for heavens sake, I STILL EAT BREAD AND LOSE WEIGHT!
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I'm so sick of these posts, but just gotta give a little tidbit of my 2 cents. First off, if there was one recipe, equstion, solution, program or plan for effective weight loss in humans, then mfp, weight watchers, atkins, south beach, none of these would exist. So why do people who include carbs as the main part of the diet feel the need to chastise those who dont? And vica versa?
However, my conclusion after reading this thread confirms my belief that refined carbs are an addiction. Read the people who don't eat carbs. They say things like "i feel better without them, I have success....." What do the carb eaters say??? "you can pry my carbs out of my cold dead hands!!!!!" Replace the carb product in those posts with your drug of choice. Heroine crack coke meth booze, whatever and it really sounds like an addiction. Don't bother to disagree. Denial is the first step to recovery.0 -
The diet is meat (fatty)+bread - one does not go without the other. Yes, bread is a 'side' (technically), but still eaten in enormous quantities (plus all other pastries eaten during the day, from bakeries). I didn't state that 'now they are including more bread", where did you get that? Last time I checked the diet was the same as ever.
Serb on a low carb diet - that's a disaster waiting to happen lolQUOTE
"oh, you are from Vojvodina - you guys love bread stuff even more than us down south
"
END QUOTE
Must explain why I love it so much and can't stop at 1 slice and explains why I failed at low carb so many times.!
just to illustrate why I think that "wheat doesn't make you fat. sitting on your *kitten* makes you fat":
it is hard to find good studies of obesity in Serbia but I think this one nicely illustrates huge importance of active lifestyle:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2009.00574.x/abstract
diet wise, these kids are eating very similar food. If anything, kids in villages will eat more bread and high fat (animal fat) food. however, boys growing up in villages are way more active than those in cities.
Unfortunately, like in other western countries, obesity in Serbia seem to be on the rise, especially in the last decade. the diet is not changing, the lifestyle does.
Balkan diets are not wheat based. They include some type of bread or pasta, but the main staple is meat. They eat bread as a side or a snack, or a pastry on the go, but the main meal consists mainly of meat traditionally. And also, obesity is on the rise because now, they are including more bread like you just stated.0 -
I eat bread, pasta, etc. I have days when I want more carbs, and days when I want more protein. Within reason, I listen to my body on this. I seem to be doing ok.0
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The diet is meat (fatty)+bread - one does not go without the other. Yes, bread is a 'side' (technically), but still eaten in enormous quantities (plus all other pastries eaten during the day, from bakeries). I didn't state that 'now they are including more bread", where did you get that? Last time I checked the diet was the same as ever.
Serb on a low carb diet - that's a disaster waiting to happen lolQUOTE
"oh, you are from Vojvodina - you guys love bread stuff even more than us down south"
END QUOTE
Must explain why I love it so much and can't stop at 1 slice and explains why I failed at low carb so many times.!
just to illustrate why I think that "wheat doesn't make you fat. sitting on your *kitten* makes you fat":
it is hard to find good studies of obesity in Serbia but I think this one nicely illustrates huge importance of active lifestyle:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2009.00574.x/abstract
diet wise, these kids are eating very similar food. If anything, kids in villages will eat more bread and high fat (animal fat) food. however, boys growing up in villages are way more active than those in cities.
Unfortunately, like in other western countries, obesity in Serbia seem to be on the rise, especially in the last decade. the diet is not changing, the lifestyle does.
So you admit you were wrong then? Because the Balkan diet INCLUDES bread and wheat etc. But the main components are not those things. I don't know if you spent a lot of time in the US but the standard American diet's MAIN component is grains. They eat grains as the main portion of all meals. And look at their obesity. If Americans adopted a Balkan type diet the obesity rates would go down drastically. You said the obesity was risint in the balkans, and i know and see firsthand that they are starting to eat like the Americans. Less fat more grains. I see it everyday. And obesity is going along with it.
Balkan diets are not wheat based. They include some type of bread or pasta, but the main staple is meat. They eat bread as a side or a snack, or a pastry on the go, but the main meal consists mainly of meat traditionally. And also, obesity is on the rise because now, they are including more bread like you just stated.0 -
You are right...as long as I don't over-do-it, I eat bread and I continue to maintain my weight-loss. I try to limit white bread/refined carbs, but wheat or whole bread is always on the menu.0
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The diet is meat (fatty)+bread - one does not go without the other. Yes, bread is a 'side' (technically), but still eaten in enormous quantities (plus all other pastries eaten during the day, from bakeries). I didn't state that 'now they are including more bread", where did you get that? Last time I checked the diet was the same as ever.
