Coronavirus prep

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  • spiriteagle99
    spiriteagle99 Posts: 3,749 Member
    I had Moderna #2 shot 46 hours ago and think most of my side effects to this side may be behind me which was mainly feeling tired.
    After first shot the side effects may have been more Covid-19 like but had passed after 22 hours leaving me stronger than any time in 2021.

    Ever if my sinus infection the first week of Jan 2021 masked Covid-19 at the time as my wife expected at the time I am glad I now have completed my 2 shot Covid-19 vaccination process and have physical proof because how much better I felt and still feel 24 hours after the 1st shot.

    Last Wednesday Cancer was ruled out as a cause of my blood issues for the past 5 months.

    Post vaccination side effects range from zero to death we read so I think comparing ours with others is without medical value.

    I'm glad they ruled out cancer, but did they get closer to figuring out what is causing your problem?
  • Theoldguy1
    Theoldguy1 Posts: 2,498 Member
    hipari wrote: »
    Avidkeo wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    Judging by work hour logging at my workplace, roughly a third of all vaccinated employees have taken some sick leave (either partial day or a full day) after their vaccination. Based on that, I don’t think it’s ”rare”.
    hipari wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    Judging by work hour logging at my workplace, roughly a third of all vaccinated employees have taken some sick leave (either partial day or a full day) after their vaccination. Based on that, I don’t think it’s ”rare”.

    I'm going to jump in here and ask what your definition of adverse reactions are?

    Generally mild and common reactions are soreness and redness at the injection site, mild symptoms including fever, tiredness and even muscle aches. I know lots of people who experience these

    Adverse reactions are anaphylaxis, encephalitis, cardiac arrest. These are extremely rare.

    You and I seem to have a very different definition of ”adverse”. Mine is more in line with Merriam-Webster dictionary, thinking that adverse is opposed to one’s interests or causing harm. I’d say headaches, fevers and chills are opposed to most people’s interests and potentially causing harm if they prevent people from fulfilling whatever plans they had for that time.

    I would of course list the reactions you mentioned as adverse, but definitely on the more serious side and, thankfully, quite rare.
    Theoldguy1 wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    Judging by work hour logging at my workplace, roughly a third of all vaccinated employees have taken some sick leave (either partial day or a full day) after their vaccination. Based on that, I don’t think it’s ”rare”.

    I'm guessing that if we were able to see how many skipped a concert, wedding reception, ballgame or other "fun" event it would be a lot less than 1/3 skipping.

    All events, fun or otherwise, have been cancelled for over a year now. Of course I can never know for sure what my colleagues do during weekends, but they’re generally a very work-motivated bunch and I’ve heard multiple recommendations of scheduling the vax appointment for a Friday so a possible reaction doesn’t interfere with work plans.

    Or scheduling a vax appointment on Friday to start the weekend early.
  • Fuzzipeg
    Fuzzipeg Posts: 2,301 Member
    I hope the Delta variant does not make it to anywhere else. With science talk suggesting it is 40-60% more transmissible, effecting youngsters much more than previous ones, it still seems to be slowed by the vaccine so vaccinated persons don't become as ill as they would otherwise. Its the unvaccinated people who are still becoming more ill, needing hospital care. I understand the hesitance, I have not had a flu vaccine since the mid '80's, I had probably what I could call Long flu. When it came to this though. The probability of death, age and health predicted, I made the choice I did before when I said life with t4 only treatment for hashi was no life at all. I'd like to think when the time comes I'll be sitting on a star looking down on everyone in my life but please, please not yet there is too much for me to learn and know let alone do.

