"You can eat whaver you want, as long as you eat at a deficit" is true, but it's garbage advice.

brittyn3

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

You're gonna have to quote someone here?? Who are you condemning now?

cwolfman13

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

I'd suggest getting a pizza from a local pizzeria that uses high quality fresh ingredients. Our favorite local place makes it's own dough, makes it's own sauce, and makes their own mozzarella and uses fresh ingredients for toppings.

Also, I don't eat a whole pizza...my wife and I usually split a small veggie combo on Friday nights and there's usually a couple of slices left over.

In the grand scheme of things, it's fairly inconsequential.

CSARdiver

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Your point is rooted in a foundation of myth.

TR0berts

HG210 wrote: »

I have read quite a few post since being on MFP. Seemingly we have some career posters that harp on anything that they can turn into something negative. To you I say carry on. Pick another target. You don't have to quote me or you can if you want to but I COULD CARE LESS what you say or think of my comment. Point is "to each is own" do what makes you happy. Now you can try and pick apart what I am saying but my comment is to the OP. Who I agree with and how am I physically sick and needing to see a doctor. Wow!!!!! The drama

Ironic post is ironic.

HG210

brittyn3 wrote: »

show previous quotes

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

You're gonna have to quote someone here?? Who are you condemning now?

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

MalkinMagic71

I happily eat pizza almost every day when I work from home. Usually an 8 or 9 inch freshly made deli pizza from the local grocery store. It's my biggest meal of the day and I make it fit easily. Have lost over 200lbs. My health markers are great. Try to pry my pizza from me lol.

mph323

I have to say, there's an awful lot of posting with paragraphs about how terrible everyone is eating based on advice given by the posters here, followed by a "but do whatever works for you" disclaimer at the end. This doesn't automatically negate the comments above the disclaimer.

edited for clarity

brittyn3

HG210 wrote: »

show previous quotes

brittyn3 wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

You're gonna have to quote someone here?? Who are you condemning now?

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

It's pretty cool that you know me so well! In fact, I had no idea I was insecure. By adding "do what makes you happy" after saying something that's pretty negative... it's like putting a flower costume on a skunk and saying it smells good.

ivygirl1937

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Myself and my entire family have been obese almost our entire lives and I have never seen one of us finish an entire pizza by ourselves. Ever. We don't even get close to that. We typically would (I'm married now so we no longer all eat together so that is why this is past tense) order two pizzas and have a couple of slices left over between the four of us. At my absolute fattest and hungriest, I could do half, MAYBE. Even then I would have to try hard and believe in myself and then be very sick afterward. I can't think of anyone who regularly eats a whole pizza as a meal.

And as others have noted, I can make one myself that is around the 700 calorie mark for the whole thing if I really just had the desire to eat a whole pizza and I can make 700 calories fit in my day just fine.

Edited to clarify.

lemurcat12

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.

Why would you assume my pizza has "packaging"? Usually I don't have enough calories to waste on packaged pizza, which often isn't that good. The pizza I eat is from a local Italian restaurant and, sure, high cal, but the same basic ingredients as their pasta, which is the same basic ingredients I would use to make the same dishes.

And if I make pizza at home it certainly does not have packaging and I know what's in it.

I do occasionally get pizza from a favorite Chicago-style place (Pequods) or a few others (Robert's is a new local pizza place I like), but again I think their ingredients are good quality.

I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas.

Nope, I never ate whole pizzas, even when fat, unless it was an individual size pizza or one I made for myself with reasonable calories. Did I overeat on pizza sometimes? Sure, but same with all other kinds of foods.

It's really easy to be fat, just eat a little over your TDEE regularly. My current TDEE (if sedentary) is about 1550, so can I gain weight without eating like a glutton? Sure can, so maybe don't make assumptions about how all fat people must eat and that fat people can't control themselves or that fat people have certain kinds of tastes or are uninterested in nutrition.

Main way I got fat, at least initially, was by becoming sedentary (stress and then depression-related) and continuing to eat basically what I was before -- a healthy diet that was maintenance for me when I was active.

comeonnow142857

HG210 wrote: »

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

Yeah because that magically negates any other passive aggressive nonsense you might write and there's no possible reason whatsoever to be held accountable for things you say if you add "do what makes you happy".

