This isn't a dating app...

YellowD0gs wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

Agree that it's common for people to flirt in Chit-Chat or Fun & Games, people who don't want that interaction probably ought to just stay out of there, because this is a site for adults, and those are the areas for lighter interactions.

I rarely see out-of-the-blue inappropriate comments on serious threads in other parts of the Community, and if really inappropriate, flag/report-ing them (with a note to the mods) usually makes them go away. Hijacking a thread in a off-topic way is against the documented rules, technically (even if not flirtatious).

I absolutely agree that it's ridiculous and inappropriate that a few men send FRs, then follow up with inappropriate PMs, when the woman who's a target has done absolutely zero to invite flirtation. They should be reported, period. There have even been some serial phishers here. (Example: Guy who's shown up multiple times with different accounts, pretends to be widower with a couple of kids, tries to lure women into . . . well, it isn't good.)

Those few guys ruin the friend side of MFP for some women, *and* for decent men, IMO.

I still accept FRs from men, but not from men with completely private profiles, no Community history; or a profile that shows *only* female friends with pretty or fit-looking profile photos. Probably some of those are decent guys, but it's just not worth the risk of inappropriate, unwelcome, unsolicited flirtatious . . . even harassing or worse . . . PMs. There's no excuse. None.

Fellow females: Always, always report bad behavior to the moderators or the Community team staffers at MFP. I'm convinced they do want to weed out unsolicited flirtatious (or worse) nonsense, keep this a safe-feeling and welcoming place for all. By reporting the baddies (not just blocking/ignoring), we can each help insulate other women from bad experiences. You can find IDs for the Community team and mods at the link below, and - even though PMs are generally blocked for people who aren't MFP friends - you can PM the MFP staffers on the Community team without being official friends with them.

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10028709/meet-our-community-team#latest

If some women want to flirt (or more), that's fine. But the rest of us are not obligated to play that game, shouldn't be exposed to it without having given any kind of hint that it's welcome. A cute/pretty/flattering/fit profile photo alone is *not* such a hint.

And yet, there's a whole thread devoted to women doing this very same thing. Over 250 pages of complaints and commentary, and still going! Yes, they're hookers and hackers, but yeah, it's only the men's fault.

Right...

Bold of you to assume that the human beings running the pornbot accounts are (1) women, (2) women who look anything like those porny avatars, or (3) the actual women depicted in said avatars themselves.

YellowD0gs wrote: »

AnnPT77 wrote: »

Agree that it's common for people to flirt in Chit-Chat or Fun & Games, people who don't want that interaction probably ought to just stay out of there, because this is a site for adults, and those are the areas for lighter interactions.

I rarely see out-of-the-blue inappropriate comments on serious threads in other parts of the Community, and if really inappropriate, flag/report-ing them (with a note to the mods) usually makes them go away. Hijacking a thread in a off-topic way is against the documented rules, technically (even if not flirtatious).

I absolutely agree that it's ridiculous and inappropriate that a few men send FRs, then follow up with inappropriate PMs, when the woman who's a target has done absolutely zero to invite flirtation. They should be reported, period. There have even been some serial phishers here. (Example: Guy who's shown up multiple times with different accounts, pretends to be widower with a couple of kids, tries to lure women into . . . well, it isn't good.)

Those few guys ruin the friend side of MFP for some women, *and* for decent men, IMO.

I still accept FRs from men, but not from men with completely private profiles, no Community history; or a profile that shows *only* female friends with pretty or fit-looking profile photos. Probably some of those are decent guys, but it's just not worth the risk of inappropriate, unwelcome, unsolicited flirtatious . . . even harassing or worse . . . PMs. There's no excuse. None.

Fellow females: Always, always report bad behavior to the moderators or the Community team staffers at MFP. I'm convinced they do want to weed out unsolicited flirtatious (or worse) nonsense, keep this a safe-feeling and welcoming place for all. By reporting the baddies (not just blocking/ignoring), we can each help insulate other women from bad experiences. You can find IDs for the Community team and mods at the link below, and - even though PMs are generally blocked for people who aren't MFP friends - you can PM the MFP staffers on the Community team without being official friends with them.

https://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10028709/meet-our-community-team#latest

If some women want to flirt (or more), that's fine. But the rest of us are not obligated to play that game, shouldn't be exposed to it without having given any kind of hint that it's welcome. A cute/pretty/flattering/fit profile photo alone is *not* such a hint.

