It is not good idea to count calories in vegetables!!

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Replies

  • PlunderBunneh
    PlunderBunneh Posts: 1,705 Member
    Lols.

    duty_calls.png

    I can't believe we made it 9 pages without this.
  • agthorn
    agthorn Posts: 1,844 Member
    Yet universally pretty much every study ever done that played with macro-nutrient ratios and kept calories consistent has shown otherwise.

    In this trial, the low carb group actually ate more calories a day, and lost more weight, showed no increased risk factors over the low fat group (which ate less calories), lost more weight, and improved insulin resistance as opposed to the low fat group.

    http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa022637#t=articleTop

    There are approximately a billion more like it. But this one proves my point so I will exit here.
    Actually, it doesn't prove your point - I suppose you didn't actually read the article?

    From Table 3. Change from Base Line in the Composition of the Two Diets at Six Months
    Total calories per day

    Low fat diet
    baseline: 1848 +/- 1338
    6 months: 1578 +/- 760
    absolute change: -271 +/- 1260

    low-carbohydrate diet
    baseline: 2090 +/- 1055
    6 months: 1630 +/- 894
    absolute change -460 +/-902
    P value of absolute change between groups = 0.33

    So, the average absolute calorie reduction was HIGHER in the low carb group, but because there was so much variability in the calorie count a P value of 0.33 means that the differences between the two groups was not statistically significant. From a statistical standpoint the two diets could be considered equivalent in calorie intake. And the low carb group lost more total weight because they lost more water weight - which is a noted physiological effect of reduced glycogen and accompanying water molecules stored. If you look at the study endpoints, scale weight and waist size were the only body composition measurements recorded, NOT body fat percentage.

    Direct quote from the discussion: "The greater weight loss in the low-carbohydrate group suggests a greater reduction in overall caloric intake, rather than a direct effect of macronutrient composition. However, the explanation for this difference is not clear. Subjects in this group may have experienced greater satiety on a diet with liberal proportions of protein and fat. However, other potential explanations include the simplicity of the diet and improved compliance related to the novelty of the diet."

    Science FTW.
  • jeffarthur
    jeffarthur Posts: 123 Member
    I know a woman, personally not on this site, and she told me the exact same thing. She eats around 1600 calories and does not count her veggies. She lost 149lbs. I count everything at this stage, because I am holding myself accountable for everything that passes through my lips. But tried and true, my friend did not count her veggies and she did it!

    I agree...it's about accountability. Being accountable for everything you eat. and it's fun
  • christibear
    christibear Posts: 93 Member
    potatos ARE a vegetable. Just because it's not a super healthy vegetable, doesn't mean it's not one. You can't pick and choose what are and aren't vegetables.

    You're right, you cannot. So you cannot decide potatoes are a vegetable, just because they are eaten as a side dish by many Americans.

    From Wikipedia alone:

    "The potato is a starchy, tuberous crop from the perennial Solanum tuberosum of the Solanaceae family (also known as the nightshades). The word potato may refer to the plant itself as well as the edible tuber. "

    Potatoes=tubers.

    And tubers are a type of vegetable. If you look it up on wikipedia it says root vegetable, here is another definition of tuber: root vegetable - any of various fleshy edible underground roots or tubers
  • LethaSue
    LethaSue Posts: 285 Member
    I don't know why we are debating what justifys a vegetable, fruit, tuber, protein, legume; when some people can't even accept the ideal that a calorie is a calorie. If I was not going to count veggies because they have only a few calories ( I am not speaking about the low calorie veggies........ onions, cabbage, lettuce, carrots, peppers, etc...) then I would see no reason to add the chocolate peppermint sticks that are only 17 calories a piece.
  • DesireeLovesOrganic
    DesireeLovesOrganic Posts: 456 Member
    I take flax oil capsules and they are 10 cal each and I log those too. LOL Even the tsp of turmeric I take everyday I log (8 cal each.)

    P.S. Please say no to "veggies" out of a can. It's not just about calories and being thinner. You want your insides to be healthy and match the outside. You can get farm fresh organic fruits and veggies delivered to your door in many areas for relatively cheap. I pay $88 a month and get huge boxes delivered to my doorstep through a CSA. There are tons of CSA (community supported agriculture) around the US and it's fresh and sans chemicals or GMOs.
  • jersanter
    jersanter Posts: 74 Member
    If you are eating a bit more veggies with your meals, I can see the logic, but if you are lining up your veggies in a horse trough or a feed bag then you have a problem and will definitely see a gain in weight. Those who are saying they know a guy who knows a girl that lost 200lbs eating veggies and not counting their calories are probably correct. It’s probably was done spread out throughout their days though and that couldn’t hurt any in my opinion.
  • aweightymatter
    aweightymatter Posts: 222
    potatos ARE a vegetable. Just because it's not a super healthy vegetable, doesn't mean it's not one. You can't pick and choose what are and aren't vegetables.

