Coronavirus prep
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https://labblog.uofmhealth.org/rounds/top-5-covid-19-vaccine-candidates-explained
Here is one recent summary.
I do not have the link in hand but one from a Chinese firm was hoping for theirs to protect 60% of the people jabed and last for 6 months. Sound like the odds for regular flu shots perhaps and long term side effects will become known it the following years.
From what I read it sounds like Bill Gates supported labs are making progress.2 -
Regarding holiday plans, I'm open to the possibility that there will be much better testing -- readily available, quick results, more accurate. I'm optimistic that at some point, if not by the holidays, people can take a test before deciding to visit grandma.
Our two college kids will live at home Thanksgiving-January, and we've asked them to test before they come back home. We had a lot of pointless quarantining -- 8 weeks total -- because tests were not available and results took >2 weeks. Each time a kid came home, we stayed in 2 weeks. Then one had indoor exposure (dinner) to someone who tested positive (step brother). Looking back, it seems like so much wasted effort because of inadequate testing. A cheap saliva self-test could make the holidays a lot merrier and safer for all.
ETA: https://www.the-scientist.com/news-opinion/saliva-tests-how-they-work-and-what-they-bring-to-covid-19-67720
https://www.statnews.com/2020/08/15/fda-clears-saliva-test-for-covid-19-opening-door-to-wider-testing/3 -
Regarding holiday plans, I'm open to the possibility that there will be much better testing -- readily available, quick results, more accurate. I'm optimistic that at some point, if not by the holidays, people can take a test before deciding to visit grandma.
Our two college kids will live at home Thanksgiving-January, and we've asked them to test before they come back home. We had a lot of pointless quarantining -- 8 weeks total -- because tests were not available and results took >2 weeks. Each time a kid came home, we stayed in 2 weeks. Then one had indoor exposure (dinner) to someone who tested positive (step brother). Looking back, it seems like so much wasted effort because of inadequate testing. A cheap saliva self-test could make the holidays a lot merrier and safer for all.
I really hope you're right. My family had a party at my parents' house this weekend to celebrate all the missed birthdays and other events. 10 people, outside, seated at least 6 feet apart, and masks when we had to go into the house or get close to each other. All I was thinking was...this is NOT going to work for Thanksgiving or Christmas (at least not in our climate).5 -
We went out (again) on Saturday night to eat. One of our regular patio places, because there's not a lot of choices in Tucson that are open in the heat in the Summer outside -- most are taking their chances inside -- I won't. We got there on Saturday and they informed us that they were "closed due to the heat for outside dining". Understandable, it was 106!
My wife had a bit of an emotional breakdown -- we've been seeing friends just eat inside and risk it and I'm not willing to do that. Let's face it, AZ is only three weeks away from being the highest per capita place on the planet.
After we left and got in the car (wife was not happy), I did a quick search and found a place that was open, but 45 minutes away on the other side of town. It wasn't fancy at all -- my wife later joked she expected a horse to pull up and be tied up. Turned out, it wasn't fancy but had seven types of hard cider (I'm celiac and that's a bid deal!) and my wife had the "best ribs in Tucson" that actually were some of the best ribs I've ever had. She let me try exactly one. And they made their ranch beans from scratch as well. Patio had misters and it ended up really pleasant and the long drive didn't seem bad because we're stuck at home all week.
One nice thing about all of this is all the exploring we've done to find outdoor seating for safe options to eat. Our friends that are just going to the same indoor places can't say the same. The wife has already mentioned when we'll go back to this new place. I have to keep reminding her (I'm a pretty simple guy, doesn't take much to make me happy) that these are first world problems and we're fortunate. She's been a bit down. The emotional toll it does take is real, not having as large of a social network or interactions. I truly feel for those that are struggling with mortgage, food or rent on top (or medical bills now).