And yet, there's a whole thread devoted to women doing this very same thing. Over 250 pages of complaints and commentary, and still going! Yes, they're hookers and hackers, but yeah, it's only the men's fault.

Right...

That thread is not about "the very same thing".

I'm talking - and I believe some other here are talking - about getting individual friend requests from what appear to be male profiles on MFP, and those users then send personal messages on a one-on-one basis. For me, those messages have included suggestions that I change my workout approach in ways that would make me more attractive/appealing to the sender, requests to give them my cell phone number or other personal contact ID, suggestions (usually somewhat veiled at first) about . . . activities . . . that we should do together, and that sort of thing.

The literally *one guy* I warned about was cat-phishing multiple women, telling a sob story. Usually it was nipped (as far as I know) before he got money out of anyone based on sob stories, or the like, but that was the nature of the situation. He claimed to be male, but I'm sure he (she) was lying about a lot of things, that being the nature of cat-phishing.

The thread you linked is about profiles believed by most to be faked or compromised, with either porn-like inappropriate profile photos, or that were posting links to porn/"dating" (looked more like escort) sites on their profile feeds. Most appeared to be old accounts that had been compromised, and even some with the porn-y female pics had "male" in the profile settings, and/or a male-sounding account name.

Those are all inappropriate things, things that sensible people would not want happening to folks who don't solicit that kind of thing, but they're not "the very same".

NVintage wrote: »

Yes, I understand that in an ideal world "the message in the OP “don’t do that”
Which is valid" would work...However, realistically you will get a lot less attention with a less sexy profile picture. Try it yourself! Common sense.. So if it truly bothers you and you'd rather not get all the attention, then put less sexiness out there. If you like your sexy selfie, nothing wrong with that, be yourself and embrace your sexiness online. Just accept that this is a public website and all kinds of people are going to see it and respond to what you display.

“People know what they do; frequently they know why they do what they do; but what they don't know is what what they do does.”
― Michel Foucault, Madness and Civilization: A History of Insanity in the Age of Reason

MargaretYakoda wrote: »

NVintage wrote: »

I agree! I have had a really good experience with MFP with most guys being very respectful and nice. I know you shouldn't have to, but might I suggest a picture like this...

instead of a sexy selfie. I put a not so sexy selfie showing half my body one time and got 3 times as many odd friend requests. Also this is my About me on my profile, haha
About Me:
I've lost most of the weight that I wanted to lose in July! Now I'm using the food diary mostly as a meal planner and to store recipes. I try to plan all my dinners for the week on Sundays.
(Nothing personal, but the private messaging is a bit weird on here, and so I usually don't respond to the private messages on this site. However, I do appreciate any friend requests.)

Turkey Salsa Thyme Bowl
*******************************
Reduced fat ranch dressing (1 tbsp)
Hot sauce, to taste
turkey (3 ounces)
shredded cheese
pico de gallo
shredded lettuce
All over wild rice
with olive oil and thyme

ninerbuff wrote: »

Welcome to the public forum. Where you'l get a mixture of creeps and good people. You just have to filter out the bad ones.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

The behavior has nothing to do with what profile picture we choose.

This is all on the people who decide to message people inappropriately.

And the message in the OP is “don’t do that”
Which is valid.

Uhhhh…. My current profile pic is a cartoon cat.
My previous profile pic was the Autigender Pride flag.

And even if my profile pic was naked boobies, the onus is on the creeper not to act like a creeper.

(Pic of naked boobies included for emphasis)

I really hope this doesn’t come across as an attempt at “mansplaining” but I did want to offer my perspective from the male point of view.

If you choose to post a “less sexy” (quotes because it’s very subjective) profile photo you may be able to reduce the amount of unwanted advances you get, but you shouldn’t have to and I really doubt it would make much of a difference anyway. I like to think of myself as a respectful and polite person, but I have had countless male friends, classmates, coworkers, teammates, etc. that didn’t care one bit how their actions or advances made a woman feel. That kind of guy is incredibly creative when it comes to this. If you post about feeling less than attractive they will think “I’ll make them feel beautiful and that will be my way in”. If you post about feeling depressed they’ll think comforting you is the way in. If you post about feeling vulnerable (financially, family issues, etc.) they will think making you feel safe and offering support is the way to get what they want. I don’t think I’ve said anything that any woman on this thread doesn’t already know, but my point is that it is intentional for that kind of guy and how far do you really want to go to adapt yourself to their behavior?

