Cardio isn't for "fat burning".
Replies
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Wasn't there a time that it was on 8mm?Wheelhouse15 wrote: »DancingDarl wrote: »What about aerobic cardio like this Jane Fonda DVDs? I honestly thought if you exercize you burn calories.. And that leads to losing fat.. Guess times have changed lol!
Jane Fonda is on DVD now? Wow, that stuff was tired and old when it was on Beta and VHS.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
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Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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AdorkableRegal wrote: »Okay, then if Cardio isn't for fat burning what exercise do you recommend?
Doing fewer fork pickups, aka Eating in a deficit.0 -
There are threads here on recomp written by people I respect in the community:Cardio burns more calories that anaerobic exercise, but again without a calorie deficit (with the exception of recomp), the body will retain fat.If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.
@ninerbuff Yes, I understand how normal weight loss happens "Reduce intake...and fat loss will happen."
What I am confused by is your statement above: "(with the exception of recomp)". What exactly is the exception of recomp?
Why do you say "The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat."
I was under the impression that the body always has to be in a deficit to lose fat. And yet, I was also under the (mistaken?) impression that when people are recomping, they eat at TDEE. Another poster indicated above that people who are recomping don't eat at TDEE, but instead eat 100 calories under or something like that. What I'm having trouble understanding is your statements, because they seem to contradict that. Am I being dense here?
Could you please explain what you understand recomposition to be exactly and how it works, because the way you have worded things has me confused.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat/p1
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1320139/12-weeks-with-sidesteel
The thing with recomp is that it's a LONG process. May take a year or more to see any results. IMO, one should only recomp if they are down to say 15% for a male/21% for a female and are still trying to put on muscle while losing fat. If one is well over those percentages, and want to get lean more than put on muscle, then lean out first and just retain the muscle you currently have.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
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I do cardio because I love it, enjoy it and have become a better person...0
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But I thought that plexus was the only thing that burned fat!!0
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I don't do cardio for fat loss, I do it so I can eat more, lol.0
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[/quote]
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.
[/quote]
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
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If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
[/quote]
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
[/quote]
why is that even a question ....?0 -
socioseguro wrote: »Wheelhouse15 wrote: »DancingDarl wrote: »What about aerobic cardio like this Jane Fonda DVDs? I honestly thought if you exercize you burn calories.. And that leads to losing fat.. Guess times have changed lol!
Jane Fonda is on DVD now? Wow, that stuff was tired and old when it was on Beta and VHS.
New DVDs, like this version did not exist when Beta and VHS existed
Wait, she's still making videos?
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There are threads here on recomp written by people I respect in the community:Cardio burns more calories that anaerobic exercise, but again without a calorie deficit (with the exception of recomp), the body will retain fat.If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.
@ninerbuff Yes, I understand how normal weight loss happens "Reduce intake...and fat loss will happen."
What I am confused by is your statement above: "(with the exception of recomp)". What exactly is the exception of recomp?
Why do you say "The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat."
I was under the impression that the body always has to be in a deficit to lose fat. And yet, I was also under the (mistaken?) impression that when people are recomping, they eat at TDEE. Another poster indicated above that people who are recomping don't eat at TDEE, but instead eat 100 calories under or something like that. What I'm having trouble understanding is your statements, because they seem to contradict that. Am I being dense here?
Could you please explain what you understand recomposition to be exactly and how it works, because the way you have worded things has me confused.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat/p1
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1320139/12-weeks-with-sidesteel
The thing with recomp is that it's a LONG process. May take a year or more to see any results. IMO, one should only recomp if they are down to say 15% for a male/21% for a female and are still trying to put on muscle while losing fat. If one is well over those percentages, and want to get lean more than put on muscle, then lean out first and just retain the muscle you currently have.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
And I will add to this my personal experience with re-comp...keeping in mind that I don't log so it's likely there are days that I'm in a deficit and days that I'm in a surplus, etc...but essentially three years ago I was 180 Lbs and 12% BF...three years later I'm 185 Lbs and 12% BF and currently cutting to get to 10%...which will likely put me back down to 180ish.
So three years to weigh the same but be 2% leaner with about 5Lbs more muscle mass...results are slow relative to the amount of mass that can be put on in a surplus and the amount of fat that can be cut in a deliberate cut.