And it's hilarious that you literally wrote that nonsensical claim in the same breath as personally disparaging the person you're talkng to, doubling down on the exact personal condemnation you were just called out for and pretended couldn't possibly exist because you also said something else.

MontyMuttland

mph323 wrote: »

show previous quotes

MontyMuttland wrote: »

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Just...wow. Fat people eat whole pizzas, not two slices, huh? And somehow packaging pizza sucks all the nutrients out of it. Because there's a long list of ingredients. Huh. So you know what we all eat, how we eat it and what made us fat. Huh.

I've posted this before, but I think it bears repeating here. My diet is heavy on frozen meals, protein/energy bars, and other unnatural foods. MFP records the macro and micro nutrients they contain. Guess what - they add up pretty good at the end of the day. I lost 30 lbs because I was on the edge of requiring statins and blood pressure meds. I'm no longer anywhere near that state and I haven't changed my diet at all, just the amounts I eat. Like wine or dessert after dinner, not both. I eat what I like, which is food.

Actually I do know what made you fat.
You ate too much and didn't move enough.
But that's the same for all of us.

It's a shame that the focus here is mainly on pizza. I pointed out that I don't eat pizza anymore and stated that the reason is because it's nutritionally poor.
That's a generalisation of course, but it's also a fact that most pizzas out there are nutritionally poor.
Whether you believe it or not is totally up to you. You won't read many package labels that say something other than the pizza is high in calories/carbs, high in salt, high in fat and low in protein.
Packaging a pizza doesn't suck the nutrition out of it, it was simply lacking in the first place.

The message I hoped to convey about food choices is that people want to question what they are eating, check it out to see if what they believe about it is actually true.
Then make some changes.

Need2Exerc1se

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

Do what makes me happy?? You mean like literally do whatever makes me happy?!?. Well that sounds completely irresponsible and inappropriate advice. Who doesn't enjoy doing extremely dangerous and harmful things? Who doesn't enjoy eating only junk food? This is terrible advice!! Why do you hate me??

ninerbuff

AntoinetteAngus wrote: »

Preservatives are chemicals to make your food last longer. This is not natural. Food should spoil when it spoils. You should not be injecting it with stuff to make it last longer.

Lol, guess you didn't ace chemistry class. You do know they've used SALT (yes even "organic" sea salt) as a preservative for CENTURIES now?

So glad you clarified the following because most people tend to leave it at 'you can eat WHATEVER you want'

You CAN eat whatever you want to lose weight. It's NOT the best approach, however the issue that arises from the diet and fitness industry is that anything not "clean" or "unprocessed" should be avoided at all costs. And that's just not the truth. Again, there are so many other industrialized countries that consume processed products and DON'T have an weight or obesity issue in their populations. In fact, I'll even say that once many of them migrate to the US, they GAIN weight within the first 5 years just due to OVEREATING.

A.C.E. Certified Personal and Group Fitness Trainer
IDEA Fitness member
Kickboxing Certified Instructor
Been in fitness for 30 years and have studied kinesiology and nutrition

slim1156

following this thread is better than watching soap operas!

comeonnow142857

HG210 wrote: »

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

brittyn3 wrote: »

show previous quotes

HG210 wrote: »

brittyn3 wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

You're gonna have to quote someone here?? Who are you condemning now?

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

It's pretty cool that you know me so well! In fact, I had no idea I was insecure. By adding "do what makes you happy" after saying something that's pretty negative... it's like putting a flower costume on a skunk and saying it smells good.

*squeezes the skunks bum glands* There is no reason for anyone to take the odour I'm presenting as offensive if I CLEARLY put these fresh rose petals here! What are you smelling?

Duchy82

OMG this thread is just going around and around in circles I'M OUT

Chef_Barbell

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

mph323 wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Just...wow. Fat people eat whole pizzas, not two slices, huh? And somehow packaging pizza sucks all the nutrients out of it. Because there's a long list of ingredients. Huh. So you know what we all eat, how we eat it and what made us fat. Huh.