I had a hockey teammate years ago who would solely go after married women who were having trouble at home because he didn’t have a lot to offer a woman in terms of conventional dating. I had another teammate who always went after young women fresh out of high school (he was mid/late twenties) who struggled with their weight and had low self esteem. Please note that I did not call either of those people my friend. It’s gross behavior and it shouldn’t happen, but it does and will continue to happen for the foreseeable future.

I guess the point I’m trying to make is this; the men out there who, like myself, try to treat people (not just women) with kindness and empathy need to call out that behavior when we see it. I can tell you that I tried, but my success rate at getting someone to change was exactly zero. My recommendation for the women out there is not to try to change your approach to deter that kind of attention (you won’t be able to change enough to put a stop to it anyway), but rather ignore it when you can (i.e. no risk of harm to yourself or others) and report it when you can’t. And it is all of our jobs, as a society, to work together to try and put an end to it. And I don’t mean that to insinuate that women bear any responsibility for it happening to them, only that it will take the collective effort of all of us to make a dent in it.

And for any men out there who feel unfairly blamed for it, I get it, it sucks. But it’s also reasonable. I’m relatively new to posting in these forums but when I started there were several people who were compassionate and empathetic enough to my situation to send me friend requests, all of them happened to be women. That’s too small of a sample size to make any concrete conclusion about compassion and empathy between the sexes but it’s enough to make me worry. At any rate, I have since sent two of those new friends PMs and I was terrified to do so. Partly because I’ve been a shut-in for years, but mostly because I’m some random guy on the internet sending a woman an unsolicited message. I started messaging one because her posts on the thread I started made me think she needed someone to reach out and show her kindness and the other because she listed a very interesting job in her profile and I thought it would be interesting to talk about. Neither conversation had anything to do with anything romantic, but I was still stepping on eggshells just because internet culture has made interactions like that a minefield. The internet has removed the social consequences those men experience from approaching a woman like that in person, so they treat it like a numbers game. And yes, women are guilty of this as well. I have been crudely propositioned by women I expressed no interest in and I’ve had women refuse to take no for an answer (not on this site), but on a relative scale it is nothing in comparison to the way a lot of men behave.

I’m enough of a misanthrope that I don’t honestly believe it will ever fully stop, and I think it will always be bad on the internet as long as people can continue to use it anonymously. But we have to try to make it better where we can. We just have to find a way to convince people that everyone is deserving of compassion and kindness regardless of our differences or what we stand to gain as an individual, should be easy enough...

Sorry, I have a habit of getting rather verbose when I post on this site. I’m trying to work on it.

BendableButMendable wrote: »

I really hope this doesn’t come across as an attempt at “mansplaining” but I did want to offer my perspective from the male point of view.

If you choose to post a “less sexy” (quotes because it’s very subjective) profile photo you may be able to reduce the amount of unwanted advances you get, but you shouldn’t have to and I really doubt it would make much of a difference anyway. I like to think of myself as a respectful and polite person, but I have had countless male friends, classmates, coworkers, teammates, etc. that didn’t care one bit how their actions or advances made a woman feel. That kind of guy is incredibly creative when it comes to this. If you post about feeling less than attractive they will think “I’ll make them feel beautiful and that will be my way in”. If you post about feeling depressed they’ll think comforting you is the way in. If you post about feeling vulnerable (financially, family issues, etc.) they will think making you feel safe and offering support is the way to get what they want. I don’t think I’ve said anything that any woman on this thread doesn’t already know, but my point is that it is intentional for that kind of guy and how far do you really want to go to adapt yourself to their behavior?

I had a hockey teammate years ago who would solely go after married women who were having trouble at home because he didn’t have a lot to offer a woman in terms of conventional dating. I had another teammate who always went after young women fresh out of high school (he was mid/late twenties) who struggled with their weight and had low self esteem. Please note that I did not call either of those people my friend. It’s gross behavior and it shouldn’t happen, but it does and will continue to happen for the foreseeable future.

I guess the point I’m trying to make is this; the men out there who, like myself, try to treat people (not just women) with kindness and empathy need to call out that behavior when we see it. I can tell you that I tried, but my success rate at getting someone to change was exactly zero. My recommendation for the women out there is not to try to change your approach to deter that kind of attention (you won’t be able to change enough to put a stop to it anyway), but rather ignore it when you can (i.e. no risk of harm to yourself or others) and report it when you can’t. And it is all of our jobs, as a society, to work together to try and put an end to it. And I don’t mean that to insinuate that women bear any responsibility for it happening to them, only that it will take the collective effort of all of us to make a dent in it.