    When my daughter had her vaccine, I was very concerned for her, the type she was to have had carried the minute possibility of developing clots. The US don't use it. I told myself, back the few months ago, the medics were, had learned so much more, they knew what to do were this sad reaction to happen, how to treat the clots particularly if the person were sensitive to their changes in how they feel and raised the alarm in good time. We like millions more were fine, my daughter is well. I feel for those who are so very precious about their least discomfort, a pin prick and achy arm, you get that with all childhood vaccines, avoiding vaccination against the probability of not running the risk of discovering, when its too late that their encounter with covid has been more than life itself.
  • SModa61
    SModa61 Posts: 3,117 Member
    edited June 2021
    @kimny72 What is odd is that I have not known anyone with significant COVID or vaccine issues until just these last two weeks. And I fully understand that each may be a coincidence. In the cases of the two very recent stories, one is Florida and the seizure one was Massachusetts treatment but they live and were vaccinated in Connecticut. I suggested they look into Vaers, but I could tell they were not interested in taking that step despite their beliefs and feelings.

    Was talking to my daughter a couple hours ago, and she pointed out to me that none of us know if doctors are reporting to Vaers while downplaying to the patient until more is known. Which I would fully understand.

    Edit: Just read the first part of your post @Kimny72 and last week I was reading an article stating pretty much exactly what you said. You covered the topic thoroughly!
  • 33gail33
    33gail33 Posts: 1,155 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    33gail33 wrote: »
    33gail33 wrote: »
    Has anyone got their second shot (Pfizer) and NOT had a bad reaction? I am getting mine on Saturday and everyone keeps telling me I am going to be sick from it.

    Also wondering if anyone has got their second shot at an extended interval yet - my first shot was three months ago. I think I am in the first cohort here to get the second shot on the extended time frame so not sure how that might influence the side effect situation.

    I heard some common reports of adverse reactions the day after the second shot and had planned to take it easy myself the day after my second shot. I got my shot at 7:30 in the morning, did a 90 minute bike ride afterwards, and some automotive work the rest of the day. The next day... nothing. No fever at all. My arm was barely even sore at the injection site. I ended up doing my normally planned long run (15 miles) for the day.

    My partner had a nasty headache the evening of her shot, and felt ill the next morning, but was feeling well enough to go out on her bike that afternoon.

    Got it 3 hours ago - so far so good. Didn't plan a whole lot for this weekend just in case.

    I think that you hear mostly the bad reactions but people don't tend to talk much about mild or non existent reactions. After posting here I see there is a range with the second shot and it isn't necessarily all bad - which was the impression I had before.

    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    In many cases, I think symptomatic reactions are self induced...they believe it will happen, so it does...basically, power of suggestion. Early on in the vaccine process, we had an issue at one of our mass vaccination centers where several people started having issues during their 15 minute watch period and the site was temporarily shut down...it turns out they were just having anxiety and panic attacks.

    Yeah my BIL works in public health and he said once the 12-17 year olds started getting vaccinated it slowed everything down in the clinics because they get a lot more fainters in that age group.

    Husband and I both did have mild reactions to the first shot - fatigue and headache for a day and a half. He seems to have had a bit of a worse reaction to our second one yesterday, fever and chills and body pain. I seem to be fine, no reaction of note at all this time.
  • lynn_glenmont
    lynn_glenmont Posts: 10,097 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When talking about possible vaccine reactions, I think it's important to remember two things, each kind of supporting opposite sides.

    First, not every doctor is an expert, or even understands, virology and vaccine science. And since covid-19 is new, even doctors who have some knowledge of viruses can be no better educated about it than an average layman. So it's quite possible that a primary care or ER doctor might give a patient bad info about covid or not react to a possible vaccine reaction correctly. It will take years for every doctor who might possibly see a patient about covid or one of the many covid vaccines to become experts themselves. I would suggest if anyone has something serious happen to them after vaccination and a doctor blows them off, contact your local public health dept and ask them how to report the possible reaction.

