Protein, Protein, Protein -enough Protein

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Replies

  • crzycatlady1
    crzycatlady1 Posts: 1,930 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Ok, so now I'm playing around with protein amounts and wonder why MFP's is so much higher than the recommended amount? Am I doing the math wrong?

    130lbs converted to kg is 59 (rounded up) x .8 (which I'm seeing recommended on numerous places online)= 47g of protein.

    But, MFP has me set at 94g? This auto adjusted after I manually entered in the calorie intake the USDA recommends that I follow for maintaining my current stats-1,864. At that calorie intake the USDA calculator gave me a recommendation of 47g of protein (factoring in my age/height etc). Why is there such a large discrepancy in protein amounts between the two?

    Sorry OP, didn't mean to hijack your post but I think I see what you're getting at?

    MFP is based off of percentage of total calories rather than grams. Also, to point out, the RDA is more of a minimum, rather than optimal. There are multiple studies point out the flaws with the RDA. Ironically, MFP is probably closer to what you should be aiming for.

    Good to know, thanks! I keep saying I don't want to mess with macros, but then I get sucked into threads like this one and spend the morning playing around with macros ratios lol. It is kind of interesting to see how the numbers all break down :) So, if I was to track protein intake, then I should aim for 47g as the minimum but then aim for getting in a bit higher (up to that 94g)?


    In general, you should be aiming for 1.5-2.2g/kg of mass. The higher end tends to be when you are in weight loss or lean.


    Even if you had excessive protein, your body would convert the leftover to glucose.


    Thanks!
  • psuLemon
    psuLemon Posts: 38,427 MFP Moderator
    Moby_Dick wrote: »
    It's like an epidemic. Of course, we need protein, it's essential for our health, it's used to build muscles, hair, and nails. I think the typical American diet contains enough protein. We eat meat, fish, and eggs with every meal.

    I am not a bodybuilder, neither am I an active athlete. I am just a fat woman trying to lose weight.

    People's comments on the protein intake here are humorous. "Good day, enough protein." Really?

    If I decide to have a meatless day and eat veggies only -like we did when I was a child, then it's not a good day?

    Weight loss comes from counting calories, so I will lose weight when I eat 1200 calories of vegetable stew, won't I?

    Years ago a study showed that we all lose weight faster if we don't combine carbs with protein. So instead of the protein epidemic, people ate protein alone for one meal, then carbs and fiber for the next meal, the results were similar to the Atkins diet and all the other diets that are copycats like Paleo and Southbeach.

    Isn't too much protein unhealthy and can even be harmful to our body? (Liver and Kidney)



    To answer the bold, it's a myth, especially if you take in adequate fluids and do not have a pre-exisiting medical condition.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Ok, so now I'm playing around with protein amounts and wonder why MFP's is so much higher than the recommended amount? Am I doing the math wrong?

    130lbs converted to kg is 59 (rounded up) x .8 (which I'm seeing recommended on numerous places online)= 47g of protein.

    But, MFP has me set at 94g? This auto adjusted after I manually entered in the calorie intake the USDA recommends that I follow for maintaining my current stats-1,864. At that calorie intake the USDA calculator gave me a recommendation of 47g of protein (factoring in my age/height etc). Why is there such a large discrepancy in protein amounts between the two?

    Sorry OP, didn't mean to hijack your post but I think I see what you're getting at?

    MFP is based off of percentage of total calories rather than grams. Also, to point out, the RDA is more of a minimum, rather than optimal. There are multiple studies point out the flaws with the RDA. Ironically, MFP is probably closer to what you should be aiming for.

    Good to know, thanks! I keep saying I don't want to mess with macros, but then I get sucked into threads like this one and spend the morning playing around with macros ratios lol. It is kind of interesting to see how the numbers all break down :) So, if I was to track protein intake, then I should try and make 47g being the minimum but then aim for getting in a bit higher (up to that 94g)?


