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why do people think you can be healthy at every size?

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  • Theoldguy1
    Theoldguy1 Posts: 2,454 Member
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    paperpudding wrote: »
    Not so, the old guy.

    And this I do know, since working with patients blood test results is big part of my job.

    Sure, the more obese you get and the older you get, the more likely you are to have glucose, cholesterol, high blood pressure

    But this idea that somebody age over 60 and BMI of, say, 32 and no poor test results is a rarity - not true.

    That's interesting. When it comes up in conversations it seems like none of my significantly overweight or obese friends has blood markers in the normal range without the use of some drug(s). Just personal observation.

    From your background do you have any stats on % of older obese individuals with normal blood markers and not on medicine vs those of a normal weight?
  • lemurcat2
    lemurcat2 Posts: 7,885 Member
    edited February 2019
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    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    lemurcat2 wrote: »
    That objective evidence said I was healthy when I was obese. I don't think being obese is healthy, as it's an unnecessary risk factor, but the idea that everyone overweight or obese has bad test results is wrong.

    Anyway, once again it's the idea that one can do things to improve health/risk factors, whatever weight one is.

    IMO, youth can cover up a bunch of health sins. Look at the over 60 or so population that is obese. I'm pretty sure you will find about as many good test results as snowcone vendors in Antarctica.

    I wasn't that young (44), and I agree that it's a risk factor and likely to lead to problems as one ages, which is what I said. What I was rebutting was the claim that anyone fat must have bad test results automatically (the converse of which would be that if you don't have bad test results you must have not really been too fat -- I certainly was too fat).

    I think some lose weight because they get bad test results and are told they need to reverse them, and good for them for doing that, but then often overgeneralize and assume such bad tests are automatic -- some of us realized we needed to lose and did so yet never had those bad results (although I think it's quite likely they would have developed later, and if not some other problem).

    Some issues, like cholesterol, aren't uncommon among thinner people. My dad's always been fit and normal weight, yet is prone to bad cholesterol if he eats too much sat fat. That started in his 40s.
  • paperpudding
    paperpudding Posts: 8,987 Member
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    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    paperpudding wrote: »
    Not so, the old guy.

    And this I do know, since working with patients blood test results is big part of my job.

    Sure, the more obese you get and the older you get, the more likely you are to have glucose, cholesterol, high blood pressure

    But this idea that somebody age over 60 and BMI of, say, 32 and no poor test results is a rarity - not true.

    That's interesting. When it comes up in conversations it seems like none of my significantly overweight or obese friends has blood markers in the normal range without the use of some drug(s). Just personal observation.

    From your background do you have any stats on % of older obese individuals with normal blood markers and not on medicine vs those of a normal weight?


    No I don't have any actual percentages. Is just my general observation that blood test results not having anything in abnormal range is not rare in older unmedicated patients with BMI's over 30.

    I'm sure the percentage of such is less than the percentage of older healthy BMI range people - I don't dispute that.

    I do dispute that it is a rarity to be over 60, unmedicated and returning normal blood test results though.
  • wmd1979
    wmd1979 Posts: 469 Member
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    Tacklewasher wrote: »
    magnusthenerd wrote: »
    mcemino2 wrote: »
    davani09 wrote: »
    it's unhealthy to be obese

    Do you think Dwayne Johnson is unhealthy? He is technically considered obese.

    I don't know about how helpful it is to use someone who's likely on PEDs as a counter example.

    Even if he isn't on PED's, he is recognized as an outlier. That in no way invalidates the standard.

    Exactly. It is the same tired argument, and it seems like people use that strawman it to make obesity appear acceptable or healthy in some way.
  • JustinAnimal
    JustinAnimal Posts: 1,335 Member
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    To sympathize with the OP's confusion, I have family members who are morbidly obese. Like, not healthy by anyone's definition. Loss of function like picking things up or climbing stairs. They quite regularly post a lot of fat-acceptance... I don't know... memes? Things like: "Your body is a garden; let is flourish." I worry for them, because I believe their weight will one day lead to something bad. I'm not here to judge anyone. I just want to keep my family members around as long as possible.
  • JustinAnimal
    JustinAnimal Posts: 1,335 Member
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    Oh, I didn't realize we were discussing obesity like obesity on paper. Yeah, I'm obese, too. Or I should say I just left it. Most of those charts tell you to disregard or take with a grain of salt if you strength train / lift weights. My relatives are not body-builders.
  • magnusthenerd
    magnusthenerd Posts: 1,207 Member
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    tbright1965 wrote: »
    mcemino2 wrote: »
    davani09 wrote: »
    it's unhealthy to be obese

    Do you think Dwayne Johnson is unhealthy? He is technically considered obese.