Oh, and we had nearly one inch hail last night! My wife's pics ended up on the local news station. 105 and it hailed so bad it looked like snow on the ground. Never a dull moment in Tucson!11 -
My cousin is taking more preventative measures than anyone I know. We call her CDC. She just related to us that we need to flush and run, especially in public places. It is the dreaded 'Rona mushroom cloud. Toilet plumes
lift 'Rona droplets out into the atmosphere to be inhaled. They say, Ol' CDC to turn your head after flushing and run like hail. Just what we need. More multi-cr@p to worry about.
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I am back to WFH for a number of reasons, including that my husband is currently in a very high risk group and will be for months. I am limiting my exposure as much as possible so I don't bring anything home to him.
BUT some family members are already saying "but we can still do Thanksgiving, right?" As much as I hate to tell them no, it's currently a necessity and they are going to have to respect that. Most understand, a few want to argue with me and one said "but he's not going to die from the flu!" I am too stressed and tired to deal with that level of ignorance.
I am grateful to everyone who wears masks and observes social distancing guidelines when needed.21 -
SuzySunshine99 wrote: »Regarding holiday plans, I'm open to the possibility that there will be much better testing -- readily available, quick results, more accurate. I'm optimistic that at some point, if not by the holidays, people can take a test before deciding to visit grandma.
Our two college kids will live at home Thanksgiving-January, and we've asked them to test before they come back home. We had a lot of pointless quarantining -- 8 weeks total -- because tests were not available and results took >2 weeks. Each time a kid came home, we stayed in 2 weeks. Then one had indoor exposure (dinner) to someone who tested positive (step brother). Looking back, it seems like so much wasted effort because of inadequate testing. A cheap saliva self-test could make the holidays a lot merrier and safer for all.
I really hope you're right. My family had a party at my parents' house this weekend to celebrate all the missed birthdays and other events. 10 people, outside, seated at least 6 feet apart, and masks when we had to go into the house or get close to each other. All I was thinking was...this is NOT going to work for Thanksgiving or Christmas (at least not in our climate).
Yeah. (Michigan, here.) I've been thinking a lot about that recently, and not just about holidays. Winter is going to be ugly. Some folks who are being semi-well-isolated in this warmer weather won't be able to hold out when the temperature's below freezing, and they can't meet others outside or eat on well-ventilated patios. This is hard on people with high social needs. I'm happy I'm not one, but it's a true psychological issue in some of my friends. It's not just an abdication of social responsibility - it's more of a dilemma from some. I hope they find a solution, without increasing their/others infection risks.9 -
I worry a bit about my mental health this winter. I am able to run outside, that helps keep depression at bay most of the time, but I am normally heebie jeebie with public spaces in the cold months anyway, this year could set me over the edge with my anxiety
I remember having to literally tell myself to breathe as we stepped into a crowded gym for basketball last year after everyone had finally gotten over being sick. (Not that we have to worry much about THAT scenario this year, ain’t no way b-ball is gonna happen for our family!) I change my clothes after the grocery store. Avoid the doctor unless absolutely, positively necessary (sometimes to a fault). I think CSI type shows ruined my brain years ago with their glowing lights showing how things were transmitted along the way. And even with the looming issues of a megasick winter, I fear people will become even more complacent or indignant as they further tire of taking precautions, or forget why they are necessary. 9 -
A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.5 -
I hate masks (I do wear them, of course) because no matter what I try my glasses fog and they are unpleasantly hot in some weather, but no skin issues at all.8
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A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.
I haven't had any skin issues from masks.4 -
Diatonic12 wrote: »My cousin is taking more preventative measures than anyone I know. We call her CDC. She just related to us that we need to flush and run, especially in public places. It is the dreaded 'Rona mushroom cloud. Toilet plumes
lift 'Rona droplets out into the atmosphere to be inhaled. They say, Ol' CDC to turn your head after flushing and run like hail. Just what we need. More multi-cr@p to worry about.