Fortunately, my focus hasn't really been on re-comp in and of itself because it's likely that I would be bat *kitten* crazy by now...I see it more as a bi-product of just focusing on my fitness and lifting and good livin' in general.0 -
Wasn't there a time that it was on 8mm?Wheelhouse15 wrote: »DancingDarl wrote: »What about aerobic cardio like this Jane Fonda DVDs? I honestly thought if you exercize you burn calories.. And that leads to losing fat.. Guess times have changed lol!
Jane Fonda is on DVD now? Wow, that stuff was tired and old when it was on Beta and VHS.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
I think you mean "Barberella"! 0 -
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
[/quote]
why is that even a question ....? [/quote]
Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all.0 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
why is that even a question ....? [/quote]
Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all. [/quote]
in your example you used cardio to create a calorie deficit....which, is what this thread is about, you need a calorie deficit to lose fat.
Most people are not going to want to run five to six miles a day to burn off 500 calories....I know I don't want to do that...0 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all.
The point that was made in the OP is that many people believe that regardless of what you eat, doing cardio makes your body burn fat. This is preached in women's magazines, in the advertising for workout programs, etc. But it's not true. Being in a deficit makes you lose fat over time, whether that deficit comes entirely from what you eat or from doing exercise or whatever.
I remember doing long cardio workouts and honestly believing the fat was literally melting from all that effort! Live and learn
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Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all.
It's not misleading. The OP specifically said that cardio will help create a calorie deficit.0 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
why is that even a question ....? [/quote]
Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all. [/quote]
Because here's what generally happens...and I see it day in and day out over years in and out of the gym...people exercise thinking it's going to burn fat and they'll lose weight...they never do...there bodies never change...they look the same today as they did months and even years ago...why? Because they don't pay attention to their diets and are under the impression that exercise is what's going to result in losing weight and burning the fat...that's why this thread is focusing on consumption.
To that end, it's a lot more efficient and just plain easier to build one's deficit into their diet...exercise, even with people who regularly exercise can be inconsistent...*kitten* happens...workouts are missed...not every workout burns 500 calories, etc...trying to create a deficit with just exercise is extremely inefficient and generally ineffective for the vast majority of people.0 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
If that person's TDEE was 2000 kcal without exercise, and they ate 2000 kcal, they would maintain their weight. 2000 eaten - 2000 burned = 0 = energy balance.
If that person then starts burning 500 kcal through exercise and they kept eating 2000 kcal they would lose weight. The reason is that their TDEE is now 2500 kcal. They increased their TDEE with exercise. 2000 eaten - 2000 burned - extra 500 burned = -500 = energy deficit.
If, however, you are saying the person has a TDEE of 2000 kcal (including the 500kcal of exercise, that is, their TDEE before exercise is 1500 kcal), and they eat 2000 kcal, then, again they would maintain their weight. 2000 eaten - 1500 burned - extra 500 burned = 0 = energy balance.
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queenliz99 wrote: »People these days eat straight up crap. Chips, soda, hot dogs, McDonald's, and everything else. Never a veggie or a fruit oh how about some old fashioned water and a good run around the block. Take account for the things you consume or they will consume you with obesity and disease.
so 100% of people eat this way?????????? How do you know this? Have you studied the eating habits of every person on the planet?
go to a super market for any length of time. watch people. youll see.
Lots of people shop at grocery stores. Do you spy on their purchases and make judgements?
YES! lol i am not ashamed.
http://www.theonion.com/article/woman-a-leading-authority-on-what-shouldnt-be-in-p-359220 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.jessicarae0316 wrote: »
If that same person who's TDEE is 2000, ate 2000 calories, and burned 500 calories doing cardio....would they lose fat?
why is that even a question ....?
Because this whole thread is making it sound like cardio won't make you lose fat, but in that case if the only thing that person changed was adding cardio, they would lose fat. It's misleading. Of course you can lose weight/fat without exercising at all. [/quote]
Because here's what generally happens...and I see it day in and day out over years in and out of the gym...people exercise thinking it's going to burn fat and they'll lose weight...they never do...there bodies never change...they look the same today as they did months and even years ago...why? Because they don't pay attention to their diets and are under the impression that exercise is what's going to result in losing weight and burning the fat...that's why this thread is focusing on consumption.
