Really?
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Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"0
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Honestly, I'd say suck it up. That sounds mean but I swear it's coming from a good place. Someone correcting misinformation can come across as being condescending. Bluntness and honesty can come across as rude. The "know-it-alls" are usually the ones that have been here awhile and are trying VERY hard to make sure people aren't falling for the snake oil and the multitudes of myths and flat out bull that's out there.
The great thing is, you have total control of what effects you. If you feel like someone is hurting your feelings, you don't have to give them the time of day. You don't have to respond. You don't have to pay attention to it. Focus on what you believe is right but try and be open to what they say. Many of them have a world of knowledge that's very useful. They've been there and done that and they just might be right.14 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I HAVE no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
I don't see anything wrong with either.
That is literally what my co-workers tell me all the time - at work OR in the gym (and it's really the only answer to any of the myriad of things I do that are objectively just wrong). It's also what I get done told on musician forums when I speak out of my *kitten* or there's a disagreement (or sometimes the other person is wrong), it's what other musicians tell me sometimes speaking out of their butt and sometimes not, and I've had my share of it in nutrition discussion. I feel dumb a lot, but overall it's great!
If I'm eating 6 times a day to speed up my metabolism and for no other reason, and somebody who KNOWS that's nonsense coaches it in maybes or whatevers or gentle suggestions whispered into my ear instead of directly stating "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way", they are doing me a great disservice.12 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I HAVE no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
So semantics? Someone forgot to don their kid gloves when they criticized you? I'll be honest, I've looked back at your past posts, and I don't see where you've been harshly treated AT ALL, especially compared to a lot of what goes on around here.16 -
comeonnow142857 wrote: »nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I HAVE no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
I don't see anything wrong with either.
That is literally what my co-workers tell me all the time - at work OR in the gym. It's also what I get done told on musician forums when I speak out of my *kitten* or there's a disagreement (or sometimes the other person is wrong), and I've had my share of it in nutrition discussion. I feel dumb a lot, but overall it's great!
And it is possible that i just need to learn to take everything at face value. Some people don't word things as gently as I do, so I possibly look at it negatively when it wasn't meant that way. This post wasn't intended to cause such a big stink. It was just looking for this kind of response you gave. Whether other people experience the same thing and how they handle it.5 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »cerise_noir wrote: »Are you referring to your stationary bike post? If yes,
No, I'm not referring to that post. But I'm also not going to cite specific examples because that's pointing a finger at someone and causing an issue where that person/those people feel like they must defend themselves. I didn't create this forum to create issues. I created it to resolve an issue by first seeing if I was the only one who had the issue. Because if I was the only one, then I'm clearly misinturpreting something. This thread was created for feedback, not finger pointing.
Going by other similar posts that I've read over the year or so I've been here then no, you're not the only one who feels this way. However, I do believe that in the majority of cases the issue is one of misperception. It's not easy to hear that you're wrong (generic "you"), and no matter how carefully someone else tries to phrase it some people are going to feel hurt and belittled by that.
I think that some people have dearly-held beliefs about what works and what doesn't in weight loss and/or fitness, often shaped by the diet industry at large, and having those beliefs challenged (by people who've been there, done that, and found it doesn't actually work or is unnecessary) can make them feel like they're being piled on and deliberately made to look/feel stupid.
That is rarely the case. I see many, MANY examples of other people being helpful and kind to others, taking time out of their day to offer advice and suggestions that have worked for them. They also do their best to stamp out misinformation when they see it, which tends to result in them being called rude, unhelpful or even spiteful by those who would rather not have their ideas challenged. Sometimes, knowledgeable posters can be a little blunt - mainly because they see the same stuff over and over again and are a little jaded, I suspect - but being blunt is not the same as being rude. It's all in the reader's perception of the reply.
And sometimes, yes, there are people who are jerks, trolls, or downright rude. They are a minority, and are not often found among the most helpful people I know of here.
As others have said above, keep an open mind and try not to be too sensitive. I know that can be hard sometimes, but remember that you also can't hear tone of voice via text. Try to read each post as if it was meant in the kindest tone possible, and perhaps you'll see less negativity. There's a lot to be learned here, if you want to learn it.
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nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
One of the best pieces of advice I've received here is to read everything on the Internet in Kermit the frog's voice. Tone online is about what we project onto a statement. "No, that's wrong" can be just as friendly as "well maybe but have you tried this other thing."17 -
diannethegeek wrote: »nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
One of the best pieces of advice I've received here is to read everything on the Internet in Kermit the frog's voice. Tone online is about what we project onto a statement. "No, that's wrong" can be just as friendly as "well maybe but have you tried this other thing."
