Coronavirus prep

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  • lemurcat2
    lemurcat2 Posts: 7,885 Member
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    That plus others not doing what they can affects many other people (I can avoid them, but many others cannot). And to the extent their behavior leads to constantly increasing case numbers, that's longer I have to be staying at home (I do go out for exercise and necessities, of course). So even though I have it pretty good (I can work at home, I live in a house with a back yard, I have access to everything I need), I strongly dislike living this way and if I let myself think about it my rage at some of the people doing the irresponsible partying (giant house parties in some neighborhoods here) and and other unnecessary large gatherings is real.

    I think that's why my Nextdoor is now endless fights between people about whether one must wear a mask when outside (inside outside your own home is required) or whether it's perfectly possible to distance 6 ft if careful/people are overreacting -- people feel powerless and frustrated and so want to feel like they are doing something to make this end.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
    @janejellyroll - if it sounded like it, I didn't mean to minimize the impact that some will have on all of us. It's just, at this point, it's looking like the powers that be don't care or it's inconvenient to THEM.

    I heard something yesterday that 30% of the population in the US, even if there's a vaccine, are so ignorant they won't take it. So I guess what I'm saying is Darwism is in full display right now in front of our very eyes. It will play out and the stupid are putting themselves (and the rest of us) at risk.

    I didn't feel like you were minimizing it at all. It's just the unfortunate reality.
  • janejellyroll
    janejellyroll Posts: 25,763 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    Huh, here in my state of Massachusetts you are not allowed in stores without some sort of face covering. Municipalities made this an order some time ago and now it is state-wide.

    https://www.mass.gov/news/wear-a-mask-in-public

    ...Governor Baker has issued an Order effective Wednesday, May 6 requiring face masks or cloth face coverings in public places where social distancing is not possible. This applies to both indoor and outdoor spaces....

    Minnesota isn't requiring masks. Anecdotally, I would say about 40%ish of the people I see when I go out are wearing them.
  • lemurcat2
    lemurcat2 Posts: 7,885 Member
    edited May 2020
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    Huh, here in my state of Massachusetts you are not allowed in stores without some sort of face covering. Municipalities made this an order some time ago and now it is state-wide.

    https://www.mass.gov/news/wear-a-mask-in-public

    ...Governor Baker has issued an Order effective Wednesday, May 6 requiring face masks or cloth face coverings in public places where social distancing is not possible. This applies to both indoor and outdoor spaces....

    Minnesota isn't requiring masks. Anecdotally, I would say about 40%ish of the people I see when I go out are wearing them.

    We only require them if you can't social distance 6 ft, but they are required in stores (and many stores are very serious about it). So currently everyone I've seen in stores are wearing them, but fewer (although still a strong majority) outside. But this is just for around where I live; it's different elsewhere.

    And I've heard of various store owners in states that do require them saying they won't require it also, so just issuing an order doesn't work without cooperation, of course.

    (I think I can social distance well enough outside, but I feel social stigma if I don't wear a mask so I do. I get why people don't want to wear them when running or just walking around in a not so populated area. I don't get why some seem to be so opposed to wearing them in indoor spaces where there are lots of other people.)
  • kshama2001
    kshama2001 Posts: 28,052 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    Huh, here in my state of Massachusetts you are not allowed in stores without some sort of face covering. Municipalities made this an order some time ago and now it is state-wide.

    https://www.mass.gov/news/wear-a-mask-in-public

    ...Governor Baker has issued an Order effective Wednesday, May 6 requiring face masks or cloth face coverings in public places where social distancing is not possible. This applies to both indoor and outdoor spaces....

    But who is enforcing that? Store employees are not paid enough to act as security guards and confront angry customers who don't follow the rules. We have the same rule here in Illinois, but people can just walk right past the signs and no one's going to stop them.
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    It seems NM is playing more on peer pressure where masks are concerned. The only current mandate is that employees of open establishments must wear a mask, and that is of this past Monday.