    But second, weird symptoms happen to otherwise healthy people all the time. People run a fever, have a seizure, have a stroke, get nauseous, all the time, unexpectedly and without a known cause. Some days I am extremely fatigued, some days my stomach acts up, some days my head hurts, and I'll never know why. With tens of millions of people getting a vaccine in a short period of time, it stands to reason that many people will experience symptoms or even major health issues in the hours and days afterward that have literally nothing to do with the vaccine. They would've happened anyway. Those conditions need to be reported, so that if there are patterns they will be seen and investigated, and compared to typical frequency of that kind of symptom in the population without a vaccine. But the fact that lots of people have something happen after they're vaccinated doesn't mean all of those something's is a reaction to the vaccine.

    I'm not at all diminishing people's suffering or suggesting nothing should be blamed on the vaccines. There is no doubt there will be rare but serious reactions to the vaccines, there always are to pretty much any medical intervention, and understanding those cases is important. But we talk a lot on the MFP forum about the difference between correlation and causation, and it applies here as well.

    (clipped for length)

    Lots of really good points here, but I just want to note that random medical incidents in the wake of the vaccination are more about the difference between coincidence and correlation than the difference between correlation and causation. That is, if you just hear about one friend or family member whose heart attack or seizure or whatever happened in the days or weeks after vaccination, that's just a coincidence for all we know until we study the incidence of such reactions in large numbers of people and find a statistical relationship -- that is, a correlation.

  • SModa61
    SModa61 Posts: 3,117 Member
    kimny72 wrote: »
    When talking about possible vaccine reactions, I think it's important to remember two things, each kind of supporting opposite sides.

    First, not every doctor is an expert, or even understands, virology and vaccine science. And since covid-19 is new, even doctors who have some knowledge of viruses can be no better educated about it than an average layman. So it's quite possible that a primary care or ER doctor might give a patient bad info about covid or not react to a possible vaccine reaction correctly. It will take years for every doctor who might possibly see a patient about covid or one of the many covid vaccines to become experts themselves. I would suggest if anyone has something serious happen to them after vaccination and a doctor blows them off, contact your local public health dept and ask them how to report the possible reaction.

    But second, weird symptoms happen to otherwise healthy people all the time. People run a fever, have a seizure, have a stroke, get nauseous, all the time, unexpectedly and without a known cause. Some days I am extremely fatigued, some days my stomach acts up, some days my head hurts, and I'll never know why. With tens of millions of people getting a vaccine in a short period of time, it stands to reason that many people will experience symptoms or even major health issues in the hours and days afterward that have literally nothing to do with the vaccine. They would've happened anyway. Those conditions need to be reported, so that if there are patterns they will be seen and investigated, and compared to typical frequency of that kind of symptom in the population without a vaccine. But the fact that lots of people have something happen after they're vaccinated doesn't mean all of those something's is a reaction to the vaccine.

    I'm not at all diminishing people's suffering or suggesting nothing should be blamed on the vaccines. There is no doubt there will be rare but serious reactions to the vaccines, there always are to pretty much any medical intervention, and understanding those cases is important. But we talk a lot on the MFP forum about the difference between correlation and causation, and it applies here as well.

    (clipped for length)

    Lots of really good points here, but I just want to note that random medical incidents in the wake of the vaccination are more about the difference between coincidence and correlation than the difference between correlation and causation. That is, if you just hear about one friend or family member whose heart attack or seizure or whatever happened in the days or weeks after vaccination, that's just a coincidence for all we know until we study the incidence of such reactions in large numbers of people and find a statistical relationship -- that is, a correlation.

    Very very true. The parts of the stories that could concern me is if no notice is made of these coincidences (ie doctor reporting info) which would then not provide the data for doctors/scientists to determine if any are actually correlated.
  • paperpudding
    paperpudding Posts: 9,304 Member
    33gail33 wrote: »
    The day after my AZ vaccine I did feel fatigue -felt to me like when I used to work night shift and then tried to stay awake next day

    Now I could of been imagining that or had it coincidentally from some other cause - but seems to me unlikely since nothing else was different (it wasnt an excuse to call in sick either- I went to work and pushed through.)

    I work in a clinic and we have now given around 1000 vaccines - nobody has had serious side effects - however some have had minor side effects, more than just sore arm - fatigue, muscle aches, fever, nausea
    Some have had nothing.