That's actually good advice. Lol I may substitute Kermit for spongebob, but still. Haha3 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »comeonnow142857 wrote: »nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I HAVE no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
I don't see anything wrong with either.
That is literally what my co-workers tell me all the time - at work OR in the gym. It's also what I get done told on musician forums when I speak out of my *kitten* or there's a disagreement (or sometimes the other person is wrong), and I've had my share of it in nutrition discussion. I feel dumb a lot, but overall it's great!
And it is possible that i just need to learn to take everything at face value. Some people don't word things as gently as I do, so I possibly look at it negatively when it wasn't meant that way. This post wasn't intended to cause such a big stink. It was just looking for this kind of response you gave. Whether other people experience the same thing and how they handle it.
Part of the problem is many times the same advice has been repeated ad nauseam until the regular, frequent, helpful posters are blue in the face, so a response to a frequently asked questions may be deemed curt, blunt, or rude. This usually happens when a relatively new user hasn't lurked long enough to see their umpteenth apple cider vinegar or 'clean eating' thread, or isn't familiar enough with the forums to utilize the search function.7 -
Ignore the jerks. Choose what/whom you take to heart. Don't let snarky people bother you- they aren't worth your time.
Wow. I'm super glad that I never followed this advice. Some of the people who've been the most kind and helpful to me here get snarky from time to time. And I wouldn't call any of them jerks.23 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »
And it is possible that i just need to learn to take everything at face value. Some people don't word things as gently as I do, so I possibly look at it negatively when it wasn't meant that way. This post wasn't intended to cause such a big stink. It was just looking for this kind of response you gave. Whether other people experience the same thing and how they handle it.
My co-workers are great to me too. And if they didn't say "No, that's wrong" when I did something blatantly wrong, and went "maybe this way instead", that would be deeply bad and unhealthy for competence, working relationships, and my own relationship with my mental health. It's critical that I know and utilise the difference between "no" and "maybe", and that the clarity of the distinction and level of wrongness or possible discretion is maximal.
(IE: NO, 6 meals a day will absolutely not do anything special for your metabolism, no matter how much you feel it does. MAYBE it will make you feel better and you should try eating that way for satiety, comfort, digestion, etc. The distinction between the two suggestions is 100% critical to them having any honest meaning at all)
I think it's often good to word things gently (I work in a customer service role where my customers are generally in huge, huge trouble and often the least fortunate in society). but pussyfooting around direct and honest language can be the most deeply toxic thing there is.
None of this applies when it's Christmas with your in-laws of course, and obviously many life negotiations require gentleness and tact to the point where you're really kinda BS'ing people (negotiating that business deal with your mother in law can be tough). But if people are commingling with the priority of getting something done/actually learning from each other...6 -
diannethegeek wrote: »Ignore the jerks. Choose what/whom you take to heart. Don't let snarky people bother you- they aren't worth your time.
Wow. I'm super glad that I never followed this advice. Some of the people who've been the most kind and helpful to me here get snarky from time to time. And I wouldn't call any of them jerks.
Me too. I love some good snark.9 -
comeonnow142857 wrote: »nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I HAVE no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
I don't see anything wrong with either.
Neither do I!Ignore the jerks. Choose what/whom you take to heart. Don't let snarky people bother you- they aren't worth your time.
Meh. I've found that people who can't appreciate some good snark/sarcasm aren't worth my time.
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nicolepburgess91 wrote: »cerise_noir wrote: »Are you referring to your stationary bike post? If yes,
No, I'm not referring to that post. But I'm also not going to cite specific examples because that's pointing a finger at someone and causing an issue where that person/those people feel like they must defend themselves. I didn't create this forum to create issues. I created it to resolve an issue by first seeing if I was the only one who had the issue. Because if I was the only one, then I'm clearly misinturpreting something. This thread was created for feedback, not finger pointing.
So instead everyone who has interacted with you or ever tried to help you is now potentially questioning whether or not they're one of the people you're criticizing. I consider that to be causing an issue too.
Feedback only works when it's specific and people can know whether it is directed at them.12 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »I came to this forum for support on my weight loss journey and I found a lot of that. But there are a few people on here that are very strong in their belief that they know everything and they talk down to you and manage to make you feel about 2 inches tall and dumb. I'm seriously considering removing MFP because I only use it for the support and community. But I can't even post on here without someone jumping in knowing everything and making me feel stupid for asking questions.
Is anyone else having this problem on this forum or is it just me?
My experience with this community over 2 years has been positive. Some people are blunt but still here helping others every day with solid advice. Occasionally there will be someone who is clearly just being negative or mocking. That is the internet.