    I've seen a slow compulsory progression towards wearing masks when out shopping, etc since the end of March/early April. Initially, you were the weirdo if you were out wearing a mask or, eeww...you must be infected or have something else going on. I think those tides have turned to wear the non mask wearers are now getting the dirty looks. Even since Monday where employees have been mandated, I've seen an uptick in gen pop wearing masks.

    Some stores are also now making it mandatory for customers to wear a mask if they want to enter and I'm sure there will be more that follow.

    I too have seen that slow uptick in mask usage. Last few weeks it's been 100% at grocery stores and Lowes.

    Our supermarkets are limited to 20% of capacity. There are store employees counting and letting people in. I'm sure they would stop anyone trying to enter without a mask.

    My OH forgot to pull up his bandana when he went in to pick up food, the employee reminded him, and he complied.
  • AnnPT77
    AnnPT77 Posts: 34,204 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    Huh, here in my state of Massachusetts you are not allowed in stores without some sort of face covering. Municipalities made this an order some time ago and now it is state-wide.

    https://www.mass.gov/news/wear-a-mask-in-public

    ...Governor Baker has issued an Order effective Wednesday, May 6 requiring face masks or cloth face coverings in public places where social distancing is not possible. This applies to both indoor and outdoor spaces....

    Minnesota isn't requiring masks. Anecdotally, I would say about 40%ish of the people I see when I go out are wearing them.

    Michigan's current executive order says this:
    Except as provided in subsection (b) of this section, any individual able to medically tolerate a face covering must wear a covering over his or her nose and mouth—such as a homemade mask, scarf, bandana, or handkerchief—when in any enclosed public space.

    The stores have the signs up. Compliance level, on my last trip (to Costco, a local health-food-ish grocery, Whole Foods)?

    Among customers, not hugely much better than what you're reporting, counting the number of people who had the masks but on their chin or pushed all the way down while they were shopping. (I'd say worse at Costco than the other two, but not great anywhere. Of course, I have no idea who is not "able to medically tolerate", and I'm not naive enough to believe that all such conditions would be visually obvious to a stranger . . . but I'm pretty sure there aren't that many people in gen pop with breathing troubles (I didn't go at senior hours).

    I'm pretty sure the stores were checking at the door, but I don't really expect every underpaid shelf-stocker to confront large numbers of shoppers while also trying to do their (essential, risky) jobs.

    SMH.
  • DancingMoosie
    DancingMoosie Posts: 8,619 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    Just curious. Why were barber shops among the first to open here, among the last in other states? Did our governor need a haircut and your governor has a private barber?

    What state are you in? If Georgia, or your state's reopening guidelines are similar to GA, I can PM you something that I can't post here lest it be deemed too political.

    My OH taught himself to trim his hair, and he did a great job on my ends and bangs. I'm about ready to find some youtube videos and let him learn how to cut layers. If it doesn't work out, I'll be in a ponytail all summer :lol:

    I learned how to cut my hair on YouTube. Hubby cuts his own with a flowbie.
  • mkculs13
    mkculs13 Posts: 679 Member
    TonyB0588 wrote: »
    Flattening the curve is needed to keep the rate of new infections lower than the rate of recoveries. Less new infections give more time for medical personnel to devote care to those already sick and prevent deaths.

    Yes, I assume almost everyone knows that by now and that was not the question. The rate of new infections can exceed the rate of recovery even after the initial stage, if people aren't taking adequate precautions. People don't seem to understand that.

  • Theoldguy1
    Theoldguy1 Posts: 2,496 Member
    kshama2001 wrote: »
    I'm in AZ and just saw a projection yesterday (I think mainly because we're on a rapid upward trajectory and have so many older people) that we will have an increase in deaths of 5000%. I think we're at 500 deaths now and they are predicting well over 5000 more.

    Yet masks aren't required and restaurants opened over the weekend. People were standing in line at haircutting places, nail salons and spas. Most all didn't have masks.