    Not enough for any concern or reason not to have vaccine - but I also dont think we should dismiss such symptoms as all being imaginary either.

    We had our second Pfizer dose yesterday - I feel perfectly fine, my husband has some fever, chills and muscle/joint pain - flu like symptoms.

    What is interesting is that my husband came down with a bad bout of vertigo last week. I have had vertigo but he has never had it before. I said to him this morning that it was a good thing that he got it last week because if it had happened after the vaccine we would have probably suspected that as the cause. With thousands of people getting vaccinated every day there are bound to be coincidental health problems that occur.

    since you quoted me to say this - so I assume your post is in response to mine.

    Yes I accept my reaction could of been co incidence due to some other unknown cause - but given it is a known reaction and nothing else was different and this is not something that happens to me regularly - I think it far more likely it was a vaccine reaction.

    a mild one and not of concern - but also not to be dismissed.
  • 33gail33
    33gail33 Posts: 1,155 Member
    33gail33 wrote: »
    The day after my AZ vaccine I did feel fatigue -felt to me like when I used to work night shift and then tried to stay awake next day

    Now I could of been imagining that or had it coincidentally from some other cause - but seems to me unlikely since nothing else was different (it wasnt an excuse to call in sick either- I went to work and pushed through.)

    I work in a clinic and we have now given around 1000 vaccines - nobody has had serious side effects - however some have had minor side effects, more than just sore arm - fatigue, muscle aches, fever, nausea
    Some have had nothing.

    Not enough for any concern or reason not to have vaccine - but I also dont think we should dismiss such symptoms as all being imaginary either.

    We had our second Pfizer dose yesterday - I feel perfectly fine, my husband has some fever, chills and muscle/joint pain - flu like symptoms.

    What is interesting is that my husband came down with a bad bout of vertigo last week. I have had vertigo but he has never had it before. I said to him this morning that it was a good thing that he got it last week because if it had happened after the vaccine we would have probably suspected that as the cause. With thousands of people getting vaccinated every day there are bound to be coincidental health problems that occur.

    since you quoted me to say this - so I assume your post is in response to mine.

    Yes I accept my reaction could of been co incidence due to some other unknown cause - but given it is a known reaction and nothing else was different and this is not something that happens to me regularly - I think it far more likely it was a vaccine reaction.

    a mild one and not of concern - but also not to be dismissed.
    33gail33 wrote: »
    The day after my AZ vaccine I did feel fatigue -felt to me like when I used to work night shift and then tried to stay awake next day

    Now I could of been imagining that or had it coincidentally from some other cause - but seems to me unlikely since nothing else was different (it wasnt an excuse to call in sick either- I went to work and pushed through.)

    I work in a clinic and we have now given around 1000 vaccines - nobody has had serious side effects - however some have had minor side effects, more than just sore arm - fatigue, muscle aches, fever, nausea
    Some have had nothing.

    Not enough for any concern or reason not to have vaccine - but I also dont think we should dismiss such symptoms as all being imaginary either.

    We had our second Pfizer dose yesterday - I feel perfectly fine, my husband has some fever, chills and muscle/joint pain - flu like symptoms.

    What is interesting is that my husband came down with a bad bout of vertigo last week. I have had vertigo but he has never had it before. I said to him this morning that it was a good thing that he got it last week because if it had happened after the vaccine we would have probably suspected that as the cause. With thousands of people getting vaccinated every day there are bound to be coincidental health problems that occur.

    since you quoted me to say this - so I assume your post is in response to mine.

    Yes I accept my reaction could of been co incidence due to some other unknown cause - but given it is a known reaction and nothing else was different and this is not something that happens to me regularly - I think it far more likely it was a vaccine reaction.

    a mild one and not of concern - but also not to be dismissed.

    @paperpudding

    I quoted you just to continue the discussion on reactions and coincidence, not to imply that yours wasn't a vaccine reaction, I'm sure it was. We had the same reaction to our first shot, fatigue and headaches for a day and a half.

