"Bulky" vs "Muscular". The real definition.
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Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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I really like this thread too. Thanks for reviving it. Everyone has their own fitness goals; mine right now are to to gain balance, mobility and barbell squat strength while maintaining current body fat to stay soft.0
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Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?5 -
Wait, so if you're described as pear shaped, you'll take offense to that if you are pear shaped? Classic. BTW, I HAVE to identify shape of my clients' bodies ANYWAY to determine what type of training program I put together for them so they can reach their goals. Just sayin'
Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?
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Wait, so if you're described as pear shaped, you'll take offense to that if you are pear shaped? Classic. BTW, I HAVE to identify shape of my clients' bodies ANYWAY to determine what type of training program I put together for them so they can reach their goals. Just sayin'
Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?
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No I probably wouldn't. But if a man started a thread dedicated solely to explaining to me why I was or wasn't pear shaped, and why I really shouldn't be describing myself that way because "this is the correct way to describe your body", complete with pictures so I can easily compare myself to his definition of pear shaped to find out if I qualify, then I might take offense to that.
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Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?
Y'know, I get how this seems a little eye-roll-y, in concept. I don't totally love it, for that reason. (That may also have something to do with my feeling like the info is kind of self-evident . . . but apparently it isn't *actually* self-evident, since there are confused posts on the subject about it periodically even now.)
But the dude's a long-term, experienced, professional trainer, talking about terminology that's part of the essential vocabulary of his field of expertise. He's also a poster with a long, diverse and helpful history on MFP, so he didn't just show up to explain female muscularity to us, out of the blue, in some condescending way.
I'd be OK with a male gynecologist writing a post about how ovaries are involved in estrogen production, even though he doesn't have ovaries himself, and even if I personally might prefer a female as my personal gynecologist. I kind of feel the same way about this.
Clearly, your mileage varies.
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Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?
Y'know, I get how this seems a little eye-roll-y, in concept. I don't totally love it, for that reason. (That may also have something to do with my feeling like the info is kind of self-evident . . . but apparently it isn't *actually* self-evident, since there are confused posts on the subject about it periodically even now.)
But the dude's a long-term, experienced, professional trainer, talking about terminology that's part of the essential vocabulary of his field of expertise. He's also a poster with a long, diverse and helpful history on MFP, so he didn't just show up to explain female muscularity to us, out of the blue, in some condescending way.
I'd be OK with a male gynecologist writing a post about how ovaries are involved in estrogen production, even though he doesn't have ovaries himself, and even if I personally might prefer a female as my personal gynecologist. I kind of feel the same way about this.
Clearly, your mileage varies.
Agree with this. @ninerbuff knows his stuff and has proven it over multiple years here on MFP.
Why is it so popular to go straight to #offended? I don’t get it. 🤷♀️3 -
So you're offended to what I actually posted as CORRECT information based on decades of experience and it's not being contradicted by many peers who have much experience as well. Makes sense.
Wait, so if you're described as pear shaped, you'll take offense to that if you are pear shaped? Classic. BTW, I HAVE to identify shape of my clients' bodies ANYWAY to determine what type of training program I put together for them so they can reach their goals. Just sayin'
Back then there were so many females afraid to lift weights (still an issue) because of fear of getting "bulky" or "too muscular". I just had to dispell the myth and give the reasons why. One took real offense.quiksylver296 wrote: »
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A thread by a man dedicated to classifying women's bodies for us. What could possibly be offensive about that?
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No I probably wouldn't. But if a man started a thread dedicated solely to explaining to me why I was or wasn't pear shaped, and why I really shouldn't be describing myself that way because "this is the correct way to describe your body", complete with pictures so I can easily compare myself to his definition of pear shaped to find out if I qualify, then I might take offense to that.
I don't understand why you find it offensive if what I'm explaining ISN'T made to demean anyone. It was to explain differences on how vernacular in the gym (and on here) was being used. The pictures were to give an idea. But to each their own. You don't have to agree.
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But here's the thing - I never said I found it offensive. YOU posted a comment that "one took offense" (laughing emoji) when I quickly scanned the thread I could see why. So I shared that yes, as a woman, I can see how a thread by a man classifying female body shapes could be considered offensive.
You can do what you want with that information. It seems to be your belief that one shouldn't be offended by it and therefore that "one" who was, was wrong. If that works for you then no need to consider what I offered as an alternative perspective on it.