My advice read the sticked posts in all the forums, read more than you post, use the search feature to see if your question has been covered, try not to assume tone.
If someone bothers you then you do not have to engage them. You can walk away from a thread. You can click on someone's name and choose to ignore that person. If you feel their post has broken the community guidelines you can flag it. (Do read the community guidelines and don't flag people just because they disagreed.)
There are other weight loss related communities on the internet. I frequented another one before coming here and the style of posters there bugged me. Check out some other sites and compare. Maybe MFP is the best for you but maybe another community is a better fit.
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If you are in the mood for some quippy, witty sarcasm, it's one thing...I don't get offended easily. But when someone asks a simple question or for some help and people have come back w/ overly snappish/rude comebacks constantly, it can get old. To each their own.
Since we can't hear tone of voice on the internet, I think we should always consider that the person who seems "overly snappish/rude" may be aiming for brevity or have a different sense of humor rather than assuming they are a "jerk." Sometimes communication styles don't easily mesh -- there are generational, geographical, and linguistic differences on forums like this. I try to assume the best instead of the worst (though I do sometimes fail to meet my own standard).8 -
First, i learned by far the most from so called know it alls.
Second, I learned from them by lurking here for a long time and observing the responses to the same questions or wildly off base statements that get posted here over and over and over.
Third, because it is known that there are many lurkers on this forum, the knowledgeable users are going to call out misinformation every time.
It would be helpful if new users of any forum would observe for a while what the tone is like and what are the sensitive topics first.10 -
I've never had a direct negative comment on one of my posts but I've seen it on others. Is it frustrating and most of the time uncalled for, yes! However, you can't let others passive aggressive comments or negativity derail your success. I sometimes see negative comments when someone doesn't agree with the OP's method of weight loss, exercise regimens, etc... There are always going to be negative people out there that try to drag others down. You can choose to dwell on those occasional negative comments or ignore them and learn from all of the positive. Not always easy but I personally refuse to let miserable people get into my head.. in any capacity of my life! Good luck to you and I hope you choose to ignore the haters 2
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If you post a Question here on Mfp I think you want an answer right? If the answer not the thing is that you want to hear it is not per definition negative or let you feel bad about it .If you want an opinion you get an opinion and not only like the things that will let you feel or look good!......And if someone is real rude and abbuse you with words than just ignore or give him or her a big mouth....Is this negative what I wrote? no far from that it is honest and I know that these days it is hard to be a person with an opinion. So do your thing be positive yourself and you get what you give goodluck!1
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melissawill2017 wrote: »I've never had a direct negative comment on one of my posts but I've seen it on others. Is it frustrating and most of the time uncalled for, yes! However, you can't let others passive aggressive comments or negativity derail your success. I sometimes see negative comments when someone doesn't agree with the OP's method of weight loss, exercise regimens, etc... There are always going to be negative people out there that try to drag others down. You can choose to dwell on those occasional negative comments or ignore them and learn from all of the positive. Not always easy but I personally refuse to let miserable people get into my head.. in any capacity of my life! Good luck to you and I hope you choose to ignore the haters
If you're not willing to learn from "negative comments", only treat them as someone trying to drag you down, and you dismiss the people who make comments that are negative towards your claims as miserable, you're not going to be learning much with any rigour. A lot of positive comments are bunkum, and reality frequently disagrees with us all.
And there is absolutely nothing passive aggressive about directly negating something somebody said. That is literally the opposite of what passive aggression is.8 -
I came here to the forums to get support but mostly to get feedback because I was failing at maintaining my weight losses from overly restrictive diets.
I've learned from "snarky" and "mean" posts. Maybe I didn't like it but I came to learn. And I got a great education that will help me when I reach maintenance.
Jump in the thread and make helpful kind comments if you feel a poster is getting beat up. If you're getting beat up perhaps look at what you said, see if it might be wrong, clarify or get out of the thread.
I'm appreciative of all types of personalities here. Makes some great threads!4 -
nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
But if you're not actually going to accomplish X by doing it that way? It's called being direct and to the point.10 -
cwolfman13 wrote: »nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
But if you're not actually going to accomplish X by doing it that way? It's called being direct and to the point.
If someone knows -- from research or their own experience -- that I'm spinning my wheels with something, I consider it a courtesy if they let me know. It's always up to me if I want to act on their advice, but standing by watching someone waste their time when you have information that can help is not courteous or kind.6 -
You could dump this site but you're still going to run into the same people in real life. Learn to ignore people who make you feel bad and appreciate people who make you feel supported.3
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You could dump this site but you're still going to run into the same people in real life. Learn to ignore people who make you feel bad and appreciate people who make you feel supported.
My advice is kind of the opposite.