    You're right, you cannot. So you cannot decide potatoes are a vegetable, just because they are eaten as a side dish by many Americans.

    From Wikipedia alone:

    "The potato is a starchy, tuberous crop from the perennial Solanum tuberosum of the Solanaceae family (also known as the nightshades). The word potato may refer to the plant itself as well as the edible tuber. "

    Potatoes=tubers.

    You're so smart. :huh:

    I'm just pointing something out because, for many of us, misinformation is what got us to be overweight. Weight loss and this entire journey is a learning process, and sometimes we have to be willing to throw out old beliefs. Good luck with your journey. x
  • sabrianna
    sabrianna Posts: 1
    I always count every calories that goes in my body because ever calories will make you fat. You have to control it because if you mot control it the food will do it!!! Every cals make you fat so count every calories. I even count my beverage and my gums.
  • aweightymatter
    aweightymatter Posts: 222
    I don't know why we are debating what justifys a vegetable, fruit, tuber, protein, legume; when some people can't even accept the ideal that a calorie is a calorie. If I was not going to count veggies because they have only a few calories ( I am not speaking about the low calorie veggies........ onions, cabbage, lettuce, carrots, peppers, etc...) then I would see no reason to add the chocolate peppermint sticks that are only 17 calories a piece.

    The point of pointing out tubers, starches, legumes, whatever, is that explaining that shows why not counting "veggies" can be a bad piece of advice for many people -- because many people do not really understand what a vegetable is. Not counting cruciferous vegetables and leafy greens probably won't hurt most -- especially if they are prepared raw/steamed/etc -- but not counting beans, corn, etc. could get you into caloric trouble pretty quickly.

    You're right, a calorie is a calorie when you are tracking overall deficit, and we agree that everything should be tracked.
  • LethaSue
    LethaSue Posts: 285 Member
    I will have to agree with you on that one because if you read the label ranch style beans contain animal fat, and for me that takes them out of the veggie catorgie.
  • casiepw
    casiepw Posts: 2
    I just proud of myself when I can muster the strength to eat veggies (yuck). Of course I'm going to record the heroic feat!
  • TamsinEllis
    TamsinEllis Posts: 293
    Okay I didn't read all of this since I'm too lazy to, so if anyone else has already pointed this out I am sorry for repeating.
    I disagree with the OP, calories are calories and should be logged unless you KNOW that you don't need to log them (like someone said about their lettuce adding up to 6cals and not logging it since they're under goal most days anyway). Now a lot of people have tried to back up this vegetable/calorie thing by listing things that aren't really vegetables (although lots of people eat them as if they are so I see nothing wrong with listing them) however, since I have a vast garden filled with vegetable beds that are constantly providing food to go on our table, here are some veggies that are high (ish) in calories. Take a globe artichoke for example (anyone who can prove that's not a vegetable please go ahead but I've always seen it as one), one large globe artichoke (boiled in water, so no oils or that included here) is going to be roughly 100 calories, then add on all the butter you dip it in and smother over the heart of it .. mmm ... so 100 calories plus whatever for the butter. That's not the same as a large potato, but a small to medium potato you can get for 100 calories (ish), so there you have one vegetable that's as high in calories as a starchy carb. And 500g of mange tout is 160calories (approx), not saying you'll eat all 500g in one sitting but raw in a salad for lunch then cooked for dinner all in one day could eat 500g, and whilst you could argue mange tout is a pea/bean ... you eat the shell you don't pick out the individual peas (well if you do you're missing out) so I'm classing that as a vegetable since you eat the entire thing, and same for sugar snaps (those who don't know another type of pea like mange tout but sweeter), they're roughly 200cals for 500g. There are plenty more vegetables out there with high calorie counts and you may not realize how much you're actually eating so I always think it's best to log it unless you're positive you know what it is and that it won't affect your net calories.
  • DeeJayTJ
    DeeJayTJ Posts: 355 Member
    as long as they arent covered in tons of butter and dipped in gravy they shoudlnt be too bad to eat a ton of veggies.

    its just like those folks that wonder why they gain weight when all they eat are salads! well because soo many folks flood their salads with very high calorie ranch dressing!
  • brittanyjeanxo
    brittanyjeanxo Posts: 1,831 Member
    I take flax oil capsules and they are 10 cal each and I log those too. LOL Even the tsp of turmeric I take everyday I log (8 cal each.)

    P.S. Please say no to "veggies" out of a can. It's not just about calories and being thinner. You want your insides to be healthy and match the outside. You can get farm fresh organic fruits and veggies delivered to your door in many areas for relatively cheap. I pay $88 a month and get huge boxes delivered to my doorstep through a CSA. There are tons of CSA (community supported agriculture) around the US and it's fresh and sans chemicals or GMOs.

    Unfortunately, some people can't afford that.
  • fjrandol
    fjrandol Posts: 437 Member
    Soylent green is a vegetable, and zero calories at that.