    If you are sedentary you won't need more than .6g of protein per pound of body weight. I know 1g and gets thrown around a lot for the fitness crowd and .8g, which is slightly more accurate, but I will agree with the OP that most people don't need as much as gets quoted on these forums.

    The studies on protein intake requirements have shown that a sedentary person needs about .4g/lb and the maximum needed for anyone is double that at .8g/lb. A lot of people assume that this means that anyone who lifts or is active should have .8g/lb but really that's a misinterpretation. Active people need about .6g/lb, soldiers on exercise or operations and endurance athletes, specifically those who compete for a living, and not the garden variety weekend warriors, need .7g and only the elite strength athletes (think pro bodybuilders, Olympic wrestlers and Olympic lifters and competitive powerlifters) actually need the .8g.

    That being said, I still shoot for around 1g/lb because there might be some other benefits, such as boosting the immune system, to having a slightly higher protein intake and it won't hurt. My analysis above is just for accuracy and not what I personally do, if that makes sense.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Moby_Dick wrote: »
    It's like an epidemic. Of course, we need protein, it's essential for our health, it's used to build muscles, hair, and nails. I think the typical American diet contains enough protein. We eat meat, fish, and eggs with every meal.

    I am not a bodybuilder, neither am I an active athlete. I am just a fat woman trying to lose weight.

    People's comments on the protein intake here are humorous. "Good day, enough protein." Really?

    If I decide to have a meatless day and eat veggies only -like we did when I was a child, then it's not a good day?

    Weight loss comes from counting calories, so I will lose weight when I eat 1200 calories of vegetable stew, won't I?

    Years ago a study showed that we all lose weight faster if we don't combine carbs with protein. So instead of the protein epidemic, people ate protein alone for one meal, then carbs and fiber for the next meal, the results were similar to the Atkins diet and all the other diets that are copycats like Paleo and Southbeach.

    Isn't too much protein unhealthy and can even be harmful to our body? (Liver and Kidney)



    To answer the bold, it's a myth, especially if you take in adequate fluids and do not have a pre-exisiting medical condition.

    Well, not exactly a myth but unless you have a kidney disorder you would need a lot of protein for it to be harmful. There are a lot of gym rats and athletes that take massive amounts of protein (think over 400g/day!) and don't seem to be hurt by it. However, it's hard to say what the long-term effects of these ultra-high levels of protein intake do since I haven't really seen any longitudinal studies that track these issues. Not to mention many of those who take in that much protein also take in other substances that aren't good for liver or kidneys either.
  • crzycatlady1
    crzycatlady1 Posts: 1,930 Member
    edited December 2016
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Ok, so now I'm playing around with protein amounts and wonder why MFP's is so much higher than the recommended amount? Am I doing the math wrong?

    130lbs converted to kg is 59 (rounded up) x .8 (which I'm seeing recommended on numerous places online)= 47g of protein.

    But, MFP has me set at 94g? This auto adjusted after I manually entered in the calorie intake the USDA recommends that I follow for maintaining my current stats-1,864. At that calorie intake the USDA calculator gave me a recommendation of 47g of protein (factoring in my age/height etc). Why is there such a large discrepancy in protein amounts between the two?

    Sorry OP, didn't mean to hijack your post but I think I see what you're getting at?

    MFP is based off of percentage of total calories rather than grams. Also, to point out, the RDA is more of a minimum, rather than optimal. There are multiple studies point out the flaws with the RDA. Ironically, MFP is probably closer to what you should be aiming for.

    Good to know, thanks! I keep saying I don't want to mess with macros, but then I get sucked into threads like this one and spend the morning playing around with macros ratios lol. It is kind of interesting to see how the numbers all break down :) So, if I was to track protein intake, then I should try and make 47g being the minimum but then aim for getting in a bit higher (up to that 94g)?