I guess the fact that you found her offense amusing should have clued me in to the fact that you probably wouldn't be interested in why that might be that she felt that way.
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So basically you took offense as well. Because RATHER than actually ask how conclusions were made on it (I have no idea if you actually read the content at all), you just took the side of the offended. I gave the reason why I actually made it years back.But here's the thing - I never said I found it offensive. YOU posted a comment that "one took offense" (laughing emoji) when I quickly scanned the thread I could see why. So I shared that yes, as a woman, I can see how a thread by a man classifying female body shapes could be considered offensive.
You can do what you want with that information. It seems to be your belief that one shouldn't be offended by it and therefore that "one" who was, was wrong. If that works for you then no need to consider what I offered as an alternative perspective on it.
I guess the fact that you found her offense amusing should have clued me in to the fact that you probably wouldn't be interested in why that might be that she felt that way.
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So basically you took offense as well. Because RATHER than actually ask how conclusions were made on it (I have no idea if you actually read the content at all), you just took the side of the offended. I gave the reason why I actually made it years back.But here's the thing - I never said I found it offensive. YOU posted a comment that "one took offense" (laughing emoji) when I quickly scanned the thread I could see why. So I shared that yes, as a woman, I can see how a thread by a man classifying female body shapes could be considered offensive.
You can do what you want with that information. It seems to be your belief that one shouldn't be offended by it and therefore that "one" who was, was wrong. If that works for you then no need to consider what I offered as an alternative perspective on it.
I guess the fact that you found her offense amusing should have clued me in to the fact that you probably wouldn't be interested in why that might be that she felt that way.
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No I personally found it eye-rolling mansplaining tbh - not offensive. And I didn't ask how the conclusions were made on it because I literally have less than zero interest in how you classify women's bodies as "bulky" or "lean" or whatever else. I was just responding to your single comment about someone who was offended.
I said I UNDERSTOOD how a woman might find it offensive, and thought maybe that as the writer that information might be useful to you. I have been a therapist and I understand women's triggers around their bodies and insecurities. Why would I need to take anyone's side? Are you framing this as an argument? Because I'm not.
At any rate I apologize that I seem to have hit a nerve, and ironically, offended you with my observations.
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I’m so not offended by this post!!!
Women always say they don’t want to get bulky and OP was just helping women understanding the diff. Posts like this actually help me understand better that as long as I keep my fat % at around 20% I will never look ‘bulky’.
There’s absolutely nothing wrong with men helping women reach their fitness goals bc not all of us fully understand female body building. I used to be afraid to lift more than 50lbs not that long ago.
I don’t care if the person explaining is a dude or where the advice comes from if it’s science and research based.
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Since I know that information, especially when it comes to relaying it to some is subjective, I take no offense and really don't ponder much on why they felt offended. What I do try to find out is why it may be offensive to them. Is it they feel it's an attack on them? And if so, why would they? Are they just as sensitive person? Anyway, I'm not here to argue about it. I stand behind what I wrote and if it bothers someone to actually read it they have the option to dislike. I just like to know why they may dislike it.
So basically you took offense as well. Because RATHER than actually ask how conclusions were made on it (I have no idea if you actually read the content at all), you just took the side of the offended. I gave the reason why I actually made it years back.But here's the thing - I never said I found it offensive. YOU posted a comment that "one took offense" (laughing emoji) when I quickly scanned the thread I could see why. So I shared that yes, as a woman, I can see how a thread by a man classifying female body shapes could be considered offensive.
You can do what you want with that information. It seems to be your belief that one shouldn't be offended by it and therefore that "one" who was, was wrong. If that works for you then no need to consider what I offered as an alternative perspective on it.
I guess the fact that you found her offense amusing should have clued me in to the fact that you probably wouldn't be interested in why that might be that she felt that way.
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No I personally found it eye-rolling mansplaining tbh - not offensive. And I didn't ask how the conclusions were made on it because I literally have less than zero interest in how you classify women's bodies as "bulky" or "lean" or whatever else. I was just responding to your single comment about someone who was offended.
I said I UNDERSTOOD how a woman might find it offensive, and thought maybe that as the writer that information might be useful to you. I have been a therapist and I understand women's triggers around their bodies and insecurities. Why would I need to take anyone's side? Are you framing this as an argument? Because I'm not.
At any rate I apologize that I seem to have hit a nerve, and ironically, offended you with my observations.