    I'm at the point now where if people want to die, you can't help them. I feel sorry that they have minimized the risk, ignored the science and now can't wait to "be free". I just don't think what will happen to them is as fun as they anticipate.

    We will continue to shelter in place for the most part, eat at home (and I'm fortunate enough to have a career where I don't step out of the house).

    The only ones I feel sorry for is the first responders and family members of those that continue to put everyone at risk for their "civil liberties".

    The thing that frustrates me about this is that *we all* have to live with these people who don't care if they live or die (or act as if they don't). I can be doing everything I can, but I still have to leave the house for groceries sometimes and when I do I'm encountering these people who are not taking any precautions. Nothing is going to protect me from that. That's what is frustrating. If these people could live in their own bubble, I wouldn't be as frustrated. They don't. We have to live alongside them.

    Huh, here in my state of Massachusetts you are not allowed in stores without some sort of face covering. Municipalities made this an order some time ago and now it is state-wide.

    https://www.mass.gov/news/wear-a-mask-in-public

    ...Governor Baker has issued an Order effective Wednesday, May 6 requiring face masks or cloth face coverings in public places where social distancing is not possible. This applies to both indoor and outdoor spaces....

    IL has this too. Not enforced and hard to. In many cases here the stores are limiting the number of people that can enter so keeping 6 ft is possible. I went in a Bass Pro Shop and guy walked in with 3 kids, none of the 4 had masks right past 2 employees standing at the door.
  • Theoldguy1
    Theoldguy1 Posts: 2,496 Member
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    TonyB0588 wrote: »
    Just curious. Why were barber shops among the first to open here, among the last in other states? Did our governor need a haircut and your governor has a private barber?

    Just curious. Why do people need barbershops? I cut my own hair for 5 years, and my wife continued for the next 32 years after that. She never stopped during the lockdown.

    Perhaps because they don't have and don't want to develop that skill set or just don't want to do it? I mean do you change the oil in you vehicles, do your own taxes, lawn care, home repairs, etc.? I'm pretty sure there is some service you are paying for that others not specifically trained to perform that function are doing just like you are cutting your own hair.


    I think the point of this post was more to address the 'But who needs barbers, I can do it myself' of the post it responded to.

    and saying Yes you can do it yourself - other people can do other things themselves but dont go round saying why do you need accountants, lawn mower services etc, you could just do it yourself.

    It wasnt a comment on the safety or neccesity or social distancing possibilities of each service - just a response to the 'I can do it myself, why doesnt everyone else' tone of the responded to post.

    That's how it came across to me anyway.



    Exactly
  • spiriteagle99
    spiriteagle99 Posts: 3,743 Member
    earlnabby wrote: »
    Our state Supreme Court just struck down the governor's stay at home order. This means any business or restaurant can open up immediately.

    Which state?

  • spiriteagle99
    spiriteagle99 Posts: 3,743 Member
    PA has required masks for a few weeks. I have read a few objections on FB, but everyone I've seen in the stores has been wearing one.

    Grocery stores are still limited, which is frustrating. No rice, no pasta, limited cheese, and no TP, though paper towels are easily available.
  • Theoldguy1
    Theoldguy1 Posts: 2,496 Member
    jo_nz wrote: »
    We've woken up this morning to a new level of freedom (I'm in New Zealand) - at midnight we went to "alert level 2"

    Level 4 was full lockdown - supermarkets, pharmacies and medical centres open with restrictions, and a few other essential services were running. People had to stay home, no travel, only contact with those in your home (or your "bubble")

    Level 3 was a slight easing - cafes and restaurants opened for takeaway only. Stores opening for click and collect or delivery services. Travelling within your region was okay.