    The info about my husband was just an interesting aside of what can/could have happened with coincidental health issues.
  • ahoy_m8
    ahoy_m8 Posts: 3,053 Member
    I had Moderna #2 shot 46 hours ago and think most of my side effects to this side may be behind me which was mainly feeling tired.
    After first shot the side effects may have been more Covid-19 like but had passed after 22 hours leaving me stronger than any time in 2021.

    Ever if my sinus infection the first week of Jan 2021 masked Covid-19 at the time as my wife expected at the time I am glad I now have completed my 2 shot Covid-19 vaccination process and have physical proof because how much better I felt and still feel 24 hours after the 1st shot.

    Last Wednesday Cancer was ruled out as a cause of my blood issues for the past 5 months.

    Post vaccination side effects range from zero to death we read so I think comparing ours with others is without medical value.

    I'm glad they ruled out cancer, but did they get closer to figuring out what is causing your problem?

    No. The doctor said he expects the cause most likely will never be known. After the day they pulled 16 vials of blood for testing and got the dye contrast CT scans approval by insurance carrier and all was negative that was as far as the Carrier wanted to go. I never did have a sense that cancer was involved but they wanted to check it out so we did.

    I, too, lament the serious ordeal you have been through this year. Glad you are better! It is sad that the decision to cease diagnostics is a payment one rather than a medical one, but that is our world. At least twice that I recall specifically, MD's have explained to me that sometimes a cause is never known because so many factors are at work that they cannot all realistically be taken into account. Point being sometimes the decision to cease diagnostics is a medical one.
  • SModa61
    SModa61 Posts: 3,117 Member
    @ahoy_m8 Interesting and thanks. For the person I mentioned, it happened overnight. If I am recalling correctly, his wife a nurse felt it was not a true seizure but that it had a neurological component. I think she said movement was an issue. The er labeled it a seizure. .... Now you have me thinking about my rare painless visual auras. Never bothered to share with my PCP.
  • cwolfman13
    cwolfman13 Posts: 41,865 Member
    edited June 2021
    hipari wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    Judging by work hour logging at my workplace, roughly a third of all vaccinated employees have taken some sick leave (either partial day or a full day) after their vaccination. Based on that, I don’t think it’s ”rare”.

    Yeah, nobody would ever think to use that as an excuse to take some time off work? I took a half day off as well mostly as a "just in case" and I was totally fine...and it was a Friday sooooo...

    How many of these people skipped some other fun activity? I bet it wasn't 1/3. I also wouldn't call a headache and fatigue for a day a particularly adverse reaction...which seems to be the most common complaint from people who've had some kind of issue after the vaccine.
  • paperpudding
    paperpudding Posts: 9,304 Member
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    hipari wrote: »
    cwolfman13 wrote: »
    I think adverse reactions are relatively rare. Everyone I know personally is fully vaccinated and not a single one of them had anything more than a sore arm like they would with any other shot.

    Judging by work hour logging at my workplace, roughly a third of all vaccinated employees have taken some sick leave (either partial day or a full day) after their vaccination. Based on that, I don’t think it’s ”rare”.

    Yeah, nobody would ever think to use that as an excuse to take some time off work? I took a half day off as well mostly as a "just in case" and I was totally fine...and it was a Friday sooooo...

    How many of these people skipped some other fun activity? I bet it wasn't 1/3. I also wouldn't call a headache and fatigue for a day a particularly adverse reaction...which seems to be the most common complaint from people who've had some kind of issue after the vaccine.


    as someone who did have fatigue for 24 hours ish after the vaccine - No I dont call it a particularly adverse reaction either - went out of my way to say it was a mild reaction, in fact - but neither do I think it should be dismissed as imaginary or not worth mentioning or just an excuse (wasnt an excuse for anything in my case, I went to work next day and pushed through, going to bed straight afterwards )