Serb on a low carb diet - that's a disaster waiting to happen lolQUOTE
"oh, you are from Vojvodina - you guys love bread stuff even more than us down south"
END QUOTE
Must explain why I love it so much and can't stop at 1 slice and explains why I failed at low carb so many times.!
just to illustrate why I think that "wheat doesn't make you fat. sitting on your *kitten* makes you fat":
it is hard to find good studies of obesity in Serbia but I think this one nicely illustrates huge importance of active lifestyle:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2009.00574.x/abstract
diet wise, these kids are eating very similar food. If anything, kids in villages will eat more bread and high fat (animal fat) food. however, boys growing up in villages are way more active than those in cities.
Unfortunately, like in other western countries, obesity in Serbia seem to be on the rise, especially in the last decade. the diet is not changing, the lifestyle does.
Balkan diets are not wheat based. They include some type of bread or pasta, but the main staple is meat. They eat bread as a side or a snack, or a pastry on the go, but the main meal consists mainly of meat traditionally. And also, obesity is on the rise because now, they are including more bread like you just stated.
when did this obesity epidemic really start? In the past 50 years? Wheat is not genetically the same as it was in the early twentieth century, which may be causing the rise in obesity. We don't truly know what genetically changing food does to its nutritional values or effects on the body. Also, Mediterranean diets are vegetable and seafood based traditionally and there is a tremendous rise in Celiac now.0 -
No i wasn't wrong, because bread is one of the two main component. We can argue about semantics of "based on" and "includes" but there is nothing wrong with what i said. Actually look at it this way: in Serbia you do eat bread without meat (like bread and jam for example) but you never eat meat without bread. Give me example of a Serbian meal traditionaly eaten without bread.So you admit you were wrong then? Because the Balkan diet INCLUDES bread and wheat etc. But the main components are not those things. I don't know if you spent a lot of time in the US but the standard American diet's MAIN component is grains. They eat grains as the main portion of all meals. And look at their obesity. If Americans adopted a Balkan type diet the obesity rates would go down drastically. You said the obesity was risint in the balkans, and i know and see firsthand that they are starting to eat like the Americans. Less fat more grains. I see it everyday. And obesity is going along with it.. I grow up in a village and left Serbia only 5 years ago so I think I can speak about traditional and contemporary diet. No, ppl are not eating any more bread now than they did 25 years ago. I'm really curious to hear which part of Serbia you live in and where exactly are you noticing this increase in bread eating, in which meals/food items/eating habits? 0 -
Oh wheat! Sure. I eat wheat. I eat wheat in BREAD. I don't eat most of what's sold in stores in THE UNITED STATES as bread. Don't know if you have the same issue where you live. Where things called "bread" have about 15 ingredients, including sugar, or worse, high fructose corn syrup.
wheat.
What food is that?
same goes the other way - I don't understand how are some people so sure that food used for thousands and thousands of years, by billions of people, is suddenly 'poisonous' for everyone.I just don't understand why people think that everyone is the same. If something works for one person, it won't necessarily work someone else!!
btw, I responded to your question from the other day, about metabolism. (I think it's on page 10)
I read your other reply. "excuses" and what not. I chose not to reply. That said, since I hit my 40s, I've had to eat a bit less of the grain type of carbohydrates to maintain my weight.
Call it metabolism, call it hormones, that's the way it is FOR ME.0 -
We can't really blame a particular food on obesity simply because we have most people eating the same food and everyone isn't obese. The question should be why do some people overeat to the point of obesity, some of the answers will be both physiological and psycological and of course other lifestyle behaviour.
The diet is meat (fatty)+bread - one does not go without the other. Yes, bread is a 'side' (technically), but still eaten in enormous quantities (plus all other pastries eaten during the day, from bakeries). I didn't state that 'now they are including more bread", where did you get that? Last time I checked the diet was the same as ever.
Serb on a low carb diet - that's a disaster waiting to happen lolQUOTE
"oh, you are from Vojvodina - you guys love bread stuff even more than us down south"
END QUOTE
Must explain why I love it so much and can't stop at 1 slice and explains why I failed at low carb so many times.!
just to illustrate why I think that "wheat doesn't make you fat. sitting on your *kitten* makes you fat":
it is hard to find good studies of obesity in Serbia but I think this one nicely illustrates huge importance of active lifestyle:
http://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1111/j.1467-789X.2009.00574.x/abstract
diet wise, these kids are eating very similar food. If anything, kids in villages will eat more bread and high fat (animal fat) food. however, boys growing up in villages are way more active than those in cities.