    Do you think he really has over 25% body fat?

    Obesity is having too much fat. It's not about how much you weigh, it's about how much fat you carry. To be obese, you have to carry over 25% body fat as a man, and 30% for a woman, IIRC.

    Are you telling me you think Dwayne Johnson carries over 25% body fat?

    No. Obesity is medically defined by having a BMI over 30. That is the only standardized use of the term medically.
    The concept proxies having excess fat, but there are aspects of obesity that persist regardless of body fat percentage. For example, both sleep apnea and risk of knee issues are both predicted by being obese, even when a person has what would be considered "acceptable" body fat percentage.
  • tbright1965
    tbright1965 Posts: 852 Member
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    Actually Obesity is medically defined as excess body fat. BMI is a Proxy to estimate it, but isn’t perfect as it doesn’t account for people like Dwane Johnson.

    People conflate BMI for body fat percentage, and there is some correlation. But not all who have a BMI > 30 are actually obese. But they are certainly worth another look.
    magnusthenerd wrote: »
    tbright1965 wrote: »
    mcemino2 wrote: »
    davani09 wrote: »
    it's unhealthy to be obese

    Do you think Dwayne Johnson is unhealthy? He is technically considered obese.

    Do you think he really has over 25% body fat?

    Obesity is having too much fat. It's not about how much you weigh, it's about how much fat you carry. To be obese, you have to carry over 25% body fat as a man, and 30% for a woman, IIRC.

    Are you telling me you think Dwayne Johnson carries over 25% body fat?

    No. Obesity is medically defined by having a BMI over 30. That is the only standardized use of the term medically.
    The concept proxies having excess fat, but there are aspects of obesity that persist regardless of body fat percentage. For example, both sleep apnea and risk of knee issues are both predicted by being obese, even when a person has what would be considered "acceptable" body fat percentage.

  • magnusthenerd
    magnusthenerd Posts: 1,207 Member
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    tbright1965 wrote: »
    Actually Obesity is medically defined as excess body fat. BMI is a Proxy to estimate it, but isn’t perfect as it doesn’t account for people like Dwane Johnson.

    People conflate BMI for body fat percentage, and there is some correlation. But not all who have a BMI > 30 are actually obese. But they are certainly worth another look.
    magnusthenerd wrote: »
    tbright1965 wrote: »
    mcemino2 wrote: »
    davani09 wrote: »
    it's unhealthy to be obese

    Do you think Dwayne Johnson is unhealthy? He is technically considered obese.

    Do you think he really has over 25% body fat?

    Obesity is having too much fat. It's not about how much you weigh, it's about how much fat you carry. To be obese, you have to carry over 25% body fat as a man, and 30% for a woman, IIRC.

    Are you telling me you think Dwayne Johnson carries over 25% body fat?

    No. Obesity is medically defined by having a BMI over 30. That is the only standardized use of the term medically.
    The concept proxies having excess fat, but there are aspects of obesity that persist regardless of body fat percentage. For example, both sleep apnea and risk of knee issues are both predicted by being obese, even when a person has what would be considered "acceptable" body fat percentage.

    No, it is literally medically defined as a BMI over 30. It is literally how the World Health Organization defines it - they have no criteria for evaluating obesity on the basis of actual fat.
    At best I've seen some sports medicine organizations provide body fat percentages for it.
  • desigood
    desigood Posts: 1 Member
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    trulyhealy wrote: »
    that can’t really be true if you’re fat/obese/underweight bc being bc if you were healthy you wouldn’t get fat
    trulyhealy wrote: »
    that can’t really be true if you’re fat/obese/underweight bc being bc if you were healthy you wouldn’t get fat
    trulyhealy wrote: »
    that can’t really be true if you’re fat/obese/underweight bc being bc if you were healthy you wouldn’t get fat
    trulyhealy wrote: »
    that can’t really be true if you’re fat/obese/underweight bc being bc if you were healthy you wouldn’t get fat

    Because people don’t understand that just because an overweight/underweight person does not CURRENTLY have health problems, that as time goes on, they will. Our bodies are amazing & can overcompensate for the crap we do to it—but only for so long. It’s impossible to be healthy at ANY weight. All types of health risks come with weight issues.
  • estherdragonbat
    estherdragonbat Posts: 5,283 Member
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    All types of health risks come with age, genetics, job, location, etc. Sooner or later, our bodies break down. Obesity is a factor, yes. But far from the only one.

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