and then the seemingly sarcastic have fun and good luck posts might have helped that interpretation.
*goes to suck the chocolate off more peanut m&ms*21 -
Pogostickers wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »
Well you dont have to have it in your life if you dont want to.
There are things I feel that way about too - liver, tripe, cucumber.
But I dont expect everybody else to not want them in their life.
I don't eat or use refined sugar. I also do not expect anything from anyone.
Well your posts in this thread have given the impression you think everyone should not eat or use refined sugar.
Just because my opinions on sugar are not positive does not mean I am telling anyone to do anything. People do what they want.
Of course people do what they want - that wasn't in dispute.
Your opinion nevertheless came across as thinking everyone should avoid all refined sugar.
That is my interpretation, sure. -if you are not saying that and I misinterpreted ( seems like not just me who did ) then maybe clarify what you are saying.
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psychod787 wrote: »fitnessjustin01 wrote: »I don't know... because it's a socially accepted drug? 🤔
<---- is currently mainlining his apple right now..... ahhh...., sweet, pun intended, bliss!jdecker32356 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »Maybe they never had half their family die from it
Is this a serious comment??
People are not dying from sugar
well, I guess a type 1 diabetic could go into diabetic coma and die if they ate massive amount and did not take their insulin. I knew somebody once who almost did that - was in ICU with BSL of 48 - but did recover.
But, most people can eat sugar in sensible amounts. Even diabetics can eat it in small amounts.
The issue is not sugar per se but over consumption leadng to obesity related diseases or, in case of diabetics, to diabetic complications.
Context. Dosage.
You conflated an instantaneous consequence with an average over time consequence, in order to call someone else dumb. People aren't talking about eating a lot of sugar once, they're talking about eating a lot of it over time, which would why diabetes is called a CHRONIC illness.
Um, no. The debate in this thread seems definitely to be between those who think sugar (or added sugar) in any amount is terrible and those of us saying it's fine in moderate amounts in the context of a healthful overall diet.Lol no one eats sugar in "sensible" amounts in the US.
No one? I think many of us here do.
It usually comes in a small package, with loads of fat, that is easy to over eat on. I have seen the research, a high sugar diet can actually lower overall fasting blood sugars in HEALTHY adults. It is because they lose weight and insulin sensitivity goes up usually when people lower adiposity.
@Pogostickers , I am with you ma'am, personally added sugars are just not worth the added calories or lack of satiety for me. I prefer my sugars to come from fruits and veggies. I noticed when I gave up added sugar, fruit became super sweet. Taste can change.
I handle this a bit differently. I eat food. I don't eat "sugar" or "fat" or whatever. I don't get my sugar from sources because getting my sugar is not important, I don't even look at it, I just eat food and sometimes it has sugar and sometimes it doesn't, sometimes the sugar is of the added sort, sometimes it's not. I focus on 2 things: eating foods I enjoy, and overall meeting my nutrient needs within calories.
What I do eat is more important to me than what I don't eat, and sometimes something that has added sugar is worth it and sometimes it isn't, just like any other food that has any other ingredient. I make my decisions on a food to food basis, I don't need to waste my effort on setting up rules for trivial things that don't affect my health or weight management. For example, yesterday I had ice cream planned but I was a bit hungrier than usual so I decided to eat a hearty snack instead because it felt more worth it. Sometimes ice cream is exactly what I need and it's worth it.
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amusedmonkey wrote: »psychod787 wrote: »fitnessjustin01 wrote: »I don't know... because it's a socially accepted drug? 🤔
<---- is currently mainlining his apple right now..... ahhh...., sweet, pun intended, bliss!jdecker32356 wrote: »paperpudding wrote: »Pogostickers wrote: »Maybe they never had half their family die from it
Is this a serious comment??
People are not dying from sugar
well, I guess a type 1 diabetic could go into diabetic coma and die if they ate massive amount and did not take their insulin. I knew somebody once who almost did that - was in ICU with BSL of 48 - but did recover.
But, most people can eat sugar in sensible amounts. Even diabetics can eat it in small amounts.
The issue is not sugar per se but over consumption leadng to obesity related diseases or, in case of diabetics, to diabetic complications.
Context. Dosage.
You conflated an instantaneous consequence with an average over time consequence, in order to call someone else dumb. People aren't talking about eating a lot of sugar once, they're talking about eating a lot of it over time, which would why diabetes is called a CHRONIC illness.
Um, no. The debate in this thread seems definitely to be between those who think sugar (or added sugar) in any amount is terrible and those of us saying it's fine in moderate amounts in the context of a healthful overall diet.Lol no one eats sugar in "sensible" amounts in the US.
No one? I think many of us here do.
It usually comes in a small package, with loads of fat, that is easy to over eat on. I have seen the research, a high sugar diet can actually lower overall fasting blood sugars in HEALTHY adults. It is because they lose weight and insulin sensitivity goes up usually when people lower adiposity.
@Pogostickers , I am with you ma'am, personally added sugars are just not worth the added calories or lack of satiety for me. I prefer my sugars to come from fruits and veggies. I noticed when I gave up added sugar, fruit became super sweet. Taste can change.
I handle this a bit differently. I eat food. I don't eat "sugar" or "fat" or whatever. I don't get my sugar from sources because getting my sugar is not important, I don't even look at it, I just eat food and sometimes it has sugar and sometimes it doesn't, sometimes the sugar is of the added sort, sometimes it's not. I focus on 2 things: eating foods I enjoy, and overall meeting my nutrient needs within calories.
What I do eat is more important to me than what I don't eat, and sometimes something that has added sugar is worth it and sometimes it isn't, just like any other food that has any other ingredient. I make my decisions on a food to food basis, I don't need to waste my effort on setting up rules for trivial things that don't affect my health or weight management. For example, yesterday I had ice cream planned but I was a bit hungrier than usual so I decided to eat a hearty snack instead because it felt more worth it. Sometimes ice cream is exactly what I need and it's worth it.
I agree with your statement, but we have to look at added sugar intake in the context of overall diet. When Cuba went into a massive recession in the past, added sugar intake went up and fat intake went down. Overall caloric intake went down. They could not afford gas, so many people started walking everywhere. Many folks lost weight. So, added sugar in the context of a deficit or energy equilibrium has no effect on weight. When people on MFP, such as yourself, count calories and have added sugar with energy equilibrium, it has little effect. Unfortunately, most western/ affluent individuals do not track their intake. We have seen that added sugar does not have the same effect on satiety as food in its whole form. This is probably why we see a correlation between Sugary Beverage consumption and weight gain, no correlation between weight gain and fresh fruit consumption. There is actually a net slimming effect in replacing sugary beverages with fresh fruit for the same "sugar" intake.3 -
One day I just stopped eating refined sugar as much as I used too. In fact certain foods like candy and sweeter baked goods that I used to crave outright repulsed me. Even now I get queasy thinking about eating certain desserts. I find all of this taste preference stuff fascinating.
However, I do sense like with most things people come to the table with emotions that while tied to the issue, cloud the discussion. Anyhoo, one thing that is interesting now is that I crave fruits and vegitables where I used to crave donuts, soda, and candy. Fruit for instance and nuts have such amazing depths of flavor that I was never able to find among the foods made with refined sugars. By eating less refined sugar, my eyes have been opened to a bounty of natural flavors that are super amazing!3
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