Unfortunately, like in other western countries, obesity in Serbia seem to be on the rise, especially in the last decade. the diet is not changing, the lifestyle does.
Balkan diets are not wheat based. They include some type of bread or pasta, but the main staple is meat. They eat bread as a side or a snack, or a pastry on the go, but the main meal consists mainly of meat traditionally. And also, obesity is on the rise because now, they are including more bread like you just stated.
when did this obesity epidemic really start? In the past 50 years? Wheat is not genetically the same as it was in the early twentieth century, which may be causing the rise in obesity. We don't truly know what genetically changing food does to its nutritional values or effects on the body. Also, Mediterranean diets are vegetable and seafood based traditionally and there is a tremendous rise in Celiac now.0 -
I don't have scientific data, so this is just observational, but Id say the rise is noticable in the last 10 years, definitely not something that started 50 years ago.
when did this obesity epidemic really start? In the past 50 years? Wheat is not genetically the same as it was in the early twentieth century, which may be causing the rise in obesity. We don't truly know what genetically changing food does to its nutritional values or effects on the body. Also, Mediterranean diets are vegetable and seafood based traditionally and there is a tremendous rise in Celiac now.
When you say genetically changing what exactly do you mean? GM or breading? Coz breading has been going on for centuries as well.0 -
As anything, you can eat it in moderation. I eat whole wheat bread all the time and love it.0
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Yes I have the same issue. It was resolved by buying the breadmakerOh wheat! Sure. I eat wheat. I eat wheat in BREAD. I don't eat most of what's sold in stores in THE UNITED STATES as bread. Don't know if you have the same issue where you live. Where things called "bread" have about 15 ingredients, including sugar, or worse, high fructose corn syrup.
What exactly was 'what not' in that reply? I apologize if you found it offensive in any way but all I wrote were numbers.I read your other reply. "excuses" and what not. I chose not to reply. That said, since I hit my 40s, I've had to eat a bit less of the grain type of carbohydrates to maintain my weight.
Call it metabolism, call it hormones, that's the way it is FOR ME.0 -
I think that it's an individual thing. Some people are just not able to process bread, pasta, ect that well.
Low carb diets like Atkins are not meant to keep you in the ketosis stage permanently. It's an induction period and then you
are supposed to slowly incorporate healthy carbs back into your diet such as fruits, more veggies, nuts, legumes,
and whole grains until you find your own personal carb level that will keep you losing weight or maintaining the loss. For some people it's 200 carbs a day for some it's 50. It just depends on their body.
I've lost weight both ways, however I know that if I ate bread, pasta, ect without any type of exercise involved I wouldn't lose no matter what calorie count I stayed at. For me personally, I have to use that energy or my body just turns it into fat.0 -
I don't have scientific data, so this is just observational, but Id say the rise is noticable in the last 10 years, definitely not something that started 50 years ago.
when did this obesity epidemic really start? In the past 50 years? Wheat is not genetically the same as it was in the early twentieth century, which may be causing the rise in obesity. We don't truly know what genetically changing food does to its nutritional values or effects on the body. Also, Mediterranean diets are vegetable and seafood based traditionally and there is a tremendous rise in Celiac now.
When you say genetically changing what exactly do you mean? GM or breading? Coz breading has been going on for centuries as well.
I was talking about genetic modifications that have been made to produce higher yield.
Here is some information about the history of wheat consumption and the effects it might have on many people:http://www.beyondveg.com/cordain-l/grains-leg/grains-legumes-1a.shtml
Here is an article on the components of modern wheat that may be contributing to the obesity epidemic (i'm not saying wheat is the sole cause, but it may be playing a role): http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-mark-hyman/wheat-gluten_b_1274872.html0 -
I wasn't offended. I just don't agree with your perspective. And I know you won't agree with mine either, so there's not point.
Yes I have the same issue. It was resolved by buying the breadmakerOh wheat! Sure. I eat wheat. I eat wheat in BREAD. I don't eat most of what's sold in stores in THE UNITED STATES as bread. Don't know if you have the same issue where you live. Where things called "bread" have about 15 ingredients, including sugar, or worse, high fructose corn syrup.