This is actually a valid concern, and one reason why I won’t travel right now, because I’m not willing to use a public toilet. Covid is shed in human feces, and infectious virus has been recovered from air in hospital bathrooms in China, hours after use.
Experts differ on how much they believe aerosols are driving transmission, but one thing they agree on at the moment, and that is that there are a large number of cases of unknown origin. So it seems pretty whack to say it never happens, when infectious virus can be recovered and cultured from aerosols, and about half of cases are coming from somewhere the experts can’t seem to figure out.
However, turning your head and rushing away won’t save you, unless you somehow manage to hold your breath and wear goggles the whole time you are in the restroom. So yeah. The silly bathroom dance is pretty pointless.8 -
A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.
My sister works in healthcare, she's got maskne. My husband's cousin works at Walmart, she has it - she said she has 60-year-old women complaining about the acne.
Both of them said disposable ones make it worse, something in the material?
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MikePfirrman wrote: »
I'm really sorry you're going through all of this. It has been hard. Harder for some than others.
I'm not going to minimize what you're going through. It's a difficult reality for many. Have you thought of maybe going for a walk or trying to find some socially distant activities? Isolation is very hard. Perhaps adopt a pet so you're not so lonely if you can afford to do that.
Thank you.
I actually have 2 cats who are pretty much what is keeping me sane. Having them around is a lifesaver and I am very grateful for them. However, they don't do much for the lack of interaction with others. Not great at keeping up a conversation lol.
I do have a table top role play game that will be starting soon on Zoom. We are just on hold atm because the game master is doing a play (digitally) so he has to finish that before we can start. Should be in just a couple more weeks though so I am looking forward to that. And I also plan to take up walking and hiking once it's not so hot out that I don't feel like I am in an oven.
I'm just tired of not being free to do what I want to do. When going to a different grocery store is the most exciting thing that happens to you, it gets a little boring. I also know that a lot of my mental health issues are also due to my physical health. My fatigue, digestive problems, sleep issues, migraines, and more can be explained by my *kitten* diet. I order in food way too much and feel like junk pretty much every single time after I eat. So I am focusing on trying to work on that. Not calorie counting or anything because my anxiety is too bad for it (I can get really bad OCD and anxiety issues with calorie counting as it is so no need to add to the current levels), but just trying to get back into a healthier mind set. More produce. Smaller portions. Learning to listen to my hunger and fullness cues. Keeping my food more simple (cooking and what I buy at the store). Less eating out. That sort of thing.
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My husband has to wear a specific type of disposable mask at work and you can see chapped skin through his beardExistingFish wrote: »A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.
My sister works in healthcare, she's got maskne. My husband's cousin works at Walmart, she has it - she said she has 60-year-old women complaining about the acne.
Both of them said disposable ones make it worse, something in the material?
My oldest just turned 13 so breakouts have been happening for a little while, but he has this weird area on each side of his nose/upper lip area - can’t tell if it’s a rash or breakout. He doesn’t wear a mask often (to church on Sunday, only during coming and going because we sit off to ourselves in the “storage area” pews, random other occasions are rare because most activities are just our family and outdoors), so it seems weird that it would be the cause, but we can’t figure out what else it would be.
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A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.
I've worn several types of masks and none irritated my skin. However, I don't need them for long stretches of time. Average time is about 30-45 minutes (grocery shopping.)2 -
baconslave wrote: »kshama2001 wrote: »
Better safe than sorry until we get an effective vaccine
Do you really think we will get an effective vaccine? There's never been a vaccine for a coronavirus before, viruses mutate all the time, and we can't even get a decent vaccine for the flu half the time (it seems like anyway). Not to mention there will be no long term studies to see what effects any vaccine will have long term....just seems like hoping for a vaccine is a pipe dream at best.