To that end, it's a lot more efficient and just plain easier to build one's deficit into their diet...exercise, even with people who regularly exercise can be inconsistent...*kitten* happens...workouts are missed...not every workout burns 500 calories, etc...trying to create a deficit with just exercise is extremely inefficient and generally ineffective for the vast majority of people.[/quote]
Not to mention that a lot just never train progressively so they never progress since they are just burning calories, which they might eat back completely. Not that it's still not good for health benefits but if you want to lose weight and look better then you need to have your diet and traning planned out better.0 -
Thanks OP, this discussion has been really instructive for me, and I'm sure others.
So if fat is lost sleeping and during rest, seems takin it easy, relaxing, getting long sleeps and eating at a deficit rather than excersizing gets us an unfat body.
Great! Tired of sore swollen body aches pains and joints. All I want is the fat off and not to have to eat much! Awesome. 1 -
queenliz99 wrote: »People these days eat straight up crap. Chips, soda, hot dogs, McDonald's, and everything else. Never a veggie or a fruit oh how about some old fashioned water and a good run around the block. Take account for the things you consume or they will consume you with obesity and disease.
so 100% of people eat this way?????????? How do you know this? Have you studied the eating habits of every person on the planet?
go to a super market for any length of time. watch people. youll see.
Lots of people shop at grocery stores. Do you spy on their purchases and make judgements?
YES! lol i am not ashamed.
http://www.theonion.com/article/woman-a-leading-authority-on-what-shouldnt-be-in-p-35922
Lol0 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »Because here's what generally happens...and I see it day in and day out over years in and out of the gym...people exercise thinking it's going to burn fat and they'll lose weight...they never do...there bodies never change...they look the same today as they did months and even years ago...why? Because they don't pay attention to their diets and are under the impression that exercise is what's going to result in losing weight and burning the fat...that's why this thread is focusing on consumption.
To that end, it's a lot more efficient and just plain easier to build one's deficit into their diet...exercise, even with people who regularly exercise can be inconsistent...*kitten* happens...workouts are missed...not every workout burns 500 calories, etc...trying to create a deficit with just exercise is extremely inefficient and generally ineffective for the vast majority of people.
Right. It's not about what is actually happening, it's about the approach/mindset.
/thread0 -
Hey There @ninerbuff great post. I can vouch for it. I exercise daily, but I also ate too many calories as a whole for about 6 months...guess what. No fat burned, no weight lost. In fact, I gained 15lbs. However, my lung capacity improved.
I lost 35lbs on MFP eating at a calorie deficit before I ever exercised at all...and you know what. I lost a lot of weight but I couldn't even jog for 5 minutes. Now I can run for several miles but I'm still about 6lbs heavier than my lowest, post MFP weight.
If you aren't doing well in the kitchen the gym will have little impact on your fat.0 -
Thanks OP, this discussion has been really instructive for me, and I'm sure others.
So if fat is lost sleeping and during rest, seems takin it easy, relaxing, getting long sleeps and eating at a deficit rather than excersizing gets us an unfat body.
Great! Tired of sore swollen body aches pains and joints. All I want is the fat off and not to have to eat much! Awesome.
Exactly why this type of post is so dangerous. Everyone stop working out and start taking naps.0 -
All exercise is mainly just for building lean body mass. Too much cardio hinders fat loss because it increases your hunger hormones.
Calorie deficit for fat loss.
Exercise for building lean body mass, mostly resistance training.
Cardio only if it's fun and for health, not too much though.0 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »Thanks OP, this discussion has been really instructive for me, and I'm sure others.
So if fat is lost sleeping and during rest, seems takin it easy, relaxing, getting long sleeps and eating at a deficit rather than excersizing gets us an unfat body.
Great! Tired of sore swollen body aches pains and joints. All I want is the fat off and not to have to eat much! Awesome.
Exactly why this type of post is so dangerous. Everyone stop working out and start taking naps.
Is that really what you've gotten from this thread? Really?1 -
jessicarae0316 wrote: »Thanks OP, this discussion has been really instructive for me, and I'm sure others.