Learn to appreciate people who make you feel bad for the right reasons (they're not trying to make you feel bad, they're just straight talking more than we're comfortable with and know what they're talking about and that makes us feel dumb when we staked our position out first), and be wary of the people who make you feel supported no matter what - they might be pulling you into an echo chamber of feelings against reality, and that's no good for your behaviour or your psychology or self awareness.
(Lighthearted example: Star Wars A New Hope is the former for George Lucas. Star Wars The Phantom Menace is the latter.)
My advice is still: Take the good, and leave the bad. But they certainly aren't always in the places that match up to what instinctively bristles or comforts you, and beware of anything that coddles that illusion.6 -
OP i get your frustration. While most people on these forums are great and give wonderful advice, there are some people who act very "know it all" and others who, without intending to, will sometimes word their posts in what could very easily come off as a "superior" tone. From what I've seen, this comes out most around controversial issues but can show up anywhere. One day it got to the point that i had an anxiety attack over it and hid in the bathroom at work to cry. It's really hard for some people (like me) to ignore people's bad attitudes. Because of personal experience, my advice would be continue to use the forums but if you start being effected by negative posts, stop checking that thread for a while, even if you started the thread. If you're feeling especially sensitive to something being posted, make a choice to not go back to it. Or once you're not feeling as upset about the comments, consider reading them over more analytically to see whether the advice, although it might be worded in a know or all tone, may still be sound advice. Occasionally I'll send someone a pm explaining how their post made me feel but asking them to clarify so i can understand the advice they were trying to give without feeling belittled by it.
Sorry for the long post. I know it can be hard navigating the forums if you're as sensitive as i am but i the knowledge and support here is worth the extra effort. Hope this helped 2 -
comeonnow142857 wrote: »melissawill2017 wrote: »I've never had a direct negative comment on one of my posts but I've seen it on others. Is it frustrating and most of the time uncalled for, yes! However, you can't let others passive aggressive comments or negativity derail your success. I sometimes see negative comments when someone doesn't agree with the OP's method of weight loss, exercise regimens, etc... There are always going to be negative people out there that try to drag others down. You can choose to dwell on those occasional negative comments or ignore them and learn from all of the positive. Not always easy but I personally refuse to let miserable people get into my head.. in any capacity of my life! Good luck to you and I hope you choose to ignore the haters
If you're not willing to learn from "negative comments", only treat them as someone trying to drag you down, and you dismiss the people who make comments that are negative towards your claims as miserable, you're not going to be learning much with any rigour. A lot of positive comments are bunkum, and reality frequently disagrees with us all.
And there is absolutely nothing passive aggressive about directly negating something somebody said. That is literally the opposite of what passive aggression is. [/quot
I think you are misinterpreting my point here. I am not talking about people that disagree with my point of views, methods, etc.. I am referring to the occasional trolls on here that are not here to offer any type of meaningful advice and only posting to be hurtful or rude. I don't think the OP started this thread because someone disagreed with her; I took it as though someone was being malicious with their statements and that does happen on here as well as any social media outlet that you choose to engage in! Trust me, I do not feed into the "butt hurt" society we leave in where everyone gets offended by everything. There is definitely a difference between constructive criticism and then someone who is malicious with their intent. OP didn't specify what specifically upset her, so we can only speculate about the response she received.
*And you are right... Passive aggressive was not the word that I was looking for in my post!0 -
I think of it like this; I don't think most people fall on the end of one extreme (going out of their way to be rude) or the other end (sugar coating everything)... I think most fall in the middle. And some people have that extra boost of confidence and reassurance of greater anonymity to be a bit snarkier on the internet than they would in real life. But I think the bottom line is for this site, is that most posters get really tired of the perpetual myths, diet scams, and snake oil being sold to unsuspecting people who just want real results. So that frustration comes through; I get that way myself. It's nothing personal against you.2
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nicolepburgess91 wrote: »Look, y'all. I have no problem with feedback. Someone offering advice. Someone saying I'm not doing something right. Someone telling me a better way to go about it. All of those are okay. But there is a difference between "maybe try doing <this> to gain that nutritient you're trying to get instead of what you're trying." Vs "that's not how you do it...youre not accomplishing anything by doing it that way"
I honestly hate it when people don't get to the point and are all wishy washy when communicating information. Get to the point, tell me what I'm doing wrong, and don't sugar coat it with a bunch of useless praise.
And I am always amazed how patient people on this board are considering how much terrible advice is regularly posted. Many times I have have been wrong to assume an original post to be a troll only to because of the willingness of some people here to answer in a non-snarky manner.
The general public is terribly misinformed about nutrition and fitness.14
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