It just doesn't seem realistic - and honest question, will you be happy to live the rest of your life isolated from friends and family? Because that could happen if we don't come up with a vaccine. I mean we can hope for a vaccine that is long term proven both effective and safe but what will our mental health be if we avoid all people/activities for so long? Will you be willing to take one that hasn't had any long term studies on it? Isn't that risking health issues just as much as Covid?
The flu vaccine is actually very effective, the problem is there are many versions of the flu and they don't always predict the correct ones. Even so, if everyone who could get the vaccine every year did get it, we would have a better chance on any given year of at least approaching herd immunity and greatly reducing flu transmission.
One of the primary reasons there are no coronavirus vaccines is that the common coronaviruses are not dangerous and the dangerous ones are not common. It's simply not budget conscious. C19 is I think the first coronavirus to warrant the time and resources to develop and produce a vaccine.
My understanding from researchers I follow on social media is the two major vaccines being tested in the US are being built with ingredients already being used in other vaccines. Assuming phase 3 of either trial shows efficacy, I will be in line for a jab as soon as I'm allowed. As more data comes out, it sounds like a measurable percentage of people end up with long term side effects like chronic fatigue, heart inflammation, circulatory issues, even those who had a mild illness. Could be as high as 40%. Serious stuff.
It is quite possible that at least in the beginning, continuing boosters will be required to maintain some level of immunity.
Having said that, of course there's no guarantee. If there is no vaccine, efforts will have to switch to increasingly efficient testing and treatment to avoid the millions of deaths seen in 1918. I'll worry about that bridge if we get there, which hopefully we won't. But I'm not going to throw caution to the wind now because I might have to throw caution to the wind later. We don't know enough yet to give up IMHO.
While I respect your decision to get in line for a jab, I am curious as to why you do not find this to be a deterrent "As more data comes out, it sounds like a measurable percentage of people end up with long term side effects like chronic fatigue, heart inflammation, circulatory issues, even those who had a mild illness. Could be as high as 40%."
I took it to mean that she was listing the risks associated with getting the virus. So in light of the likelihood of experiencing those long term after-effects, she is really seriously considering getting the vaccine right away. That's how I read it anyway.
Yes, this. Sorry if that wasn't clear, it looks like I was typing as the thoughts popped into my head lol. The long lasting effects are from covid-19, the jab would hopefully help to spare me from them!
Oh! I thought you meant as more data comes out about the VACCINES, not the VIRUS, lol. Thanks for clearing that up
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MikePfirrman wrote: »
I'm really sorry you're going through all of this. It has been hard. Harder for some than others.
I'm not going to minimize what you're going through. It's a difficult reality for many. Have you thought of maybe going for a walk or trying to find some socially distant activities? Isolation is very hard. Perhaps adopt a pet so you're not so lonely if you can afford to do that.
Thank you.
I actually have 2 cats who are pretty much what is keeping me sane. Having them around is a lifesaver and I am very grateful for them. However, they don't do much for the lack of interaction with others. Not great at keeping up a conversation lol.
I do have a table top role play game that will be starting soon on Zoom. We are just on hold atm because the game master is doing a play (digitally) so he has to finish that before we can start. Should be in just a couple more weeks though so I am looking forward to that. And I also plan to take up walking and hiking once it's not so hot out that I don't feel like I am in an oven.
I'm just tired of not being free to do what I want to do. When going to a different grocery store is the most exciting thing that happens to you, it gets a little boring. I also know that a lot of my mental health issues are also due to my physical health. My fatigue, digestive problems, sleep issues, migraines, and more can be explained by my *kitten* diet. I order in food way too much and feel like junk pretty much every single time after I eat. So I am focusing on trying to work on that. Not calorie counting or anything because my anxiety is too bad for it (I can get really bad OCD and anxiety issues with calorie counting as it is so no need to add to the current levels), but just trying to get back into a healthier mind set. More produce. Smaller portions. Learning to listen to my hunger and fullness cues. Keeping my food more simple (cooking and what I buy at the store). Less eating out. That sort of thing.