I've posted this before, but I think it bears repeating here. My diet is heavy on frozen meals, protein/energy bars, and other unnatural foods. MFP records the macro and micro nutrients they contain. Guess what - they add up pretty good at the end of the day. I lost 30 lbs because I was on the edge of requiring statins and blood pressure meds. I'm no longer anywhere near that state and I haven't changed my diet at all, just the amounts I eat. Like wine or dessert after dinner, not both. I eat what I like, which is food.

Actually I do know what made you fat.
You ate too much and didn't move enough.
But that's the same for all of us.

It's a shame that the focus here is mainly on pizza. I pointed out that I don't eat pizza anymore and stated that the reason is because it's nutritionally poor.
That's a generalisation of course, but it's also a fact that most pizzas out there are nutritionally poor.
Whether you believe it or not is totally up to you. You won't read many package labels that say something other than the pizza is high in calories/carbs, high in salt, high in fat and low in protein.
Packaging a pizza doesn't suck the nutrition out of it, it was simply lacking in the first place.

The message I hoped to convey about food choices is that people want to question what they are eating, check it out to see if what they believe about it is actually true.
Then make some changes.

What is this focus on packaged pizza as if it is the devil? It still has the same things regular pizza has, it's just frozen. :huh:

Emily3907

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Two slices is 1/4 of the pizza (it is approx. 14-15 inches). I make the pizza I stated every. freaking. Saturday. DH and I split it. So, I eat half at 1049 cals, 102 carbs, 49 fat and 54 protein. It is filling and half the pizza makes me happy and satisfied.

DH has lost 78 pounds, I have lost about 28 and have another 92 to go. So, we both understand the whole "fat person" mentality, but I would struggle to eat a whole pizza. Not all fat people sit down and eat whole pizzas. My weight crept on by a thousand paper cuts.

brittyn3

comeonnow142857 wrote: »

show previous quotes

HG210 wrote: »

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

show previous quotes

brittyn3 wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

brittyn3 wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

You're gonna have to quote someone here?? Who are you condemning now?

You are very insecure. There is no reason for anyone to take my comment as condemning them if I CLEARLY said "do what makes you happy". What are you reading?

It's pretty cool that you know me so well! In fact, I had no idea I was insecure. By adding "do what makes you happy" after saying something that's pretty negative... it's like putting a flower costume on a skunk and saying it smells good.

*squeezes the skunks bum glands* There is no reason for anyone to take the odour I'm presenting as offensive if I CLEARLY put these fresh rose petals here! What are you smelling?

I'm crying. The visual is enough to ruin me from roses. LOL

ronjsteele1

fitoverfortymom wrote: »

I wonder if all those natural childbirth moms ever received their medal in the mail.

This entire thing made me LOL. The cloth vs. natural childbirth thing is so real! Even between my husband and I this argument rages. He hated natural childbirth (we had Bradley births) because the nurses were mean to him when they saw him trying to talk me through things and reminding me that I had specifically told him no drugs. He said they treated him like a mean ogre. LOL! After #3 he said never again would he coach me through a natural birth unless it was at home.

But no, I never did get my medal for any of our natural childbirths. I did however have 3 different nurses come in and literally bow down at the end of my hospital bed after having our 9.12 boy naturally. That was just plain humorous and I'll accept that in lieu of my medal.

janejellyroll

MontyMuttland wrote: »

show previous quotes

mph323 wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

Just...wow. Fat people eat whole pizzas, not two slices, huh? And somehow packaging pizza sucks all the nutrients out of it. Because there's a long list of ingredients. Huh. So you know what we all eat, how we eat it and what made us fat. Huh.

I've posted this before, but I think it bears repeating here. My diet is heavy on frozen meals, protein/energy bars, and other unnatural foods. MFP records the macro and micro nutrients they contain. Guess what - they add up pretty good at the end of the day. I lost 30 lbs because I was on the edge of requiring statins and blood pressure meds. I'm no longer anywhere near that state and I haven't changed my diet at all, just the amounts I eat. Like wine or dessert after dinner, not both. I eat what I like, which is food.

Actually I do know what made you fat.
You ate too much and didn't move enough.
But that's the same for all of us.