    If you are sedentary you won't need more than .6g of protein per pound of body weight. I know 1g and gets thrown around a lot for the fitness crowd and .8g, which is slightly more accurate, but I will agree with the OP that most people don't need as much as gets quoted on these forums.


    The studies on protein intake requirements have shown that a sedentary person needs about .4g/lb and the maximum needed for anyone is double that at .8g/lb. A lot of people assume that this means that anyone who lifts or is active should have .8g/lb but really that's a misinterpretation. Active people need about .6g/lb, soldiers on exercise or operations and endurance athletes, specifically those who compete for a living, and not the garden variety weekend warriors, need .7g and only the elite strength athletes (think pro bodybuilders, Olympic wrestlers and Olympic lifters and competitive powerlifters) actually need the .8g.

    That being said, I still shoot for around 1g/lb because there might be some other benefits, such as boosting the immune system, to having a slightly higher protein intake and it won't hurt. My analysis above is just for accuracy and not what I personally do, if that makes sense.

    Thanks, yeah I'm a pretty sedentary middle aged, stay at home mom :)

  • Cylphin60
    Cylphin60 Posts: 863 Member
    psuLemon wrote: »
    psuLemon wrote: »
    Ok, so now I'm playing around with protein amounts and wonder why MFP's is so much higher than the recommended amount? Am I doing the math wrong?

    130lbs converted to kg is 59 (rounded up) x .8 (which I'm seeing recommended on numerous places online)= 47g of protein.

    But, MFP has me set at 94g? This auto adjusted after I manually entered in the calorie intake the USDA recommends that I follow for maintaining my current stats-1,864. At that calorie intake the USDA calculator gave me a recommendation of 47g of protein (factoring in my age/height etc). Why is there such a large discrepancy in protein amounts between the two?

    Sorry OP, didn't mean to hijack your post but I think I see what you're getting at?

    MFP is based off of percentage of total calories rather than grams. Also, to point out, the RDA is more of a minimum, rather than optimal. There are multiple studies point out the flaws with the RDA. Ironically, MFP is probably closer to what you should be aiming for.

    Good to know, thanks! I keep saying I don't want to mess with macros, but then I get sucked into threads like this one and spend the morning playing around with macros ratios lol. It is kind of interesting to see how the numbers all break down :) So, if I was to track protein intake, then I should aim for 47g as the minimum but then aim for getting in a bit higher (up to that 94g)?


    In general, you should be aiming for 1.5-2.2g/kg of mass. The higher end tends to be when you are in weight loss or lean.


    Even if you had excessive protein, your body would convert the leftover to glucose.

    Thanks for the explanations.
  • Moby_Dick
    Moby_Dick Posts: 26 Member
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25886710

    http://www.eatthis.com/what-happens-when-you-eat-too-much-protein

    https://www.forksoverknives.com/meeting-protein-needs-simply-by-eating/

    http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/three-problems-associated-much-protein-intake-6546.html

    http://www.livestrong.com/article/287078-how-much-protein-is-bad-for-the-liver/

    http://www.onegreenplanet.org/natural-health/the-effects-of-too-much-animal-protein-on-our-liver/

    I ask the questions because I am older and -as you can see- I look like a whale. I do not want my fat to turn into muscles, I would look like a funny version of Schwarzenegger.

    I want to be lean and have muscles. I am taking daily medications that already could damage my liver -like Ibuprofen does- I am trying to find out what the healthiest diet will be for ME, in my age. I am planning on living for another 40 years, so it better be good.

    Most of our animal products are genetically manipulated, many contain antibiotics -none of it can be healthy to us. I fear that too much animal products could be unhealthy in the long run.

    I appreciate all your answers. Some of you have done your homework (thank you) while others just repeat what they have heard or read here (not so good).

    In the end, we all have to find our way back to health and back to a normal weight. Health first, that's why I asked.

    I am older than many of you who have taken your time to answer me. I might have different issues, osteoporosis, and arthritis and joint pain are some of them.

    I think my mind is pretty much made up. I will stay away from too much protein, especially from animal protein.