So if fat is lost sleeping and during rest, seems takin it easy, relaxing, getting long sleeps and eating at a deficit rather than excersizing gets us an unfat body.
Great! Tired of sore swollen body aches pains and joints. All I want is the fat off and not to have to eat much! Awesome.
Exactly why this type of post is so dangerous. Everyone stop working out and start taking naps.
This seems to me to be willful misunderstanding. Adults should be able to have adult conversations and discuss matters that interest them without worrying that the topic is "dangerous."
Perhaps a more valuable takeaway is that getting sufficient sleep is important.1 -
There are threads here on recomp written by people I respect in the community:Cardio burns more calories that anaerobic exercise, but again without a calorie deficit (with the exception of recomp), the body will retain fat.If one's TDEE is say 2000 and they eat 2000, they would NOT lose fat. Reduce intake by 250 calories and fat loss will happen. The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat.
@ninerbuff Yes, I understand how normal weight loss happens "Reduce intake...and fat loss will happen."
What I am confused by is your statement above: "(with the exception of recomp)". What exactly is the exception of recomp?
Why do you say "The body usually has to be in deficit to lose fat."
I was under the impression that the body always has to be in a deficit to lose fat. And yet, I was also under the (mistaken?) impression that when people are recomping, they eat at TDEE. Another poster indicated above that people who are recomping don't eat at TDEE, but instead eat 100 calories under or something like that. What I'm having trouble understanding is your statements, because they seem to contradict that. Am I being dense here?
Could you please explain what you understand recomposition to be exactly and how it works, because the way you have worded things has me confused.
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10177803/recomposition-maintaining-weight-while-losing-fat/p1
http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/1320139/12-weeks-with-sidesteel
The thing with recomp is that it's a LONG process. May take a year or more to see any results. IMO, one should only recomp if they are down to say 15% for a male/21% for a female and are still trying to put on muscle while losing fat. If one is well over those percentages, and want to get lean more than put on muscle, then lean out first and just retain the muscle you currently have.
A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition
Thanks. Actually, I was searching around on the internet to try to understand recomposition better and found this article:
http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/fat-loss/adding-muscle-while-losing-fat-qa.html/
He seems to believe that recomposition is indeed possible, but contrary to your suggestion of recomping only at 15% bodyfat for males or 21% bodyfat for females, he says that recomposition is really only likely to be successful in two very specific populations:
1) the overfat beginner and
2) previously lean and muscular individuals who have gotten fat and are trying to get back into shape
He indicates that people who are already lean or well trained are very unlikely to experience recomposition.
Edited: I guess this was misreading on my part. I think that I am conflating "adding muscle while losing fat" (the title of this article) with "recomposition". Perhaps these are different things? I've clicked around his site now and it seems the whole thing is about achieving recomposition in the very population he says it won't work for in this article: already lean individuals. I guess the whole site is a pitch to sell his special diet which is aimed directly at the 15% bodyfat male and the 21% bodyfat female.
My bad. I should have read more and researched more before posting. But, in the end I think the take away that I've come away with isn't much different from my previous understanding: Stay in a deficit to lose fat/weight. Get into a surplus to gain muscle/weight. Doing both at the same time might not be impossible, but it ain't easy.0 -
very helpful thread. Gave me something to think about. I mostly strength train, but I do about 30 minutes of cardio each session. I ate at TDEE for months and lost NOTHING. Once I dropped my calories (to a deficit)- the weight began to come off0
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jessicarae0316 wrote: »Thanks OP, this discussion has been really instructive for me, and I'm sure others.
So if fat is lost sleeping and during rest, seems takin it easy, relaxing, getting long sleeps and eating at a deficit rather than excersizing gets us an unfat body.
Great! Tired of sore swollen body aches pains and joints. All I want is the fat off and not to have to eat much! Awesome.
Exactly why this type of post is so dangerous. Everyone stop working out and start taking naps.
This seems to me to be willful misunderstanding. Adults should be able to have adult conversations and discuss matters that interest them without worrying that the topic is "dangerous."
Perhaps a more valuable takeaway is that getting sufficient sleep is important.
It's dangerous because in the case of the poster above, they now believe that exercising is not worthwhile.0
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