It's a shame that the focus here is mainly on pizza. I pointed out that I don't eat pizza anymore and stated that the reason is because it's nutritionally poor.
That's a generalisation of course, but it's also a fact that most pizzas out there are nutritionally poor.
Whether you believe it or not is totally up to you. You won't read many package labels that say something other than the pizza is high in calories/carbs, high in salt, high in fat and low in protein.
Packaging a pizza doesn't suck the nutrition out of it, it was simply lacking in the first place.

The message I hoped to convey about food choices is that people want to question what they are eating, check it out to see if what they believe about it is actually true.
Then make some changes.

You're acting like pizza is this unchanging food that doesn't come in all sorts of styles. Lots of pizza doesn't have packaging. Some of the pizza that is packaged is just fine. All pizza can be consumed in controlled portions that will fit into the calorie and macro goals of many seeking to lose weight and many more people who are maintaining. And there's little evidence that most people are eating entire pizzas, although I understand if that is your experience it might seem more universal to you.

The focus is on pizza because it's the example *you* chose of a nutritionally poor food. So again, why is pizza *as a category* worth calling out, but pasta (which also comes in many styles and portion sizes, some of which are difficult to fit into a calorie deficit) not?

prattiger65

By the way, I have an 8" cast iron skillet, a flour tortilla fits perfect. I make an awesome personal size pizza in it, macros break down just about 30/30/40. Around 400 calories. My garbage advice is to eat some of that unhealthy crap!

lemurcat12

janejellyroll wrote: »

show previous quotes

MontyMuttland wrote: »

Emily3907 wrote: »

Chef_Barbell wrote: »

MontyMuttland wrote: »

"For things to change, you have to change." (Jim Rohn, 1930-2009).
This is a fundamental truth and it applies to anyone trying to lose weight and keep it off every bit as much as the formula stating that to lose weight you must burn more calories every day than you consume.
I was obese for most of my adult life, a serial yo-yo dieter who would try this and that diet, lose some weight and then put it back on again plus more.
The reason I kept failing is actually very simple. I didn't change. I just did what the diets said I had to do, but they didn't teach me anything. I didn't learn any new eating habits.
And this is what the OP is getting at with his post.
If you tell an obese person they can eat what they want providing they stay under their daily calorie allocation, you are just sugar-coating the truth to make it easier to swallow.
The simple truth is, if you eat nutritionally poor foods as part of a calorie controlled eating plan, then the weight you lose won't just be fat. Sure, you will lose some fat, but some of the weight you will lose is going to be the good part of your body (your muscle tissue, your organs, your skeleton, etc).
That is the price you pay for eating nutritionally poor foods. They don't contain enough good stuff to maintain the important parts of your body.
If you are already eating less food to stay under your calorie allocation, then it's even more important than ever that the food you eat had high nutritional value - what the hell else is your body going to use to sustain itself?
So here is the real deal: if you want to lose weight and keep it off, better start learning some new eating habits.
New eating habits means making food choices that are nutrient rich.
Does it mean you can never eat another burger? Of course not, but you'd do far better learning how to make a decent burger yourself rather than eating the total non-food they serve at fast food outlets.
"For things to change, you have to change."
Embrace it, do it.
During 2016 I lost 9 stone (126lb) and now I'm happily maintaining my weight under 11stone.
I did that by changing my relationship with food and learning new eating habits.
I don't eat pizza anymore. Why? Because it's nutritionally poor food.
But I make a mean burger meal, a steak meal and a spaghetti bolognese meal all for less than 500 calories each.
I learned how to eat well whilst consuming less.
That's what this is about, and the rest can be summed up like this:
"Suck it up or stay fat!".

I don't know how things are done elsewhere but they serve food in fast food restaurants here.

How is pizza nutritionally poor? It's just bread, sauce, cheese and you can add veggies and make your own. I never understand this argument.

Agreed. My homemade pepperoni pizza has 524 cals, 51 carbs, 25 fat and 27 protein in 2 slices. I consider that a pretty good macro ratio. Add veggies to that, even better.