    Level 2 we now have restaurants open for table service again - groups of 10 or less. Shops can open, social distancing and hygiene measures in place. School will reopen on Monday. We can now travel again - looking forward to visiting my mum who is in another region and has been alone for 7 weeks! I have been talking to her lots, and ordering her groceries for delivery as she's in an at-risk group and taking all precautions.
    There are still restrictions on gatherings, so the kids' extra-curricular activities won't be starting face-to-face just yet. That will be reviewed in two weeks as we see how the case numbers progress.

    (Those descriptions of levels are not complete lists, just a few things relevant to me)

    Funny how today, for me, is actually just the same. I guess it will help when the kids head back to school next week, but I will continue to work from home. I am looking forward to taking the dog for a walk as we'd been requested to keep dogs on leash for all walks for level 3&4, so it'll be great to let her off at the beach or river for a run - except I think everyone else in town will probably have the same idea, and my dog hates crowds.
    My daughter is super excited to see her best friend today.

    Fingers crossed (and hands washed) that our numbers stay low going forward.

    What I don't understand is, if social distancing and hygiene measures are in place and groups are limited to 10, how do schools open? This is why we don't know when schools will reopen here. We have to follow the social distance guidelines, which is 10 or less. That is not a full school bus or classroom. They are even limiting staff to 10 at a time. Parks are open, but not playgrounds(in some cities). My city opened parks and playgrounds, but not restrooms. I don't understand...are we supposed to pee ourselves?

    That's what the other side of the tree is for:)
  • jo_nz
    jo_nz Posts: 548 Member
    jo_nz wrote: »
    We've woken up this morning to a new level of freedom (I'm in New Zealand) - at midnight we went to "alert level 2"

    Level 4 was full lockdown - supermarkets, pharmacies and medical centres open with restrictions, and a few other essential services were running. People had to stay home, no travel, only contact with those in your home (or your "bubble")

    Level 3 was a slight easing - cafes and restaurants opened for takeaway only. Stores opening for click and collect or delivery services. Travelling within your region was okay.

    Level 2 we now have restaurants open for table service again - groups of 10 or less. Shops can open, social distancing and hygiene measures in place. School will reopen on Monday. We can now travel again - looking forward to visiting my mum who is in another region and has been alone for 7 weeks! I have been talking to her lots, and ordering her groceries for delivery as she's in an at-risk group and taking all precautions.
    There are still restrictions on gatherings, so the kids' extra-curricular activities won't be starting face-to-face just yet. That will be reviewed in two weeks as we see how the case numbers progress.

    (Those descriptions of levels are not complete lists, just a few things relevant to me)

    Funny how today, for me, is actually just the same. I guess it will help when the kids head back to school next week, but I will continue to work from home. I am looking forward to taking the dog for a walk as we'd been requested to keep dogs on leash for all walks for level 3&4, so it'll be great to let her off at the beach or river for a run - except I think everyone else in town will probably have the same idea, and my dog hates crowds.
    My daughter is super excited to see her best friend today.

    Fingers crossed (and hands washed) that our numbers stay low going forward.

    What I don't understand is, if social distancing and hygiene measures are in place and groups are limited to 10, how do schools open? This is why we don't know when schools will reopen here. We have to follow the social distance guidelines, which is 10 or less. That is not a full school bus or classroom. They are even limiting staff to 10 at a time. Parks are open, but not playgrounds(in some cities). My city opened parks and playgrounds, but not restrooms. I don't understand...are we supposed to pee ourselves?

    It is strange, I agree. Really I wonder if it's more that in order for people to return to work, kids need to go back to school. Or is that just me being cynical??

    My kids'schools have various changes in place - no assemblies, assigned seating, extra spacing of desks etc. But still, there will be 25+ kids in a classroom together all day. And lots of them playing together at break times.
    And I am waiting to see how the high school is handling moving classrooms for each subject. Do they clean in between etc? I know they have installed hand sanitizer dispensers to be used going in and out. And any kids with a sign of being unwell will be sent straight home.

    Our city council has advised that public toilets are also open - cleaning twice a day. I would aim to avoid them anyway, but good to know they are there.