    Eat your greens!
  • wareagle8706
    wareagle8706 Posts: 1,090 Member
    calories are calories are calories
  • onedayillbamilf
    onedayillbamilf Posts: 662 Member
    I will have to agree with you on that one because if you read the label ranch style beans contain animal fat, and for me that takes them out of the veggie catorgie.

    So it would count as a veggie and a fat, no? And here I was thinking I don't get my veggies in, but it turns out I do! Thank you pintos, black beans, and ranch style beans for coming to my rescue.
  • kdrew11
    kdrew11 Posts: 363 Member
    I NEVER count vegetables. I eat broccoli, cauliflower, carrots, sprouts, cabbage, mushrooms, onions etc. A handful of a few of these a day amount to about 20 cals so barely worth mentioning.

    However, I do count veg with a higher calorie content such as sweetcorn, peas, parsnips etc.
  • JennetteMac
    JennetteMac Posts: 763 Member
    I have been vegetarian for 31 years. I have hardly eaten wheat products for the last 6 1/2 years. I still put weight on when I go over my 1200 calories. Wish I didn't.:sad:
  • fjrandol
    fjrandol Posts: 437 Member
    veggang.jpg
    We count!
  • j3nn953lk
    j3nn953lk Posts: 13
    http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/nutrition/not-all-calories-are-created-equal.html

    http://home.trainingpeaks.com/articles/nutrition/a-calorie-is-not-a-calorie.aspx

    The "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie" argument isn't quite right, I think. Every body is different, but if the lady doesn't count her veg cals and still loses weight, and if you're not her, I don't see how we/you can say she's wrong.
  • heavenlyhazel
    heavenlyhazel Posts: 89 Member
    I was once on an eating plan called The Charleston Diet. Basically, it gave you things you could eat as much as you wanted of each day, things 3 times a day, things 2 times a day, things 1 time a day and things it suggested you eat only rarely. Many vegetables were on the eat all you want, but not ALL VEGETABLES. Many of them like the starchy ones (potatoes, corn on the cob, yams, etc) were only 2 portions a day. Other vegetables (artichokes, black-eyed peas, corn, pumpkin, beets, eggplant, parsnips, squash, water chestnuts, etc.) were only one portion a day. Fruits were also mostly once a day.

    Almost all foods have calories. So, all calories count. What is different is the nutrient density of foods. A sweet potato is going to be much more nutrient dense than a brownie of the same caloric value. Thus, the sweet potato is better for you, but still if you ate too many, you would get fat. Anything you eat in excess can make you fat...that includes plain old calories in any form.
  • dwtouch4
    dwtouch4 Posts: 98
    My rule is that if its under 20 calories per serving I don't count it. This is mainly because I'm too lazy to do it. I do add veggies if I juice them because the capacity to eat them is greatly increased by doing that.

    However there is a benefit to adding the veggies in MFP so that you can tabulate the good nutrients you are ingesting by eating them.
  • Picola1984
    Picola1984 Posts: 1,133
    They count towards your carbs too remember!
  • Athijade
    Athijade Posts: 3,300 Member
    http://www.fitday.com/fitness-articles/nutrition/not-all-calories-are-created-equal.html

    http://home.trainingpeaks.com/articles/nutrition/a-calorie-is-not-a-calorie.aspx

    The "a calorie is a calorie is a calorie" argument isn't quite right, I think. Every body is different, but if the lady doesn't count her veg cals and still loses weight, and if you're not her, I don't see how we/you can say she's wrong.

    But in the same boat, unless you know everything about everyone else, it is not a good idea to make a blanket statement that "it is not good idea to count calories in vegetables!!".

    I count every vegetable that goes in my mouth. I count just about everything that goes in my mouth because a calorie still counts towards my daily totals. I need to hold myself accountable because that is how I will succeed.
  • LethaSue
    LethaSue Posts: 285 Member
    Everyone is right in their own head. What ever you beleive is right. :smile: If it works for you, then you are right, but only for you, because just like bung holes everyone has an opinion. We don't even need these message boards, except to keep us entertained. :bigsmile:
  • jenny95662
    jenny95662 Posts: 997 Member
    I consider veggies free calories. I never counted them and hit my goal weight without any issues.

    can i eat them fried??? lmao

    I kid i kid lol
  • Shawna_831
    Shawna_831 Posts: 316
    Thank you to Google and Wikipedia for allowing us all to run to you, search for the "answer" and post it here so we look smart!
    :happy:
  • swirl121
    swirl121 Posts: 13
    The point is, the vege calories are negligible and if counting them discourages you from eating them then you should stop.

    I like counting the calories in veg - becuase there are so few calories in them, it actually encourages me to eat more!! Fill up on bulkier food that is full of nutrition and not so many calories! Saying that, some veg are high in calories like potatoes; sweetcorn etc. I love the taste of most veg - it depends on how you cook them! Mmmmm!! ;-)
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