You both illustrate my point perfectly.
If your average pizza actually was just bread, cheese, veggies then you'd be some way to having a bit of nutrition - but they're not.
Try reading the ingredients list on some pizza packaging, you'll see the list of stuff going in them is somewhat longer. Then read the nutritional information about those pizzas and see just how "healthy" they are.
The home-made pizza does sound a ton better, specially the amount of protein there compared to ready-made ones. But I'll make a stab at two slices being what, two sixths of the pizza maybe?
I've been a fat person remember, fat people don't eat two slices of pizza, they eat whole pizzas. And so do most ordinary people as well. Do you order half pizzas or quarter pizzas in a restaurant? Nope, didn't think so.
So yeah, two-sixths of a pizza for 524 calories ain't bad, but that's knocking on the door of 1600 calories for the whole pizza.
And guess who is eating the whole pizza?
Yep, just about everyone...

It may be your experience that most people are eating an entire pizza, but I'm skeptical if this is actually true. I realize it's anecdotal, but when we have pizza-based events at work, most of my co-workers seem to have 2-4 pieces.

This is a good point and consistent with my experience too.

HG210

Need2Exerc1se wrote: »

show previous quotes

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

Do what makes me happy?? You mean like literally do whatever makes me happy?!?. Well that sounds completely irresponsible and inappropriate advice. Who doesn't enjoy doing extremely dangerous and harmful things? Who doesn't enjoy eating only junk food? This is terrible advice!! Why do you hate me??

Hate is a strong word but that is what I mean. That is exactly what I mean. Do what makes you happy. If you don't know as an adult not to do something that is harmful to you, well that is one you.

Chef_Barbell

ronjsteele1 wrote: »

show previous quotes

fitoverfortymom wrote: »

I wonder if all those natural childbirth moms ever received their medal in the mail.

This entire thing made me LOL. The cloth vs. natural childbirth thing is so real! Even between my husband and I this argument rages. He hated natural childbirth (we had Bradley births) because the nurses were mean to him when they saw him trying to talk me through things and reminding me that I had specifically told him no drugs. He said they treated him like a mean ogre. LOL! After #3 he said never again would he coach me through a natural birth unless it was at home.

But no, I never did get my medal for any of our natural childbirths. I did however have 3 different nurses come in and literally bow down at the end of my hospital bed after having our 9.12 boy naturally. That was just plain humorous and I'll accept that in lieu of my medal.

Ouch.

geneticsteacher

I am astonished that someone can eat a whole pizza. I have never known anyone that did this.

Need2Exerc1se

HG210 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Need2Exerc1se wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

Do what makes me happy?? You mean like literally do whatever makes me happy?!?. Well that sounds completely irresponsible and inappropriate advice. Who doesn't enjoy doing extremely dangerous and harmful things? Who doesn't enjoy eating only junk food? This is terrible advice!! Why do you hate me??

Hate is a strong word but that is what I mean. That is exactly what I mean. Do what makes you happy. If you don't know as an adult not to do something that is harmful to you, well that is one you.

Exactly. Do whatever you want. Eat whatever you want. You missed the sarcasm but maybe got the message.

Chef_Barbell

HG210 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Need2Exerc1se wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

Do what makes me happy?? You mean like literally do whatever makes me happy?!?. Well that sounds completely irresponsible and inappropriate advice. Who doesn't enjoy doing extremely dangerous and harmful things? Who doesn't enjoy eating only junk food? This is terrible advice!! Why do you hate me??

Hate is a strong word but that is what I mean. That is exactly what I mean. Do what makes you happy. If you don't know as an adult not to do something that is harmful to you, well that is one you.

Didn't the OP consider this exact thing garbage advice.... I feel like I am spinning in circles.

janejellyroll

HG210 wrote: »

show previous quotes

Need2Exerc1se wrote: »

HG210 wrote: »

When did I say that???? What are you talking about???? In no way was my message cryptic. It was do what makes you happy. IF you think that it is because of your own insecurities.

Do what makes me happy?? You mean like literally do whatever makes me happy?!?. Well that sounds completely irresponsible and inappropriate advice. Who doesn't enjoy doing extremely dangerous and harmful things? Who doesn't enjoy eating only junk food? This is terrible advice!! Why do you hate me??

Hate is a strong word but that is what I mean. That is exactly what I mean. Do what makes you happy. If you don't know as an adult not to do something that is harmful to you, well that is one you.

That's kind of the whole point here. It's not "garbage advice" to tell people to eat what they like because the vast majority of people instinctively understand that will not include things that make them feel ill. Yet that was your argument for agreeing with the OP.