What exactly was 'what not' in that reply? I apologize if you found it offensive in any way but all I wrote were numbers.I read your other reply. "excuses" and what not. I chose not to reply. That said, since I hit my 40s, I've had to eat a bit less of the grain type of carbohydrates to maintain my weight.
Call it metabolism, call it hormones, that's the way it is FOR ME.0 -
Ok, so you are talking GM. As far as I know (I might be wrong, didn't look up the laws myself, but the source seemed reliable) GM crops are banned in Serbia (with some recent attempts by manufacturers to get them introduced). So I wouldn't say that's the case.I was talking about genetic modifications that have been made to produce higher yield.
Here is some information about the history of wheat consumption and the effects it might have on many people:http://www.beyondveg.com/cordain-l/grains-leg/grains-legumes-1a.shtml
Here is an article on the components of modern wheat that may be contributing to the obesity epidemic (i'm not saying wheat is the sole cause, but it may be playing a role): http://www.huffingtonpost.com/dr-mark-hyman/wheat-gluten_b_1274872.html0 -
No i wasn't wrong, because bread is one of the two main component. We can argue about semantics of "based on" and "includes" but there is nothing wrong with what i said. Actually look at it this way: in Serbia you do eat bread without meat (like bread and jam for example) but you never eat meat without bread. Give me example of a Serbian meal traditionaly eaten without bread.So you admit you were wrong then? Because the Balkan diet INCLUDES bread and wheat etc. But the main components are not those things. I don't know if you spent a lot of time in the US but the standard American diet's MAIN component is grains. They eat grains as the main portion of all meals. And look at their obesity. If Americans adopted a Balkan type diet the obesity rates would go down drastically. You said the obesity was risint in the balkans, and i know and see firsthand that they are starting to eat like the Americans. Less fat more grains. I see it everyday. And obesity is going along with it.. I grow up in a village and left Serbia only 5 years ago so I think I can speak about traditional and contemporary diet. No, ppl are not eating any more bread now than they did 25 years ago. I'm really curious to hear which part of Serbia you live in and where exactly are you noticing this increase in bread eating, in which meals/food items/eating habits?
I never said Serbia. But I live in zagreb part time and US part time. I have my family there. They all seem to get it. And the ones who don't are the ones with the weight problems. Go figure.0 -
Yes I have the same issue. It was resolved by buying the breadmakerOh wheat! Sure. I eat wheat. I eat wheat in BREAD. I don't eat most of what's sold in stores in THE UNITED STATES as bread. Don't know if you have the same issue where you live. Where things called "bread" have about 15 ingredients, including sugar, or worse, high fructose corn syrup.
just to make it clear, the only thing I dont agree with is a simplified stament "everyone on this topic can eat carbs and lose becausethey are young ".I read your other reply. "excuses" and what not. I chose not to reply. That said, since I hit my 40s, I've had to eat a bit less of the grain type of carbohydrates to maintain my weight.
Call it metabolism, call it hormones, that's the way it is FOR ME.0 -
My family is there too. You didn't explain in which aspects of their diet you see this increase in bread consumption? (Im not pushing, Im just curious.)
I never said Serbia. But I live in zagreb part time and US part time. I have my family there. They all seem to get it. And the ones who don't are the ones with the weight problems. Go figure.
Btw, this is total speculation but might have some impact: westernization of lyfestile has probably gone much further in Zagreb than in rural Serbia.
This doesn'change the fact that average Serbian is traditionally consuming large quantities of bread and pastry without the obesity problem.0 -
Carbs are a good source of tryptophan which is the essential amino acid needed to form serotonin.
You made me go research Tryptophan. +1 on that. Your statement is misleading. I will copy a section from Wiki....Tryptophan is a routine constituent of most protein-based foods or dietary proteins. It is particularly plentiful in chocolate, oats, dried dates, milk, yogurt, cottage cheese, red meat, eggs, fish, poultry, sesame, chickpeas, sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds, corn, spirulina, bananas, and peanuts.
You are right, it is a carb! Just the source is not really grains in general as discussed through-out this thread. That being said, I eat plenty of meat, dairy, nuts, and seeds. No worries here!
Which is why I followed by first post with this
"Further, carbs such as bread/pasta pass through the blood brain barrier easier than most sources of tryptophan. A low protein high carb meal is most likely to increase the tryptophan crossing the blood brain barrier because the amino acids present in protein interfere with tryptophan, as they are larger and inhibit tryptophan from crossing the blood brain barrier. "
So yes, all those other foods contain tryptophan but they are not as easily processed to cross the blood brain barrier to form serotonin.0
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