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Why do people deny CICO ?

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  • stanmann571
    stanmann571 Posts: 5,727 Member
    TR0berts wrote: »
    TR0berts wrote: »
    WinoGelato wrote: »
    WinoGelato wrote: »
    The fact is that the principle of CICO for weight loss is effective in practice. Recording what you eat and keeping a calorie deficit, which is, at the fundamental level, what causes weight loss, is highly effective process for someone with that goal. But, it's also way too simplistic. Though it is a "simple scientific concept", the body isn't. When you have a biological environment that has higher insulin, that does change how people's bodies manage metabolism.

    So, at one level, CICO is a good tool. At deeper level, it's not that simple. Anyone that has a deeper understanding of biology knows this, or should. Just because it is a good methodology doesn't mean it's all things. We argue about this because we want to live in a binary world. Calories matter, not doubt. But, composition does, too.

    Ultimately, who's more right isn't important. If CICO works for someone's quest to lose weight, it just doesn't matter (and no blog of an anecdotal nature will convince me otherwise, though I will cheer your success nonetheless).

    yeah. I'm finding that there is a cult of conformity around here, that wants to force this idea that calories is the only thing that matters. If that's the case why track nutrients and macros, at all? Yes CICO is great for weight management, but what about your actual health. Your body weight isn't the only thing matters.

    Find a thread, any thread (if it happens as often as you say then it shouldn't be hard) where someone asks about challenges with losing weight, and all the responses say that "eat whatever you want, CICO is all that matters" and no one mentions health, nutrition, and satiety.

    People constantly suggest that this happens and I've yet to have someone come back with an actual thread where it does.

    I know there is one somewhere.

    Cuz I posted it to make a point :)

    I thought I found it but no, not this one. http://community.myfitnesspal.com/en/discussion/10451302/eat-whatever-you-want-and-lose-weight/p1

    Still looking, I know it is out there.

    LOL. Thanks for proving my point.

    The poster you were quoting was trying to find a thread where no one brought up the importance of good nutrition in the context of using CICO (energy balance) to lose weight. They are saying that they still can't find it after searching. I notice you haven't posted an example either, even though you said it happens all the time in this "culture of conformity".

    I didn't need to. There are two prime examples linked in this thread. The one you mention here. Literally, no valuable discussion regarding nutrition and health in either one. Just a bunch of, yay I can eat pizza, ice cream, and drink wine.

    So, you didn't actually read the thread. That explains things.

    I totally read both, Unless you consider diabetes, and high cholesterol a worthy health goal, then no nothing of value there.

    So the improvement of health markers doesn't mean much to you...

    OR

    You didn't actually read the thread.

    An overweight Paleo vegan is at much higher risk of diabetes and high cholesterol than a very active Factory worker/ powerlifter who is within "normal weight range" who eats McDonald's 3 meals a day, 7 days a week.


    And/or have funny (aka incorrect) ideas about what causes diabetes and high cholesterol.

    And/or didn't understand when people mentioned eating healthy, nutritious foods - especially in the OP, which would indicate that not much (if any) additional discussion is required. Even though it was present.

    Obviously it's better to have lower quantities of highly saturated fat and refined sugars in your diet, but ultimately a person with a healthy BW or BF% is at radically lower disease risk than someone with elevated BW or BF%.

    I avoid HFCS, because of how it affects my emotional and mental metabolism. And yes, I've done double blind testing to confirm that it's HFCS that is causing the effects. But YMMV, and I wouldn't suggest you avoid HFCS unless you have similar symptoms. AND if cutting it out doesn't work, by all means go back to drinking or eating foods with it.
  • kuftae
    kuftae Posts: 299 Member
    lemurcat12 wrote: »
    kuftae wrote: »
    Eating processed foods, carbs and sugar really do make me feel like garbage. I don't think I am alone in this. It is WAY easier to eat vegetables, eggs, lean meat and water only if you are going for a steep cut (2lbs+ per week). With a clean diet I can go to bed full on 1700 calories easy (1200 cal deficit). I can't imagine getting through a day after having a 400+ calorie sugary snack. I would wake up the next day with a sugar hangover unable to move. Whatever keeps you sane though.

    Calories in-- calories out means everything though. I maintain and gain weight on the same foods, just more volume (and a lot of added butter!)

    Vegetables have carbohydrates.

    Also, fruit is one of the foods highest in carbs by percentage, and yet few people claim to feel like garbage because they eat fruit. So yeah, I do think that's kind of unusual, although there are others who claim carbs in general make them feel bad.

    Of course, most of the healthiest human diets (the blue zones) are reasonably high carb.

    and high in fiber.