  • J72FIT
    J72FIT Posts: 6,002 Member
    Moby_Dick wrote: »
    It's like an epidemic. Of course, we need protein, it's essential for our health, it's used to build muscles, hair, and nails. I think the typical American diet contains enough protein. We eat meat, fish, and eggs with every meal.

    I am not a bodybuilder, neither am I an active athlete. I am just a fat woman trying to lose weight.

    People's comments on the protein intake here are humorous. "Good day, enough protein." Really?

    If I decide to have a meatless day and eat veggies only -like we did when I was a child, then it's not a good day?

    Weight loss comes from counting calories, so I will lose weight when I eat 1200 calories of vegetable stew, won't I?

    Years ago a study showed that we all lose weight faster if we don't combine carbs with protein. So instead of the protein epidemic, people ate protein alone for one meal, then carbs and fiber for the next meal, the results were similar to the Atkins diet and all the other diets that are copycats like Paleo and Southbeach.

    Isn't too much protein unhealthy and can even be harmful to our body? (Liver and Kidney)

    Losing weight is the result of an energy deficit. Counting calories is a tool used to as best you can stay in an energy deficit.
  • Wheelhouse15
    Wheelhouse15 Posts: 5,575 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    Oh, and of course fat doesn't "turn into" muscle. When losing as a middle-aged woman gaining muscle isn't going to be an issue, preserving what you have is.

    If I had a pill that could do that I would be a billionaire next year!

    You should try a juice cleanse. Without all those toxins, you'll be able to turn fat into muscle whilst eating what you want.

    Oh, right I forgot about the cleanse because it's not January yet! :lol:

  • Moby_Dick
    Moby_Dick Posts: 26 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    Oh, and of course fat doesn't "turn into" muscle. When losing as a middle-aged woman gaining muscle isn't going to be an issue, preserving what you have is.

    If I had a pill that could do that I would be a billionaire next year!

    This has turned now into your thread, so please take over and manipulate it into the direction of your liking.

    I did not mean to offend anybody. I wrongfully assumed that people here would be open-minded. You show clearly that this is not the case.

    I wish you and all your bodybuilding hard working friend all the best -may you always be right. I would also suggest that in the future you should stay away from posts that might have a different opinion than yours.

    Thank you for your insults! Well done

  • crzycatlady1
    crzycatlady1 Posts: 1,930 Member
    Moby_Dick wrote: »
    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/25886710

    http://www.eatthis.com/what-happens-when-you-eat-too-much-protein

    https://www.forksoverknives.com/meeting-protein-needs-simply-by-eating/

    http://healthyeating.sfgate.com/three-problems-associated-much-protein-intake-6546.html

    http://www.livestrong.com/article/287078-how-much-protein-is-bad-for-the-liver/

    http://www.onegreenplanet.org/natural-health/the-effects-of-too-much-animal-protein-on-our-liver/

    I ask the questions because I am older and -as you can see- I look like a whale. I do not want my fat to turn into muscles, I would look like a funny version of Schwarzenegger.

    I want to be lean and have muscles. I am taking daily medications that already could damage my liver -like Ibuprofen does- I am trying to find out what the healthiest diet will be for ME, in my age. I am planning on living for another 40 years, so it better be good.

    Most of our animal products are genetically manipulated, many contain antibiotics -none of it can be healthy to us. I fear that too much animal products could be unhealthy in the long run.

    I appreciate all your answers. Some of you have done your homework (thank you) while others just repeat what they have heard or read here (not so good).

    In the end, we all have to find our way back to health and back to a normal weight. Health first, that's why I asked.

    I am older than many of you who have taken your time to answer me. I might have different issues, osteoporosis, and arthritis and joint pain are some of them.

    I think my mind is pretty much made up. I will stay away from too much protein, especially from animal protein.


    Isn't most of the food we eat modified though? Fruits and veggie, grains etc.