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I think it's great to reassure people about what their physique may or may not end up looking like. However I think you are to some extent flogging a dead horse if you seek to enlighten the vast majority of people on the meanings of "bulky" and "muscular" and exhort them to use the correct terms. I'm a stickler for correct usage of English (why I ever bother with social media escapes me!) but when it comes to aesthetics people will always be subjective. Pictures are invaluable and if I were training somebody I would obtain loads of pictures of physiques so we could drill down to what they were hoping to achieve and then (if necessary) manage their expectations, taking their structure into account. I remember chatting to a friend in our gym coffee shop and saying a particular trainer had a figure I envied. She didn't know the trainer so next time said trainer came into the coffee shop I pointed her out. My friend looked goggle-eyed (not in a good way) and said "OMG - look at the size of her thighs!". I didn't think her thighs were particularly big.2
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Yes, it's subjective. Where some find Jessica Biel "too muscular" for their liking, others will wish that were their current physique.SnifterPug wrote: »I think it's great to reassure people about what their physique may or may not end up looking like. However I think you are to some extent flogging a dead horse if you seek to enlighten the vast majority of people on the meanings of "bulky" and "muscular" and exhort them to use the correct terms. I'm a stickler for correct usage of English (why I ever bother with social media escapes me!) but when it comes to aesthetics people will always be subjective. Pictures are invaluable and if I were training somebody I would obtain loads of pictures of physiques so we could drill down to what they were hoping to achieve and then (if necessary) manage their expectations, taking their structure into account. I remember chatting to a friend in our gym coffee shop and saying a particular trainer had a figure I envied. She didn't know the trainer so next time said trainer came into the coffee shop I pointed her out. My friend looked goggle-eyed (not in a good way) and said "OMG - look at the size of her thighs!". I didn't think her thighs were particularly big.
But what initially this thread was for was actually confusion on the actual difference between "bulky" and "muscular". The fear factor for many females was that lifting weights would make them look like either. Or that some females made lots of claims that any lifting at all made them "bulky".
I usually have to persuade many a new female to exercise that lifting weights isn't going to make them look manly. And for many, they DON'T want to look like a fitness model or shot put thrower. But that's all going to based on how they train. And I can say that many many times on here, but will still get some that believe lifting weights won't get them to the level of look they desire.
And if you think that's crazy, you should have read my thread on "toning".
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I began going to the gym around 1993. It was all about aerobics step classes for women. We were terrified to lift more than 50 lbs bc we saw pics of female body builders who were on steroids. Funny looking back now.
I’m so glad that people like ‘Ninerbuff’ have taken the task of educating women on weight lifting. The younger women won’t get where you are coming from and that’s a great thing!!! It means people like you have done your job well and paved the way in the fitness industry.2 -
Winner, winner chicken dinner!!!!So to sum up:
Bulky = muscular with high body fat, 27%+
Muscular = muscles with moderate body fat. 20% to 26%
Muscular and defined = muscles and lower body fat 12% to 19%
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https://youtu.be/YzbgkdCmjdo 0 -
This was an interesting read, too. I think maybe because "bulky" seems to have such a negative connotation, ppl will find offense to it. (Not all ppl but some)
What I have learned through my own journey was that I actually prefer bulky me. When I was leaner I just didn't feel as well, I didn't feel like my lifts were as strong or that I ran as well. I was uncomfortable in the leaner body ( ppl can argue that all that want but that's my personal experience, not talking for anyone else). So, I guess I have to own being more on the "bulky" side of things . I am OK with that. I am strong, I am muscular, I am not super lean. It's good to have a firm grasp on what you are wanting and defining these terms can for sure help with that.
Another great bumped thread.5 -
Pics in the beginning are washed out, so thought it'd be a good idea to give visual again:
This is the "toned" look that a lot of females think of and are trying to achieve.
Same female, but now more "muscular" looking because of competition (where she actually weighs less than her precomp pic above)
And this would be a "bulky" phase. Many strength athletes bulk up because it improves their performance. Being too lean reduces their strength.
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I think women on PED's screw up women's perception of what an extreme weight lifter ends up looking like moreso than with men.
With men, it's kind of obvious that an average height, lean, elite natural athlete with at or nearly max muscle development kind of looks something between a sprinter and an NFL halfback.
Even elite, natural women powerlifters may not look "bulky" as the OP shows it.0
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