I'm having lots of physical and mental health issues these days too.
I started addressing my anxiety and poor coping skills of this via tele-health with a behavioral health intern, which was somewhat helpful, but can really tell the difference between an intern and someone experienced. Fortunately, her program ended and I am now with someone a lot more experienced, which makes a BIG difference. Had a great session today. I prefer video calls - the remoteness feels safer.
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MikePfirrman wrote: »
I'm really sorry you're going through all of this. It has been hard. Harder for some than others.
I'm not going to minimize what you're going through. It's a difficult reality for many. Have you thought of maybe going for a walk or trying to find some socially distant activities? Isolation is very hard. Perhaps adopt a pet so you're not so lonely if you can afford to do that.
Thank you.
I actually have 2 cats who are pretty much what is keeping me sane. Having them around is a lifesaver and I am very grateful for them. However, they don't do much for the lack of interaction with others. Not great at keeping up a conversation lol.
I do have a table top role play game that will be starting soon on Zoom. We are just on hold atm because the game master is doing a play (digitally) so he has to finish that before we can start. Should be in just a couple more weeks though so I am looking forward to that. And I also plan to take up walking and hiking once it's not so hot out that I don't feel like I am in an oven.
I'm just tired of not being free to do what I want to do. When going to a different grocery store is the most exciting thing that happens to you, it gets a little boring. I also know that a lot of my mental health issues are also due to my physical health. My fatigue, digestive problems, sleep issues, migraines, and more can be explained by my *kitten* diet. I order in food way too much and feel like junk pretty much every single time after I eat. So I am focusing on trying to work on that. Not calorie counting or anything because my anxiety is too bad for it (I can get really bad OCD and anxiety issues with calorie counting as it is so no need to add to the current levels), but just trying to get back into a healthier mind set. More produce. Smaller portions. Learning to listen to my hunger and fullness cues. Keeping my food more simple (cooking and what I buy at the store). Less eating out. That sort of thing.
I talk a ton to my animals these days. I have 3 dogs and two cats and I'm sure my neighbors think I'm crazy if they would hear me having conversations with my dogs in the AM. But I have a borderline unhealthy affection for animals anyway, so screw the neighbors
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moonangel12 wrote: »
My husband has to wear a specific type of disposable mask at work and you can see chapped skin through his beardExistingFish wrote: »A question to those who have worn masks in public places for a longer time: do you get more skin irritation/flare-ups in your chin, nose or cheeks?
We got a mask advisory for public transportation on Thursday, and today a newspaper did interviews of people in the train. There was a woman who didn’t wear a mask, and her arguments included ”it will only be useful if everyone wears it, so I won’t wear it unless forced”, which, ?????? Can’t really understand the logic. Her other argument was that her cosmetologist/beautician had speculated on possible skin issues, which, again, I really wonder if they could be worse than the effects of covid-19.
Whether the mask causes pimples or other skin issues won’t affect my decision to wear a mask, but I got genuinely curious.
My sister works in healthcare, she's got maskne. My husband's cousin works at Walmart, she has it - she said she has 60-year-old women complaining about the acne.
Both of them said disposable ones make it worse, something in the material?
My oldest just turned 13 so breakouts have been happening for a little while, but he has this weird area on each side of his nose/upper lip area - can’t tell if it’s a rash or breakout. He doesn’t wear a mask often (to church on Sunday, only during coming and going because we sit off to ourselves in the “storage area” pews, random other occasions are rare because most activities are just our family and outdoors), so it seems weird that it would be the cause, but we can’t figure out what else it would be.
I would add, I work from home so I just wear my mask when entering the gym and to church on Sunday, as well as a once-weekly shopping trip (if we don't do pickup) and/or the occasional dash into the dollar store. I just have my regular annoying adult acne, I haven't noticed any more due to mask usage, but I'm not wearing mine all day like my family members who mentioned it.0
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