And for any men out there who feel unfairly blamed for it, I get it, it sucks. But it’s also reasonable. I’m relatively new to posting in these forums but when I started there were several people who were compassionate and empathetic enough to my situation to send me friend requests, all of them happened to be women. That’s too small of a sample size to make any concrete conclusion about compassion and empathy between the sexes but it’s enough to make me worry. At any rate, I have since sent two of those new friends PMs and I was terrified to do so. Partly because I’ve been a shut-in for years, but mostly because I’m some random guy on the internet sending a woman an unsolicited message. I started messaging one because her posts on the thread I started made me think she needed someone to reach out and show her kindness and the other because she listed a very interesting job in her profile and I thought it would be interesting to talk about. Neither conversation had anything to do with anything romantic, but I was still stepping on eggshells just because internet culture has made interactions like that a minefield. The internet has removed the social consequences those men experience from approaching a woman like that in person, so they treat it like a numbers game. And yes, woman are guilty of this as well. I have been crudely propositioned by women I expressed no interest in and I’ve had women refuse to take no for an answer (not on this site), but on a relative scale it is nothing in comparison to the way a lot of men behave.

I’m enough of a misanthrope that I don’t honestly believe it will ever fully stop, and I think it will always be bad on the internet as long as people can continue to use it anonymously. But we have to try to make it better where we can. We just have to find a way to convince people that everyone is deserving of compassion and kindness regardless of our differences or what we stand to gain as individual, should be easy enough...

Sorry, I have a habit of getting rather verbose when I post on this site. I’m trying to work on it.

I think that makes complete sense. Laudable, even. I agree that shifting culture in better directions requires collective efforts, over time.

I find it abhorrent when women behave badly, too: I figure it makes me and other women look bad, possibly makes life more difficult for us, depending on the details. It sounds like you're feeling similarly about badly-behaved men. (BTW: This isn't just a sex/gender issue; I feel the same way when (for example) other vegetarians use unscientific nonsense to try to persuade omnivores to stop eating meat. It just makes the rest of us look bad, turns some omnivores off to the whole concept. And so forth.)

I can't speak for you or your female MFP friends, nor for any other women on MFP, but I do get unsolicited messages from male MFP friends that are fine with me, that I enjoy reading and responding to, about things of common interest. On my MFP profile page, it says I do read and answer PMs from friends but " . . . if your private messages will be . . . things you wouldn't say in church in front of your wife/GF and all your friends/neighbors . . . we can't be friends. Don't even try."

NVintage wrote: »

that advice is perilously close to "what were you wearing?" It should not be necessary to change one's profile photo from a normal photo of a normal woman wearing things that it's legal and decent to wear in public, in order to avoid rude, unwelcome come-ons. Looking nice in one's profile photo is not a solicitation of inappropriate messages. The focus needs to be on the people who are behaving badly."

I thought about that when I said it, which is why I said* I know you shouldn't have to* I'm all for truth, though...it's good to be honest with yourself and think about why you do what you do.

As long as the advice is given to avoid certain clothes, poses, hair colors, hemlines, or etc - even with the qualification “I know you shouldn’t have to” - then it leaves room to blame the victim.

I haven’t mentioned it on this forum yet, but the one thing that was a key factor in my stopping my previous effort at weight loss was my chemistry professor who happened also to be my work study boss.
Long story. Won’t detail all of it here. Suffice it to say it was bad.

But I was returning to school. Trying to finish my degree. I had been getting fit and losing weight for some time. I was looking great. Really. I was 46, and about 160. Not that far from my goal.

The things he did, well…. When I found out he was doing the same to others (and, it turned out, worse) I reported him. And then I got the full force of rumors and the school and their lawyers. It was an absolute nightmare, that went on for a long time.

He even used the fact that I am well endowed and had the nerve to wear a sweater I purchased at Costco to “prove” to others what a “party girl” I was.
When all I was doing was attending class, cleaning lab equipment, setting up experiments for students, and occasionally grading papers (which I later found out I should never have been doing) That sweater showed exactly one inch of cleavage.
An inch…. And was brown and otherwise quite boring.

For the record, I am not, and never have been, a party girl. But there is nothing wrong with that if it’s truly consensual.

My point here is it doesn’t matter what you wear, the creepers will say it was a signal you wanted to (insert adult activity here)
So please. Keep the emphasis on the creeper’s behavior. Because someone could be wearing a head to toe covering and creepers will always say “They led me on! They wanted it!”
Don’t let them have even that much to hang on to.
It’s always always always the creeper’s behavior that is the problem. Always.